How "siloed" are you?

[rousseau]

Don't mean politically. It recently occurred to me that I've started to gravitate toward certain people when it comes to various services in a way I never used to.

Example 1: A couple of months ago I needed an emergency root canal, but all I got from my dentist was a specialist appointment out of town that was days away. Frantically calling around while contemplating cutting my head off, I was rescued by a gruff, no-nonsense dentist in his sixties with nothing in the way of the considerate bedside manner you expect these days. Suddenly what always made me so uncomfortable at my previous dentist's, a much younger guy, came into clear focus, namely the insincere and obsequious show of attentiveness, the seeming hypersensitivity to current niceties. My new dentist is a plain-speaking farm owner (and an interesting mix of the politically liberal and libertarian).

Example 2: After years of getting my hair cut by conversationally inept drones at those discount places, I accidentally walked into a men's barbershop run by a lone guy in his late sixties, and now I'm hooked. The talk, the jokes and the camaraderie are free-flowing. Why had I never thought about trying one of these places before?

I never used to discriminate much, but as I get older I'm starting to consciously seek out people I feel more comfortable around when it comes to certain areas like the examples above. In some ways I can see the potential danger of cutting myself off from demographic diversity, but then again, it's not like I agree with everything that the dentist and the barber say, or have limitless commonalities with them.

Do people in big cities really come into contact with a wide variety of people all the time? Isn't there some "siloing" happening there too?

[kwoldtimer]

I'm not sure what you mean by "siloing". Is it gravitating toward greater interaction or do you mean sticking to the familiar? Or just interacting with one's own demographic group?

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

I'm not sure what you mean by "siloing". Is it gravitating toward greater interaction or do you mean sticking to the familiar? Or just interacting with one's own demographic group?

The last one. I always used to see myself as a cosmopolitan renaissance man (don't laugh), able and willing to take all comers, but lately I've taken comfort/refuge in my own demographic (or thereabouts) when it comes to choosing how to spend money and/or time.

I guess I'm prodding my own assumptions and prejudices about this. I grew up in the aftermath of the civil rights movement, when the idea of "sticking to your own kind" was anathema.

I dunno, maybe raising the whole question is overwrought. They're just barbers and dentists, after all.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by rousseau

The last one. I always used to see myself as a cosmopolitan renaissance man (don't laugh), able and willing to take all comers, but lately I've taken comfort/refuge in my own demographic (or thereabouts) when it comes to choosing how to spend money and/or time.

The older I get (i'm shy of 30) the more I grow to dislike boomers. My family doctor is younger, my dentist is younger, most everyone I spend time with is under 40.

The only older people I don't mind are immigrants, honestly, because they don't have that entitlement that I find in a lot of older North American residents. At least IMO.

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by JHikka

The older I get (i'm shy of 30) the more I grow to dislike boomers. My family doctor is younger, my dentist is younger, most everyone I spend time with is under 40.

The only older people I don't mind are immigrants, honestly, because they don't have that entitlement that I find in a lot of older North American residents. At least IMO.

Ahh the confidence of the youth! Embraced that attitude my boy, because before you know it you'll be in your 50's and yelling at kids to get off your nondescript public mat located in front of your chosen habitation dwelling!

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

Ahh the confidence of the youth! Embraced that attitude my boy, because before you know it you'll be in your 50's and yelling at kids to get off your nondescript public mat located in front of your chosen habitation dwelling!

The irony is astounding.

[wave46]

I'd say I'm quite 'siloed'.

Partly, this is a result of the area I live in. The place has been in perpetual recession since the 1990s (and was fairly stagnant through the 1980s), so there's not much in the way of immigration, especially of the visible kind.

Walking through the shopping mall or around town, demographically it looks as if Canada of the 1970s had simply shut the door and just let the locals do their thing.

With the age demographic, I suppose so too. Less than culturally, since I have to work with a fairly large age group, but looking at who I'd call my friends they tend to be within about a decade of my own age.

Is this a conscious choice? That's hard to say. I suspect one naturally gravitates to those with whom you share commonalities, moreso if you're in a culturally homogeneous place.

[Acajack]

I've been thinking about this since I saw it last night. Trying to think of what to say.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by rousseau

The last one. I always used to see myself as a cosmopolitan renaissance man (don't laugh), able and willing to take all comers, but lately I've taken comfort/refuge in my own demographic (or thereabouts) when it comes to choosing how to spend money and/or time.

I think a lot of people do that. I was at the Toronto Eaton Centre yesterday and it struck me how the vast majority of people were from the same demographic. There was a complete absence of socially upper middle class/upper class people. They avoid this place like the plague.

It's well known amongst downtown folk that the demographic changes considerably around the Eaton Centre and north to about College. I only go down there when I have to; they're not people I have much in common with. In contrast, I feel instantly at ease when I'm on Bayview Avenue, bits of King West, and the Distillery (preferably week days).

As with the Eaton Centre I find the people at Yorkdale off putting. Most are monied but with few social graces to speak of. Crude, uncultured, aggressive people in expensive clothes ....to put it politely. You'd think that being exposed to people like this the last 15-20 years would make me accustomed to them but I find myself even more uncomfortable around that demographic than I was when I was a kid. In other words, the circles I travel in are becoming more rigid and narrow the older I get.

I should add one point. I've always found that adage that the social classes don't mix repugnant; it's not how I was raised. I'm kind, respectful, and courteous to everyone and open to befriending anyone regardless of how much money they have or where they come from. To my dismay I just don't have much common ground with these people. It's not like I didn't try. My last 2 boyfriends were working class but both relationships ran there predictable course. I'm definitely 'siloed'.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by isaidso

I think a lot of people do that. I was at the Toronto Eaton Centre yesterday and it struck me how the vast majority of people were from the same demographic. There was a complete absence of socially upper middle class/upper class people. They avoid this place like the plague.

It's well known amongst downtown folk that the demographic changes considerably around the Eaton Centre and north to about College. I only go down there when I have to; they're not people I have much in common with. In contrast, I feel instantly at ease when I'm on Bayview Avenue, bits of King West, and the Distillery (preferably week days).

As with the Eaton Centre I find the people at Yorkdale off putting. Most are monied but with few social graces to speak of. Crude, uncultured, aggressive people in expensive clothes ....to put it politely. You'd think that being exposed to people like this the last 15-20 years would make me accustomed to them but I find myself even more uncomfortable around that demographic than I was when I was a kid. In other words, the circles I travel in are becoming more rigid and narrow the older I get.

I should add one point. I've always found that adage that the social classes don't mix repugnant; it's not how I was raised. I'm kind, respectful, and courteous to everyone and open to befriending anyone regardless of how much money they have or where they come from. To my dismay I just don't have much common ground with these people. It's not like I didn't try. My last 2 boyfriends were working class but both relationships ran there predictable course. I'm definitely 'siloed'.

I found this post really interesting.

I think this is part of a wider trend in society. People talk diversity a lot but in the end a lot of us probably like to mostly be with people who are similar to us.

So it's diversity-diversity-diversity on the surface, but when it comes to actual behaviour we might be segregating as much or more than we ever have. Think of Christian dating sites or conservative baseball leagues in the U.S...

I don't really think it's about age and I certainly don't think it's just about you.

[mistercorporate]

I dont get it, do you mean old white guys or old gruff guys? I gravitate towards intelligent, talkative types with good social skills, regardless of race. Oh, and hot mama-sitas as well, intelligence optional

[SpongeG]

In my part of Coquitlam which I have lived in for 26+ years now, I have seen some changes, lately, a lot more Chinese, before that it was Koreans, Iranians before that, some eastern Europeans like Russians, Romanians.

Now I have noticed more Chinese in the area, the local mall has had a lot more Chinese businesses moving in which before that we had the "western style" Chinese restaurants catering to the mainly white/Canadian customers. Now they are catering more to the Chinese customers.

We have had loads of Korean restaurants in the area for years but now they are replacing the long standing Greek, Italian, Western Style Chinese restaurants. As well as more authentic Chinese restaurants opening.

Its always been an affordable area so its always had a large immigrant demographic. But if I compare the houses in my area to a decade ago a lot of Koreans have replaced the previous typical white Canadian homeowners. We don't have any real visible Indian population at all.

Its pretty diverse but is definitely less typical white Canadian then it was when we moved to the area in 1991.

If I use the chain haircut place I go as a barometer the chinese/koreans working there outnumber the others that have been there in the past.

The banks have really changed, RBC, TD, Scotia, CIBC etc all have Korean on their signs now and the tellers are about 90% Asian, mostly Korean.

I don't go to Church now but I used to go at Christmas and in the last few years that I would go, last time was probably 3 or 4 years ago, I noticed the Church was now 75% Asian. It was/is an old French Canadian Catholic Church, they used to have a mass in French I don't think they do anymore. Compared to 20+ years ago the parish is really different.

I don't know if that is what you're after. But I would say over the years we have seen/are more exposed to a wide variety of people. Here in Northern Alberta there are quite a few Koreans who have bought or started businesses like hotels, gas stations etc. Most locals just call them Chinese cause they don't seem to know the difference.

[SignalHillHiker]

I'm pretty firmly siloed into Irish-Newfoundland surroundings, though a few of my closest friends are or were raised Protestant (I bring that up as a joke, but it is accurate just the same). Lots of acquaintances outside Of that but none I'd really see outside of a house party.

I do have friends, family and interests across almost all classes. Pretty varied in what I eat and do, though there are some constants: live music/comedy, butter chicken, hiking, travel, watching documentaries, etc.

Age wise my two best friends are almost a decade younger and a decade older. Most of the people I admire and like being around in terms of accessing services are 30+, vulgar but kind, salty people. It's what feels real and home to me.

[urbandreamer]

I think Rousseau means he hangs out with his Mennonite brethren?
(In Waterloo/Perth county that's easily understandable.)

I don't know anyone from my background in Toronto so yes, sometimes I find myself wondering if life would be better if I did move to the American South, Scotland or England.

I've occupied silos before ... Which way does your forage blower blow?

[Acajack]

So, thinking about this OP.

Based on what he's said in his posts over the years, Rousseau and I are virtually the same age.

One of the main differences between us is that I have kids (now teenagers) and he does not.

Now, getting to his question about "services", I can't say that I am feeling the same thing. Or if I am, it's happening very very subtly and I am not noticing it.

My health care and personal care providers tend to be millenials (doctor and dentist) or people my age (hairdresser - the aunt of one my kids' friends).

Obviously due to my kids I have lots of teenagers around all the time. My kids are also heavily involved in activities and I interact with their instructors quite a bit - these are generally people in their 20s.

I think the people I gravitate to in general are more similar to me in terms of social class and demeanour than anything that has to do with age.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I think the people I gravitate to in general are more similar to me in terms of social class and demeanour than anything that has to do with age.

Same here. Frankly, I'd be surprised if someone DIDN'T feel this way.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

Same here. Frankly, I'd be surprised if someone DIDN'T feel this way.

Like, dealing with the gruff old guy in his late 60s who does dentistry (as described in the OP), does not appeal to me any more than dealing with a dentist who is 20 years away from me in age in the other direction - who would be a millenial in that case.

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by Acajack

So, thinking about this OP.

Based on what he's said in his posts over the years, Rousseau and I are virtually the same age.

One of the main differences between us is that I have kids (now teenagers) and he does not.

Now, getting to his question about "services", I can't say that I am feeling the same thing. Or if I am, it's happening very very subtly and I am not noticing it.

My health care and personal care providers tend to be millenials (doctor and dentist) or people my age (hairdresser - the aunt of one my kids' friends).

Obviously due to my kids I have lots of teenagers around all the time. My kids are also heavily involved in activities and I interact with their instructors quite a bit - these are generally people in their 20s.

I think the people I gravitate to in general are more similar to me in terms of social class and demeanour than anything that has to do with age.

What prompted this thread was the sudden realization that I've sort of done what I've always found frivolous or amusing in others: consciously choosing a service due to feeling more comfortable with the provider.

A long time ago I recall an aunt complaining vociferously about how off-putting her dentist's personality was because he didn't engage in social niceties like asking about how her day. He made the interaction seem like a "conveyor belt." To me, I thought this was funny. If he does a good job, then who cares?

Well, it turns out that I seem to care. At least a bit.

My doctor is a millennial, and I'm happier with her than with the older doctor that she replaced when he retired. Even so, I think there is something about the age thing going on with me. It has to do with my "station in life," I guess. I'm in a gentrified downtown neighbourhood without too many kids around. Kids naturally take up a lot of time and headspace, so it's probably not as likely for a quick hello on the street to turn into a half-hour conversation on the porch when you're coming home from soccer practice.

But that happens regularly here, where the neighbours are in their fifties, sixties and seventies. We really let loose with the jokes, the innuendo and the teasing. Good "craic," as the Irish say. I'm now fifty-two, and I've noticed how incredibly easy my interactions are with older folks. The general lack of pretension once you get past your forties, the lack of insecurity about how you measure up in society or make your place, comes as a relief. You have to accept who you are and who you've become, because otherwise the bitterness and regret would be toxic.

Which is not to say that I avoid people below me in age. I like playing basketball with high school kids at the Y. It's great fun. I do care about the young folks. It's just that I care about the old folks, too. Maybe even a bit more.

• Video Link

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by rousseau

What prompted this thread was the sudden realization that I've sort of done what I've always found frivolous or amusing in others: consciously choosing a service due to feeling more comfortable with the provider.

A long time ago I recall an aunt complaining vociferously about how off-putting her dentist's personality was because he didn't engage in social niceties like asking about how her day. He made the interaction seem like a "conveyor belt." To me, I thought this was funny. If he does a good job, then who cares?

Well, it turns out that I seem to care. At least a bit.

My doctor is a millennial, and I'm happier with her than with the older doctor that she replaced when he retired. Even so, I think there is something about the age thing going on with me. It has to do with my "station in life," I guess. I'm in a gentrified downtown neighbourhood without too many kids around. Kids naturally take up a lot of time and headspace, so it's probably not as likely for a quick hello on the street to turn into a half-hour conversation on the porch when you're coming home from soccer practice.

But that happens regularly here, where the neighbours are in their fifties, sixties and seventies. We really let loose with the jokes, the innuendo and the teasing. Good "craic," as the Irish say. I'm now fifty-two, and I've noticed how incredibly easy my interactions are with older folks. The general lack of pretension once you get past your forties, the lack of insecurity about how you measure up in society or make your place, comes as a relief. You have to accept who you are and who you've become, because otherwise the bitterness and regret would be toxic.

Which is not to say that I avoid people below me in age. I like playing basketball with high school kids at the Y. It's great fun. I do care about the young folks. It's just that I care about the old folks, too. Maybe even a bit more.

• Video Link

I think I may always have been atypical in terms of age-sensitivity. In my youth I was the elementary school aged-kid who wanted to sit at the adults' table to discuss the upcoming elections or the Iranian hostage crisis.

Today I am often surrounded by teens and always chat with them about all and sundry (can you say that in English in this context? it sounded good) whereas my kids tell me that when they go to their friends' places the parents (especially dads) generally ignore them except for the requisite hello.

So I try to make the best of what each generation has to offer, and I try to remain self-aware that our generation (I am just a few years younger than you) has its quirks that can probably be irksome to others too.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I think I may always have been atypical in terms of age-sensitivity. In my youth I was the elementary school aged-kid who wanted to sit at the adults' table to discuss the upcoming elections or the Iranian hostage crisis.

Today I am often surrounded by teens and always chat with them about all and sundry ([I]can you say that in English in this context? it sounded good[/I]) whereas my kids tell me that when they go to their friends' places the parents (especially dads) generally ignore them except for the requisite hello.

So I try to make the best of what each generation has to offer, and I try to remain self-aware that our generation (I am just a few years younger than you) has its quirks that can probably be irksome to others too.

Kinda sorta - it refers to people rather than things, but nobody would be confused about your meaning. Unless you actually mean that you gossip about people with teenagers, in which case it's bang on.