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  #11801  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 4:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Zmapper View Post
Bike lanes: I've come to dislike standard bike lanes next to traffic lanes as a bus operator. When servicing a stop, it's about a 50-50 chance that other drivers will treat the remaining 5 feet or so of the traffic lane as a lane. The bike lane also tends to be a bit of a blind spot for large vehicle operators when merging or turning right.

The 'Yurope solution of tucking the bike lane behind a boarding island is far superior for all users.
The city is developing bike design standards. A big piece of the work will be around bus/bike interactions (emphasis at bus stops). The work will develop the thresholds for when a floating bus island (FBI) will be required and when it won’t. Criteria include ridership, frequencies, and bike counts.

The city is also looking to pilot a temporary boarding platform program. Something like this ZICLA product for when funding isn’t available for a permanent bus island:


Last edited by PLANSIT; Nov 30, 2018 at 4:46 PM.
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  #11802  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 4:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zmapper View Post
Bike lanes: I've come to dislike standard bike lanes next to traffic lanes as a bus operator. When servicing a stop, it's about a 50-50 chance that other drivers will treat the remaining 5 feet or so of the traffic lane as a lane. The bike lane also tends to be a bit of a blind spot for large vehicle operators when merging or turning right.

The 'Yurope solution of tucking the bike lane behind a boarding island is far superior for all users.
^This

There are now several of these downtown, and their effectiveness speaks for itself. They effectively act as a "bulb out" for pedestrians as well, providing a pedestrian island and narrowing the crosswalk distance. 16th and Lawrence comes to mind as an example. Narrowing the curb to curb in urban street design makes sense anyway, and does not have to limit our options for transit solutions - many of our roads have 4 or 5 WIDE lanes plus parking - pretty serious overkill if you ask me. And the extra space required to protect a bike lane doesn't necessarily expand the space allocated to bikes at all - it just reallocates curbside features like street trees, bus stops, bike racks, or even parking meters. Again, I would argue that these changes make life better for pedestrians in a pedestrian environment.

It seems to me this is more a question of funding and timing rather than a geometric question whether there is space in the ROW for both a good bike lane and curbside drop off - of course there is. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to spend millions moving curb, gutter, and storm sewer infrastructure just for bikes.

But striping solutions are much cheaper, and policy changes in regards to best practices can be made right now. And as funding comes available for individual corridors (for a whole host of other reasons), more durable solutions can be put into place over time. Notice how in that example at 16th and Lawrence, the new island doesn't extend all the way to the mall. I could be wrong, but I assume this is because it makes more sense to wait until mall reconstruction begins, and then leverage that project budget to finish off those extra square feet (same goes for the brand new curb extension at 16th and Market). The same principal applies all over the city.
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  #11803  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 5:27 PM
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The part they are having the most issues with is the one that was a no-brainer for grade separation - York to Steele. Boggles the mind.
Yeah, hindsight on this one screams for all three of these intersection to be grade-separated. The only one that might have been a little challenging would be York/Josephine.

I'm interested to see how much RTD and DTP will each pony up to make this whole thing go away. I'm guessing $50M each give or take $10M.
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  #11804  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 5:44 PM
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https://denverite.com/2018/11/29/a-g...eid=ccfa777344
Quote:
Denver has a lot of transportation plans. ... They also contain price tags of more than $6 billion.

“We’re gonna look at a more regional approach as opposed to just Denver,” Hancock said during an interview at the Sustainable Denver Summit. “I think we’ll have some success. I’ve already had a few preliminary conversations with some mayors.”
Not much to go on except I've calculated all along that a metro-wide effort made the most sense. Is Hancock thinking that such cooperation could satisfy half or more of that $6 billion plus?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
Yeah, hindsight on this one screams for all three of these intersection to be grade-separated. The only one that might have been a little challenging would be York/Josephine.

I'm interested to see how much RTD and DTP will each pony up to make this whole thing go away. I'm guessing $50M each give or take $10M.
I have to wonder if FRA is frustrated partly by the conflict between RTD and DTP and assume this half the problem?
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  #11805  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 6:39 PM
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Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
Yeah, hindsight on this one screams for all three of these intersection to be grade-separated. The only one that might have been a little challenging would be York/Josephine.

I'm interested to see how much RTD and DTP will each pony up to make this whole thing go away. I'm guessing $50M each give or take $10M.
There wasn't $50m in equity in DTP to start with, that's half the problem. Much cheaper for them to walk away.
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  #11806  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 7:13 PM
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There wasn't $50m in equity in DTP to start with, that's half the problem. Much cheaper for them to walk away.
You know they ain't going to do that and if they don't have $50M in an umbrella policy I'll laugh my ass off.
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  #11807  
Old Posted Nov 30, 2018, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
You know they ain't going to do that and if they don't have $50M in an umbrella policy I'll laugh my ass off.
I actually do think they would do that. Once the equity evaporates, their reason for staying is nil. The payment stream is fixed - they know exactly what they'll be getting over the term. Once that goes negative, there's no coming back.

That's an interesting idea with the insurance. But what would you say the insurable event here is? "Shit we built not working" isn't usually something a contractor can recover on.
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  #11808  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2018, 5:50 AM
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Originally Posted by PLANSIT View Post
The city is developing bike design standards
Do we really need to reinvent the wheel? Are our cyclists more special than other cities? Couldn't we just use NACTO and be done with it?
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  #11809  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2018, 10:33 PM
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Somebody check my math

If Denver reserves one lane for cyclists; reserves one lane for big and small buses; reserves one lane for private passenger vans, limos and other ride hailing vehicles and lastly one general purpose lane... doesn't that just about cover the road real estate in downtown aside from parking?

Wouldn't the next logical step be to take 15th, 17th, 18th and 19th streets and make both bus lanes and van/limo/ride hailing lanes into HOV lanes with express tolling? Add in signal priority and you could allocate time similar to 'talk radio' where every half hour has 18 minutes of talk, 10 minutes of advertising and 2 minutes of news at the top and bottom of the hour. Only in this case time priority goes 18 minutes for favored streets, 10 minutes for the other streets and 2 minutes for pedestrians.
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  #11810  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2018, 7:16 PM
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Do we really need to reinvent the wheel? Are our cyclists more special than other cities? Couldn't we just use NACTO and be done with it?
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...-million-levy/
Speaking of bike lanes, Seattle has a very enthusiastic and 'entitled' group of bike (lane) lovers. They even managed to pressure city council into passing a "a nonbinding resolution calling for a complete network of downtown bike lanes by the end of next year."

In 2015, Seattle, the city voters passed Move Seattle, a $930 million tax initiative that was all about multimodal transportation. The sun, the moon and stars were promised; since then the fog has rolled in. One problem is that the protected bike lanes promised, instead of costing $860,000 per mile ended up costing as much as $12 million per mile. Ouch! Getting half the promised bike lanes may still be optimistic.

Much of the projected estimates relied on Federal funding which may or may not materialize. After a year of study, the new mayor has released a new 'list' which is likely optimistic but certainly more realistic.

One of the projects moving forward is to tear out and replace 10 miles of road with concrete. While this costs 8X as much as asphalt, it turns out that the bus traffic tears up asphalt quickly. Another good reason to consider using smaller buses if Big Bertha buses aren't necessary.

With respect to $937 million Elevate Denver Bond Program (half for transportation) which doesn't rely on Federal funding, we can only hope they fare better than Seattle. I know it has a 10% contingency so there's reason for optimism but who knows what will actually happen?
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  #11811  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2018, 9:30 PM
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Bike lanes only cost that much if a HELL of a lot of other stuff gets involve, like utilities, including the case they're alluding to which was in the CBD. The Times and a columnist or two are opponents of bike lanes. So take it all with a grain of salt.
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  #11812  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2018, 9:59 PM
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Originally Posted by mhays View Post
Bike lanes only cost that much if a HELL of a lot of other stuff gets involve, like utilities, including the case they're alluding to which was in the CBD. The Times and a columnist or two are opponents of bike lanes. So take it all with a grain of salt.
Very fair; EngiNerd would remind us that RTD's West LRT line was more of a drainage project masquerading as a light rail construction project. But the point was that to install protected bike lanes w/o doing the attendant necessary infrastructure work made little sense and w/o other funding available they used what they had. I'm not sure Denver will have those issues in their CBD or at least not everywhere. They did spend a chunk of money redoing 14th street though.

The bigger point is that what sounds easy-peasy to the layman can get real complicated and real pricey real fast. But ignorance is bliss and everybody have an opinion. That's life.
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  #11813  
Old Posted Dec 5, 2018, 5:33 PM
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Intelligent transportation?


Source

Wide open bus lanes; buses going 60 miles per hour?

My problem? I was Born to be Wild.
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  #11814  
Old Posted Dec 10, 2018, 2:33 AM
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DIA Updated concourse plans:
https://business.flydenver.com/bizop..._Expansion.pdf

A bunch more glass than the current concourses.

Neat that the concourse ends will have an outdoor terrace.
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  #11815  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2018, 9:55 PM
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Originally Posted by seventwenty View Post
DIA Updated concourse plans:
https://business.flydenver.com/bizop..._Expansion.pdf

A bunch more glass than the current concourses.

Neat that the concourse ends will have an outdoor terrace.
Thanks for the link. That expansion is impressive. I have to assume this expansion about does it for what the underground people mover can handle. I wonder if they'd ever consider making people using Concourse A only use the bridge for access?
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  #11816  
Old Posted Dec 12, 2018, 10:12 PM
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CDOT is getting Smart

https://www.transportation.gov/sites...5pm-update.pdf
Quote:
PROJECT NAME: Colorado’s V2X Technology Safety and Mobility Improvement Project
APPLICANT/SPONSOR: Colorado Department of Transportation
BUILD GRANT AWARD: $20,000,000
TOTAL PROJECT COST: $67,000,000

PROJECT DESCRIPTION:
This project will create a commercial-scale connected vehicle environment using vehicle-to-everything (V2X) technology. The approximately 537-mile network will provide real-time communication with connected vehicles and install over 200 miles of new fiber optic lines to rural communities. This network will send safety and mobility-critical messages directly to drivers through infrastructure-to-vehicle (I2V) communication as well as notify CDOT of crashes or hazards on the road through vehicle-to-infrastructure (V2I) communication.

PROJECT HIGHLIGHTS AND BENEFITS:
The project will be the first of its kind to be deployed on a state level, and the country’s first commercial-scale connected vehicle environment using V2X technology. Providing broadband access to rural communities will lead to greater opportunities for economic development, including job creation and investment attraction. The project will generate safety benefits in the form of reduction in the occurrence of roadway accidents, injuries, and fatalities. Vehicle-to-infrastructure communication also allows CDOT to be immediately notified of crashes or hazards on the road to expedite emergency services and hasten the clearance of a crash scene.
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  #11817  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2018, 4:13 PM
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  #11818  
Old Posted Yesterday, 6:59 PM
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That is one twisty bus route.

Scheule here: https://ridebustang.com/wp-content/u...12.17.2018.pdf

From the Bellevue Station to the Arapahoe station, the bus takes 31-34 minutes. Wow.
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