CHICAGO | Politics and Current Events

[Jibba]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

Agree except the asinine 80/20 nonsense.

You realize that the people that most need public transit can't come close to affording the rent in any of the "transit-oriented" developments being built, right??

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Jibba

You realize that the people that most need public transit can't come close to affording the rent in any of the "transit-oriented" developments being built, right??

Since when do they have a God given right to live in a newly constructed building with all of the top of the line amenities?



There is plenty of affordable housing stock in decent condition in this city. And near the L too.

Let me repeat myself: plenty. Abundant. More than we know what to do with because, you know, the whole population decline thing... But sure let's just give a spanking new apartment to a freeloader while everybody else has to actually pay for it. That's a great lesson to teach our kids--why work for anything? Just be like that guy, sit on your monthly Government check and you can still live in a spanking new pad in the heart of the city.

[Chi-Sky21]

They can, just not "transit-oriented" developments in well to do areas.

[Stunnies23]

Originally Posted by Jibba

You realize that the people that most need public transit can't come close to affording the rent in any of the "transit-oriented" developments being built, right??

Well, there are dozens of other El stops that have more affordable rent.

[Jibba]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

Since when do they have a God given right to live in a newly constructed building with all of the top of the line amenities?



There is plenty of affordable housing stock in decent condition in this city. And near the L too.

Let me repeat myself: plenty. Abundant. More than we know what to do with because, you know, the whole population decline thing... But sure let's just give a spankingnew apartment to a freeloader while everybody else has to actually pay for it. That's a great lesson to teach our kids--why work for anything? Just be like that guy, sit on your monthly Government check and you can still live in a spanking new pad in the heart of the city.

You're right, my mistake; people subsisting off of the government are completely comfortable doing so, have no aspirations of something else, and have no sense of shame and embarrassment about it. Definitely something that young folks are sure to emulate...

When their hours-plus commute gets too long for them to be able to clean your clothes and make your coffee and take-out food (and remove your trash, and take care of the sewers--all the shit jobs they should be grateful to have), you'll think twice about not caring about where they live.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Jibba

You're right, my mistake; people subsisting off of the government are completely comfortable doing so, have no aspirations of something else, and have no sense of shame and embarrassment about it. Definitely something that young folks are sure to emulate...

When their hours-plus commute gets too long for them to be able to clean your clothes and make your coffee and take-out food (and remove your trash, and take care of the sewers--all the shit jobs they should be grateful to have), you'll think twice about not caring about where they live.

Pitch your sob story to someone else. Chicago is far away from having a crisis that you describe. We've got land right next to downtown that nobody wants to build anything on, that's the current status of our "affordable housing crisis".

Wake me up to listen to your tearjerker when nobody can find a single apartment for less than $1.50 per square foot within an hour of downtown.

[Via Chicago]

i mean, i do think theres a fair point that if we're talking about conversions, most of the down conversions are likely vintage 2 flats that otherwise would have been more affordable to rent, being turned into fancy SFHs. these are the types of rentals most prevalent in neighborhoods on the north side that would have given a person who couldnt afford a top of the line building, a way to still live in a more expensive neighborhood. these served as an important bedrock of the chicago rental market for a long time. now however as mentioned, those are being replaced with top of the line units in much fancier, larger, newer buildings charging top of the line rent. the person who could afford an $800-900 unit in an older building probably cant easily just be absorbed into a new building charging 2-3 times as much. it also continues the process of pushing Mom and Pop landlords out of the business, and replacing it more with large corporate-owned entities in neighborhoods. i think its detrimental to communities in general.

[ChiHi]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

Pitch your sob story to someone else. Chicago is far away from having a crisis that you describe. We've got land right next to downtown that nobody wants to build anything on, that's the current status of our "affordable housing crisis".

Wake me up to listen to your tearjerker when nobody can find a single apartment for less than $1.50 per square foot within an hour of downtown.

Couldn't agree more. I've come to notice that the people complaining about a housing crisis in Chicago tend to lack one of two things.

1.) Realistic expectations for what they think they are entitled to get for their money (most common). No. You likely cannot find a 2 bed 2 bath place with parking in downtown for $1,200/mo. You'll need to go a whopping 2 miles away for that. Bridgeport, Pilsen, Little Village, Bronzeville, Humboldt Park are all quite affordable and very close to downtown.

2.) Relative comparison to other cities. Our property taxes aren't great but they are only in the mid range as far as other larger cities. Try Milwaukee where a $350k loft in the 3rd ward comes with a $8k-$10k tax bill.

[Investing In Chicago]

Originally Posted by Jibba

You're right, my mistake; people subsisting off of the government are completely comfortable doing so, have no aspirations of something else, and have no sense of shame and embarrassment about it. Definitely something that young folks are sure to emulate...

When their hours-plus commute gets too long for them to be able to clean your clothes and make your coffee and take-out food (and remove your trash, and take care of the sewers--all the shit jobs they should be grateful to have), you'll think twice about not caring about where they live.

Do you actually live in Chicago? The city is ridiculously affordable.

I own a 16 unit apartment building within a 5 min walk to the EL; be downtown in 20 min; the neighborhood is relatively safe as well. I rent my 2bd 1bth units for $800/mo (no security deposit)...they are renovated within the last 10 years.

[LouisVanDerWright]

Chicago has a critical affordability crisis, but not the kind Jibba describes. Quite the opposite really.

Chicago has a crisis of affordability where buildings are TOO affordable in huge swaths of the city and therefore not worth rehabilitating or maintaining. Think of the tens of thousands of units that have already rotted away along the South Lakefront. These buildings are not decaying because of gentrification. They are decaying because there are simply not enough people to rent them. Therefore these beautiful units are gradually left to rot because there is no profitable business plan to bring them back. At least not a plan that overcomes the massive costs associated with renovating historic building stock in Chicago.

All the jokers who think we lack affordable housing explain to me why I am able to pick up a two flat, a four flat, and two vacant lots literally next to the L (it runs down my alley) a block away from the train for $150,000? Oh I forgot, that's a massive increase in price over the price of FREE I paid for another six unit building on that block in the recession because it was about to be razed.

How much did those buildings cost to renovate? $110k per unit. I spend almost as much to renovate one unit as I did to buy two lots and two solid brick buildings. Those buildings literally had no updates since 1885, original kitchen and bathrooms. They were already almost 100 years beyond the typical useful life of real estate. They were left to rot. That is not a sign of a wildly expensive real estate market.

All of these properties sit within a block of the pink line station, a block from Riot Fest, a block from Lagunitas, and a block from Cinespace. This is not an area without reasons to live there. So please, tell me why I continue to get buildings virtually for free if we have such an issue with housing prices.

Oh and by the way, my units rent from $1250 for a 2/1 up to $2250 for a massive duplex 4/2 that's basically a house. For new plumbing, framing, electrical, windows, tuckpointing, roof, heat, ac (with humidifier), solid oak floors (no laminate bullshit), sprayfoam insulation, 5/8" drywall, stainless appliances, restored 18"x7' art glass arches, new water line, new sewer, etc etc etc... For 4 stops down from the West Loop, 3 stops from the IMD, 6 stops from the Loop.

And for those who can't even afford that, I have another building one stop down the line that was partially gutted in 1995 that I've done cosmetic updates to where I rent small 2/1's for $800 a month. That's a 20 minute ride from Clark and Lake.


Anyone who wants to complain about housing affordability can shove whatever bullshit they are spouting up their ass. If you actually know someone who needs a cheap place to stay who has a decent job, PM me and I'll get them a place for like $800. If I'm full up I'll just go buy another building and fill that one up to. There is literally a limitless supply of buildings in decent areas of Chicago near the train. My growth is only limited by how quickly I can renovate them, lease them up, and accumulate enough rents to buy another.

[Investing In Chicago]

^^^ x2

[IrishIllini]

Hearing people complain about the cost of living (real estate) in Chicago is unbearable. I see condo listings in Lakeview with monthly mortgage payments less than asking rents IN THE SAME BUILDING. You can buy a good sized, relatively current house in a suburb like Park Ridge for $400k.

[Notyrview]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

Pitch your sob story to someone else. Chicago is far away from having a crisis that you describe. We've got land right next to downtown that nobody wants to build anything on, that's the current status of our "affordable housing crisis".

Wake me up to listen to your tearjerker when nobody can find a single apartment for less than $1.50 per square foot within an hour of downtown.

The point I've been trying to make ad nauseam is that working class, and especially immigrant communities, depend on living together in close proximity for survival. It doesn't matter if low-cost housing is available in dislocated areas, what matters is strong/safe neighborhoods, and 80/20 allows for just that.

You can call whomever you want a tearjerker, but you're an extremist with very little empathy. I'd much rather have my heart bleeding for the whole world to see.

It's almost laughable that people are lobbing around "Oooo what a bargain, i can pick up some housing for only $150K". Helllo? get out of your privileged mentality for a minute. Immigrant communities hardly ever can afford to own anything. And in case you forgot, that's what this country is all about. Immigrants moving and building strong networks so the next generation can thrive.

[Notyrview]

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

Hearing people complain about the cost of living (real estate) in Chicago is unbearable. I see condo listings in Lakeview with monthly mortgage payments less than asking rents IN THE SAME BUILDING.

Case in point

[LouisVanDerWright]

^^^ You can buy an entire building in some neighborhoods for the equivalent of a couple month's rent on the Northside for Pete's sake!

[Notyrview]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

^^^ You can buy an entire building in some neighborhoods for the equivalent of a couple month's rent on the Northside for Pete's sake!

I know it's so rad! and that's exactly what all our new residents from Mexico are doing! Flipping property! Yay! #maga

[IrishIllini]

Originally Posted by Notyrview

I know it's so rad! and that's exactly what all our new residents from Mexico are doing! Flipping property! Yay! #maga

I feel as though you're intentionally misrepresenting what has been said. Not every neighborhood that isn't Lakeview is like Roseland. There are A LOT of affordable, safe, well-connected neighborhoods throughout Chicago. Houses on the NW side can be bought for $200k or less. Houses on the SW side are a bit cheaper. Neither of these areas has any immediate "threat" of gentrification. The south side Lakefront is a great opportunity for upwardly mobile immigrants in my opinion. You're not going to get the Big Ten crowd to move into South Shore, but immigrants may.

I agree that mixed income housing has benefits, but not everyone can or needs to live in Lincoln Park.

[Khantilever]

Originally Posted by Notyrview

The point I've been trying to make ad nauseam is that working class, and especially immigrant communities, depend on living together in close proximity for survival. It doesn't matter if low-cost housing is available in dislocated areas, what matters is strong/safe neighborhoods, and 80/20 allows for just that.

You can call whomever you want a tearjerker, but you're an extremist with very little empathy. I'd much rather have my heart bleeding for the whole world to see.

It's almost laughable that people are lobbing around "Oooo what a bargain, i can pick up some housing for only $150K". Helllo? get out of your privileged mentality for a minute. Immigrant communities hardly ever can afford to own anything. And in case you forgot, that's what this country is all about. Immigrants moving and building strong networks so the next generation can thrive.

And the counterpoint that others have made ad nauseum is that it’s not obvious that an 80/20 requirement actually preserves communities. The disincentive to build new housing that such a requirement places might, via higher housing costs, overwhelm the amount of “affordable housing” created in these new developments.

I’m genuinely curious why you don’t believe that’s the case.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Notyrview

The point I've been trying to make ad nauseam is that working class, and especially immigrant communities, depend on living together in close proximity for survival. It doesn't matter if low-cost housing is available in dislocated areas, what matters is strong/safe neighborhoods, and 80/20 allows for just that.

You can call whomever you want a tearjerker, but you're an extremist with very little empathy. I'd much rather have my heart bleeding for the whole world to see.

It's almost laughable that people are lobbing around "Oooo what a bargain, i can pick up some housing for only $150K". Helllo? get out of your privileged mentality for a minute. Immigrant communities hardly ever can afford to own anything. And in case you forgot, that's what this country is all about. Immigrants moving and building strong networks so the next generation can thrive.

Of course I’m not an “extremist” for disagreeing with 80/20. But keep saying that if you wish, I’m not offended.

You create a problem where there isn’t one, and your approach to resolve it is toxic—plain and simple. It would be best we lay off this discussion because I cannot possibly come anywhere near to agreeing to your world view when it comes to this particular issue.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Khantilever

And the counterpoint that others have made ad nauseum is that it’s not obvious that an 80/20 requirement actually preserves communities. The disincentive to build new housing that such a requirement places might, via higher housing costs, overwhelm the amount of “affordable housing” created in these new developments.

I’m genuinely curious why you don’t believe that’s the case.

Because he thinks with his “bleeding heart”. Let others figure out those pesky details.

I guarantee you guys like this have never ran a business in their lives, even a small one. They have never had to put together a balance sheet, once. People like this don’t relate—it’s easier to villainize