Will Jagmeet Singh win the Burnaby South by-election?

[mistercorporate]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Nenshi is Ismaili, is he not ( is he observant)? They are usually exempt from anti-Muslim views. I'm not familar enought with Sikhism to know what tenets of the religion make people uncomfortable.

There is nothing anti-Western about Sikhism, just as there is nothing anti-Western about Judaism. There is reason for concern when highly politicized and nationalistic members of that faith's insular baptized Sikh community (in Brampton) run for our highest office just as there would be concern if an ultra-orthodox Jewish nationalist ran for president of the USA (imagine the foreign policy implications). Jagmeet's promotion of the ludicrous Sikh genocide bill among other things is unbecoming of a Canadian PM, and he would likely not be welcome in India. His turban style is also a popular one among Sikh militants and is rarely seen outside certain circles in Surrey or Brampton.

[mistercorporate]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

"Played"? I think it's just a case of not living up to expectations.

Yep, Canada will be more than comfortable with a capable non-white or non-Christian PM, but Jagmeet isn't that person.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by mistercorporate

His turban style is also a popular one among Sikh militants and is rarely seen outside certain circles in Surrey or Brampton.

Now I'm intrigued... what is the difference between his turban and the garden variety Sikh turban you see all over Ontario and western Canada? What is the implicit meaning of Singh's style of turban?

[mistercorporate]

Originally Posted by esquire

Now I'm intrigued... what is the difference between his turban and the garden variety Sikh turban you see all over Ontario and western Canada? What is the implicit meaning of Singh's style of turban?

Notice the overlapping folds in an upside down V shape with the visible undercloth?:



Jagmeets is more evenly folded, in a long elongated style, favored by Sikh militants and those going for a similar look. I guess the implicit statement is that Sikh nationalism is an important part of his identity:

[esquire]

Originally Posted by mistercorporate

Jagmeets is more evenly folded, in a long elongated style, favored by Sikh militants and those going for a similar look:

Interesting, thanks for the insight.

To me, Sajjan's turban as shown above is pretty much the standard look that I would expect for a turban-wearing Sikh male. I see it on a daily basis around here.

I noticed that Singh's turban looked different, but I chalked it up to his fashion plate tendencies, I figured it was a style thing but as you note there may be some political elements to it.

If you google image search 'khalistan activists' you will see a lot of the Sajjan style (for lack of a better term) normal turban, but you also see plenty of Singh's style:


source: hindustantimes.com

[mistercorporate]

Yeah, some nationalist types are even clean shaven and dont have turbans, but if they have this look then 9 times out of 10...

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by esquire

As interesting as hearing lio's views about Sikhs for the umpteenth time is, imma change the subject ever so slightly.

Singh was caught like a deer in the headlights on CTV Question Period yesterday when Evan Solomon asked him about the Chinese ambassador's accusation published in the Hill Times that Canada is motivated in part by 'white supremacy' in its dealings with China, with the implication being that it was a factor in how the Meng Wangzhou situation is being handled.

Singh didn't seem to know what this was all about and danced around the question. The Twitterverse lit up, with numerous people expressing stunned surprise that Singh was apparently so poorly prepared/briefed that he didn't have a response.

My initial thought wasn't that Singh was ignorant of the claim, but rather that he has to walk a fine line simply because there are probably factions within the NDP where denying Canadian white supremacy (in the guise of colonialism or however else it might be described) would lose you some real cred. In other words, Singh is too woke to deny the accusation of systemic white supremacy or racism on Canada's part.

Which I suppose is fine if you're a student union protester rallying people to the cause. But it's not a good look if you're basically applying to be the Prime Minister of Canada.

Does anybody really believe Singh (or any NDP leader) is applying to be PM of Canada? Seriously, there was one brief flicker of time when Jack Layton was able to capitalize on Liberal Party weakness and the Quebecois electorate penchant for a "flavour of the month" when voting. They were never going to seriously form government. Their role is to push the governing Liberals to adopt a more socialist stance than they normally might.

[esquire]

^ Well, let's just say that he's theoretically applying to be the Prime Minister of Canada.

And for what it's worth, for a while there it looked like Jack Layton actually had a shot at winning. Imagine he had stayed healthy after the 2011 election... with a solid performance during the final years of the Harper government, a NDP victory in 2015 would not have been out of the question.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ Well, let's just say that he's theoretically applying to be the Prime Minister of Canada.

And for what it's worth, for a while there it looked like Jack Layton actually had a shot at winning. Imagine he had stayed healthy after the 2011 election... with a solid performance during the final years of the Harper government, a NDP victory in 2015 would not have been out of the question.

This is my view as well.

The fact that he only has a remote chance of winning doesn't really placate me.

The party he leads will be running candidates in all ridings andi it's the third most popular party in the country.

His views on religion and the state/in the public sphere and everything else from defence spending to economic policy to daycare, I want to know about.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by esquire

Interesting, thanks for the insight.

mistercorporate is a bit out there sometimes and there's obviously some personal or family history there, but his comments have also led me to learn more about Sikhism and the Khalistan movement. By and large he's not spreading falsehoods about the movement, though we can only speculate about where Jagmeet Singh fits into all that - he himself has on occasion been quite coy about all of that, so...

As I mentioned before on here before, last year I listened to former BC Premier Ujjal Dosanjh at a conference in Ottawa and even chatted a bit with him afterwards. He is a Sikh but does wear a beard nor a turban and openly rejects the more militant aspects of the culture and religion. (He almost paid dearly for that with an assassination attempt at one point.)

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Acajack

mistercorporate is a bit out there sometimes and there's obviously some personal or family history there, but his comments have also led me to learn more about Sikhism and the Khalistan movement. By and large he's not spreading falsehoods about the movement, though we can only speculate about where Jagmeet Singh fits into all that - he himself has on occasion been quite coy about all of that, so...

As I mentioned before on here before, last year I listened to former BC Premier Ujjal Dosanjh at a conference in Ottawa and even chatted a bit with him afterwards. He is a Sikh but does wear a beard nor a turban and openly rejects the more militant aspects of the culture and religion. (He almost paid dearly for that with an assassination attempt at one point.)

Meh, I'm sure of one had the time to dig one would fine Irish-Canadian or Irish-American politicians from the 1970s who were "vague" on the IRA.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Meh, I'm sure of one had the time to dig one would fine Irish-Canadian or Irish-American politicians from the 1970s who were "vague" on the IRA.

It was up to people to raise those issues back then if it bothered them.

I don't think that's relevant to today's debate.

Anyway, whether or not Jagmeet Singh is a Khalistan separatist sympathizer is largely irrelevant. I mean, we have people who want to make a part of Canada independent sitting in our Parliament.

But ties to extremism (I have no idea if they exist BTW) are a whole other matter. Just like it would be unacceptable for a Bloc Québécois (or Parti Québécois) member to have ties with the FLQ...

[Bcasey25raptor]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Not really, Kennedy Stewart won by just 547 votes last time. It is a sad but true fact that Indo-Canadians poll lower on civic election slates in Vancouver/Burnaby when voters have a choice. There is also a strong contingent of organized and conservatively bigotted Chinese voters in Burnaby, check this out:
https://bc.ctvnews.ca/burnaby-all-ca...asty-1.4122342

Sorry but I don't trust those polls at all. Burnaby south as a riding has been in NDP hands for the better part of 30 or so years.

The reason it was in contention in 2015 was due to higher turnout among liberal supporters, not a conservative threat.

I still predict the NDP will win burnaby south as it's a riding that practically always swings that way.

Edit: The burnaby citizens coalition are an extremist faction in burnaby that runs in civic elections and always loses. The amount of right of centre extremists you point to in burnaby are much smaller in numbers than you make it seem. I doubt they'd be a factor much at all. Fact remains, the NDP has won this riding in every election federally and provincially for years, even the precursers of this riding were NDP going as far back as the 80s, possibly longer.

is the vote margin as large as back then? no, But Trudeau's Liberals are polling worse in BC than they were during the 2015 election while the NDP provincially is polling about the same.

As for the cons taking this riding? Yeah no, that won't happen.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by misher

Totally true, the left wing which tends to be the poor or middle who want more taxes more social security more jobs also tend to be anti immigration anti foreigner. Singh is an oxymoron and the NDP is risking its traditional voter base to appeal to the indo community (who already were usually voting NDP).

Indo-Canadians both federally and provincially tend to vote more Liberal or Conservative until Singh came along in Brampton with the exception of BC where many there vote NDP.

I totally disagree with what you wrote. I live in Timmins, ON which is big-time NDP both federally and provincially. Very few people here are anti-immigration. We need new people as there are employment shortages just like there are across much of Canada. And even in Timmins there is a new Sikh population and almost everybody finds the people to be very friendly and respectful.

Singh hasn't done well as NDP leader because many Canadians haven't heard much from him and many have no idea who he is. Singh isn't an immigrant. Born in Ontario. I don't think belonging to a minority religion will hurt him that much. But he has made errors that have turned off many people and his religion and background have little to do with it.

He is too much like Justin Trudeau, in fact maybe a "Trudeau on steroids" who goes too far. He lost a lot of credibility when he invited the media to his marriage proposal to his future wife. That was so lame. Here is a video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfsrkVN7vpU He wanted to show off his future wife and himself in a very self-centered way. Like WTF was he thinking? Poor judgement for sure.

[Dengler Avenue]

Oh yea? If anything I thought that was cool (although I also thought he should just focus more on family rather than get meddled in politics in that case).

[Loco101]

A lot of people in Timmins think that Charlie Angus will soon be the next NDP leader.

But I still feel that Singh will win the BC riding with about 35-38% of the votes. It will be close but he's a party leader which means something more than just having an ordinary MP. Singh is also known as being a very good campaigner. I realize that Burnaby is not the same as Brampton but Singh has a chance given that the last MP was NDP.

[ssiguy]

Let`s forget the fact that Singh is a Sikh and just look at him individually. The guy has proven time and again that he has shockingly little understanding of key policy issues. His speaking and motivational skills are so poor he would have a hard time motivating a 5 year old into a candy shop. The NDP thought they had young dynamic leader that could outshine Trudeau and instead got a dud that has shown that he doesn't have the skills to run a newsstand and the NDP know it and perhaps even worse, the public knows it. It has become crystal clear to everyone that the NDP now knows that made a fatal error in choosing Singh and the voters are legitimately asking if his own party doesn't have faith in their new leader to even run the party then how can we have faith in him to run the country?


It's pretty sad when you are a newly elected leader of a party and the only one who seems to be gunning for you is Trudeau.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Let`s forget the fact that Singh is a Sikh and just look at him individually. The guy has proven time and again that he has shockingly little understanding of key policy issues. His speaking and motivational skills are so poor he would have a hard time motivating a 5 year old into a candy shop. The NDP thought they had young dynamic leader that could outshine Trudeau and instead got a dud that has shown that he doesn't have the skills to run a newsstand and the NDP know it and perhaps even worse, the public knows it. It has become crystal clear to everyone that the NDP now knows that made a fatal error in choosing Singh and the voters are legitimately asking if his own party doesn't have faith in their new leader to even run the party then how can we have faith in him to run the country?


It's pretty sad when you are a newly elected leader of a party and the only one who seems to be gunning for you is Trudeau.

I actually find Singh to be a pretty good speaker.

Agree with the rest of your points, though.

[Docere]

Singh ahead in Burnaby South - strong Chinese/non-Chinese split

https://www.mainstreetresearch.ca/si...h-by-election/

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Docere

Singh ahead in Burnaby South - strong Chinese/non-Chinese split

https://www.mainstreetresearch.ca/si...h-by-election/

Do I misunderstand the report? It suggests that the split is within the Chinese community itself.