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  #21  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2018, 11:38 PM
ThePhun1 ThePhun1 is offline
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Originally Posted by pdxtex View Post
my prediction is seattle will be the first city with a big three expansion team (nhl) and detroit will be the next city for mls....portland is too flaky to commit to big name sports but i think it would work. people here will clap for anything....
Big 3? If it's a Big 3, that certainly doesn't include the NHL.
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  #22  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2018, 11:46 PM
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Seattle can be viewed as a sunbelt market regarding hockey. It'll be a mostly new addition to the culture.
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  #23  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2018, 11:50 PM
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Seattle can be viewed as a sunbelt market regarding hockey. It'll be a mostly new addition to the culture.
They've taken to it in San Jose.
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  #24  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 12:42 AM
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It is very likely that Seattle will get an NHL team. In fact the process is already underway:

https://www.sbnation.com/nhl/2018/2/...-keyarena-deal

I wouldn't be surprised to see the Arizona Coyotes move, Houston has been a rumored destination.

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They've taken to it in San Jose.
Nashville as well. Seattle would have a built in rivalry with Vancouver and hockey would be no more foreign than soccer which has worked there.
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  #25  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 12:48 AM
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Not many teams could move in the next 10 years. Here's the teams that could move in maybe 5 years:

Oakland Athletics (MLB): They are getting close to closing for a new stadium in Oakland, but if they moved, I could see them go to Las Vegas.
Tampa Bay Rays (MLB): They aren't getting anywhere with a new stadium in the Tampa Bay area; Montreal seems the most likely location.
Arizona Coyotes (NHL): They want an arena of their own in the East Valley, even after all that mess just 5-10 years ago. If Seattle doesn't get an expansion team, Seattle is a perfect location, especially because it wouldn't result in realigning divisions (one reason why Quebec City didn't get an expansion team a couple years ago).
New Jersey Devils (NHL): They apparently are not doing well even with their arena in Downtown Newark. No clue where they could go, but somewhere in the Eastern Time Zone would be needed to keep the conferences balanced. Quebec City would be the best option, even though Quebec City would fit more in the Atlantic Division.
Carolina Hurricanes (NHL): Struggling with attendance and support. Like New Jersey, Quebec City is the best option, despite the divisional problems.

Here are the teams that we could see move in the next 10 years, although it's unlikely:

Jacksonville Jaguars (NFL): Have a long-term lease for their stadium, but tarping the upper levels is not a good sign of fan support, and having home games in London all the time isn't good either.
Cincinnati Bengals (NFL): If I remember correctly, the owner has said he would consider moving if he doesn't get a new stadium, or better lease, or something. This is all in the early stages. The Bengals, despite some recent playoff appearances, have historically been terribly run by the front office, and this is apparently still the case.
Buffalo Bills (NFL): With a new owner, this is now unlikely, but New Era Field is old and Roger Goodell wants a new stadium in Buffalo. If it doesn't happen in the next generation, the Bills may move elsewhere.
Florida Panthers (NHL): In a lease and are the only tenant at their arena. Arena owners likely won't let their main tenant leave, despite the lack of support in the Miami area. A more likely outcome is that the Panthers get a more favorable lease if they mention moving.
New York Islanders (NHL): Actively looking to move, but they want to stay on Long Island. They are planning on playing some games back in Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum, and want to build an arena in Flushing or in Nassau County. Unlikely to leave the New York metropolitan area.

Notice that the NBA has no teams on the list. The most-recent teams that threatened to move, the Sacramento Kings, Los Angeles Clippers, and Milwaukee Bucks, now have long-term solutions in place with new arenas built or being built. The NBA has never been stronger, and is actually in position to supplant the NFL as the biggest league in the US or North America, fan-wise. This leaguewide strength has lead to good or great stability for each franchise.
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  #26  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 12:56 AM
ThatDarnSacramentan ThatDarnSacramentan is offline
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Originally Posted by xzmattzx View Post
Notice that the NBA has no teams on the list. The most-recent teams that threatened to move, the Sacramento Kings, Los Angeles Clippers, and Milwaukee Bucks, now have long-term solutions in place with new arenas built or being built. The NBA has never been stronger, and is actually in position to supplant the NFL as the biggest league in the US or North America, fan-wise. This leaguewide strength has lead to good or great stability for each franchise.
The one exception for the NBA is the Pelicans. They're a small market, not the main draw in that market, as well as poorly run with a strange ownership situation with the Benson family feuding. I don't think the Pelicans are long for New Orleans unless they become a contender in the next couple of seasons, which is highly doubtful in its own right given the state of the Western Conference and their own assets cupboard.
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  #27  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 12:59 AM
JAYNYC JAYNYC is offline
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Originally Posted by xzmattzx View Post
Not many teams could move in the next 10 years. Here's the teams that could move in maybe 5 years:

Oakland Athletics (MLB): They are getting close to closing for a new stadium in Oakland, but if they moved, I could see them go to Las Vegas.
Tampa Bay Rays (MLB): They aren't getting anywhere with a new stadium in the Tampa Bay area; Montreal seems the most likely location.
Arizona Coyotes (NHL): They want an arena of their own in the East Valley, even after all that mess just 5-10 years ago. If Seattle doesn't get an expansion team, Seattle is a perfect location, especially because it wouldn't result in realigning divisions (one reason why Quebec City didn't get an expansion team a couple years ago).
New Jersey Devils (NHL): They apparently are not doing well even with their arena in Downtown Newark. No clue where they could go, but somewhere in the Eastern Time Zone would be needed to keep the conferences balanced. Quebec City would be the best option, even though Quebec City would fit more in the Atlantic Division.
Carolina Hurricanes (NHL): Struggling with attendance and support. Like New Jersey, Quebec City is the best option, despite the divisional problems.

Here are the teams that we could see move in the next 10 years, although it's unlikely:

Jacksonville Jaguars (NFL): Have a long-term lease for their stadium, but tarping the upper levels is not a good sign of fan support, and having home games in London all the time isn't good either.
Cincinnati Bengals (NFL): If I remember correctly, the owner has said he would consider moving if he doesn't get a new stadium, or better lease, or something. This is all in the early stages. The Bengals, despite some recent playoff appearances, have historically been terribly run by the front office, and this is apparently still the case.
Buffalo Bills (NFL): With a new owner, this is now unlikely, but New Era Field is old and Roger Goodell wants a new stadium in Buffalo. If it doesn't happen in the next generation, the Bills may move elsewhere.
Florida Panthers (NHL): In a lease and are the only tenant at their arena. Arena owners likely won't let their main tenant leave, despite the lack of support in the Miami area. A more likely outcome is that the Panthers get a more favorable lease if they mention moving.
New York Islanders (NHL): Actively looking to move, but they want to stay on Long Island. They are planning on playing some games back in Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum, and want to build an arena in Flushing or in Nassau County. Unlikely to leave the New York metropolitan area.

Notice that the NBA has no teams on the list. The most-recent teams that threatened to move, the Sacramento Kings, Los Angeles Clippers, and Milwaukee Bucks, now have long-term solutions in place with new arenas built or being built. The NBA has never been stronger, and is actually in position to supplant the NFL as the biggest league in the US or North America, fan-wise. This leaguewide strength has lead to good or great stability for each franchise.
Regarding your take on the NBA, could you then see expansion as an option? If the league is really as strong as you imply, could you see it expanding - potentially to Las Vegas, St. Louis, Cincinnati and / or Vancouver (2 Western Conference additions and 2 Eastern Conference additions via expansion) by 2028?

Regarding the New York Islanders, didn't Nassau Coliseum just undergo a massive renovation in order to retain the team there?

Regarding the Florida Panthers and their lack of support, can we all agree that South Florida has, by far, the most fairweather fans in all pro sports?
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  #28  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 12:59 AM
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Originally Posted by mhays View Post
Seattle can be viewed as a sunbelt market regarding hockey. It'll be a mostly new addition to the culture.
the seattle metropolitans were the first US team to win the stanley cup in 1917...first US team, win stanley cup......seattle!!! it will just mean it comes full circle a century later....
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  #29  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:03 AM
JAYNYC JAYNYC is offline
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Originally Posted by ThatDarnSacramentan View Post
The one exception for the NBA is the Pelicans. They're a small market, not the main draw in that market, as well as poorly run with a strange ownership situation with the Benson family feuding. I don't think the Pelicans are long for New Orleans unless they become a contender in the next couple of seasons, which is highly doubtful in its own right given the state of the Western Conference and their own assets cupboard.
Interesting speculation. "Seattle Pelicans" actually has a nice ring to it, in keeping with the Seahawks bird theme.
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  #30  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:05 AM
ThatDarnSacramentan ThatDarnSacramentan is offline
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Originally Posted by JAYNYC View Post
Interesting speculation. "Seattle Pelicans" actually has a nice ring to it, in keeping with the Seahawks bird theme.
They wouldn't be the Pelicans, just like they wouldn't have been the Seattle Kings and they aren't the Oklahoma City Sonics. They'd change the name to Sonics, retake the historical rights that the Thunder currently have, and the Pelicans would cease to exist.
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  #31  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:06 AM
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xzmattzx xzmattzx is offline
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Originally Posted by ThatDarnSacramentan View Post
The one exception for the NBA is the Pelicans. They're a small market, not the main draw in that market, as well as poorly run with a strange ownership situation with the Benson family feuding. I don't think the Pelicans are long for New Orleans unless they become a contender in the next couple of seasons, which is highly doubtful in its own right given the state of the Western Conference and their own assets cupboard.
The ownership and relative lack of support may be true, but the incredible TV revenue makes up for a lot of that. If you see TV viewership go down nationwide and/or worldwide, then there may be some rumblings.
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  #32  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:07 AM
JAYNYC JAYNYC is offline
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Originally Posted by Chef View Post
It is very likely that Seattle will get an NHL team. In fact the process is already underway:

https://www.sbnation.com/nhl/2018/2/...-keyarena-deal

I wouldn't be surprised to see the Arizona Coyotes move, Houston has been a rumored destination.



Nashville as well. Seattle would have a built in rivalry with Vancouver and hockey would be no more foreign than soccer which has worked there.
It's interesting that the NHL has become popular in certain markets that one would never expect it to be popular in (San Jose & Nashville), yet has failed to take off in other similar markets (Atlanta & Phoenix). It will be interesting to see what happens in Las Vegas over the long-term.
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  #33  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:18 AM
ThatDarnSacramentan ThatDarnSacramentan is offline
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Originally Posted by xzmattzx View Post
The ownership and relative lack of support may be true, but the incredible TV revenue makes up for a lot of that. If you see TV viewership go down nationwide and/or worldwide, then there may be some rumblings.
You're right about the ludicrous revenue from the national broadcasters, but I'm not sure what effect that has on a struggling local market and whether the NBA would want to capture a larger local market. If you look here, New Orleans is the 51st largest TV market in the US, between Memphis and Providence, RI. That makes them the dead last TV market in the NBA. Add in that they rank 24th in attendance this season and all the way back to the 2014/15 season, I think we see rumors about the Pels sooner than later. After all, one of the main reasons the Maloofs gave for trying to move the Kings and later sell them is that the local TV market wasn't good for them in Sacramento, which new ownership immediately disproved by getting a $30 million local broadcasting deal.
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  #34  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:20 AM
Buckeye Native 001 Buckeye Native 001 is online now
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The Coyotes will be in Seattle within the next decade. The Suns might not be too far behind in relocating (probably not to Seattle) if that team doesn't get better anytime soon and Devin Booker finds success with another, better, Western Conference team once his current contract expires. They're also bitching about wanting a new arena. Robert Sarver can go fuck himself for the way he's ruined that once respectable franchise. Ditto Ken Kendrick (owner of the Diamondbacks) for demanding that Maricopa County pay for the stadium upgrades he wants for his 20-year-old ballpark.

Cincinnati can't even get it's act together finding a proper site for an MLS stadium (that's FC Cincinnati's fault). The sooner the Reds and Bengals either relocate or are contracted, the better. Tear down the fucking wastes of space that are Great American Ballpark and Paul Brown Stadium and connect downtown to the riverfront by capping Fort Washington Way and expanding The Banks over where PBS and GABP stood.
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  #35  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:23 AM
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Originally Posted by JAYNYC View Post
It's interesting that the NHL has become popular in certain markets that one would never expect it to be popular in (San Jose & Nashville), yet has failed to take off in other similar markets (Atlanta & Phoenix). It will be interesting to see what happens in Las Vegas over the long-term.
probably because san jose is rife with disposable income and nashville is full of northerners. sunbelt markets full of west coast retirees dont scream nhl to me. atlanta is a tougher nut to crack but its staunchly southern and hockey just isnt in the dna....shrug...
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  #36  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:30 AM
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Originally Posted by pdxtex View Post
probably because san jose is rife with disposable income and nashville is full of northerners. sunbelt markets full of west coast retirees dont scream nhl to me. atlanta is a tougher nut to crack but its staunchly southern and hockey just isnt in the dna....shrug...
Also, San Jose and Nashville have had good ownership and as a result have had competitive teams for most of their existence. Atlanta and Arizona are or were garbage teams. I think if a hockey team wants to build a base in a sunbelt market they need to become watchable pretty quickly.
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  #37  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:41 AM
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Any latent NBA support to be tapped in St Louis or KC? Would it even be possible for one of these two metros to host a Missouri-wide team?
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  #38  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:43 AM
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I think if a hockey team wants to build a base in a sunbelt market they need to become watchable pretty quickly.
This year's Vegas launch and local reception proves the point well. Probably the most successful expansion launch season in the history of North America's Big 4, and the locals are loving it.
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  #39  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:45 AM
ThePhun1 ThePhun1 is offline
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Originally Posted by xzmattzx View Post
Not many teams could move in the next 10 years. Here's the teams that could move in maybe 5 years:

Oakland Athletics (MLB): They are getting close to closing for a new stadium in Oakland, but if they moved, I could see them go to Las Vegas.
Tampa Bay Rays (MLB): They aren't getting anywhere with a new stadium in the Tampa Bay area; Montreal seems the most likely location.
Arizona Coyotes (NHL): They want an arena of their own in the East Valley, even after all that mess just 5-10 years ago. If Seattle doesn't get an expansion team, Seattle is a perfect location, especially because it wouldn't result in realigning divisions (one reason why Quebec City didn't get an expansion team a couple years ago).
New Jersey Devils (NHL): They apparently are not doing well even with their arena in Downtown Newark. No clue where they could go, but somewhere in the Eastern Time Zone would be needed to keep the conferences balanced. Quebec City would be the best option, even though Quebec City would fit more in the Atlantic Division.
Carolina Hurricanes (NHL): Struggling with attendance and support. Like New Jersey, Quebec City is the best option, despite the divisional problems.

Here are the teams that we could see move in the next 10 years, although it's unlikely:

Jacksonville Jaguars (NFL): Have a long-term lease for their stadium, but tarping the upper levels is not a good sign of fan support, and having home games in London all the time isn't good either.
Cincinnati Bengals (NFL): If I remember correctly, the owner has said he would consider moving if he doesn't get a new stadium, or better lease, or something. This is all in the early stages. The Bengals, despite some recent playoff appearances, have historically been terribly run by the front office, and this is apparently still the case.
Buffalo Bills (NFL): With a new owner, this is now unlikely, but New Era Field is old and Roger Goodell wants a new stadium in Buffalo. If it doesn't happen in the next generation, the Bills may move elsewhere.
Florida Panthers (NHL): In a lease and are the only tenant at their arena. Arena owners likely won't let their main tenant leave, despite the lack of support in the Miami area. A more likely outcome is that the Panthers get a more favorable lease if they mention moving.
New York Islanders (NHL): Actively looking to move, but they want to stay on Long Island. They are planning on playing some games back in Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum, and want to build an arena in Flushing or in Nassau County. Unlikely to leave the New York metropolitan area.

Notice that the NBA has no teams on the list. The most-recent teams that threatened to move, the Sacramento Kings, Los Angeles Clippers, and Milwaukee Bucks, now have long-term solutions in place with new arenas built or being built. The NBA has never been stronger, and is actually in position to supplant the NFL as the biggest league in the US or North America, fan-wise. This leaguewide strength has lead to good or great stability for each franchise.
Las Vegas is way too small and hot for MLB, even if they built a retractable roof stadium.

And the Bengals just built that place not all that long ago.
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  #40  
Old Posted Apr 9, 2018, 1:54 AM
ThePhun1 ThePhun1 is offline
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Originally Posted by ThatDarnSacramentan View Post
The one exception for the NBA is the Pelicans. They're a small market, not the main draw in that market, as well as poorly run with a strange ownership situation with the Benson family feuding. I don't think the Pelicans are long for New Orleans unless they become a contender in the next couple of seasons, which is highly doubtful in its own right given the state of the Western Conference and their own assets cupboard.
New Orleans is likely too small and impoverished to support one team let alone two. The only reason the Saints do so well is because they've been there so long and have a recent history of success. They aren't going anywhere any time soon.

If I had to guess, the Pelicans become the new Sonics.
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