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  #141  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2019, 3:25 PM
Docere Docere is offline
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Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
How so?

I've never lived in Chicago or NYC, but I've visited both, so I can't really "judge" the other two, but I don't get that the "liberalism" in LA is contrived. Historically, LA was not kind to unions; LA post Mexican-cession really grew because of American capitalist ventures, whether it was oil, film making, or real estate (mostly real estate).
L.A. was dominated by Midwestern Protestants for much of the 20th century.
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  #142  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2019, 3:31 PM
mrnyc mrnyc is online now
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Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
How so?

I've never lived in Chicago or NYC, but I've visited both, so I can't really "judge" the other two, but I don't get that the "liberalism" in LA is contrived. Historically, LA was not kind to unions; LA post Mexican-cession really grew because of American capitalist ventures, whether it was oil, film making, or real estate (mostly real estate).

But being a resident of the LA area basically my whole life, I don't get that the liberalism is contrived. I feel like in the LA area, people do anything they want, and aren't so quick to assimilate (or don't even assimilate at all) into mainstream US culture, and no one seems to mind. That's a liberalism in itself. You don't see billboards like this in many other American cities: https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0527...2!8i6656?hl=en

I don't even recall seeing ads in Korean in NYC's Koreatown but maybe I wasn't paying attention. And it seemed everyone spoke English there. But maybe it was because I was in (touristy) Manhattan. At the restaurant we go to in LA's Koreatown, often they'll have to find a server that speaks English to take our order.

yes you were in touristy manhattan. wrong koreatown.

as for people not assimilating over generations, that is very conservative, not liberal leaning to me. that others don't care is liberal though, but i notice a lot less interaction between cultures in los angeles than in nyc. i dk if its truly culture that no one cares in los angeles or no one cares because they can more easily avoid each other due to the layout and density of the city though.
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  #143  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2019, 3:49 PM
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sopas ej sopas ej is offline
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
yes you were in touristy manhattan. wrong koreatown.

as for people not assimilating over generations, that is very conservative, not liberal leaning to me. that others don't care is liberal though
Yes, and that is liberal; nobody forces them to assimilate. That wasn't always the case, though. There are stories from older generations of Mexican-Americans where they were told in public schools that they weren't even allowed to speak Spanish, even outside the classroom. Some people even raised their kids with Spanish being forbidden even at home.

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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
but i notice a lot less interaction between cultures in los angeles than in nyc. i dk if its truly culture that no one cares in los angeles or no one cares because they can more easily avoid each other due to the layout and density of the city though.
I think you're incorrect here; kind of like how you pointed out that I was in the wrong Koreatown in NYC, when in LA, you probably only went to certain areas in LA. Brentwood, sure, everyone seems homogenous there. The Westside in general. But in other neighborhoods, cultures and ethnicities mix, and nobody seems to pay any mind. And in the LA County suburbs, especially in the San Gabriel Valley, there are cultures mixing everywhere, and again, nobody seems to mind. You see Latinos and Asians going to the same dumpling houses, taco trucks, etc.

This is an interesting read:

amazon.com

It talks about the history of race and redlining in the San Gabriel Valley, and how things are nowadays.
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  #144  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2019, 3:50 PM
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?
I haven't been in NYC in awhile, but I think races in LA interact really well in comparsion to Chicago and DC, the other places I've lived.
Downtown LA in particular is pretty obvious with this.

LA being segregated seems like a very outdated concept, I don't see it at all in my years living here.
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  #145  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2019, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by LA21st View Post
?
I haven't been in NYC in awhile, but I think races in LA interact really well in comparsion to Chicago and DC, the other places I've lived.
Downtown LA in particular is pretty obvious with this.

LA being segregated seems like a very outdated concept, I don't see it at all in my years living here.
Yup, its always so weird to me to hear stereotypes from 30 years ago still out there that have no bearing to today's LA. Go to Downtown LA, Hollywood, Koreatown, Mid City, etc... these are all very integrated areas with many different ethnicities living next door to each other with zero problems.
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  #146  
Old Posted Sep 13, 2019, 11:45 PM
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North Hollywood, Culver City, Venice, etc.


Yea, either they haven't spent much time here or if they do/did, didn't really going anywhere.

It's actually one of LA's biggest strengths, and probably becoming similar to NYC in that way.
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  #147  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2019, 12:06 AM
Docere Docere is offline
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Originally Posted by LA21st View Post
?
I haven't been in NYC in awhile, but I think races in LA interact really well in comparsion to Chicago and DC, the other places I've lived.
Downtown LA in particular is pretty obvious with this.

LA being segregated seems like a very outdated concept, I don't see it at all in my years living here.
L.A. is less than 10% Black and they have higher levels of residential segregation than Hispanics and Asians, so it's likely the case that L.A. is the least segregated of the three.
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  #148  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2019, 9:13 AM
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Originally Posted by LA21st View Post
?
I haven't been in NYC in awhile, but I think races in LA interact really well in comparsion to Chicago and DC, the other places I've lived.
Downtown LA in particular is pretty obvious with this.

LA being segregated seems like a very outdated concept, I don't see it at all in my years living here.
It’s outdated, but not because LA is really a melting pot. What’s outdated is the idea that the city's build defines racial discord. LA is an ethnic mosaic model vs. melting pot. At some point the city became proud of its sprawling landscape of ethnic neighborhoods, and starting dismissing the idea that all ethnicities should be living side by side (usually championed by white folks who "don’t see color").

Los Angeles is the most liberal of the 3, but I WISH it were politically more middle-ground like Chicago and NYC, so we don’t have to constantly suffer through laws (mostly bans) passed for the purpose of virtue signaling. I can’t see Chicago trying to pass vegan food mandates and banning fur.
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  #149  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2019, 12:50 PM
jtown,man jtown,man is offline
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starting dismissing the idea that all ethnicities should be living side by side (usually championed by white folks who "don’t see color").
Yeah, I guess white people are the only ones who championed the cause against segregation? LOL

I am told that white flight was racist. The government helped this flight. This flight, therefore, hurt black urban residents. Now white people moving back in the city is racist because it's hurting black people. But these neighborhoods lack investment. They are now getting investment, but its hurting black people, so its bad investment. Segregation was bad when whites liked it, but now that some minorities like it, it's good. Being colorblind(as much as is humanly possible) is now racist, because white people are promoting it more.

This is what is so annoying about racial politics in this country. At the end of the day, it's basically white people are bad. There is NO WAY to appease racial hucksters.

If we move out the city=bad
If we don't invest in city neighborhoods because we dont live there=bad
If we move into those cities again(usually moving into neighborhoods our great grandparents could have lived in)=bad
If we invest in poor minority neighborhoods=bad
If we try to be color-blind=bad
If we think segregation is good=bad
If we think segregation is bad=bad

Stop it people. I know this conversation is waaaay more nuanced than I am making it. But at the end of the day you have to face reality on the ground and stop having a perpetual claim of grievance against one race of people.
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  #150  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2019, 6:12 PM
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^
The guy with the long list of racial grievances is tired of all the racial politics in this country
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  #151  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2019, 6:46 PM
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Originally Posted by LA21st View Post
?
I haven't been in NYC in awhile, but I think races in LA interact really well in comparsion to Chicago and DC, the other places I've lived.
Downtown LA in particular is pretty obvious with this.

LA being segregated seems like a very outdated concept, I don't see it at all in my years living here.
Chicago and DC are two of the most segregated cities in the country so that's not saying much. But you're right, LA ethnic neighborhoods do feel better integrated into the cultural and urban fabric compared to a lot of other cities.
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  #152  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2019, 9:56 PM
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Originally Posted by jtown,man View Post
Yeah, I guess white people are the only ones who championed the cause against segregation? LOL
It’s not segregation they’re championing against. It’s the idea that there’s something wrong when they walk into a neighborhood that's 70% latino. It’s these neighborhoods that they have in mind. Because they feel unsafe and uncomfortable accidentally wandering into these parts of the city because for one small moment, they're forced to actually think about what it’s like for whites to be a minority and it’s scary for them.

And being “color-blind” doesn’t exist. The idea that you think you’re color-blind, just means that you’re unwilling to examine and keep-in-check the inherent biases people have.

Last edited by ocman; Sep 15, 2019 at 10:18 PM.
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  #153  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2019, 10:35 PM
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Anecdotal garbage here but I was in a long distance relationship with a guy from LA (Venice/Marina) a few years back.

He would come to Chicago and we had zero pressure to be closeted or to dilute the fact that we were two gay dudes who were super in to each other.

First trip to LA and he wouldn't hold hands in public, acted dodgy as hell. This was in West Hollywood on Santa Monica.

Later in the safety of The Abbey, I asked him what the fuck was up and he unloaded a torrent of stories about how being out in LA is a career death sentence and how it's great to be gay only if you are somebody else.

I came out of that relationship feeling that I had either just dated a real piece of work or that LA is actually a little backwards.
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  #154  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 2:13 AM
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Anecdotal garbage here but I was in a long distance relationship with a guy from LA (Venice/Marina) a few years back.

He would come to Chicago and we had zero pressure to be closeted or to dilute the fact that we were two gay dudes who were super in to each other.

First trip to LA and he wouldn't hold hands in public, acted dodgy as hell. This was in West Hollywood on Santa Monica.

Later in the safety of The Abbey, I asked him what the fuck was up and he unloaded a torrent of stories about how being out in LA is a career death sentence and how it's great to be gay only if you are somebody else.

I came out of that relationship feeling that I had either just dated a real piece of work or that LA is actually a little backwards.
I met my husband in Los Angeles. We were always out, everywhere, all the time. We never had any problems or issues at all, and I cannot say that even about San Francisco, where we currently live. I lived in the Valley for a year, and on the Westside for three. Never any issue of any kind.

Come to think of it, I cannot imagine everyday Angelenos giving a damn about any aspect of someone they don't already know (well, maybe if you're a celebrity). The vibe I got was more "I don't see you" or "I don't care."
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  #155  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 3:03 AM
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Yea, la exudes a "come as you are" vibe I've never seen anywhere else.
Nobody cares about your past, just what you're doing now.
Idk what field being gay would be considered a death sentence here. Certainly not entertainment. Makes very little sense.
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  #156  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 6:59 PM
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^^ That was my assumption going out there for the first time. Both of your posts are what I had expected. He was in entertainment sooooo ... maybe it kinda-sorta exists in that industry in his head. Either way. I thought LA was wonderful.
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  #157  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 7:16 PM
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Possibly. People are/become weird here.
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  #158  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 8:21 PM
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Which of the three has the most "working class" NHW population?
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  #159  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 8:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Docere View Post
Which of the three has the most "working class" NHW population?
Chicago Metro has the highest share of NHW population.

But Chicago is less overtly ethnic than NHW population in NYC (but moreso than LA).
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  #160  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2019, 8:48 PM
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German is the largest ancestry group in Chicago and they're really just a stream of "nonethnic white American." For all the puffery about Irish American "uniqueness" overall they probably have more in common with WASPs and people of German ancestry - especially outside the Northeast - than Italian Americans, say. Polish comes in at #3 for white ancestry groups. Chicago is well known for its Polish American population and they are certainly the most 'visible" European ethnic group. The heavily Polish neighborhoods and close-in suburbs are made up of people descended from the more recent immigrant waves - not the "Bill Swerski superfans" types (who probably live in far-flung suburbia nowadays).
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