HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Mountain West

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #6121  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 6:32 PM
CherryCreek's Avatar
CherryCreek CherryCreek is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by milehighmomentum View Post
Looks like the final pieces of the puzzle are coming together for a groundbreaking that's not too far off...

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/n...evelopers.html
Nice! After a lull in announcements and a seeming lull in activity, things seem to be heating up. This quote confirms what many of us have suspected: the great availability of development opportunities in RiNo is not only a real competitor to "legacy" downtown, but for now, has the upper hand:

We have had one tenant say they want almost the entire building," Lee said. "I strongly believe that we could lease this building multiple times over the given amount."


It's a theme seen across RiNo. The proximity to the train station — about a 90-foot walk, Lee said — is a big driver, but it's the quality of life that the hip neighborhood offers that tenants are most excited about.

"It's the vibe that is RiNo," Lee said. "I think you're going to see more new product in RiNo than in downtown over the next two to four years."

Crews are expected to break ground on the office portion of the project later this year with a completion in the third quarter of 2021. Some ground floor tenants may be able to move in even sooner, depending on construction progress, Campbell said. The hotel is also scheduled to be delivered in 2021


Poor T2. If they had gotten their shit together early in the cycle and got 'er done, I suspect they'd be 100% leased now at favorable rates. But now RiNo is stealing their thunder.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6122  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 6:47 PM
mhays mhays is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 17,400
Based on the renderings (how units are lighted), the units appear to be eight to a long side, including one at each corner. The short sides seem to have two more each. At 31 residential floors that would be 620 units.

But maybe what looks like one unit is actually two. Split every unit in two and you're close to the 1,253 figure.

I'm not understanding the floorplates. Assuming 639,000 sf rentable in 31 stories, plus circulation and common areas, we're talking way north of 700,000 sf on the residential levels? Those would be massive floorplates. The units would have to be extremely long and skinny.

I'm not a technical guy, but the cantilever looks expensive. The benefit might be related to parking efficiency more than anything else, and avoiding transfer elements. Kudos for an aggressive parking ratio, which would certainly save cost along with putting the parking above-grade.

But yes it seems (thanks laniroj!) like a lot of disjointed assmptions. This jibes with the frequent occurence of an inexperienced developer being off by double digits on cost, and having odd ideas about potential rents.
__________________
"Alot" isn't a word.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6123  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 6:47 PM
twister244 twister244 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 494
Quote:
Originally Posted by CherryCreek View Post
Nice! After a lull in announcements and a seeming lull in activity, things seem to be heating up. This quote confirms what many of us have suspected: the great availability of development opportunities in RiNo is not only a real competitor to "legacy" downtown, but for now, has the upper hand:

We have had one tenant say they want almost the entire building," Lee said. "I strongly believe that we could lease this building multiple times over the given amount."


It's a theme seen across RiNo. The proximity to the train station — about a 90-foot walk, Lee said — is a big driver, but it's the quality of life that the hip neighborhood offers that tenants are most excited about.

"It's the vibe that is RiNo," Lee said. "I think you're going to see more new product in RiNo than in downtown over the next two to four years."

Crews are expected to break ground on the office portion of the project later this year with a completion in the third quarter of 2021. Some ground floor tenants may be able to move in even sooner, depending on construction progress, Campbell said. The hotel is also scheduled to be delivered in 2021


Poor T2. If they had gotten their shit together early in the cycle and got 'er done, I suspect they'd be 100% leased now at favorable rates. But now RiNo is stealing their thunder.
That was my thought too..... T2 really is cursed! Lol...... The article mentions other projects in the area as well, but..... they all appear to be just on the other side of the opportunity zone boundary. From what I can tell, that is delineated by 38th street. So, this actually just boosted my optimism in WTC significantly as most folks are probably looking at this as more likely to get off the ground now that is has some serious backing and location.

That one tenant...... could it be the secret "S" we were mentioning last week?......
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6124  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 6:55 PM
wong21fr's Avatar
wong21fr wong21fr is offline
Reluctant Hobbesian
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,531
Quote:
Originally Posted by milehighmomentum View Post
Looks like the final pieces of the puzzle are coming together for a groundbreaking that's not too far off...

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/n...evelopers.html
Man, that Opportunity Zone in RiNo is blowing up. When they announce development plans for the NWSS Triangle that's going to be huuuuge. I also imagine that the Pepsi bottling plant will be in play within the next five years- probably with the next cycle.
__________________
"You don't strike, you just go to work everyday and do your job real half-ass. That's the American way!" -Homer Simpson

All of us who are concerned for peace and triumph of reason and justice must be keenly aware how small an influence reason and honest good will exert upon events in the political field. ~Albert Einstein

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6125  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 6:55 PM
Robert.hampton Robert.hampton is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by CherryCreek View Post
Nice! After a lull in announcements and a seeming lull in activity, things seem to be heating up. This quote confirms what many of us have suspected: the great availability of development opportunities in RiNo is not only a real competitor to "legacy" downtown, but for now, has the upper hand:

We have had one tenant say they want almost the entire building," Lee said. "I strongly believe that we could lease this building multiple times over the given amount."


It's a theme seen across RiNo. The proximity to the train station — about a 90-foot walk, Lee said — is a big driver, but it's the quality of life that the hip neighborhood offers that tenants are most excited about.

"It's the vibe that is RiNo," Lee said. "I think you're going to see more new product in RiNo than in downtown over the next two to four years."

Crews are expected to break ground on the office portion of the project later this year with a completion in the third quarter of 2021. Some ground floor tenants may be able to move in even sooner, depending on construction progress, Campbell said. The hotel is also scheduled to be delivered in 2021


Poor T2. If they had gotten their shit together early in the cycle and got 'er done, I suspect they'd be 100% leased now at favorable rates. But now RiNo is stealing their thunder.
Is it just me or is the rendering for this far more pedestrian than the initial vision?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6126  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 6:58 PM
wong21fr's Avatar
wong21fr wong21fr is offline
Reluctant Hobbesian
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,531
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert.hampton View Post
Is it just me or is the rendering for this far more pedestrian than the initial vision?
As in more realistic and likely to get built? Yuuuup.

Trimmed the fat and made some design concessions in order to keep to the development budget. It's frustrating, but necessary.
__________________
"You don't strike, you just go to work everyday and do your job real half-ass. That's the American way!" -Homer Simpson

All of us who are concerned for peace and triumph of reason and justice must be keenly aware how small an influence reason and honest good will exert upon events in the political field. ~Albert Einstein

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6127  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 7:03 PM
CherryCreek's Avatar
CherryCreek CherryCreek is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
As in more realistic and likely to get built? Yuuuup.

Trimmed the fat and made some design concessions in order to keep to the development budget. It's frustrating, but necessary.
Indeed. Still not as bad the PBS downgrades from their RiNo structure. Hahah. That was the saddest evolution of a development plan in the history of the city.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6128  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 7:10 PM
TakeFive's Avatar
TakeFive TakeFive is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by milehighmomentum View Post
Looks like the final pieces of the puzzle are coming together for a groundbreaking that's not too far off...

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/n...evelopers.html

Source

You just won the prize for Best First Post Ever. Congratulations.

This flew completely under my radar
Had I seen it I would have done a little dance.

Golub & Company Opens Denver Office, Expands Presence Through Western U.S.
NEWS PROVIDED BY: Golub & Company LLC Jun 04, 2018
Quote:
CHICAGO and DENVER, June 4, 2018 /PRNewswire/ -- International real estate investment and development firm Golub & Company, headquartered in Chicago, announced today it will establish a Denver office focused on multifamily and office acquisitions across Colorado and the Western United States.
They've been a long time player in Phoenix, not that they've done that much; bought land for development mostly.

They are well qualified however.
__________________
Cool... Denver has reached puberty.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6129  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 7:35 PM
CherryCreek's Avatar
CherryCreek CherryCreek is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 790
The special election this week in Lakewood has been under the radar, but could be a big deal if it passes:

The ballot proposal would bar growth greater than 1 % of existing housing stock.


https://www.denverpost.com/2019/06/2...owth-election/


My concern would be the precedent it set - if it succeeds, look for similar initiatives elsewhere.

As an aside, the fact that it's a special election is B.S. Something this important should be in a general election.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6130  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 7:46 PM
BG918's Avatar
BG918 BG918 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,022
Quote:
Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
As in more realistic and likely to get built? Yuuuup.

Trimmed the fat and made some design concessions in order to keep to the development budget. It's frustrating, but necessary.
Still looks good to me. What's the ghosted building to the north, future phase?

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6131  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 8:03 PM
twister244 twister244 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 494
^^^^^^^

I'm assuming that's the still unnamed hotel component they will be building.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6132  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 8:08 PM
CherryCreek's Avatar
CherryCreek CherryCreek is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 790
Quote:
Originally Posted by BG918 View Post
Still looks good to me. What's the ghosted building to the north, future phase?

Sort of reminds me of this Denver classic:

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6133  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 9:16 PM
wong21fr's Avatar
wong21fr wong21fr is offline
Reluctant Hobbesian
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,531
Quote:
Originally Posted by twister244 View Post
^^^^^^^

I'm assuming that's the still unnamed hotel component they will be building.
I think that the hotel is the portion of the building above the parking podium. I believe the transparent building is a future office phase.
__________________
"You don't strike, you just go to work everyday and do your job real half-ass. That's the American way!" -Homer Simpson

All of us who are concerned for peace and triumph of reason and justice must be keenly aware how small an influence reason and honest good will exert upon events in the political field. ~Albert Einstein

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6134  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 9:19 PM
SirLucasTheGreat SirLucasTheGreat is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 206
I just noticed the mural on what we think might be the hotel portion. Cool
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6135  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 9:38 PM
TakeFive's Avatar
TakeFive TakeFive is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by wong21fr View Post
I think that the hotel is the portion of the building above the parking podium. I believe the transparent building is a future office phase.
Except it don't look they'll have a parking podium; they're going to build one of them thar separated parking garages.

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/n..._news_headline
Quote:
In terms of design, the developers decided to go with a separate parking garage as opposed to underground parking to save time on the project. Campbell estimates that when construction starts later this year, it will take about 18 months to complete. Underground parking would have added about six months of construction time and more cost to the project, which is now estimated at about $300 million total.
AFAIK this is in reference to the hotel.
__________________
Cool... Denver has reached puberty.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6136  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2019, 9:50 PM
wong21fr's Avatar
wong21fr wong21fr is offline
Reluctant Hobbesian
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,531
Quote:
Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
Except it don't look they'll have a parking podium; they're going to build one of them thar separated parking garages.

https://www.bizjournals.com/denver/n..._news_headline

AFAIK this is in reference to the hotel.
Than the hotel adjacent to the garage. The project always had one of them thar fancy parking garages, looks like the hotel was either set on it or next to it, but now it's a bigger above-ground garage instead of a smaller one with an underground component as well.
__________________
"You don't strike, you just go to work everyday and do your job real half-ass. That's the American way!" -Homer Simpson

All of us who are concerned for peace and triumph of reason and justice must be keenly aware how small an influence reason and honest good will exert upon events in the political field. ~Albert Einstein

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6137  
Old Posted Jun 27, 2019, 3:26 PM
CherryCreek's Avatar
CherryCreek CherryCreek is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Denver
Posts: 790
Interesting urban area walk-ability study that puts Denver No. 2 on the list after NYC.

https://smartgrowthamerica.org/resou...ic-ahead-2019/
Before everyone groans that that's nuts, i'd note the study is focused much more narrowly than typical walk-ability ratings/studies.

Key economic findings
Based on the share of office, retail, and rental multi-family occupied square footage in WalkUPs relative to the metro region as a whole, the top regions are 1) New York City, 2) Denver, 3) Boston, 4) Washington, DC, 5) San Francisco Bay Area, and 6) Chicago.

Drivable sub-urban real estate products have been losing market share to walkable urban real estate products in all 30 metros. In some metros, walkable urban places have accounted for almost 100 percent of net new office and rental multi-family space while drivable sub-urban places have added no new space or lost occupancy since 2010.

This report indicates that the highest-ranked walkable urban metros are models for the future development patterns of many U.S. metros. Conversely, metros such as Tampa, Orlando, and Phoenix have an uphill climb to create walkable places. However, these low-ranking metros have also demonstrated an inability or unwillingness to change by continuing to promote drivable sub-urban sprawl through public policy and infrastructure investments.

It should be noted that this analysis specifically examines office, retail, and multi-family income-producing properties, and does not include single-family for-sale homes, which are a primary driver of sprawling development. Drivable sub-urbanism, i.e. sprawl, is and has been systematically subsidized by federal, state, and local governments for more than half a century. This leads to the question of whether drivable sub-urban development patterns should continue to be subsidized, especially when the commercial real estate market is increasingly demanding walkable urbanism.


From what I can tell, Denver comes in so high because of the concentration of office space downtown and the huge amounts of multi-family housing that has been built within walking distance of downtown - i.e., "urban walk-ability."

Obviously, many of the older cities listed below Denver have much larger areas with walk-able neighborhoods, but the study is focused on the walk-ability of the core urban area, not on neighborhoods per se.

Makes for an interesting read.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6138  
Old Posted Jun 27, 2019, 3:56 PM
wong21fr's Avatar
wong21fr wong21fr is offline
Reluctant Hobbesian
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 12,531
Tower crane going up at 3463 Walnut.
__________________
"You don't strike, you just go to work everyday and do your job real half-ass. That's the American way!" -Homer Simpson

All of us who are concerned for peace and triumph of reason and justice must be keenly aware how small an influence reason and honest good will exert upon events in the political field. ~Albert Einstein

Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6139  
Old Posted Jun 27, 2019, 5:06 PM
TakeFive's Avatar
TakeFive TakeFive is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 5,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by CherryCreek View Post
Makes for an interesting read.
Not really; well maybe since it's so kind to Denver. Consider the source and the parameters. If you live in any nice neighborhood that doesn't have a few office building skyscrapers in the center then you're a loser.

This is nothing more than an anti-car, urbanist, classic downtown focused self adulation. Since it's specifically set up to exclude most anything outside of downtown it succeeds with it's self-defined but limited goal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CherryCreek View Post
Interesting urban area walk-ability study that puts Denver No. 2 on the list after NYC.

Obviously, many of the older cities listed below Denver have much larger areas with walk-able neighborhoods, but the study is focused on the walk-ability of the core urban area, not on neighborhoods per se.
It's easy enough to understand why Denver scores so well as you suggest. The core of downtown has always been compact; essentially between 14th and 19th streets. The intense growth of lots of residential on the edges becoming part of an urban center fits the given parameters to a T.

It's a given that following the Great Recession there has been a millennial-driven migration to urban centers ie downtown's.

Is the migration to classic downtown urban centers a good thing?

Yes I believe it is. It brings more balance to existing metro areas. There are specific benefits to density in general; in traditional cities with a prominent downtown it is understandably the area of focused growth.

Some of the other points are pretty weak but follow from their limited view.
__________________
Cool... Denver has reached puberty.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6140  
Old Posted Jun 27, 2019, 5:07 PM
Stonemans_rowJ's Avatar
Stonemans_rowJ Stonemans_rowJ is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Lodo
Posts: 358
For millennials with smallish down payments these 500' units would be $3,500+ a month when they can rent these things all day long for $2,000/mo in better locations.
__________________
JP
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > United States > Mountain West
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 5:55 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.