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  #1821  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 2:33 PM
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Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark View Post
Good points. I was mostly alluding to the fact that the rest of the Raptors have been seemingly ignored even though they just won the championship.

And also, they just won the championship... enjoy it because it may never happen again... forget about Kawhi, it's done.
Thank you for reminding everyone that it's a team sport. Your primary loyalty is to the team, not to individual players, especially in this day and age.

Of course some players do come to embody the team and become civic icons too. And of course without players, there is no team.

What Kawhi Leonard represents for the Raptors is a far cry from Larry Bird for the Celtics, Magic Johnson for the Lakers or Michael Jordan for the Bulls.
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  #1822  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 2:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
What Kawhi Leonard represents for the Raptors is a far cry from Larry Bird for the Celtics, Magic Johnson for the Lakers or Michael Jordan for the Bulls.
Indeed - Kawhi is a mercenary and a sell-sword, pure and simple. He is the Michael Ignatieff of the Toronto Raptors (just visiting). Toronto fans have to learn to accept this.

Kawhi is not a franchise player like the other that you mentioned. In the long term, I think this will affect his legacy in the NBA. The only loyalty Kawhi has is to himself............
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  #1823  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 3:03 PM
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In fairness to Kawhi Leonard and other pro athletes, if they lose their edge they're kicked outta there without any second thoughts from their team and those teams usually don't give a damn about them after they've let them go. And leagues have strongly resisted any player moves related to long-term injuries and conditions that they may suffer as a result of taking part in certain sports.

That doesn't necessarily mean that I weep that much for multi-millionaire pro athletes. Just bringing a little balance into the discussion.

One can't blame most of them for trying to get it when the gettin's good.
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  #1824  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 3:08 PM
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There is a very popular edgelord mindset I've noticed where players are praised for taking every cent they can get and that any fan who thinks there is more to the equation are derided as suckers and patsies. A lot of sportswatchers think this way, including some people here.

While I don't think that we should go back to the days of players being chattel there to earn money for wealthy owners, the amount of control that owners and now increasingly, players have does make me wonder if fans (or the paying ones, at least) aren't the ones getting the shaft these days. Fans are asked to make a major emotional and financial investment in their teams, and there is effectively zero loyalty in return.

There are probably a lot of rousseaus out there who feel shafted by this turn of events in Toronto. The good news for the NBA is that it doesn't matter right now given the levels of fan mania out there. But in the long run it could hurt them.
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  #1825  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
There is a very popular edgelord mindset I've noticed where players are praised for taking every cent they can get and that any fan who thinks there is more to the equation are derided as suckers and patsies. A lot of sportswatchers think this way, including some people here.

While I don't think that we should go back to the days of players being chattel there to earn money for wealthy owners, the amount of control that owners and now increasingly, players have does make me wonder if fans (or the paying ones, at least) aren't the ones getting the shaft these days. Fans are asked to make a major emotional and financial investment in their teams, and there is effectively zero loyalty in return.

There are probably a lot of rousseaus out there who feel shafted by this turn of events in Toronto. The good news for the NBA is that it doesn't matter right now given the levels of fan mania out there. But in the long run it could hurt them.
So far the cases of fans actually sticking it to teams or owners for their blatant disloyalty and ingratitude are rare. The one example that comes to mind (and is close to home) is the giant middle finger that Montreal and Quebec gave to MLB and the Expos after the cancelled season in 1994 and the subsequent fire sale of most of the team's star players.
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  #1826  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 3:48 PM
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^The St. Louis Blues fans really stayed away from the stadium with the previous set of owners.

"An NHL lockout canceled the 2004-05 season and the Lauries put the team up for sale in June 2005, citing losses of more than $60 million over the previous two years. As the team lingered on the shelf, management further demoralized the fan base by streamlining the books and trading its high-salaried players. Pronger, Doug Weight and Mike Sillinger were all sent packing. Attendance plummeted, from 18,560 a game in 2003-04 to 12,520 in 2006-07." Blues' ownership: A colorful history ~St. Louis Post Dispatch
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  #1827  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 4:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Of course some players do come to embody the team and become civic icons too. And of course without players, there is no team.

What Kawhi Leonard represents for the Raptors is a far cry from Larry Bird for the Celtics, Magic Johnson for the Lakers or Michael Jordan for the Bulls.
This is all the more reason Toronto needs to embrace and celebrate Lowry now. Is he as good as any of those players? Absolutely not. But he's been with the Raptors through the good and the bad, and as far as the fans should be concerned he's the King of the North right now. Get him some murals, yo.
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  #1828  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 4:06 PM
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This is all the more reason Toronto needs to embrace and celebrate Lowry now. Is he as good as any of those players? Absolutely not. But he's been with the Raptors through the good and the bad, and as far as the fans should be concerned he's the King of the North right now. Get him some murals, yo.
I would agree with that.
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  #1829  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 4:08 PM
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Did I dream or is there a Kawhi mural in Toronto?
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  #1830  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 4:29 PM
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I know this has been said but...

Kawhi deserves the accolades he received. Re-instated Superstar comeback from injury.

But the care and feeding of that comeback wasn't just his own. The front office, coaching staff, medical/training staff, teammates... even dizzy fan support... made a huge contribution obviously.

Not many organizations could help this very unique individual soar (back) to MVP.

Now that he's home in L.A. and banked his mega-millions... championship notwithstanding... I do think he owes the Raptors/fan some kinda of extra thanks. Be it a corny full page ad in a newspaper, half a dozen new city ball courts, or a modest cut of his salary ;-)

He should break his legendary silence and say a personal good bye... give back a bit of what was given to him. He gave us a lot, but he was given as much (more?) in return.

And the Raptors often forgotten core had a very solid winning percentage when he was being cared for (not playing).

We all like to be appreciated of course. But maybe like many I'm just feeling rejected lol.

P.S. a thanks tweet won't cut it imo ;-)

*Just noticed online he said "good bye and thanks" to the Spurs after the trade to Toronto... and was mostly slagged as a quitter (faked injury etc). Maybe silence is golden...

Last edited by Maldive; Jul 11, 2019 at 5:17 PM.
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  #1831  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 5:14 PM
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I agree, a message to Toronto fans would go a long way. Similar to how much better Lebron handled his return to Cleveland with the Sports Illustrated piece.

Kawhi mentioned during the playoffs that this year was the most fun he's had playing basketball. A small written piece in a full-page ad in the star mentioning something like that would be a good send-off. It's typically done by long-term, face-of-the-franchise type players, but this was a unique situation and it would show some gratitude for the organization and the city that supported him as best as anyone could of.

It's his decision though and he doesn't come off as a guy who wants to drag out this process.
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  #1832  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 5:17 PM
OldDartmouthMark OldDartmouthMark is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maldive View Post
I know this has been said but...

Kawhi deserves the accolades he received. Re-instated Superstar comeback from injury.

But the care and feeding of that comeback wasn't just his own. The front office, coaching staff, medical/training staff, teammates... even dizzy fan support... made a huge contribution obviously.

Not many organizations could help this very unique individual soar (back) to MVP.

Now that he's home in L.A. and banked his mega-millions... championship notwithstanding... I do think he owes the Raptors/fan some kinda of extra thanks. Be it a corny full page ad in a newspaper, half a dozen new city ball courts, or a modest cut of his salary ;-)

He should break his legendary silence and say a personal good bye... give back a bit of what was given to him. He gave us a lot, but he was given as much (more?) in return.

And the Raptors often forgotten core had a very solid winning percentage when he was being cared for (not playing).

We all like to be appreciated of course. But maybe like many I'm just feeling rejected lol.

P.S. a thanks tweet won't cut it imo ;-)
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  #1833  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 8:59 PM
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Too late for a heartfelt goodbye now.

It's not so much that he left, it's that he left in such an underhanded way. He's supposedly serious about coming back to Toronto for 2 more seasons, but behind the scenes he is trying to recruit players to play with him in L.A. A full page ad or whatever would just make things worse at this point

When's the next CBA, because I can see a very long work stoppage next time around. Like miss the whole season long. These players are arrogant spoiled brats.
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  #1834  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 10:40 PM
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Too late for a heartfelt goodbye now.

It's not so much that he left, it's that he left in such an underhanded way. He's supposedly serious about coming back to Toronto for 2 more seasons, but behind the scenes he is trying to recruit players to play with him in L.A. A full page ad or whatever would just make things worse at this point

I have a sneaking suspicion that he never had any real intention of staying here, and the "leaks" about him re-signing were just intended to be used as leverage to get the Clippers to make some trades for his preferred teammate.
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  #1835  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2019, 11:14 PM
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This indication is that if they didnt get Paul George he was staying. He wanted to win, and he felt that Paul George on the Clippers was enough to do that.

I dont get where this sense of entitlement is coming from. This is a player who wasn't drafted, signed, or had any sort of verbal commitment with the Raptors. He literally did the most you can ask of a player you initially traded for as a rental to win a championship.

Like go back and read the posts in this thread from last year. Everyone said it was worth trading away DeRozan for a guy who will probably leave if we won. That exact scenario happened and now everyone has apparently revised their expectations.
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  #1836  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2019, 12:21 AM
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Derozan has one more year in San Antonio, I would love to see him back. It wont happen, but Lowrey and him are the closest thing the Raptors have had to Franchise players.

Siakam is the future for the team and to be fair to this team they went 19-5 without KL last year (We will miss Danny Green).
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  #1837  
Old Posted Jul 12, 2019, 8:27 PM
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Derozan has one more year in San Antonio, I would love to see him back. It wont happen, but Lowrey and him are the closest thing the Raptors have had to Franchise players.

Nah. As with most Raptors fans, DeRozan always have a special place in my heart, but he's just not good enough to be the team's star player or to justify a $30 million/year salary. Sooner or later he was going to have to go if the Raptors ever wanted to make it out of the Eastern Conference.
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  #1838  
Old Posted Jul 13, 2019, 7:15 PM
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Report: Canadian Bennett, Rockets have deal
TSN.ca Staff July 13 2019

Former No. 1 overall pick Canadian Anthony Bennett has agreed to a non-guaranteed deal with the Houston Rockets, according to Shams Charania of The Athletic and Stadium.

The 26-year old forward, who spent last season with the Agua Caliente Clippers, the G League affiliate of the Los Angeles Clippers, averaged 12.2 points and 4.6 rebounds per game. Bennett, who was drafted first overall by the Cleveland Cavaliers in 2013, hasn't appeared in NBA regular season game since the 2016-17 season when he played with the Brooklyn Nets.

Besides the Cavaliers and Nets, the Brampton, Ont., native has also played with the Minnesota Timberwolves and the Toronto Raptors in his four previous season in the NBA. He holds career averages of 4.4 points and 3.1 rebounds.
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