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  #41  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 7:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post

Though it's also true that Canada has a higher percentage of its population that is foreign-born.
yes, not only is the US percentage of foreign born lower than canada's to begin with, of the US foreign born population, over half are from spanish speaking nations, so that doesn't leave a whole lot of room for other foreign language groups to get much critical mass, proportionally speaking.

canada has a higher foreign born percentage and they speak a wider array of different languages compared to the US.
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  #42  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 9:32 PM
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Its almost 0 chance. I have older relatives that still speak French, but they are dying off.

In the 80's there was a push to bring it back, as many of us were required to take French in elementary and high school, but only as a foreign language. After the civil war the federal government banned Louisiana schools' from offering French based school instruction and required all students to learn English as the primary language, thus killing off French.
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  #43  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 9:35 PM
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I can see Cajun French basically dying out in Louisiana. I'm sure there will be some French speakers, just like there are some French speakers in LA or NYC, who immigrate from French speaking countries or decide to learn it in school because it's one of the most important languages worldwide, but I don't think there's a single community left in Louisiana that's majority French speaking, not even a small one? Any even then, the majority of the French speakers in Louisiana probably speak English fluently, so there's about as much of a need to learn French to fit in as there is to learn Polish to fit in in Chicago...

(the more interesting question would be about NE Ontario, which I believe has the most significant French speaking community outside of Quebec and New Brunswick)
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  #44  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Urbanguy View Post
^You found mother tongue which is a somewhat archaic term, the US Census used to used that too which is more closely aligned with what you identify with the most in regards to ancestry and culture.
First google search for the definition of "mother tongue"

noun
the language which a person has grown up speaking from early childhood.

Seems pretty straightforward. I've always understood that to be the common usage.

What's the preferred alternative? First language? Native language? (Linguists use L1).

And, I don't know anyone personally stateside who would interpret "mother tongue" as ancestry or culture independent of knowing a language, since the word "language" is in there, not culture or ancestry. Does any Hispanic-by-surname only person say Spanish is their "mother tongue" if they never speak a lick of it? I've never heard anyone say that. I know there are some countries in the world that treat things that way (eg. Ireland claiming that Irish, the language, is the first language of all Ireland, even if most don't really have it as native language, essentially saying that identification with a language is about symbolism, not practice), but most people I know use the same definition of mother tongue, native language and first language.

Quote:
Originally Posted by memph View Post

(the more interesting question would be about NE Ontario, which I believe has the most significant French speaking community outside of Quebec and New Brunswick)
Is a better parallel with Louisiana's situation with Cajun French, the Francophone communities within Anglo-Canada outside Quebec and New Brunswick (eg. NE Ontario, even Franco-Manitobans, though I know that's a really small group etc.)? I wonder if the two will have similar trajectories, since both are small populations not really being "replenished" by migration of French speakers, to present assimilating into English-speaking society.

Or does even NE Ontario and even smaller minority Francophone communities still stand more of a chance due to of course Canadian official language government policy (that holds nation-wise, benefiting all Francophones) that Louisiana lacks to "protect" French?

In the US, there's no official policy on language, so laissez-faire (no pun intended) attitudes ultimately favor the dominant English tongue, for better or worse, so that even "speak French in addition to English to keep it alive" fails as a strategy.
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  #45  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2019, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post

canada has a higher foreign born percentage and they speak a wider array of different languages compared to the US.
That's often why you see such disagreements sometimes about what "diversity" means if you bring up culture between some (usually urban) Americans and Canadians in discussing their metro areas.

Eg. "Our city is more diverse because it has X number of languages, and that's more important than ancestries etc. since different language means a different culture" vs. "different cultures can still operate despite being in the same language. African American culture and Australian culture sure aren't the same even if they speak the same (though different dialects of the same) language" and "African Americans, non-Spanish speaking Hispanics all speak English, so they won't count in the stats if you use language diversity vs. Somali immigrants that speak Somali and Russian immigrants that speak Russian etc." blah blah etc.

Or the idea that because Canada has an entirely different linguistic region (Quebec and more broadly Francophone society) that can exist consuming media in a self-contained way independent of English-speaking society it counts as more diverse than a place where you see Chinese-Americans who watch the same Hollywood movies in English as do African Americans and as do white Americans etc.
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  #46  
Old Posted Aug 21, 2019, 2:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Capsicum View Post
That's often why you see such disagreements sometimes about what "diversity" means if you bring up culture between some (usually urban) Americans and Canadians in discussing their metro areas.

Eg. "Our city is more diverse because it has X number of languages, and that's more important than ancestries etc. since different language means a different culture" vs. "different cultures can still operate despite being in the same language. African American culture and Australian culture sure aren't the same even if they speak the same (though different dialects of the same) language" and "African Americans, non-Spanish speaking Hispanics all speak English, so they won't count in the stats if you use language diversity vs. Somali immigrants that speak Somali and Russian immigrants that speak Russian etc." blah blah etc.

Or the idea that because Canada has an entirely different linguistic region (Quebec and more broadly Francophone society) that can exist consuming media in a self-contained way independent of English-speaking society it counts as more diverse than a place where you see Chinese-Americans who watch the same Hollywood movies in English as do African Americans and as do white Americans etc.
Yeah. The Diversity Olympics you see on here is rather silly. I've never understood the obsession with proving there are more people around you that don't speak your language or look like you. I think the universities have pounded it in people's heads as the key to a pleasant and functioning place that people think its like the ultimate virtue or something.

I see the positives and negatives of diversity. I've lived as an extreme minority(Japan), a minority in San Antonio, a minority in my neighborhood in Norfolk, and in the majority in Arkansas. My experience(besides Japan, for obvious reasons) has pretty much been the same. Chain restaurants, poor and rich people, same ole stores, and generally nice people with a sprinkling of douche bags.
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