Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (YOW/CYOW)

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

That's too bad. I was on this flight in October and then same route with the Montreal stopover in December and it is amazing how much worse it can be. Between flight delays and customs lines and full flights I arrived a full 8 hours after my arrival in Montreal. Last winter I used KLM and the bus and that is actually a better experience. Once the LRT will take me from the train station I might even take that over the direct flight.

...and if that happens that's exactly why our international service is so lousy out of YOW. Probably a +1 million YOW-area air trips are leaked to other airports (mostly YUL) a year. You're basically saying serve us poorly as we'll gladly put up with the hassles of adding hours to a trip. I have never taken more than 45 minutes to clear immigration/customs & collect bags when arriving internationally at YOW.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by RomanR27

Final pax numbers for 2016 are up, 4,743,091 for the year, a bit short of the approximately 4.8 million the airport authority predicted in their 2015 annual report. Both international/transborder down but a little over 5% growth in the domestic sector.

Here's the full breakdown:

Sector / Dec-15 / Dec-16 / % Change
Dom: 283,439 / 295,182 / +4.1%
TB: 62,090 / 57,005 / -8.2%
Int'l: 41,701 / 39,129 / -6.2%
TTL: 387,230 / 391,316 / +1.1%

Sector / YTD 2015 / YTD 2016 / % Change
Dom: 3,488,629 / 3,679,232 / +5.5%
TB: 735,755 / 673,434 / -8.5%
Int'l: 431,976 / 390,425 / -9.6%
TTL: 4,656,360 / 4,743,091 / +1.9%

Only January and April of 2016 saw net losses, even though transborder and international were down almost every month this year.

[YOWflier]

Originally Posted by daud

I got caught on this. Was bragging on this board a few pages back about my nonstop YOW-MCO.

They just sent me the flight change, transferring through YYZ and arriving at midnight (with 2 kids).

I called and complained. They switched me to a decent hour a day earlier and covered the room. While I appreciate the compensation, I really just wanted the non-stop. I travel about 10 times a year and I constantly feel pushed to use YYZ.

I'm not sure what your knowledge is of this stuff, but I wish you posted before making alternate arrangements. What happened to you is fairly common (and it sucks) and is referred to as an involuntary schedule change. Under these circumstances, you're not obligated to accept whatever alternative they offer you; you can ask for almost anything (in terms of schedule/reroute) and they will comply at no additional cost to you.

In your circumstance, you would have been well within your right to switch to another day with a nonstop and they would have given it to you, assuming availability.

Originally Posted by Dominion301

...and if that happens that's exactly why our international service is so lousy out of YOW. Probably a +1 million YOW-area air trips are leaked to other airports (mostly YUL) a year. You're basically saying serve us poorly as we'll gladly put up with the hassles of adding hours to a trip. I have never taken more than 45 minutes to clear immigration/customs & collect bags when arriving internationally at YOW.

Exactly. You get what you ask for, and if people continue to settle for that kind of travel pattern, things will never improve.

[JCL]

To any plane spotters out there: A Boeing 777-300 (B77W) has been assigned today to Air Canada flights 460/465 - Toronto-Ottawa-Toronto flight.

Air Canada 452/457 and Air Canada 456 were cancelled today. Reason: Weather issues in Toronto (fog).

[RomanR27]

Thanks to weather related cancellations, AC460/465 will be a 77W tonight. AC460 is in 18:00, AC465 is supposed to leave at 19:00.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by RomanR27

Thanks to weather related cancellations, AC460/465 will be a 77W tonight. AC460 is in 18:00, AC465 is supposed to leave at 19:00.

I wonder if we'll see any subs later on tonight with the ice pellets and snow? I see on the FIDS there are already 3 Rapidairs cancelled today.

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

I wonder if we'll see any subs later on tonight with the ice pellets and snow? I see on the FIDS there are already 3 Rapidairs cancelled today.

Just those three cancelled, no subs unfortunately.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by RomanR27

Just those three cancelled, no subs unfortunately.

Not surprising as on a Tuesday in late January during mid-morning/early-afternoon, probably everyone can be accommodated on other flights throughout the day. A slow travel day during a slow travel period.

[ars]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

The bad times just continue to roll on for YOW transborder:
WS MCO-YOW FEB 1.0>0.6 MAR 1.0>0.6 APR 0.9>0.5
WS TPA-YOW MAR 0.5>0.3 APR 0.4>0.3

Those are mighty close-in cuts.

Really surprised to see this because I just flew YOW<->MCO on AC this month, and on both legs the flight was fairly full(the return trip looked completely full).

Originally Posted by Dominion301

...and if that happens that's exactly why our international service is so lousy out of YOW. Probably a +1 million YOW-area air trips are leaked to other airports (mostly YUL) a year. You're basically saying serve us poorly as we'll gladly put up with the hassles of adding hours to a trip. I have never taken more than 45 minutes to clear immigration/customs & collect bags when arriving internationally at YOW.

Same here, YOW is my preferred airport to fly out of because of how hassle free everything is, it makes for a much more pleasant experience. If there's a non stop service to my destination from YOW, I'll gladly pay the premium(if applicable) because it will literally save hours of my time.

[DubberDom]

Originally Posted by ars

Really surprised to see this because I just flew YOW<->MCO on AC this month, and on both legs the flight was fairly full(the return trip looked completely full).

Here are the PAX numbers from my MCO flight (Westjet)
Jan 21 depart - 117+2 infants
Jan 25 return - 41+2infants

We may lose more flights based on some of those numbers!!

[YOWflier]

Just so people don't think we're so alone ... this week's reported adjustments:

WS FLL-YUL MAY 0.4>0.1 JUN 0.4>0.1 JUL 0.5>0.2 AUG 0.4>0.1 SEP 0.4>0.2 OCT 0.5>0.2
WS LAS-YEG MAY 2>1.4 JUN 2>1.4 JUL 2>1.5 AUG 2>1.4 SEP 2>1.4
WS LAS-YWG MAY 0.5>0.3 JUN 0.6>0.3 SEP 0.5>0.3 OCT 0.6>0.3
WS MCO-YYC MAY 0.3>0.1 JUN 0.3>0.1
WS MYR-YYZ MAY 0.4>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.5>0.3 SEP 0.4>0.3 OCT 0.4>0.3
WS PHX-YYZ OCT 0.5>0.1
WS RSW-YYZ MAY 1.1>0.5
WS SAN-YVR SEP 0.4>0.3 OCT 0.4>0.3
WS TPA-YYZ MAY 1.3>0.8

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by DubberDom

Here are the PAX numbers from my MCO flight (Westjet)
Jan 21 depart - 117+2 infants
Jan 25 return - 41+2infants

We may lose more flights based on some of those numbers!!

Makes sense they're cutting the Monday-Thursday flights, then. That's a brutal load on your return flight.

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by ac888yow

Just so people don't think we're so alone ... this week's reported adjustments:

WS FLL-YUL MAY 0.4>0.1 JUN 0.4>0.1 JUL 0.5>0.2 AUG 0.4>0.1 SEP 0.4>0.2 OCT 0.5>0.2
WS LAS-YEG MAY 2>1.4 JUN 2>1.4 JUL 2>1.5 AUG 2>1.4 SEP 2>1.4
WS LAS-YWG MAY 0.5>0.3 JUN 0.6>0.3 SEP 0.5>0.3 OCT 0.6>0.3
WS MCO-YYC MAY 0.3>0.1 JUN 0.3>0.1
WS MYR-YYZ MAY 0.4>0.3 JUN 0.4>0.3 JUL 0.4>0.3 AUG 0.5>0.3 SEP 0.4>0.3 OCT 0.4>0.3
WS PHX-YYZ OCT 0.5>0.1
WS RSW-YYZ MAY 1.1>0.5
WS SAN-YVR SEP 0.4>0.3 OCT 0.4>0.3
WS TPA-YYZ MAY 1.3>0.8

The Trump administration coupled with the dollar sure isn't going to help the transborder numbers. On the bright side, the DL CR9 is still loaded!

[Dominion301]

Well WestJet just announced their summer 2017 schedule and and (I'm sure to no one's surprise), there are ZERO new flight frequencies for YOW. However the daily YWG flight gets upgauged to a 738 and the evening YYC is also on a 738 (not sure if that's an upgauge). YVR is a 73G daily x3, while on day 3 when it's on a 736...I think it was mostly 736s last year. That's the only 736 listed unless a couple more pop up on weekends.

Everything else stays the same including the LGW 1-stop and 2 x 73G + 10x Q400 on YYZ.

AC's summer schedule must still be getting finalized. They're showing Rapidair flight frequencies increasing to 19x, BUT there are two 0600 departures and the majority of flights are E90 instead of Airbuses. The 763 is showing departing on a new 1630 flight and an 1830 flight is added. Outside of the AC1xx to AC3xx on YOW-west flights and CRAs sharing YHZ again with Q400s (essentially the same capacity), AC is unchanged elsewhere. Edit: I just checked YOW-YYZ again and now it's showing 20x with departures at 1800, 1825, 1830 & 1910. That doesn't seem true. If Rapidair becomes E90-heavy the YOW-YYZ seat capacity increase will be minimal, if any at all. Hopefully a lot of those are placeholders.

YOW-YUL also still doesn't make any sense with only 7x outbound (3 of which are between 1515 and 1530) and a slightly higher than usual 11x inbound (only two of these 5 minutes apart are likely duplicates).

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Well WestJet just announced their summer 2017 schedule and and (I'm sure to no one's surprise), there are ZERO new flight frequencies for YOW. However the daily YWG flight gets upgauged to a 738 and the evening YYC is also on a 738 (not sure if that's an upgauge). YVR is a 73G daily x3, while on day 3 when it's on a 736...I think it was mostly 736s last year. That's the only 736 listed unless a couple more pop up on weekends.

AC's summer schedule must still be getting finalized. They're showing Rapidair flight frequencies increasing to 19x, BUT there are two 0600 departures and the majority of flights are E90 instead of Airbuses. The 763 is showing departing on a new 1630 flight and an 1830 flight is added. Outside of the AC1xx to AC3xx on YOW-west flights and CRAs sharing YHZ again with Q400s (essentially the same capacity), AC is unchanged elsewhere. Edit: I just checked YOW-YYZ again and now it's showing 20x with departures at 1800, 1825, 1830 & 1910. That doesn't seem true. If Rapidair becomes E90-heavy the YOW-YYZ seat capacity increase will be minimal, if any at all. Hopefully a lot of those are placeholders.

YOW-YUL also still doesn't make any sense with only 7x outbound (3 of which are between 1515 and 1530) and a slightly higher than usual 11x inbound (only two of these 5 minutes apart are likely duplicates).

I did a couple dummy booking for YOW-YYC with WS and it didn't seem like that 738 is daily.

As for the AC YOW-YYZ, they definitely need to do some adjusting. AC839 is scheduled in at 1600, so that 1630 departure time is unrealistic (AC888 doesn't get in until 1750). The FRA times are later than usual so that could be why the schedules are so screwy.

There's no 321s listed for YOW-YVR, which seems strange. Also YOW-YYC has a mistake, they have two identical morning departures listed. Another possible reason for the weird schedules could be the switch over to new flight numbers.

[mxg308]

Air Canada joins the cutting as it appears FLL may no longer be a year round service.

AC FLL-YOW OCT 0.2>0.0

So now what?

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by mxg308

Air Canada joins the cutting as it appears FLL may no longer be a year round service.

AC FLL-YOW OCT 0.2>0.0

So now what?

Yup, just did a dummy booking and the last FLL flight is on 29APR17. MCO is still at 2x weekly in the summer on days 67.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by RomanR27

Yup, just did a dummy booking and the last FLL flight is on 29APR17. MCO is still at 2x weekly in the summer on days 67.

Hmmm it looks like MCO over the summer months has been more successful than FLL over the summer months for AC. Last summer it was 1x to both MCO and FLL. The summer prior it was 2x FLL and 0x MCO. At least it appears capacity remains the same to Florida over the summer months, despite FLL returning to a seasonal service. I guess it makes sense that there's more demand for Disney/Universal while school's out than to the beach market of FLL.

WG have YOW-VRA loaded weekly again year-round. Looks like on Mondays. They also have YOW-FPT loaded as a new destination for winter 2017-18.

[Dominion301]

The CAA in the UK publish monthly city pair stats for all nonstop and same-plane routes served out of UK airports. YOW-LHR saw:

An approx. 70% LF in November 2016 (+5% in total pax vs. 2015): http://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/C...e_Analysis.pdf

An approx. 77% LF in December 2016 (-6% in total pax vs. 2015): http://www.caa.co.uk/uploadedFiles/C...e_Analysis.pdf

The reason I say approx. is I know AC didn't operate 2-4 days in each of Nov & Dec., but I don't know the exact number.

If you want to check other months/year, simply change this portion of the url Airport_data_2016_11

It's not 100% accurate as if you look for 2016_10 you'll notice they've allocated about 98% of the traffic on WS' LGW-YYT-YOW route to YOW...I'd hazard a guess that YOW would account for 50% of the route's traffic at most.

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

Hmmm it looks like MCO over the summer months has been more successful than FLL over the summer months for AC. Last summer it was 1x to both MCO and FLL. The summer prior it was 2x FLL and 0x MCO. At least it appears capacity remains the same to Florida over the summer months, despite FLL returning to a seasonal service. I guess it makes sense that there's more demand for Disney/Universal while school's out than to the beach market of FLL.

WG have YOW-VRA loaded weekly again year-round. Looks like on Mondays. They also have YOW-FPT loaded as a new destination for winter 2017-18.

I'm pretty sure YOW-MCO was 2x weekly through this past summer....I could be wrong.

And VRA was on Mondays last year so makes sense. And if you mean YOW-FPO, that's a current destination, albeit a short season (first flight this Thursday, which was pushed back from around Christmas). Also making its first appearance this Thursday is YOW-MCO with TS.