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  #81  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2018, 2:18 AM
rocketphish's Avatar
rocketphish rocketphish is offline
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Toronto-centric, but I think the same principles apply here...

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Don't let the cost of commuting from the suburbs fool you: It's still cheaper to live there
CMHC study made several assumptions, leading to opposite conclusion

Special to Financial Post
Updated: November 22, 2018


Relative to the urban core, housing is less expensive in the suburbs. But does the savings get eaten up by increased commuting costs?

That was one of the findings of a recent study by the Canada Mortgage Housing Corporation (CMHC), which claimed that — at least in the Greater Toronto Area (GTA) — “the cost of longer commutes can completely offset the savings from moving to more affordable municipalities.”

While the CMHC study alerted households to the hidden costs of suburbanization, Canadian census data nevertheless reveal that most of the recent population growth in metropolitan areas has taken place in the suburbs.

But why are Canadiana moving to the suburbs en masse, if affordability gains are not necessarily as advertised?

The answer lies in the assumptions that drive the conclusions in the CMHC study, among them that dwelling units and household sizes are the same across the urban landscape.

Furthermore, the study estimates commuting costs using median distances and does not factor travel times directly into the calculation. It further estimates suburban transit trip costs by regional train service (in this case, Go Transit) “for each municipality as the monthly fare (40 one-way trips) to commute to Union Station” in downtown Toronto.

Challenging these assumptions reveals that the suburban savings remain intact.

First and foremost is the fact that dwelling units differ in sizes. According to the 2016 Census, the average number of rooms in a dwelling in the City of Toronto was five. In the neighbouring suburb of Vaughan, the average number of rooms was 7.2.

Not only is the size of low-rise housing itself larger in the suburbs, but the lot sizes tend to be much larger, too, because of the lower land prices.

It is only by ignoring the huge difference in dwelling sizes that the mortgage carrying costs of smaller-size detached units in the City of Toronto can be equated to their much larger counterparts in the suburbs.

Suburbs have larger homes because they shelter larger families. The average household size is 33 per cent larger in Markham and 25 per cent higher in Mississauga than the average household size in the City of Toronto.

The smaller-size households, i.e. singles and couples without children need much less space than larger-size families and therefore, on a per-square-foot basis, smaller households outbid larger-size households for housing in the urban core.

Another unstated assumption in the CMHC study is about the false choice between the suburbs and the central city for larger-size households. The urban core offers fewer affordable choices for larger families. Even if the commuting costs were higher, which we will show is not necessarily the case, large families do not have a real choice between the suburbs and the core.

The CMHC study also bases its commuting costs on median distances. This favours the urban areas for two reasons. First, for the 12 per cent who walk or bike to work, the study assumes zero commuting costs. Second, since the study estimates costs based on distance and not time, it underestimates the duration of short-distance commutes in the congested urban core. Thus, the monthly commuting cost for the City of Toronto is estimated at a mere $115, even less than the cost of a monthly transit pass. In comparison, workers living in Georgina, 80 kilometres north of the city, are estimated to incur a cost of $1,079 for driving to work.

The 2016 Census, though, presents a more nuanced picture. For starters, one in five residents of the City of Toronto commutes to a work location in the suburb. Most of the suburb-bound Toronto residents, i.e., 83 per cent of them, commute by car.

Almost 44 per cent of those who live and work in the City of Toronto commute by public transit and another 40 per cent commute by car on a very congested road network. At the same time, transit-based commutes on average are much longer in duration than those by automobile. By estimating commuting costs as a function of distance and not time unduly favours Toronto in this comparison.

The number of suburban workers who commute to the central core is small in the GTA. In Georgina’s case, that number is 2,655. As for Oshawa, a suburb with an abundance of affordable low-rise housing, only 10,750 residents commute (largely by regional train service) to the City of Toronto.

While some suburban residents incur longer commutes, many more don’t. The suburban commuting advantage is obvious when one considers commutes of fewer than 15 minutes’ duration. Only 13 per cent of Toronto residents enjoyed commutes shorter than 15 minutes’ duration. In suburban Oshawa, 28 per cent of commutes were less than 15 minutes long.

After stripping away the assumptions, the locational advantage of suburbs is obvious: cheaper housing with sufficient shelter space for families and commutes comparable to those of central city dwellers. No wonder most of the population growth in Canada’s metropolitan areas was realized in the suburbs between 2006 and 2016.

Murtaza Haider is an associate professor at Ryerson University. Stephen Moranis is a real estate industry veteran. They can be reached at www.hmbulletin.com.

https://ottawacitizen.com/real-estat...e-a5799d923f47
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  #82  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 6:07 PM
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rocketphish rocketphish is offline
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In Ottawa’s Glebe, neighbours wrangle over a new build

by Adam Stanley
Special to The Globe and Mail
Published 5 hours ago


An Ottawa surgeon is fighting a group of neighbours who are trying to take a scalpel to the plans of his dream home and have already amassed an almost $13,000 war chest on GoFundMe.com.

Hassan Moghadam, the chief oral surgeon at Ottawa’s Monfort Hospital, bought the property last year on Broadway Avenue, within shouting distance of the Rideau Canal and the renovated Landsdowne Park in the Glebe, one of Ottawa’s elite neighbourhoods.

But Dr. Moghadam has found himself at odds with a group of neighbours committed to preserving the streetscape of Broadway Avenue.

Dr. Moghadam wanted to tear down the nearly 100-year-old home and build a dream property fit for his family – including four bedrooms (each of the three children get their own bedroom and bathroom), a large dining and kitchen area, a gym, and a personal theatre.

The neighbours feel the planned structure does not fit with the other homes of the street.

Dr. Moghadam claims the group – which started the GoFundMe campaign last month to raise money for legal fees – is ganging up on him as they resist change.

“You can imagine; it’s disturbing. These guys are on TV news, telling everyone what a horrible person I am, and I’m building a monster house, and I’m ruining the neighbourhood,” he says. “It’s pretty hard to take that, with a family and kids who go to school in the Glebe. I think it’s inhumane to take house construction to such a personal vendetta against someone who works in the community and helps people in the community every single day at the hospital.”

Dr. Moghadam currently lives with his wife, Litsa, and their three children in another home in the Glebe – a posh neighbourhood about 15 minutes from Parliament Hill.

The problem, according to residents, is not the look and feel of the home, which is set to be more than 3,900 square feet and will have three storeys, built of brick, limestone and copper. From a legal perspective, they can’t do anything about those aspects. What they are worried about is the look of their streetscape.

“’Your street gives you your rules.’ That’s the words in the mature-neighbourhood bylaws,” says resident Bernie Sander, who has lived on the street for more than 30 years.

“We’re not at all against modernity. [There have been] infills, new homes built on vacant lots or old homes torn down on the street and all of them are massively modern with a different look, but they have respected the streetscape and are aligned with the street.”

Mr. Sander believes the City of Ottawa is letting down its residents in this case. He feels a community group shouldn’t have to be the ones who are enforcing the bylaws.

Mr. Sander says people decide to move to Broadway because they want to be part of a mature neighbourhood. A neighbour down from 21 Broadway Ave. renovated their home within the past five years but kept the alignment – in the eyes of Mr. Sander and the community at large – as close to the existing as possible. He says Dr. Moghadam’s home isn’t doing that.

“Rather than a porch that projects towards the sidewalk, it’s going to be the whole goddamn house that’s going to be there,” Mr. Sander explains. “It’s a completely different look.”

However, City of Ottawa officials say what Dr. Moghadam is planning is within the rules.

Dr. Moghadam won his hearing at the Local Planning Appeal Tribunal earlier this year, but there will be an appeal in January. "Kind of a Pyrrhic victory,” Mr. Sander says, as the delay means the home won’t be built for another few months.

The only thing that is legally stopping a construction crew from beginning work on the project – other than the weather – is getting a building permit.

David Wise is a program manager of development review at the City of Ottawa and says there are a handful of “frustrating” things about this case.

He says the residents may not be aware that the zoning for Dr. Moghadam’s lot is actually categorized as Residential Third Density, which allows for a semi-detached or triplex to be built on the property.

“From the perspective of the city and mature neighbourhoods, we think the proponent fits in quite well,” Mr. Wise says. “It’s catering to the market demand, where people want to just have more house.”

Dr. Moghadam’s application for a variance isn’t egregious, Mr. Wise adds. For that lot, a “developmental box” exists that would allow construction of a house about 450 square metres wide and 10 metres high. Dr. Moghadam’s proposed home will fill approximately 90 per cent of the developmental box.

“It’s high, but it’s not crazy,” Mr. Wise says, pointing to many cases where people propose homes that max out their developmental box and then seek variances to take it even further – a trend the City of Ottawa is watching carefully.

In mature neighbourhoods in Ottawa, homes can be positioned away from the road an average of the distance of the two properties on either side.

“What a lot of community associations have the perspective of is, when they think of the front wall, they think the largest part of the house they see,” Mr. Wise says.

Dr. Moghadam’s architect, Jacques Hamel, says the only part of the building where a variance actually needed to be granted was for a portion of the building near the second-storey windows.

“It’s a little bit ludicrous in my mind,” he says. “There is an existing house on the property and what we’re proposing is entirely within that footprint. The whole footprint is set within what we are permitted from a bylaw perspective, and from existing non-conforming rights, due to the existence of the original building.

“We are building to the rights that were guaranteed by the bylaw. There’s no arguing that. [The neighbours] may not agree with it, but there’s no arguing.”

And the look of Dr. Moghadam’s new home, Mr. Hamel believes, will actually add to the streetscape.

“The richness of this streetscape has to do with the differences, not with the sameness,” he says.

But by fighting this case, Mr. Sander says the community is actually doing Ottawa residents a service as it relates to the bylaw’s legalese and where homes can and can not be built.

He may soon have a political ally in the fight as new Councillor Shawn Menard said in his campaign platform that he would stand up to developers in the city.

“What I am concerned about in this city is the development and planning approach, which has traditionally been very in favour of developers in this city. They’re able to usually get every variance through that they apply for,” Mr. Menard says. “Right now, people aren’t finding it very fair to come into the city and have bylaws and variances that are often just approved without the debate they need.”

Despite the heated back-and-forth between neighbours, there’s little to be done until the appeal hearing in January.

Dr. Moghadam says despite the exchange with the neighbours, he’ll continue to give back to the community. He is a classic-car collector and hosted an open house in late November, with proceeds going to the May Court Hospice.

“We want to live in a normal, modern house where my kids have their own bedrooms. We just want to build a house and be part of the community and be part of the area. We love the street. It’s phenomenal,” he says. “The house fits in the neighbourhood and we want it to fit in the neighbourhood.”

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/real...r-a-new-build/
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  #83  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 6:55 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
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I happen to think it looks fine in that neighbourhood. Just because it doesn't have a cross-hip with a dormer at the front doesn't mean it doesn't fit in... I think the renderings and material palette look great. Could be worse. Count your blessings.

Granted, the crotchety old man next door isn't ever going to appreciate the new shadow cast on his roof. But then, that's the real reason why he's organized this NIMBY group, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
In Ottawa’s Glebe, neighbours wrangle over a new build

by Adam Stanley
Special to The Globe and Mail
Published 5 hours ago


An Ottawa surgeon is fighting a group of neighbours who are trying to take a scalpel to the plans of his dream home and have already amassed an almost $13,000 war chest on GoFundMe.com.

Hassan Moghadam, the chief oral surgeon at Ottawa’s Monfort Hospital, bought the property last year on Broadway Avenue, within shouting distance of the Rideau Canal and the renovated Landsdowne Park in the Glebe, one of Ottawa’s elite neighbourhoods.

But Dr. Moghadam has found himself at odds with a group of neighbours committed to preserving the streetscape of Broadway Avenue.

Dr. Moghadam wanted to tear down the nearly 100-year-old home and build a dream property fit for his family – including four bedrooms (each of the three children get their own bedroom and bathroom), a large dining and kitchen area, a gym, and a personal theatre.

The neighbours feel the planned structure does not fit with the other homes of the street.

Dr. Moghadam claims the group – which started the GoFundMe campaign last month to raise money for legal fees – is ganging up on him as they resist change.

“You can imagine; it’s disturbing. These guys are on TV news, telling everyone what a horrible person I am, and I’m building a monster house, and I’m ruining the neighbourhood,” he says. “It’s pretty hard to take that, with a family and kids who go to school in the Glebe. I think it’s inhumane to take house construction to such a personal vendetta against someone who works in the community and helps people in the community every single day at the hospital.”

Dr. Moghadam currently lives with his wife, Litsa, and their three children in another home in the Glebe – a posh neighbourhood about 15 minutes from Parliament Hill.

The problem, according to residents, is not the look and feel of the home, which is set to be more than 3,900 square feet and will have three storeys, built of brick, limestone and copper. From a legal perspective, they can’t do anything about those aspects. What they are worried about is the look of their streetscape.

“’Your street gives you your rules.’ That’s the words in the mature-neighbourhood bylaws,” says resident Bernie Sander, who has lived on the street for more than 30 years.

“We’re not at all against modernity. [There have been] infills, new homes built on vacant lots or old homes torn down on the street and all of them are massively modern with a different look, but they have respected the streetscape and are aligned with the street.”

Mr. Sander believes the City of Ottawa is letting down its residents in this case. He feels a community group shouldn’t have to be the ones who are enforcing the bylaws.

Mr. Sander says people decide to move to Broadway because they want to be part of a mature neighbourhood. A neighbour down from 21 Broadway Ave. renovated their home within the past five years but kept the alignment – in the eyes of Mr. Sander and the community at large – as close to the existing as possible. He says Dr. Moghadam’s home isn’t doing that.

“Rather than a porch that projects towards the sidewalk, it’s going to be the whole goddamn house that’s going to be there,” Mr. Sander explains. “It’s a completely different look.”

However, City of Ottawa officials say what Dr. Moghadam is planning is within the rules.

Dr. Moghadam won his hearing at the Local Planning Appeal Tribunal earlier this year, but there will be an appeal in January. "Kind of a Pyrrhic victory,” Mr. Sander says, as the delay means the home won’t be built for another few months.

The only thing that is legally stopping a construction crew from beginning work on the project – other than the weather – is getting a building permit.

David Wise is a program manager of development review at the City of Ottawa and says there are a handful of “frustrating” things about this case.

He says the residents may not be aware that the zoning for Dr. Moghadam’s lot is actually categorized as Residential Third Density, which allows for a semi-detached or triplex to be built on the property.

“From the perspective of the city and mature neighbourhoods, we think the proponent fits in quite well,” Mr. Wise says. “It’s catering to the market demand, where people want to just have more house.”

Dr. Moghadam’s application for a variance isn’t egregious, Mr. Wise adds. For that lot, a “developmental box” exists that would allow construction of a house about 450 square metres wide and 10 metres high. Dr. Moghadam’s proposed home will fill approximately 90 per cent of the developmental box.

“It’s high, but it’s not crazy,” Mr. Wise says, pointing to many cases where people propose homes that max out their developmental box and then seek variances to take it even further – a trend the City of Ottawa is watching carefully.

In mature neighbourhoods in Ottawa, homes can be positioned away from the road an average of the distance of the two properties on either side.

“What a lot of community associations have the perspective of is, when they think of the front wall, they think the largest part of the house they see,” Mr. Wise says.

Dr. Moghadam’s architect, Jacques Hamel, says the only part of the building where a variance actually needed to be granted was for a portion of the building near the second-storey windows.

“It’s a little bit ludicrous in my mind,” he says. “There is an existing house on the property and what we’re proposing is entirely within that footprint. The whole footprint is set within what we are permitted from a bylaw perspective, and from existing non-conforming rights, due to the existence of the original building.

“We are building to the rights that were guaranteed by the bylaw. There’s no arguing that. [The neighbours] may not agree with it, but there’s no arguing.”

And the look of Dr. Moghadam’s new home, Mr. Hamel believes, will actually add to the streetscape.

“The richness of this streetscape has to do with the differences, not with the sameness,” he says.

But by fighting this case, Mr. Sander says the community is actually doing Ottawa residents a service as it relates to the bylaw’s legalese and where homes can and can not be built.

He may soon have a political ally in the fight as new Councillor Shawn Menard said in his campaign platform that he would stand up to developers in the city.

“What I am concerned about in this city is the development and planning approach, which has traditionally been very in favour of developers in this city. They’re able to usually get every variance through that they apply for,” Mr. Menard says. “Right now, people aren’t finding it very fair to come into the city and have bylaws and variances that are often just approved without the debate they need.”

Despite the heated back-and-forth between neighbours, there’s little to be done until the appeal hearing in January.

Dr. Moghadam says despite the exchange with the neighbours, he’ll continue to give back to the community. He is a classic-car collector and hosted an open house in late November, with proceeds going to the May Court Hospice.

“We want to live in a normal, modern house where my kids have their own bedrooms. We just want to build a house and be part of the community and be part of the area. We love the street. It’s phenomenal,” he says. “The house fits in the neighbourhood and we want it to fit in the neighbourhood.”

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/real...r-a-new-build/
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  #84  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 6:56 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
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Posts: 1,332
I happen to think it looks fine in that neighbourhood. Just because it doesn't have a cross-hip with a dormer at the front doesn't mean it doesn't fit in... I think the renderings and material palette look great. Could be worse. Count your blessings.

Granted, the crotchety old man next door isn't ever going to appreciate the new shadow cast on his roof. But then, that's the real reason why he's organized this NIMBY group, right?



Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
In Ottawa’s Glebe, neighbours wrangle over a new build

by Adam Stanley
Special to The Globe and Mail
Published 5 hours ago


An Ottawa surgeon is fighting a group of neighbours who are trying to take a scalpel to the plans of his dream home and have already amassed an almost $13,000 war chest on GoFundMe.com.

Hassan Moghadam, the chief oral surgeon at Ottawa’s Monfort Hospital, bought the property last year on Broadway Avenue, within shouting distance of the Rideau Canal and the renovated Landsdowne Park in the Glebe, one of Ottawa’s elite neighbourhoods.

But Dr. Moghadam has found himself at odds with a group of neighbours committed to preserving the streetscape of Broadway Avenue.

Dr. Moghadam wanted to tear down the nearly 100-year-old home and build a dream property fit for his family – including four bedrooms (each of the three children get their own bedroom and bathroom), a large dining and kitchen area, a gym, and a personal theatre.

The neighbours feel the planned structure does not fit with the other homes of the street.

Dr. Moghadam claims the group – which started the GoFundMe campaign last month to raise money for legal fees – is ganging up on him as they resist change.

“You can imagine; it’s disturbing. These guys are on TV news, telling everyone what a horrible person I am, and I’m building a monster house, and I’m ruining the neighbourhood,” he says. “It’s pretty hard to take that, with a family and kids who go to school in the Glebe. I think it’s inhumane to take house construction to such a personal vendetta against someone who works in the community and helps people in the community every single day at the hospital.”

Dr. Moghadam currently lives with his wife, Litsa, and their three children in another home in the Glebe – a posh neighbourhood about 15 minutes from Parliament Hill.

The problem, according to residents, is not the look and feel of the home, which is set to be more than 3,900 square feet and will have three storeys, built of brick, limestone and copper. From a legal perspective, they can’t do anything about those aspects. What they are worried about is the look of their streetscape.

“’Your street gives you your rules.’ That’s the words in the mature-neighbourhood bylaws,” says resident Bernie Sander, who has lived on the street for more than 30 years.

“We’re not at all against modernity. [There have been] infills, new homes built on vacant lots or old homes torn down on the street and all of them are massively modern with a different look, but they have respected the streetscape and are aligned with the street.”

Mr. Sander believes the City of Ottawa is letting down its residents in this case. He feels a community group shouldn’t have to be the ones who are enforcing the bylaws.

Mr. Sander says people decide to move to Broadway because they want to be part of a mature neighbourhood. A neighbour down from 21 Broadway Ave. renovated their home within the past five years but kept the alignment – in the eyes of Mr. Sander and the community at large – as close to the existing as possible. He says Dr. Moghadam’s home isn’t doing that.

“Rather than a porch that projects towards the sidewalk, it’s going to be the whole goddamn house that’s going to be there,” Mr. Sander explains. “It’s a completely different look.”

However, City of Ottawa officials say what Dr. Moghadam is planning is within the rules.

Dr. Moghadam won his hearing at the Local Planning Appeal Tribunal earlier this year, but there will be an appeal in January. "Kind of a Pyrrhic victory,” Mr. Sander says, as the delay means the home won’t be built for another few months.

The only thing that is legally stopping a construction crew from beginning work on the project – other than the weather – is getting a building permit.

David Wise is a program manager of development review at the City of Ottawa and says there are a handful of “frustrating” things about this case.

He says the residents may not be aware that the zoning for Dr. Moghadam’s lot is actually categorized as Residential Third Density, which allows for a semi-detached or triplex to be built on the property.

“From the perspective of the city and mature neighbourhoods, we think the proponent fits in quite well,” Mr. Wise says. “It’s catering to the market demand, where people want to just have more house.”

Dr. Moghadam’s application for a variance isn’t egregious, Mr. Wise adds. For that lot, a “developmental box” exists that would allow construction of a house about 450 square metres wide and 10 metres high. Dr. Moghadam’s proposed home will fill approximately 90 per cent of the developmental box.

“It’s high, but it’s not crazy,” Mr. Wise says, pointing to many cases where people propose homes that max out their developmental box and then seek variances to take it even further – a trend the City of Ottawa is watching carefully.

In mature neighbourhoods in Ottawa, homes can be positioned away from the road an average of the distance of the two properties on either side.

“What a lot of community associations have the perspective of is, when they think of the front wall, they think the largest part of the house they see,” Mr. Wise says.

Dr. Moghadam’s architect, Jacques Hamel, says the only part of the building where a variance actually needed to be granted was for a portion of the building near the second-storey windows.

“It’s a little bit ludicrous in my mind,” he says. “There is an existing house on the property and what we’re proposing is entirely within that footprint. The whole footprint is set within what we are permitted from a bylaw perspective, and from existing non-conforming rights, due to the existence of the original building.

“We are building to the rights that were guaranteed by the bylaw. There’s no arguing that. [The neighbours] may not agree with it, but there’s no arguing.”

And the look of Dr. Moghadam’s new home, Mr. Hamel believes, will actually add to the streetscape.

“The richness of this streetscape has to do with the differences, not with the sameness,” he says.

But by fighting this case, Mr. Sander says the community is actually doing Ottawa residents a service as it relates to the bylaw’s legalese and where homes can and can not be built.

He may soon have a political ally in the fight as new Councillor Shawn Menard said in his campaign platform that he would stand up to developers in the city.

“What I am concerned about in this city is the development and planning approach, which has traditionally been very in favour of developers in this city. They’re able to usually get every variance through that they apply for,” Mr. Menard says. “Right now, people aren’t finding it very fair to come into the city and have bylaws and variances that are often just approved without the debate they need.”

Despite the heated back-and-forth between neighbours, there’s little to be done until the appeal hearing in January.

Dr. Moghadam says despite the exchange with the neighbours, he’ll continue to give back to the community. He is a classic-car collector and hosted an open house in late November, with proceeds going to the May Court Hospice.

“We want to live in a normal, modern house where my kids have their own bedrooms. We just want to build a house and be part of the community and be part of the area. We love the street. It’s phenomenal,” he says. “The house fits in the neighbourhood and we want it to fit in the neighbourhood.”

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/real...r-a-new-build/
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  #85  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 8:04 PM
Norman Bates Norman Bates is offline
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Is the real issue that Mr. Bernie Sander does not like the cut of Dr. Hassan Moghadam’s jib?
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  #86  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 8:15 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
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At the very least infill housing should use similar building materials. Where the neighbourhood is red brick houses, use red brick on infill houses.
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  #87  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 8:32 PM
Capital Shaun Capital Shaun is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
At the very least infill housing should use similar building materials. Where the neighbourhood is red brick houses, use red brick on infill houses.
Why?

When infills come to more recently built neighbourhoods, do we really want the bland off-white or beige vinyl siding replaced by more off-white or beige vinyl siding?

IMO, streets where all the houses look the same are kinda boring.

Last edited by Capital Shaun; Dec 6, 2018 at 8:33 PM. Reason: typo
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  #88  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2018, 9:34 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
At the very least infill housing should use similar building materials. Where the neighbourhood is red brick houses, use red brick on infill houses.
So, like what he's doing then?

The neighbourhood is limestone accents at entryways, with red brick.

So, that's how this new house is designed. Difference: No sloping roof. Big whoop.
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  #89  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 1:16 AM
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waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
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I'm having difficulty understanding how they could raise so much money to fight a three-foot reduction of the setback that applies to less than 10% of the facade. I know people with terminal cancer who got much less in their GoFundMe page.
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  #90  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 1:44 AM
Proof Sheet Proof Sheet is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
I'm having difficulty understanding how they could raise so much money to fight a three-foot reduction of the setback that applies to less than 10% of the facade. I know people with terminal cancer who got much less in their GoFundMe page.
I know people representing the owners and the opponents really were fighting over crumbs.

The Mature Neigbhourhoods overaly is sucking the vitality out of new rejuventation in older Ottawa neighbourhoods. Shawn Menard sounds like he won't be a friend of any of this kind of stuff although technically as a Councillor he is to stay away from Committee decisions.

If it went to LPAT recently how can they have another hearing in Janaury. Sounds like the neighbours don't know when to cut their losses. They lost once and I assume the same legal and planning representation won't be there again.
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  #91  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 5:51 AM
shawkr shawkr is offline
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Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
I'm having difficulty understanding how they could raise so much money to fight a three-foot reduction of the setback that applies to less than 10% of the facade. I know people with terminal cancer who got much less in their GoFundMe page.
I think the "neighbours" spent $30K the first time around.
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  #92  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 3:04 PM
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I think the "neighbours" spent $30K the first time around.
My friend lives on that street. These are the same neighbours who stopped him from building a small addition on the back of his house because of a technical setback that would have put them 6 inches over the allowable setback (which makes no sense in the context and has no actual impact on any neighbour). He eventually went ahead, but had to build an indent in the wall of his house to meet the rules exactly, rather than face the wrath of these people.

Too much time, too much money and a very healthy sense of entitlement.
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  #93  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 3:36 PM
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I know no one wants to bring this up, but I can't help but wonder if racism plays a role.
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  #94  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 3:49 PM
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I know no one wants to bring this up, but I can't help but wonder if racism plays a role.
Can't rule it out, but my friend is white and they were equally dickish to him.
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  #95  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 4:07 PM
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Originally Posted by phil235 View Post
My friend lives on that street. These are the same neighbours who stopped him from building a small addition on the back of his house because of a technical setback that would have put them 6 inches over the allowable setback (which makes no sense in the context and has no actual impact on any neighbour). He eventually went ahead, but had to build an indent in the wall of his house to meet the rules exactly, rather than face the wrath of these people.

Too much time, too much money and a very healthy sense of entitlement.
I end up being at roughly 1/3 of the Committee hearings in Panel 1 and some of the crazy twists and turns that people have to do to get approval for fairly minor things amazes me. Often times the opponents don't fully understand the scope of the variances and often are not aware of actually how close to the lot lines a building could be anyway and the current building on the lot is an underdevelopment of the lot based on zoning.

The Glebe has got to be on the most entitled 'raise the drawbridge I have my piece of paradise and nobody else can build' neighbourhoods in the City.
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Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 4:26 PM
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Originally Posted by OTownandDown View Post
So, like what he's doing then?

The neighbourhood is limestone accents at entryways, with red brick.

So, that's how this new house is designed. Difference: No sloping roof. Big whoop.
My comment was a general one and as you point out (I did notice the red brick) not specific to this case. I have seen other cases with house extensions that were grossly out of place with the neighbourhood and indeed the original house itself that was not being torn down. I know it is always difficult to assess, but infill and housing extensions should improve the neighbourhood, not make it worse.
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Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 5:25 PM
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At the very least infill housing should use similar building materials. Where the neighbourhood is red brick houses, use red brick on infill houses.
Why?
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  #98  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 5:26 PM
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Originally Posted by shawkr View Post
I think the "neighbours" spent $30K the first time around.
Must be nice to have that kind of cash burning holes in your pants pockets.
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  #99  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 7:50 PM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
My comment was a general one and as you point out (I did notice the red brick) not specific to this case. I have seen other cases with house extensions that were grossly out of place with the neighbourhood and indeed the original house itself that was not being torn down. I know it is always difficult to assess, but infill and housing extensions should improve the neighbourhood, not make it worse.
I think perhaps your method would be pandering to the NIMBY's if this were to become a rigid requirement.

I wouldn't want to conflate the ideas of 'similar' material and 'quality' material. Often times the quality of a cladding is the issue, rather than the type. And in neighbourhoods like this one, red brick on a front facade shouldn't be the be-all/end-all. Nothing bothers me more than a front facade in brick veneer with back and sides in shitty vinyl. What the hell is the point of that?

Having said that, engineered 'wood' cladding panels (as have become popular in Westboro) which turn an unfortunate perimeter grey and delaminate within a couple years should also be avoided.

What is the solution? I don't know. Something better. The same problems happen with larger construction projects as well (I'm looking at Claridge). The new fad of clay brick on a bar-code facade, which inevitably has water infiltration, freeze-thaw damage, etc. etc. is a scourge on society.
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  #100  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2018, 8:06 PM
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I live in Old Ottawa South. I was walking along Belmont Avenue the other day b/w Riverdale and the river and thinking about the Broadway Avenue case. As I did so, I noticed just how much built-form variety there was. It's clear that the block was built up over several decades. Some houses have one story, others have two or two-and-a-half. Some have front porches. Others do not. Some brick. Some stucco. Some obvious extensions and additions. Some lots are wide, others are narrow. Lots of different roofing styles. I hadn't truly noticed how diverse the housing was before. Because it just seemed like a pleasant block with some houses I quite like and others I don't. A house only sticks out here in a negative way because it is ugly, not because it doesn't "fit in".

If we insist on conformity, then sure, a non-conforming building sticks out and disturbs the "local character". But that's not an argument for an aesthetic of conformity, only a description of it. The real question is what kind of aesthetic character do we want: strict conformity or permissive diversity?
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