Metro Phoenix Transit/Transportation Developments

[PHX31]

Originally Posted by combusean

Streets is so run amok--I've been unable to stand them for half a generation now. This is the "well run" side of Phoenix that will run it into the ground. Streets departments tend to be full of traffic engineers who embrace their obsolete quackery AND waste money on pedestrian-killing facilities, things like the nice big signs that drivers can see from a mile away as they haul ass down the Interstate-wide lanes so they can smash into a pedestrian roasting without any trees.

Then there needs to be more support for bicycle facilities and more opposition for what you're calling obsolete quackery.

For every 1 bicyclist resident that complains and wants good bicycle facilities, there are likely a thousand passenger car residents that are complaining and wanting good car facilities.

What do you think the Streets Department is going to do or who are they going to try to placate and cater to?

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by azsunsurfer

....could I shower there if I didn't have a bike?....

I honestly don't know what their policies will be, but I wouldn't be surprised if the answer is no. There might be concerns about making the place overcrowded, or maybe even people with unclear motives trying to gain access to a shower facility. I also don't know how their dues will compare to the Lincoln Family YMCA and other fitness clubs nearby with showers.

[combusean]

Originally Posted by PHX31

Then there needs to be more support for bicycle facilities and more opposition for what you're calling obsolete quackery.

For every 1 bicyclist resident that complains and wants good bicycle facilities, there are likely a thousand passenger car residents that are complaining and wanting good car facilities.

What do you think the Streets Department is going to do or who are they going to try to placate and cater to?

Placating to motorists faultily assumes you can pave your way out of congestion.

If you want to make it easier for drivers, make the choice or whatever situation of walking, biking, or taking transit easier for those that can do it or are presently forced to.

A tiny amount of cars taken off the roads has huge ripple effects in congestion. Where I work has everything like enormous intersections, right turn curve lanes breaking up the crosswalk making me wonder if I'm going to get hit, speeding drivers. This sort of thing makes me wonder if I should get a car again.

[biggus diggus]

Originally Posted by PHX31

Then there needs to be more support for bicycle facilities and more opposition for what you're calling obsolete quackery.

For every 1 bicyclist resident that complains and wants good bicycle facilities, there are likely a thousand passenger car residents that are complaining and wanting good car facilities.

What do you think the Streets Department is going to do or who are they going to try to placate and cater to?

This is, by far, the most rational argument thus far.

My argument is thin because I'm basically calling people who won't ride a bike without a bike lane sissies.

The other argument for bike lanes is thin because it's basically saying having no bike lanes is the reason people don't ride bikes - not buying that.

Your argument is 100% solid. 1,000 people want A, 13 people want B. A is going to win every time.

[DesertRay]

Originally Posted by combusean

Placating to motorists faultily assumes you can pave your way out of congestion.

If you want to make it easier for drivers, make the choice or whatever situation of walking, biking, or taking transit easier for those that can do it or are presently forced to.

A tiny amount of cars taken off the roads has huge ripple effects in congestion. Where I work has everything like enormous intersections, right turn curve lanes breaking up the crosswalk making me wonder if I'm going to get hit, speeding drivers. This sort of thing makes me wonder if I should get a car again.

Honestly, most of this has to do with inertia. Media depends upon the ads generated by the fossil fuel/transportation/real estate triad that needs to keep marketing to maintain the cultural norms. Most folks in the area are happy to have any kind of infrastructure (bicycle, etc.) as long as their flavor of travel eventually gets taken care or. The people that these planners are kowtowing to are the politicians who count on lazily-aggregated donations. Insisting on bike lanes is largely symbolic, but it does remind folks that bicycle riders exist, and have a right to be on the streets, despite the horrific planning that makes many of our streets all but impossible to traverse without a car. No, we should have bike lanes, and then we should harden them to prevent accidents. Eventually, we should create corridors where cars can't go. That would take a lot of cars off the road, and make it easier and cheaper to maintain the roads that remain.

[ASU Diablo]

Originally Posted by DesertRay

Honestly, most of this has to do with inertia. Media depends upon the ads generated by the fossil fuel/transportation/real estate triad that needs to keep marketing to maintain the cultural norms. Most folks in the area are happy to have any kind of infrastructure (bicycle, etc.) as long as their flavor of travel eventually gets taken care or. The people that these planners are kowtowing to are the politicians who count on lazily-aggregated donations. Insisting on bike lanes is largely symbolic, but it does remind folks that bicycle riders exist, and have a right to be on the streets, despite the horrific planning that makes many of our streets all but impossible to traverse without a car. No, we should have bike lanes, and then we should harden them to prevent accidents. Eventually, we should create corridors where cars can't go. That would take a lot of cars off the road, and make it easier and cheaper to maintain the roads that remain.

My thoughts exactly.

The petition that Urban Phoenix Project started has over 250 signatures thus far to get this as an agenda item in an upcoming City Council meeting (trying to get 500). Let's see if this goes anywhere...

[N830MH]

Originally Posted by azsunsurfer

....could I shower there if I didn't have a bike?....

Yes, you have take a shower. Not before or after.

[exit2lef]

Some media coverage of the west Roosevelt bike lane controversy:

https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news...-lane-11362389

[muertecaza]

Formal grant agreement signed for Tempe Street Car:

https://www.masstransitmag.com/rail/...-federal-grant

I believe that makes this officially fully funded.

[N830MH]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

Formal grant agreement signed for Tempe Street Car:

https://www.masstransitmag.com/rail/...-federal-grant

I believe that makes this officially fully funded.

Great news! I'm so happy for it. Congratulations! A job well done!

Tempe Streetcar is schedule to open 2021. No specific date to be set yet.

[muertecaza]

Transportation committee is voting tonight to allocate ~$90m for real estate acquisition costs for the South Central and Northwest II light rail extensions, as well as ~$150m on the downtown hub and ~$80m on construction of Northwest II. Flood gates open after the election

[CrestedSaguaro]

Wasting no time with the South Central extension. Construction to start Oct. 14th.

https://www.phoenix.gov/econdev/inthenews/656

[Obadno]

Interesting that they are treating the south extension and the capitol extension as both happening now

I suppose if the south central line will finish in 2024 the west extension will have to start basically right after in 2025 to be open by 2030

[Classical in Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Interesting that they are treating the south extension and the capitol extension as both happening now

I suppose if the south central line will finish in 2024 the west extension will have to start basically right after in 2025 to be open by 2030

Isn't the Capitol portion of the west extension supposed to open in 2024, also.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by Classical in Phoenix

Isn't the Capitol portion of the west extension supposed to open in 2024, also.

Yes, it is. It's the second phase from the Capitol to 79th Avenue via I-10 that is supposed to follow later in 2030.

[Sunsfan87]

https://azdot.gov/planning/transport...oop-202-santan

I’m hoping they see how much traffic congestion the south mountain freeway alleviates before making a final decision on this.

[xymox]

Originally Posted by Sunsfan87

https://azdot.gov/planning/transport...oop-202-santan

I’m hoping they see how much traffic congestion the south mountain freeway alleviates before making a final decision on this.

Sounds like we really need both projects to alleviate congestion on that section of highway. This is one of those projects that keeps getting talked about but nothing winds up happening. Maybe now?

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by Sunsfan87

https://azdot.gov/planning/transport...oop-202-santan

I’m hoping they see how much traffic congestion the south mountain freeway alleviates before making a final decision on this.

The 10 widening is more than just traffic alleviation

[Sunsfan87]

Originally Posted by Obadno

The 10 widening is more than just traffic alleviation

What else is it for?

[exit2lef]

An update on the light rail extension to MetroCenter. As I think I've said before, I really like this elevated design with bus bays under rail platforms. No need for passengers to cross busy streets when transferring.

https://kjzz.org/content/1209366/pho...-interstate-17