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  #41  
Old Posted Jun 19, 2023, 3:22 AM
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OCH project updates.


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  #42  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2023, 1:43 AM
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$110M affordable housing plan gets go-ahead, but won't meet demand
Money welcome but doesn't come close to what's needed, committee hears

Giacomo Panico · CBC News
Posted: Sep 06, 2023 5:40 PM EDT | Last Updated: 4 hours ago


Ottawa's planning and housing committee has approved a plan to spend $110 million over the next three years on affordable housing, but not without hearing concerns that the city needs more than three times that amount.

The money earmarked Wednesday is capital funding the city gives to not-for-profit agencies it partners with to build affordable housing units, often with supportive services attached.

It includes housing money from both the federal and provincial governments.

While he was pleased his fellow committee members approved the spending plan, Coun. Jeff Leiper noted demand far exceeds the $110 million being provided.

"Our affordable housing provider partners have projects that they would like to build," said Leiper, the committee's chair.

"But at this point the funding is uncertain to actually move ahead and build the units."

In order to meet the demand, the city would need to invest an additional $375 million, said director of housing services Paul Lavigne.

"If we had that extra money, it would go a long way to advancing our goals, based on the number of projects that we have ready," said Lavigne.

A major challenge highlighted during the meeting was the staggering increase in construction costs, which staff said have risen 51 percent since 2020.

The impact, they said, is that the $110 million will be used in part to build 133 new units and also as contingency funding for 408 units already under construction.

The committee should explore ways to work with the federal government to convert vacant government office space into affordable housing, said Mary Huang, president of the Centretown Community Association.

"There's a lot of people who are struggling," said Huang, the only public delegation to speak at Wednesday's meeting, in an interview with CBC.

"There's people sleeping rough in encampments, behind community gardens, in exits of condo buildings."

The list of affordable housing projects that will benefit from this funding include:
  • Ottawa Community Housing Corporation's project for 715 Mikinak Rd., on the former Canadian Forces Base Rockcliffe lands.
  • Ottawa Salus Corporation's construction of 54 supportive housing units at 56 Capilano Dr. in the Fisher Heights neighbourhood.
  • Nepean Housing Corporation's completion of a project at 1 Dunbar Court near Hunt Club Road and Greenbank Road.
  • The Multifaith Housing Initiative on LeBreton Flats, which would add 133 affordable rental units there.

Full city council must still approve the affordable housing strategy, which is expected to happen on Sept. 13.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...mand-1.6958300
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  #43  
Old Posted Dec 17, 2023, 4:03 PM
Richard Eade Richard Eade is offline
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Since several of you might be involved, in various capacities, regarding the developing of properties, I thought that I might try to tap into your knowledge.

I see that the city is capping some areas at 4 stories, and some at 6. I thought that I had heard that about 5 stories is the limit of wood-framed construction, and after that, there was a shift to concrete. I think that I have also heard that the step up in construction cost means that you need about 15 stories to make a concrete building economical.

So, can you help me with my confusion?

If 6 stories is above the limit for wood-framing, and concrete buildings need to be 15+ stories to be economical, what is the point of a 6-story limit?

Is there the possibility of taller (and economical) wood-framing? Can 6 story concrete buildings be economical? Is there something in the middle (steel framing?) that works for middle heights?

Obviously, if the units were all designated (and priced) as luxury units, a shorter concrete building could be built, but is that the only way to make 6 stories work? (That doesn’t help in creating ‘affordable’ housing, though.)
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  #44  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2023, 3:04 PM
Dzingle Bells Dzingle Bells is offline
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Historically, the limit in Ontario for wood building construction was because of the Ontario Building Code limiting how tall you were allowed to build out of wood. Although that has been updated to 6 stories now, there is still some resistance from developers and builders to go that tall.

Additionally, once you get to around 6 stories in wood, you change from "stick-built" (aka 2" by 6"s and 2" by 4"s) to "mass timber", which changes the design, engineering, and construction methods. There has not been many mass-timber buildings in Ontario but it is slowly starting. Out west they are miles ahead - https://www.archdaily.com/879625/ins...tured-building

So that's a roundabout way of answering your questions. Wood is definitely feasible for 6-stories.
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  #45  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2023, 5:05 PM
Richard Eade Richard Eade is offline
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Wow. Very interesting, Dzingle Bells. Thanks for that information.

I had heard just yesterday (from the ‘about here’ video provided by J.OT.13, in the Building Better Suburbs thread) that Vancouver allowed up to 12 stories with wood, but the Brock Commons Tallwood House appears to have 18 floors (17 in wood, sitting on a concrete base). Progress indeed.

Ontario should follow Vancouver’s lead, and allow 12-story wood-framed buildings. (Although there might be more severe snow-load issues in Ontario.) I think that this is a great opportunity to construct the ‘up-to-12-story Missing Middle’ buildings economically while sealing in carbon, instead of spewing carbon into the atmosphere through the creation of concrete. Engineered timbers are also a great way to use up smaller trees, resulting in faster turn-over in managed forests.

This is how affordable housing can be delivered more quickly and economically. A factory manufactured ‘kit’ that can be easily assembled on site, with minimum disruption to neighbours.
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  #46  
Old Posted Dec 18, 2023, 9:51 PM
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Seems like an easy win to get more housing built for cheaper. Isn't that the Governments priority? I guess no developers asked for that change.
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  #47  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2024, 10:29 PM
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Ottawa Community Housing acquires 311 townhomes in Nepean
The deal is scheduled to close Feb. 15.

Blair Crawford, Ottawa Citizen
Published Jan 09, 2024 • Last updated 1 hour ago • 2 minute read




More than 300 aging, but affordable townhomes have been added to the Ottawa Community Housing stock thanks to a multi-million dollar deal between OCH and Minto.

In the deal announced Tuesday, OCH has acquired 122 three-bedroom townhomes in Tanglewood plus 154 three-bedroom and 35 four-bedroom townhomes in Chesterton from Minto Apartments REIT. Both neighbourhoods are in Nepean near Merivale Road and Viewmount Drive.

The units, most of which are already occupied, have a range of rents, but are all significantly below current market rates, said Cliff Youdale, chief development officer for OCH. The deal is the first of its kind for OCH buying private-market housing that is already renting at affordable rates.

“This is definitely new. It’s a byproduct of the economic conditions,” Youdale said in an interview Tuesday. “It’s been really hard for us to acquire units in the past because it was such a competitive marketplace. But, with some of the adjustments in the market, it’s a cost-effective way of adding units to our portfolio that are currently affordable.”

Existing tenants will be allowed to stay, and OCH will be able to keep their rents low. When units do turn over, having OCH as the owner will prevent rents from climbing out of reach.

Multi-bedroom units suitable for large families like the ones in the Minto deal are particularly hard to find, Youdale said. Some tenants have lived there for 20 years or more.

OCH purchased the properties at about $270,000 per unit, he said.

The Tanglewood complex was built in 1975 and the Chesterton homes date back to 1969, but all have been well maintained by Minto and are the same age as many of OCH’s existing 15,000 units, he said.

Negotiations began in the fall, and Youdale said he hoped OCH could acquire other properties like these in the future to help ease Ottawa’s affordable housing crunch. The wait list for affordable housing is currently about 12,000 names long.

“We really think it’s important that we protect that private market affordable,” Youdale said. “And I think private-market players would also agree. It’s an opportunity for them to move some stock that may not be part of their future visions.”

Minto described the deal as beneficial for both the city and the company.

“This transaction is truly a win-win,” Jonathan Li, president and CEO of Minto Apartment REIT, said in a statement.

“It helps maintain affordability in the assets, and, at the same time, the proceeds generated from the transaction strengthen the REIT’s position to further increase housing supply across the country as we invest in our existing portfolio and new purpose-built rental developments.”

The deal is scheduled to close Feb. 15.

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...omes-in-nepean
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  #48  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2024, 10:50 PM
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Ottawa Community Housing acquires 311 townhomes in Nepean
The deal is scheduled to close Feb. 15.

Blair Crawford, Ottawa Citizen
Published Jan 09, 2024 • Last updated 1 hour ago • 2 minute read




More than 300 aging, but affordable townhomes have been added to the Ottawa Community Housing stock thanks to a multi-million dollar deal between OCH and Minto.

In the deal announced Tuesday, OCH has acquired 122 three-bedroom townhomes in Tanglewood plus 154 three-bedroom and 35 four-bedroom townhomes in Chesterton from Minto Apartments REIT. Both neighbourhoods are in Nepean near Merivale Road and Viewmount Drive.

The units, most of which are already occupied, have a range of rents, but are all significantly below current market rates, said Cliff Youdale, chief development officer for OCH. The deal is the first of its kind for OCH buying private-market housing that is already renting at affordable rates.

“This is definitely new. It’s a byproduct of the economic conditions,” Youdale said in an interview Tuesday. “It’s been really hard for us to acquire units in the past because it was such a competitive marketplace. But, with some of the adjustments in the market, it’s a cost-effective way of adding units to our portfolio that are currently affordable.”

Existing tenants will be allowed to stay, and OCH will be able to keep their rents low. When units do turn over, having OCH as the owner will prevent rents from climbing out of reach.

Multi-bedroom units suitable for large families like the ones in the Minto deal are particularly hard to find, Youdale said. Some tenants have lived there for 20 years or more.

OCH purchased the properties at about $270,000 per unit, he said.

The Tanglewood complex was built in 1975 and the Chesterton homes date back to 1969, but all have been well maintained by Minto and are the same age as many of OCH’s existing 15,000 units, he said.

Negotiations began in the fall, and Youdale said he hoped OCH could acquire other properties like these in the future to help ease Ottawa’s affordable housing crunch. The wait list for affordable housing is currently about 12,000 names long.

“We really think it’s important that we protect that private market affordable,” Youdale said. “And I think private-market players would also agree. It’s an opportunity for them to move some stock that may not be part of their future visions.”

Minto described the deal as beneficial for both the city and the company.

“This transaction is truly a win-win,” Jonathan Li, president and CEO of Minto Apartment REIT, said in a statement.

“It helps maintain affordability in the assets, and, at the same time, the proceeds generated from the transaction strengthen the REIT’s position to further increase housing supply across the country as we invest in our existing portfolio and new purpose-built rental developments.”

The deal is scheduled to close Feb. 15.

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...omes-in-nepean
I'll take this any second of the day over these units going into Land-trusts (as preferred by Laine Johnson) or the hands of CCOC. At least with them being OCH there is a chance they may eventually have a density increase as OCH has done in other areas of the city with there property.
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  #49  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2024, 6:35 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is offline
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I'll take this any second of the day over these units going into Land-trusts (as preferred by Laine Johnson) or the hands of CCOC. At least with them being OCH there is a chance they may eventually have a density increase as OCH has done in other areas of the city with there property.
Maybe but I'd be very curious how this evaluation took place. Certainly the market price is nowhere near that amount. You're right though hopefully OCH builds up block by block over the next 30 years.
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  #50  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2024, 6:40 PM
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Glad to see that they were sold to OCH for well below market rate, which makes sense. Would like to see them try something similar with the Woodroffe/Knoxdale area townhouses along the Stage 3 route, though I doubt that property owner would play ball.
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  #51  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2024, 2:22 AM
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Environ 300 nouveaux logements abordables annoncés à Gatineau

Par Mathieu Bélanger, Le Droit
16 février 2024 à 13h47


Les politiciens fédéraux, provinciaux et municipaux étaient nombreux à s’être donné rendez-vous à la Maison du citoyen de Gatineau pour annoncer un total de 47 nouveaux projets répartis aux quatre coins de la province et financés par le Programme d’habitation abordable Québec (PHAQ). «Choisir de faire cette annonce nationale ici démontre bien que la réalité frontalière qu’on vit ici est comprise par les gouvernements» ont tous deux affirmé la députée de Hull, Suzanne Tremblay, et le député fédéral de Gatineau, Steven MacKinnon.

Pour Gatineau, l’investissement fédéral-provincial dans les trois projets atteint 47,4 millions de dollars, ce qui représente 12 % de l’enveloppe. «Je vois dans cet engagement des gouvernements une reconnaissance claire de la situation difficile dans laquelle on se trouve», a noté la mairesse de Gatineau, France Bélisle. La Ville contribue d’ailleurs aux trois projets à hauteur de 15 millions de dollars.

L’investissement des gouvernements fédéral et provincial a été rendu possible grâce à l’Entente Canada-Québec sur le logement de 1,8 milliard de dollars qui a été signée l’automne dernier.

Le projet de 79 logements étudiants totalisant 131 chambres présenté par l’Université du Québec en Outaouais (UQO) est l’un des trois projets retenus par Québec à Gatineau. Le Droit a révélé en octobre dernier que l’immeuble de six étages évalué à 31 millions de dollars sera construit aux abords du terrain synthétique de soccer de l’université.

Le chantier doit s’amorcer au cours des prochains mois.«L’argent est là, les tests de sol sont faits, on est prêt à aller en appel d’offres pour les services professionnels», a noté la rectrice de l’UQO, Murielle Laberge.

Cette dernière précise toutefois que bien qu’il soit bienvenu, ce projet à lui seul ne pourra répondre à toute la demande en matière de résidences étudiantes. La liste d’attente pour une résidence étudiante est actuellement de 555 noms.

Le projet Sacré-Coeur de 198 logements présenté par les Habitations de l’Outaouais métropolitain (HOM) sera construit à l’angle de la rue Champlain et du boulevard Sacré-Coeur, dans le centre-ville de Gatineau. L’immeuble de 13 étages qui sera construit par l’entreprise Boless comptera des logements d’une, deux et trois chambres et s’adressera principalement à des familles. HOM précise avoir en main toutes les autorisations. Le chantier devrait voir le jour rapidement dans les prochaines semaines.

La construction du projet soumis par Accueil-Parrainage Outaouais de 19 logements pour les nouveaux arrivants pourrait pour sa part s’amocher cet automne, au 111-113, rue Montcalm, aussi dans le centre-ville.

Le directeur général de l’organisme, Bato Redzovic, précise que les besoins en logements pour les nouveaux arrivants sont immenses dans la région.

«Les prix des logements et le manque de disponibilité sur le marché font en sorte qu’il est très difficile pour les nouveaux arrivants de se loger, note-t-il. C’est un besoin très important et ce projet va nous permettre d’aider les familles et de stabiliser les gens quand ils arrivent.»

La ministre québécoise de l’Habitation, France-Élaine Duranceau, a rappelé qu’il est urgent de construire des logements au Québec. «On n’a pas le luxe d’attendre en habitation, a-t-elle noté. On a déjà assez attendu.» Ainsi, tous les projets annoncés vendredi matin devront être en chantier d’ici un maximum de 12 à 18 mois.

Mme Duranceau avait évidemment eu vent des critiques des promoteurs de l’Outaouais envers les difficultés de la Ville de Gatineau à répondre rapidement aux impératifs de l’industrie de la construction. Les lacunes du service de l’urbanisme et du service de l’infrastructure ont d’ailleurs été publiquement reconnues par la mairesse Bélisle. Interrogée pour savoir ce que Québec peut faire pour accompagner les villes qui, comme Gatineau, peinent à répondre à la demande en matière d’émission de permis, la ministre de l’Habitation a noté que le projet de loi 31 actuellement à l’étude pourrait offrir des réponses.

«Lorsqu’il sera adopté, il va donner des pouvoirs spéciaux aux villes qui leur permettront de déroger de leur règlement de zonage pour accélérer des projets de construction, a-t-elle expliqué. Ça va requérir une consultation publique préalable, mais ensuite, la ville aura plus de latitude pour bouger rapidement. Ce sera un outil intéressant pour enlever du sable dans l’engrenage.»

https://www.ledroit.com/actualites/a...IUR3FZM7VE4UU/
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  #52  
Old Posted Mar 7, 2024, 12:15 AM
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City of Ottawa to open new transitional housing centre on Queen Street
A 10-year lease, with an option for two five-year renewals, will cost $4.38 million with another $1.48 million to be spent on building improvements.

Blair Crawford, Ottawa Citizen
Published Mar 06, 2024 • Last updated 59 minutes ago • 2 minute read




The City of Ottawa is adding transitional housing space for up to 130 people with a 10-year lease of a vacant office building on Queen Street.

The lease, with an option for two five-year renewals, will cost $4.38 million with another $1.48 million to be spent on building improvements.

“This is a huge deal,” said Orléans West-Innes Coun. Laura Dudas, who co-chairs the city’s emergency shelter crisis task force with Mayor Mark Sutcliffe.

“We’re just coming out of winter and heading into nice warmer weather, but the problem of having unsheltered residents is not going to go away. We have to plan, not just for next winter, but for permanent solutions so that we continue to be a compassionate city where anyone needs our help can find shelter and stay safe.”

The Queen Street building, in Centretown, could have its first residents by November, she said.

Two weeks ago, the first families moved into another transitional housing building the city is renting on Corkstown Road in Kanata. The former retirement home is a four-storey, 170-unit building that will be used to provide housing for families that are currently living in temporary locations such as motels and hotels.

Unlike emergency shelters such as the Shepherds of Good Hope and the Ottawa Mission, transitional housing offers more stable living conditions and residents aren’t forced to leave during the day, as they are at emergency shelters. It’s also easier for them to access social services and other supports that can help them transition into permanent housing of their own.

Last fall, the city bought a former seminary on Kilborn Place in Alta Vista that it will convert into affordable housing. That $18.5-million purchase also included 8.7 acres of land where the city hopes to build new affordable housing.

“Kilborn is going to phenomenal,” Dudas said. “We can make the space whatever we need it to be.”

The city is also using two buildings once used for physical-distancing sites — the Dempsey Community Centre and Bernard Grandmaître Arena — as emergency shelters.

Speaking to reporters after Wednesday’s council meeting, Sutcliffe said the city was open to converting other unused office space like 230 Queen into housing. He also said the city wanted to open a welcome centre for newcomers — refugees and asylum seekers, many of whom are forced into emergency shelters because of the lack of affordable housing.

“We’re open to any solutions that are available,” Sutcliffe said. “Not every office building is suited for this kind of purpose, but we need solutions and ultimately we need a welcome centre in Ottawa and we need the federal government to support us in that. Our shelter system is not designed to welcome newcomers to Ottawa who are seeking asylum. That’s not the best way to welcome to our community and help them achieve their goals. That’s not what our shelter system was designed for.”

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...n-queen-street
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  #53  
Old Posted Mar 7, 2024, 3:44 PM
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When are suburban wards going to start pulling their weight on this kind of stuff? Urban wards can only handle so much…
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  #54  
Old Posted Mar 7, 2024, 5:19 PM
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When are suburban wards going to start pulling their weight on this kind of stuff? Urban wards can only handle so much…
Putting homeless people in the suburbs where there are no services solves nothing. It could make things worse.

But, I also remind you about pulling weight, that there is already a lot of low income housing in many suburban neighbourhoods, more than you would expect. Just look at Herongate, Hog's Back, Elmvale, and many more locations. Transitional housing is another matter, and that requires adequate supports that are only available in Centretown.
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  #55  
Old Posted Mar 7, 2024, 5:34 PM
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When are suburban wards going to start pulling their weight on this kind of stuff? Urban wards can only handle so much…
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
Putting homeless people in the suburbs where there are no services solves nothing. It could make things worse.

But, I also remind you about pulling weight, that there is already a lot of low income housing in many suburban neighbourhoods, more than you would expect. Just look at Herongate, Hog's Back, Elmvale, and many more locations. Transitional housing is another matter, and that requires adequate supports that are only available in Centretown.
Suburbs do have affordable and social housing (well, mostly inner-city suburbs, outer Greenbelt suburbs), and they have taken on a bit more housing first projects, but the homelessness issue continues to be the burden of the core almost exclusively.

It's true that the suburbs don't have the same services, but that is solvable by... providing the services in the suburbs as well.
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  #56  
Old Posted Mar 8, 2024, 7:39 AM
DTcrawler DTcrawler is offline
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Putting homeless people in the suburbs where there are no services solves nothing. It could make things worse.
It creates a level playing field. No more people running off to live in the burbs to escape the addiction crisis. Downtown residents didn’t create the problem - it’s a shared city wide issue. So let’s share the issue.

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But, I also remind you about pulling weight, that there is already a lot of low income housing in many suburban neighbourhoods, more than you would expect. Just look at Herongate, Hog's Back, Elmvale, and many more locations. Transitional housing is another matter, and that requires adequate supports that are only available in Centretown.
Why do such supports need to only be available in Centretown? Why can’t we open a safe injection site in Findlay creek to go along with a newly built transitional housing project? Oh that’s right, because residents and councillors would never let that happen. Suburbanites love to pretend to care about addicts, as long as they stay downtown and out of sight from the burbs. As for low income housing like Herongate, etc, there’s a big difference between low income predominantly immigrant families living mostly peacefully and trying to build a better life in Canada, and career criminal junkies taking advantage of an overly-tolerant system while making daily life more challenging for neighbours.
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  #57  
Old Posted Mar 8, 2024, 12:33 PM
LeadingEdgeBoomer LeadingEdgeBoomer is offline
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Putting homeless people in the suburbs where there are no services solves nothing. It could make things worse.

But, I also remind you about pulling weight, that there is already a lot of low income housing in many suburban neighbourhoods, more than you would expect. Just look at Herongate, Hog's Back, Elmvale, and many more locations. Transitional housing is another matter, and that requires adequate supports that are only available in Centretown.
That is true. We have low income housing in Blackburn Hamlet. I live close to it.
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  #58  
Old Posted Mar 8, 2024, 2:09 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is offline
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
Putting homeless people in the suburbs where there are no services solves nothing. It could make things worse.

But, I also remind you about pulling weight, that there is already a lot of low income housing in many suburban neighbourhoods, more than you would expect. Just look at Herongate, Hog's Back, Elmvale, and many more locations. Transitional housing is another matter, and that requires adequate supports that are only available in Centretown.
"A lot" seems like a stretch. Yes there is some.
That said that's how it works in general. Of course suburbanites will block shelters in their area and why wouldn't they. Downtown councilors block anything new as well.
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  #59  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2024, 1:41 PM
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City to consider 'community impact' before approving new supportive housing projects
Ninety per cent of the $176.3 million Ottawa is to receive from the federal Housing Accelerator Fund will be used to build more non-profit housing.

Blair Crawford, Ottawa Citizen
Published Apr 03, 2024 • Last updated 17 hours ago • 2 minute read


With a massive infusion of federal money on the way to build more affordable and supportive housing in Ottawa, city councillors want to make sure the city considers the social effects of those projects on the surrounding community.

Councillors voted 17-7 in favour of a motion that requires the city’s director of housing services to “consider the cumulative effect and community impact” of supportive housing projects before allocating funds for them.

Ninety per cent of the $176.3 million the city is to receive from the federal Housing Accelerator Fund will be used to build more non-profit housing, with 26 projects and properties already identified by the city as priorities. Ottawa declared a “housing emergency” in 2020.

One of those 26 projects is a Shepherds of Good Hope residence on Merivale Road in Carlington, on the same block as three other Shepherds’ facilities. Those are already causing headaches for neighbours, said River Ward Coun. Riley Brockington, who brought forward the motion.

“Some of my residents are pushing back,” Brockington told reporters after Wednesday’s council meeting. “It’s really to get the Shepherds’ attention, to say ‘You need to invest in wraparound services for those residents who are coming out of the shelter system and collectively work with us on the issues that exist in the community.”

Brockington said there have been increased calls for police and emergency services to the area since the Shepherds’ opened up a third building on Merivale near Kirkwood Avenue last summer.

“These are people coming directly from the shelter system into residences in the community. You better have resources on-site to help them,” he said.

Brockington said the city has already acknowledged that it needs to spread supportive housing units out across the city so that they aren’t concentrated in the downtown, but he rejected that the motion was driven by NIMBYism. NIMBY stands for “Not in my backyard.”

“You don’t see me advocating to shut them down,” Brockington said. “You see me advocating for our new residents who come into the community that have high acuity, high needs, to have the support that they need.”

Somerset Ward Coun. Ariel Troster was one of seven councillors to vote against the motion.

“Supportive housing is the solution, not the problem,” Troster said, although she agreed on the need for social supports.

Clara Freire, director of community and social services, said the Brockington motion will be incorporated into city decisions on how the accelerator fund will be used after individual projects have been considered and designed.

“At that level, we will put in place an additional lens of community impact and make that part of our discussion with the proponents to ensure they have the property community engagement before advancing on a project,” Freire said.

“It’s an initial step, but not a roadblock.”

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...using-projects
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  #60  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2024, 5:02 PM
DTcrawler DTcrawler is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Ottawa
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I wonder when (if ever) we'll see one of these built in Kanata, Barrhaven, Orleans, RSS, Stittsville, etc.
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