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  #81  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 2:33 AM
Admiral Nelson Admiral Nelson is offline
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We have all seen the outcome from students having classes at home. It works for some, it has been a disaster for others. The political pressure to re-open schools, colleges and universities for in-person classes has been incredible. And what happened? They re-opened. I have directly spoken to students whose experiences with classes at home was terrible. Some quit university as a result. Hopefully, they return and this does not damage their life-long future.

But I guess students are a different species from adults in the workforce.
A key difference is that students wanted to go back to school/university and feel they learn better that way. Plus, there's actual evidence instead of supposition that remote learning is less effective with children. That's not the case with employees in many types of roles. Simple as that.

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Now, before everybody gets on my back again. I said that I see value in Zoom conferences and WFH to some extent, but I go back to my original comment some months ago, that I found it shocking that 48% of PS workers were still 'exclusively' working from home. Hopefully, that has since changed.
We're seeing a paradigm shift - the pandemic probably moved us forward a decade or more on the digital workplace. As a Canadian, I'm glad that the PS will likely reap huge financial benefit from reducing office demand, freeing up resources for, you know, programs Canadians actually care about.

Anecdotally, I feel more productive, as do most who do primarily autonomous work. The exceptions are the colleagues who enjoy watercooler conversations more than they loathe commuting.
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  #82  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 3:09 PM
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Originally Posted by originalmuffins View Post
Lol what a ridiculous and useless consistent regurgitation of the same things. Same people constantly griping about WFH and the modern workplace daily.

Daily.

Regardless of information or viewpoints presented, the same conversations take place. It comes up on multiple threads with the same garbage rhetoric with zero back up and the dumb perception of just federal workers demanding this (FYI, it's private sector as well). It's getting supremely annoying to hear so I'm going to be taking a break. Have fun.

I'm sure the dream of Ottawa continuing to stay in the past will stay as long as everyone wants.
The comments that you seem to disdain are just personal opinions on a comment board. Your comments are also a personal opinion, despite your apparent absolute certainty that your opinion is the correct one. Not sure why the need to belittle and disrespect.
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  #83  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 3:45 PM
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As an introvert who loves the current WFH trend because I don’t have to waste hours and money commuting every week and have the flexibility to make my own schedule, a big no thanks to being forced back into the office. I actually switched companies because my old Kanata-based company was going to force people to come back into the office(which is not helping the downtown core at all if I may add). My current company has an optional hybrid policy where you can come into the office if you want but you will never be forced to, and a lot of people who don’t have a good working space at home choose to come in regularly. It’s a win-win for all sides because the employer can save costs by reducing their real estate as well.

Revitalizing downtown by forcing people back into offices is a crutch and a band-aid solution that doesn’t actually solve the real problem that there isn’t much to do downtown outside of 9-5 on weekdays. The Sens coming to Lebreton might help, but even Lebreton isn’t super-accessible to and from the downtown core. If you look at some of the most vibrant downtowns in the world, a lot of them revolve around amenities and communities that are difficult to recreate in suburbs(open air markets, world class restaurants and entertainment, tourists, high end hotels, architecture and nature).

FWIW, I think Shopify becoming digital only hurt downtown more than suburban dwelling government workers working from home. Even if you force people back into the office, the type of companies you need downtown are the trendy companies and startups that will have a younger crowd of employees living downtown within walking distance of the office.
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  #84  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 4:56 PM
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Foot traffic steadily rising in Ottawa and other Canadian cities, new data shows

By: The Canadian Press
Oct 6, 2022 10:36pm EDT


As Canada moves out of the COVID-19 pandemic era, new data from commercial real estate firm Avison Young shows Ottawa leads the country in increased foot traffic as more people return to the office, shop in-store, head back to class, and venture out for events.

The latest data comes from the firm's refreshed Vitality Index, which tracks weekly foot traffic in North America across industries such as the office sector, retail, hospitality and tourism, food services, and colleges and universities.

Since Ontario lifted pandemic restrictions in May, foot traffic in the nation’s capital is up 105 per cent as of the week of Sept. 19, making it the best-performing Canadian city when isolating these time periods. Toronto, by comparison, is up 80 per cent.

Data for the week of Sept. 19 shows Ottawa is the fourth-best performing market among all North American cities since the week preceding the first pandemic lockdown in March 2020, with foot traffic up 20 per cent when isolating those dates.

Edmonton leads all cities surveyed with an increase of 51 per cent, while Calgary increased by 23 per cent and Montreal rose by 11 per cent.

According to the Vitality Index, education and retail properties reported some of the strongest foot traffic increases across the country when isolating these time periods.

Since this past Labour Day weekend, Ottawa, Toronto and Calgary have been the most active, up 13.6 per cent, 13.4 per cent and 13.2 per cent respectively, as of the week of Sept. 19.

Avison Young CEO Mark Rose says this is a moment in time where culture is driving foot traffic patterns, as foot traffic has shown to be highest on weekends for leisure activities, such as shopping, sporting events and concerts, yet lower on weekdays, which correlates with office work and the hybrid work model many companies have adopted.

The data comes as other studies suggest Ottawa is lagging behind other big Canadian cities when it comes to workers returning to the office in a post-pandemic world.

A Statistics Canada survey from earlier this year revealed that nearly 46 per cent of Ottawa’s labour force was still working from home, the highest rate in the country. By comparison, in Toronto just 35 per cent of workers were staying home.

In addition, Ottawa also finished far down the list in a joint study between the University of Toronto and the University of California, Berkeley that compared mobile device usage in 62 major North American cities at downtown sites like bars and restaurants between March and May of this year and the same time period in 2019.

The researchers found that downtown Ottawa had returned to only 48 per cent of pre-pandemic levels of activity, placing it 46th overall.

– With additional reporting from OBJ staff


https://www.obj.ca/article/local/foo...new-data-shows
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  #85  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 5:26 PM
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If you look at some of the most vibrant downtowns in the world, a lot of them revolve around amenities and communities that are difficult to recreate in suburbs(open air markets, world class restaurants and entertainment, tourists, high end hotels, architecture and nature).
I do think that we sell our downtown short a little bit. Maybe you are just considering Centretown, but we do have a world class museum (National Gallery), the NAC for entertainment, an exisitng open air market and some pretty great architecture in the parliamentary precinct. Also some high end hotels and great restaurants (Beckta, Riviera, North and Navy for instance plus lots in the Market and on Elgin). Most of the elements of a vibrant downtown are there, they just tend to be on the periphery of the office district.

To me a key would be to focus on Bank St., which has lots of potential to be a vibrant, walkable street like Elgin and to start linking the things that are there. The upgrades on Queen St., and introduction of Queen St. Fare are a beginning. With all of the new condos/apartments coming on line this year and next, you certainly have an expanding local market.
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  #86  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 6:09 PM
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The comments that you seem to disdain are just personal opinions on a comment board. Your comments are also a personal opinion, despite your apparent absolute certainty that your opinion is the correct one. Not sure why the need to belittle and disrespect.
Yeah kind of sad really. I have a pretty strong opinion against WFH from what I saw of my coworkers and subordinates and more generally the drop off in productivity of corporate service. That said several comments here have made some points that made me think about the other side of the issue and certainly for some industries it certainly makes sense.
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  #87  
Old Posted Oct 12, 2022, 6:23 PM
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I do think that we sell our downtown short a little bit. Maybe you are just considering Centretown, but we do have a world class museum (National Gallery), the NAC for entertainment, an exisitng open air market and some pretty great architecture in the parliamentary precinct. Also some high end hotels and great restaurants (Beckta, Riviera, North and Navy for instance plus lots in the Market and on Elgin). Most of the elements of a vibrant downtown are there, they just tend to be on the periphery of the office district.

To me a key would be to focus on Bank St., which has lots of potential to be a vibrant, walkable street like Elgin and to start linking the things that are there. The upgrades on Queen St., and introduction of Queen St. Fare are a beginning. With all of the new condos/apartments coming on line this year and next, you certainly have an expanding local market.
I am very much an introvert as well, but I am so thankful that my 'new' job required me to work with others in person even at the height of the pandemic in 2020. I now work in retail services that requires me to work in person and with customers. Even for me, there are limits to being alone all the time. I have seen many people sink into a funk where their lives have become dominated by a fear of getting any virus. This has looked very unhealthy. I could see that this could have happened to me if I was not forced to be out there to some degree. I think we are looking for reasonable compromises in the work environment. I have to wonder whether agoraphobia has grown during the pandemic? I often commented to friends that we started looking at everybody with suspicion and as potential walking viruses. This still applies today as the inevitable expansion of the virus has hit more and more people. Covid has become like the common cold in its spread amongst the population and our inability to stop it.

On your specific comments, what you say is mostly true. The problem is the shockwave of WFH. Many businesses have been just hanging on, hoping that things will get better. The smallest businesses downtown will be gone soon, if they are not already. I don't know how we can avoid this entirely. Turning around downtown again will not happen over night.

We need a plan to revitilize downtown on a number of fronts. If commuters are not coming back in full force (which I understand and accept), then we need to make it easier to get downtown and treat it as a 24/7 destination and work towards that. This means improved transit connections and improved cycling infrastructure. What we have created on the transit side is not good enough and is too focused on only the Confederation Line.

I recall my visit to Gothenburg in Sweden, a mid-sized city to see how diverse transit can animate downtown, and make it the meeting place for residents, which should be our goal.

We really fail when the main meeting places has become suburban Walmart superstores, Home Depot and Costco.
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  #88  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2022, 4:57 AM
Admiral Nelson Admiral Nelson is offline
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I have a pretty strong opinion against WFH from what I saw of my coworkers and subordinates and more generally the drop off in productivity of corporate service.
Just to pick up on this point because it's not the first time it's been raised here: managers need to manage employees whether they're slacking off at home or slacking off in the office. It's lazy for managers to place the blame on telework for their failure to motivate their employees and manage their performance.

At least in my line of work, I've not observed any reduction in my colleagues' performance and engagement despite being fully remote.
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  #89  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2022, 1:04 PM
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Lol what a ridiculous and useless consistent regurgitation of the same things. Same people constantly griping about WFH and the modern workplace daily.

Daily.

Regardless of information or viewpoints presented, the same conversations take place. It comes up on multiple threads with the same garbage rhetoric with zero back up and the dumb perception of just federal workers demanding this (FYI, it's private sector as well). It's getting supremely annoying to hear so I'm going to be taking a break. Have fun.

I'm sure the dream of Ottawa continuing to stay in the past will stay as long as everyone wants.
I think we all know WFH has it's positives, but I think we all need to stop being armchair quarterbacks thinking we know what is best for every workplace, including different federal government departments. Leave it up to those in charge (managers, directors, etc) to decide when to go back in person and how much of a hybrid model they think best suits their teams. It's cringy hearing so many people praising the virtues of WFH when they often have a vested interest in remaining at home. For example, I had an insane debate with a patient last week who didn't want to go back to 2 days per week in person due to COVID "safety concerns". Wanted me to write her a note. I told her that there is no medical indication to stay home and she needed to discuss this with her boss. If they can't come to a consensus maybe she needs to find another place of work. Meanwhile, I know she moved far outside the city in 2020 when things went virtual and is now regretting that decision now that things are getting back to (new) normal. Anyway, we can debate until we are blue in the face but, in the end, it's up to employers/bosses to determine what's next and this is going to have a huge impact on the sustainability of our downtown core for the next 20 years.
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  #90  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2022, 7:20 PM
JayBuoy JayBuoy is offline
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I think we all know WFH has it's positives, but I think we all need to stop being armchair quarterbacks thinking we know what is best for every workplace, including different federal government departments. Leave it up to those in charge (managers, directors, etc) to decide when to go back in person and how much of a hybrid model they think best suits their teams. It's cringy hearing so many people praising the virtues of WFH when they often have a vested interest in remaining at home. For example, I had an insane debate with a patient last week who didn't want to go back to 2 days per week in person due to COVID "safety concerns". Wanted me to write her a note. I told her that there is no medical indication to stay home and she needed to discuss this with her boss. If they can't come to a consensus maybe she needs to find another place of work. Meanwhile, I know she moved far outside the city in 2020 when things went virtual and is now regretting that decision now that things are getting back to (new) normal. Anyway, we can debate until we are blue in the face but, in the end, it's up to employers/bosses to determine what's next and this is going to have a huge impact on the sustainability of our downtown core for the next 20 years.
Vested interest? That is a strange way to say it. Everyone is looking out for their own best interest, and the vast majority of office workers have determined that means WFH. Your phrasing implies they should not have any influence over the location of their work. While current collective agreements in the public service stipulate that the employer is free to determine the location of work, that does not mean it can't or won't change in the near future. Depending on the union and bargaining unit, permanent WFH could be in talks right now, despite rhetoric from the privy council and upper management. It would not be unprecedented. Some Bell corporate workers inked a new collective agreement guaranteeing WFH, less than a year ago.

Workers should have a say in the conditions of their employment, including location.
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  #91  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2022, 10:53 PM
YOWetal YOWetal is online now
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Originally Posted by AuxTown View Post
I think we all know WFH has it's positives, but I think we all need to stop being armchair quarterbacks thinking we know what is best for every workplace, including different federal government departments. Leave it up to those in charge (managers, directors, etc) to decide when to go back in person and how much of a hybrid model they think best suits their teams. It's cringy hearing so many people praising the virtues of WFH when they often have a vested interest in remaining at home. For example, I had an insane debate with a patient last week who didn't want to go back to 2 days per week in person due to COVID "safety concerns". Wanted me to write her a note. I told her that there is no medical indication to stay home and she needed to discuss this with her boss. If they can't come to a consensus maybe she needs to find another place of work. Meanwhile, I know she moved far outside the city in 2020 when things went virtual and is now regretting that decision now that things are getting back to (new) normal. Anyway, we can debate until we are blue in the face but, in the end, it's up to employers/bosses to determine what's next and this is going to have a huge impact on the sustainability of our downtown core for the next 20 years.
Interesting. I am surprised there is so little sympathy for those claiming safety concerns. It seems like we will be re-starting other restrictions. If Covid is still something we need to contain surely a public servant can stay home for 2 days a week which I find punitive as either a job can be done from home effectively or it can't no?
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  #92  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 4:42 AM
Admiral Nelson Admiral Nelson is offline
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It's cringy hearing so many people praising the virtues of WFH when they often have a vested interest in remaining at home.
It's strange to me that employees seeking respect and recognition as a key stakeholder in arbitrary-seeming RTO decisions—considering that commuting imposes direct costs to employees' time and finances—are belittled here as a vested interests, while the loudest voices calling for RTO, who are literally seeking to volunteer other peoples' time and money into supporting some businesses over others, are given a free pass.

Telework isn't going away. Instead of pinning hopes on re-creating yesterday's market, Ottawa should move to diversify downtown away from the 9-5 worker. Long-term downtown revitalization lies there.
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  #93  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 2:37 PM
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Workers should have a say in the conditions of their employment, including location.
Workers can have their voices heard but if their employer doesn't agree then it's end of story. This whole argument is the epitome of entitlement. People thinking they know best despite the fact there is significant data in many departments to suggest otherwise. Not to mention the fact the feds have to deal with public perception and, like it or not, some of these decisions to return to the office are being made for that reason. Not saying it's justified; just that it is one of many practical realities this large and diverse employer has to contend with.

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It's strange to me that employees seeking respect and recognition as a key stakeholder in arbitrary-seeming RTO decisions—considering that commuting imposes direct costs to employees' time and finances—are belittled here as a vested interests, while the loudest voices calling for RTO, who are literally seeking to volunteer other peoples' time and money into supporting some businesses over others, are given a free pass.
I am saying that people who made arguably dumb decisions (like moving 1.5 hours further from their workplace assuming they would never be asked to come back in) are claiming bullshit medical concerns as their reason to not return to the office.

To be clear, I am all for teleworking in the right setting. What I am against is the assertion that these office environments are unsafe to return to and that it is up to physicians to give people a pass to stay home. This is between them and their employer and shouldn't be further burdening an already taxed healthcare system IMO.

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Interesting. I am surprised there is so little sympathy for those claiming safety concerns. It seems like we will be re-starting other restrictions. If Covid is still something we need to contain surely a public servant can stay home for 2 days a week which I find punitive as either a job can be done from home effectively or it can't no?
The VAST majority of COVID spread has, thankfully, not occurred in workplace settings. That includes some high risk ones like service workers and people working with active COVID cases in the hospital. Many large studies have shown schools and family gatherings to be much more problematic. In fact, the feds have invested a ton of money and time into making their workplaces some of the safest.
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  #94  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 4:46 PM
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Workers can have their voices heard but if their employer doesn't agree then it's end of story. This whole argument is the epitome of entitlement. People thinking they know best despite the fact there is significant data in many departments to suggest otherwise. Not to mention the fact the feds have to deal with public perception and, like it or not, some of these decisions to return to the office are being made for that reason. Not saying it's justified; just that it is one of many practical realities this large and diverse employer has to contend with.
And I'm telling you, giving examples, that unions can and will bargain for WFH...
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  #95  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 4:48 PM
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It's strange to me that employees seeking respect and recognition as a key stakeholder in arbitrary-seeming RTO decisions—considering that commuting imposes direct costs to employees' time and finances—are belittled here as a vested interests, while the loudest voices calling for RTO, who are literally seeking to volunteer other peoples' time and money into supporting some businesses over others, are given a free pass.

Telework isn't going away. Instead of pinning hopes on re-creating yesterday's market, Ottawa should move to diversify downtown away from the 9-5 worker. Long-term downtown revitalization lies there.
+1 very much agreed. Makes no sense to fight the rising tide.
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  #96  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 6:21 PM
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And I'm telling you, giving examples, that unions can and will bargain for WFH...
I'm glad they will and I think it is justified in most cases. I guess I should keep my personal gripe out of it Just seems to be taking up an inordinate amount of my time these days.

Transitioning our downtown will take time and the transition phase will be painful (business closures, low transit ridership, etc.). But if it needs to be done hopefully we can get buy-in early from all stakeholders.
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  #97  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 10:25 PM
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Expedited federal plan to shed thousands of square feet of office space sounds alarm bells for business leaders

By: Darren Fleming, OBJ
Oct 14, 2022 1:37pm EDT


On Thursday, I attended the 2022 Ottawa Real Estate Forum along with more than 700 property developers, leasing agents, investment brokers, asset managers, building owners and various members of industry and local economic trade representatives — all meeting in person for the first time since the pandemic. The forum included participation from municipal and federal government officials, both elected and public servants.

It was a dynamic day full of conversation, more than a few hugs and, quite frankly, some much-needed blunt talk.

If there was one overall theme, it was the industry coming to grips with the reality that the federal public service, which occupies virtually half of all the office space in Ottawa (about 42 million square feet, both owned and leased) is not going to be re-occupying that office space at anywhere near the density of pre-pandemic levels. Though there was lots of conversation on the continued robust demand for industrial space and the fact that retail space, while still somewhat at risk as an asset class due to the COVID-19 acceleration of online shopping, has survived and is doing well, the overwhelming discussion in the main conference room as well as in the breakout sessions and coffee breaks centred around how we are going to get people back to the office and the downtown core in general.

While office vacancy remains relatively stable across the city, vacancy in the downtown core has been creeping up as our city’s chief employer, the federal public service, has not come up with a unified strategy with respect to physical attendance. And while tenants are still paying rent, many of their spaces remain practically empty.

“World Exchange Plaza is 96 per cent leased,” said Dan Gray, vice-president of leasing at QuadReal Property Group, before adding, “but for how long?”

Gray shared that his firm has been polling its downtown tenants on a weekly basis concerning occupancy levels and that currently attendance is around 20 per cent, a number similar to that shared by the federal government.

The federal government reaffirmed that the scheduled rollout of its current workplace strategy, GCWorkplace, which was released prior to the pandemic, has been greatly accelerated by COVID. That strategy outlined a plan to reduce the overall government office space portfolio by as much as 30 per cent over 25 years.

The stated intent is to focus on greener buildings that support four pillars: collaboration, caring, creativity and community. Centred on hybrid work and an anticipated attendance by employees of one to three days a week depending on the needs of the department and the specific job, benefits would include reduced carbon footprints from a smaller portfolio and less commuting, as well as increased employee health and wellness.

Forum participants learned that, within the next two or three months, the federal government expects to release a list of surplus government-owned properties that will be available for purchase and/or partnership in redevelopment, representing 15 to 20 per cent of the existing owned portfolio of three to four million square feet. These end-of-life buildings would be in addition to some planned relocations of an undisclosed number of public servants from buildings with government leases coming to an end in the next few years, to properties where the government has signed long-term leases, as a further means of maximizing the federal public service’s use of space.

Clearly, this will have an enormous impact on the make-up of Ottawa’s downtown office inventory.

Of particular note was a great panel discussion on the future of office work that included landlords, brokers and tenants that centred around the idea of “magnetic space.”

This concept was coined by panelist John Sicard, CEO of Kinaxis. It recognizes, as moderator Shawn Hamilton, vice-president of business development at Canderel, put it, “That commercial real estate is, at its core, a manifestation of the physical requirements of people.”

In Sicard’s words, “Isolation is not the natural state of humanity. Teams are stronger together.”

Heather Tyrie, chief talent officer of rapidly growing Fullscript, shared her company’s policy of “work wherever you work well.” She related how some of her colleagues preferred to drive and were welcome at Fullscript’s small Kanata office, while those who preferred to take public transit could easily go to the company’s larger space downtown. A key criteria of the entire discussion centred on recognizing that the best way to get people back in the office was to create a sense of community and even moments of joy.

What resonated throughout the day was the idea that the commercial real estate industry’s approach to office space must be transformed. Sueling Ching, president and CEO of the Ottawa Board of Trade and a member of the Downtown Ottawa Revitalization Task Force, said that for too long Ottawa has relied on the federal government to fill the downtown core and that, for the past two and a half years, the prevailing strategy of trying to “guilt the government” into sending its employees back to work has failed.

“Instead” she said, “we need to change the image of what the downtown of our city will be.”

“Leadership is what’s needed,” said Hugh Gorman, CEO of Colonnade Bridgeport, one of Ottawa’s largest property managers. “Ottawa’s business leaders need to commit.”

He added that, “There is danger in allowing the core of our city to hollow out and rot.”

Christine Leadman, executive director of the Bank Street BIA, reminded us that there is no going back. Hybrid work is here to stay and we must all be flexible and adapt to this new reality in the downtown. “Downtown has to be inviting, clean and safe,” she said.

In the views of this real estate professional, to fill Ottawa’s empty buildings we need space that is inspiring. We need to create offices that are centres of collaborative and social activity that support our personal work styles and preferences. We need magnetic space!

In the downtown, we're going to need significant investment from business and government to activate and revitalize the heart of our city. We're going to need to have fun cafes and festivals to attract tourists and office workers alike. We need transit that is reliable and flexible parking arrangements that recognize that hybrid workers showing up a couple of days a week don’t want to buy a bus pass or pay $300 a month to park.

Now we just have to get it done.


Darren Fleming is CEO of Real Strategy Advisors Ltd.

https://www.obj.ca/article/real-esta...e-space-sounds
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  #98  
Old Posted Oct 14, 2022, 10:31 PM
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'We're going to need to have fun cafes and festivals to attract tourists and office workers alike.'

Ottawa needs more 'fun cafes'?
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  #99  
Old Posted Oct 15, 2022, 3:27 PM
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Well, “fun cafes” will be one component, as will festivals, but there will need to be more than those. The downtown will need to become a destination.

OK, downtown used to be a destination – because it was where so many people went to work each day. That’s what made it a ‘destination’. Besides having to go to work every day, what got people to go downtown? Festivals and events. Buskerfest is always a great draw, and the Rib- and Poutine-fests seem popular. Parades draw in crowds, as does the Remembrance Day service. There are a few musical events, like Bluesfest and the ‘Silent Concerts’ on Bank that get good numbers. But, unless there is a lot of work put into animating the streets, there will be only empty streets.

The City is HORRIBLE at making sure that things are happening around the city. (This is the biggest reason that old Lansdowne was only bringing in about half of what it cost to maintain it. The City just didn’t work on having it in use.) The NCC is little better than the City. The Amphitheatre up on Nepean Pointe could have been a ‘hopping place’, but instead, it was just left to decay.

Do we need a giant ‘Spider’ to invade the city every day? Of course not. We need variety. Sparks Street used to offer ‘Dance Nights’ in the evenings, and the BIA paid for the orchestra. Why not open things up so that it is easy for any band, or even lone musician, to book a block for a few hours in an evening? They don’t have to be formally paid – it could be Busking. (Although the City and BIA could have a pot of money to attract ‘bigger names’, occasionally.) It could be like an incubator for musical, or other, talent. (Where do young bands go these days, when they think that they are ready to try their sound on a real audience – and not just bouncing it off of the walls of a parent’s garage? Back in Ottawa’s past, the many smaller clubs and bars often had a live band. Anyone remember Octavian, or any of the myriad small bands in Ottawa of olde?)

The empty streets and plazas (which we could use more of) in the core need to be animated – even if it is somewhat less regulated. Empty places with nothing happening generally don’t attract many people. (Although those are probably the places that need more police resources.)

Even some ‘static’ things can be a draw. There used to be sand-boxes along Sparks Street. How about putting in children’s play facilities in the core? (Oh, yeah, grandparents can no longer ‘abandon’ their grandchildren in a sand-box with other kids while they run into Birks to buy the silver cutlery as a wedding present for their niece.) Maybe a large slide from the Mackenzie King Bridge down to Confederation Park? (Adults would try it out, too, I’ll bet.) (Oh, yeah, liability issues.) Little things that jump-out and surprise people are a treat. (How did anyone ever get permission to paint the risers of the staircase from Mackenzie to Sussex? Good on them, though!) There should be a lot more things like that.

Sure, we have ‘The Market’ area, but that appears to have been dying out over the past many years. It hasn’t been the blocks upon blocks of nightclubs, that attracted the youth, for a long time. That was considered too rowdy, so the City imposed restrictive changes. The City wanted to move ‘The Market’ area back to its roots. So much for the nightlife draw.

The By-ward Market has faded as the number of local producers of vegetables and fruit surrounding Ottawa has dropped. Add to that the fact that many, more suburban, neighbourhoods are getting their own “Farmer’s Markets”. What is the incentive to go to the downtown location? It used to be that a late-fall trip to the By-ward Market was the only way to get a half-bushel of Russet apples (If you haven’t tried a Russet, do it this fall!). Now, I can go to my local Farm Boy and pick them up.

Do the few unique stores in the Rideau Centre justify driving downtown, to pay for parking?

People claim that there ARE draws to get folks to come to the core, but how many times do locals go to see the Parliament Buildings in a year? Even the National Art Gallery, and War Museum seem to be places that school groups visit once every few years. It seems that, at best, the Gallery has a big show once a year to try to drag patrons in.

There is the NAC, too, but that hardly makes a Theater District. In London, Eng., you simply go to ‘The West End’ and you know that you can choose from a selection of shows. Ditto for New York’s Broadway area.

Just getting a bunch more people to live downtown will not make it a destination. Lots of people live in Kanata, but how many of you travel to Centrum Mall every few days, just to see what is happening there? Probably not many (if any).

There needs to be a cluster of varied activities that is almost continuous. People need to know that they can just decide to go downtown on a whim, and know that there will be something happening there. This takes continuous work. This is not a ‘build-it-once-and-they-will-come-forever’ thing. Over time, it will become the place where things just happen, because that is where everyone expects things to happen, so that is where everyone does things – just as it used to be that if you wanted an office, you would immediately think of renting one downtown, because that is where offices were.
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Old Posted Oct 15, 2022, 5:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Richard Eade View Post
Well, “fun cafes” will be one component, as will festivals, but there will need to be more than those. The downtown will need to become a destination.

OK, downtown used to be a destination – because it was where so many people went to work each day. That’s what made it a ‘destination’. Besides having to go to work every day, what got people to go downtown? Festivals and events. Buskerfest is always a great draw, and the Rib- and Poutine-fests seem popular. Parades draw in crowds, as does the Remembrance Day service. There are a few musical events, like Bluesfest and the ‘Silent Concerts’ on Bank that get good numbers. But, unless there is a lot of work put into animating the streets, there will be only empty streets.

The City is HORRIBLE at making sure that things are happening around the city. (This is the biggest reason that old Lansdowne was only bringing in about half of what it cost to maintain it. The City just didn’t work on having it in use.) The NCC is little better than the City. The Amphitheatre up on Nepean Pointe could have been a ‘hopping place’, but instead, it was just left to decay.

Do we need a giant ‘Spider’ to invade the city every day? Of course not. We need variety. Sparks Street used to offer ‘Dance Nights’ in the evenings, and the BIA paid for the orchestra. Why not open things up so that it is easy for any band, or even lone musician, to book a block for a few hours in an evening? They don’t have to be formally paid – it could be Busking. (Although the City and BIA could have a pot of money to attract ‘bigger names’, occasionally.) It could be like an incubator for musical, or other, talent. (Where do young bands go these days, when they think that they are ready to try their sound on a real audience – and not just bouncing it off of the walls of a parent’s garage? Back in Ottawa’s past, the many smaller clubs and bars often had a live band. Anyone remember Octavian, or any of the myriad small bands in Ottawa of olde?)

The empty streets and plazas (which we could use more of) in the core need to be animated – even if it is somewhat less regulated. Empty places with nothing happening generally don’t attract many people. (Although those are probably the places that need more police resources.)

Even some ‘static’ things can be a draw. There used to be sand-boxes along Sparks Street. How about putting in children’s play facilities in the core? (Oh, yeah, grandparents can no longer ‘abandon’ their grandchildren in a sand-box with other kids while they run into Birks to buy the silver cutlery as a wedding present for their niece.) Maybe a large slide from the Mackenzie King Bridge down to Confederation Park? (Adults would try it out, too, I’ll bet.) (Oh, yeah, liability issues.) Little things that jump-out and surprise people are a treat. (How did anyone ever get permission to paint the risers of the staircase from Mackenzie to Sussex? Good on them, though!) There should be a lot more things like that.

Sure, we have ‘The Market’ area, but that appears to have been dying out over the past many years. It hasn’t been the blocks upon blocks of nightclubs, that attracted the youth, for a long time. That was considered too rowdy, so the City imposed restrictive changes. The City wanted to move ‘The Market’ area back to its roots. So much for the nightlife draw.

The By-ward Market has faded as the number of local producers of vegetables and fruit surrounding Ottawa has dropped. Add to that the fact that many, more suburban, neighbourhoods are getting their own “Farmer’s Markets”. What is the incentive to go to the downtown location? It used to be that a late-fall trip to the By-ward Market was the only way to get a half-bushel of Russet apples (If you haven’t tried a Russet, do it this fall!). Now, I can go to my local Farm Boy and pick them up.

Do the few unique stores in the Rideau Centre justify driving downtown, to pay for parking?

People claim that there ARE draws to get folks to come to the core, but how many times do locals go to see the Parliament Buildings in a year? Even the National Art Gallery, and War Museum seem to be places that school groups visit once every few years. It seems that, at best, the Gallery has a big show once a year to try to drag patrons in.

There is the NAC, too, but that hardly makes a Theater District. In London, Eng., you simply go to ‘The West End’ and you know that you can choose from a selection of shows. Ditto for New York’s Broadway area.

Just getting a bunch more people to live downtown will not make it a destination. Lots of people live in Kanata, but how many of you travel to Centrum Mall every few days, just to see what is happening there? Probably not many (if any).

There needs to be a cluster of varied activities that is almost continuous. People need to know that they can just decide to go downtown on a whim, and know that there will be something happening there. This takes continuous work. This is not a ‘build-it-once-and-they-will-come-forever’ thing. Over time, it will become the place where things just happen, because that is where everyone expects things to happen, so that is where everyone does things – just as it used to be that if you wanted an office, you would immediately think of renting one downtown, because that is where offices were.
Well said
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