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  #181  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2007, 3:30 AM
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It's great to see another story of immigrants contributing to Saint John - the growing Chinese community has already transformed parts of Millidgville around the University - I look forward to seeing some of it Uptown. Wouldn't it be nice to see some neon signs in Mandarian on King St or Prince William?



Published Monday February 12th, 2007
Appeared on page C4


Pair of vocal mayors help Chinese immigrants open bar

CANDICE MAC LEAN
TELEGRAPH-JOURNAL


They weren't perched on the bow of a ship like the stars of the 1997 film Titanic, but when mayors Norm McFarlane of Saint John and Grace Losier of Grand Bay-Westfield belted out a classic Celine Dion love ballad Friday, they drew a crowd all the same.

The pair sang the epic My Heart Will Go On to a group of about 30 people who gathered for the opening of Sunstar Lounge, a karaoke bar set in the city's historic uptown.

Owner and third-year University of New Brunswick student Yuki Huang and her boyfriend and partner Yang Fu thought Saint John could use a hit of Chinese popular culture.

"We wanted to do something different for international students, especially Chinese students," Huang said, amid a buzz of local business people who showed up for the afternoon opening. "Karaoke is very popular in China."

When McFarlane reluctantly took the karaoke stage, his deep, sometimes off-key voice clashed with Dion's. Losier, however, carried the tune quite well.

Everyone in the room giggled at the pair's efforts.

Before his Dion debut, McFarlane touched on the importance of immigrants opening new businesses in the city.

"To me it puts the roots down. Once they bought a building it means they're going to stay here and create a business here," he said, noting that while in China, he had dinner with Huang's parents and brother. "We're becoming a very cultural capital in New Brunswick and for Atlantic Canada because we've got different nationalities coming in."

Huang's parents plan to move to Saint John in March or April.

Sunstar Lounge, located on Grannan Street just around the corner from Germain, is a fresh addition to the local bar scene. It has four individual karaoke rooms, each set with modern mustard-yellow carpet and furniture, each equipped with its own karaoke set that will play any choice from 10,000 Chinese karaoke songs and 200 English songs.

The bar's two larger rooms - one a disco dance area and the other a bar area - were filled with people sipping on Chinese herbal tea Friday.

"We want to feature local people too and show them our culture," said Huang, 27.

"It's important to take people in the community and make them feel welcome and provide them with a sense of place," said Losier, noting that the Huangs may do business in Grand Bay-Westfield when they relocate.

"Allowing them to have some things they enjoy from their own country here where they've made their home, I think, is just extremely important in us maintaining their presence in our community."

The individual karaoke rooms at the bar can be rented out to a group of friends privately, Huang said, or enjoyed by a group on a regular bar night. She said the final operating hours are still preliminary, but Sunstar Lounge should be open from noon until 2 a.m. seven days a week.

In the afternoon, the bar would cater to business people who can drink Chinese tea and eat snacks.

"Today I stand here really happy because we've used our own hands," Fu said. "I hope our business will

be successful."
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  #182  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2007, 5:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTL Lucas View Post
It's great to see another story of immigrants contributing to Saint John - the growing Chinese community has already transformed parts of Millidgville around the University - I look forward to seeing some of it Uptown. Wouldn't it be nice to see some neon signs in Mandarian on King St or Prince William?
Its quite awesome, at some point, the New-brunswick rural citizens choose Moncton however, it is clear that Saint John has strong immigration policies and is becoming the new gateway for immigration in New-Brunswick
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  #183  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2007, 9:38 PM
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Originally Posted by HalifaxMtl666 View Post
Its quite awesome, at some point, the New-brunswick rural citizens choose Moncton however, it is clear that Saint John has strong immigration policies and is becoming the new gateway for immigration in New-Brunswick
To an extent, we shall see what the 2006 data shows (less than a month now btw ) but the 2001 data shows this:

Foreign-born population
Moncton - 3,360
Saint John - 4,620

Immigrated between 1991 and 2001
Moncton - 615
Saint John - 765

So in other words both cities suck for international immigration lol...
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  #184  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2007, 9:42 PM
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and as far as all the immigration in Moncton being from rural NB, here's the data for people who moved to the cities from another province in 1996-2001

Moncton - 7,365
Saint John - 6,420
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  #185  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2007, 9:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stu_pendousmat2 View Post
To an extent, we shall see what the 2006 data shows (less than a month now btw ) but the 2001 data shows this:

Foreign-born population
Moncton - 3,360
Saint John - 4,620

Immigrated between 1991 and 2001
Moncton - 615
Saint John - 765

So in other words both cities suck for international immigration lol...
I do not know why but Saint john seem to me more cosmopolitain than Moncton. Immigrants seem to be more involve in business developement in Saint John. Moreover the strong number of asian students in UNB could help to change my perception. I expect we can add 1000 to 1500 students/immigrants who dont have canadian citizenship yet. In the CMA cencus issue, Moncton will overcome Saint John by some thousands for sure but Rafinery project could change that issue by 2009 though

you`re right both suck in this issue lol

Last edited by ErickMontreal; Feb 16, 2007 at 10:59 PM.
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  #186  
Old Posted Feb 19, 2007, 8:38 PM
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Cap on emissions could kill plans for second refinery: Irving

Strict caps on greenhouse gas emissions could kill Irving Oil's plans to build a second oil refinery, the company said Friday.

Members of the public got their first chance at an open house Friday to see and ask questions about Irving Oil's plans for the new refinery in Saint John.

The company acknowledged that the popularity of the issue of global warming could eventually affect whether the facility gets built, and that the project could be doomed by an absolute federal or provincial cap on carbon dioxide emissions.

"An absolute cap on CO2 emissions for a region or for the country may well do that," said Irving Oil spokesman Ken Scott.

Last week, the New Brunswick legislature was buzzing with a debate on the province's greenhouse gas problems.

Premier Shawn Graham has been giving mixed signals about what the province plans to do about climate change.

"We will introduce a new climate change action plan that will ensure that the progress we make as a province does not jeopardize our environment," Graham said Friday.

However, Graham has also already endorsed Irving's second refinery as a boost to the province's economy.

Scott said the company has been meeting with the province on the action plan and hopes the plan would allow for the second refinery.

"We believe refineries will be built somewhere in the world, and the question is, should we take the opportunity and build it here, or should we let it slip and go to the U.S. Gulf Coast or Central America, where they may not be as focused on greenhouse gases as we are," Scott said.

Scott said whether the second refinery gets built is still far from certain, but the company is forging ahead and hoping the growing climate change storm doesn't eventually blow the project away.
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  #187  
Old Posted Feb 19, 2007, 9:32 PM
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I do realize that refinery would create jobs and help the economy, but really imo, Saint John is polluted enough as it is. One time when i was there the air was orange and hurt with every breath.

Irving seems to rule that city with an iron fist and that really is a shame.
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  #188  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2007, 2:06 AM
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Note to Irvings:

You're filthy rich.
This province made you filthy rich.
2 words - environmental controls
Suck it up, if it's not now, it'll be in the next 10 years nomatter where you are in the world.

These arguments that saving the environment will hurt the economy are full of crap. Better environment leads to healthier people leads to higher productivity leads to long term profits.
Ignoring the environment may lead to short term profit but also leads to sicker people which leads to lower productivity which leads to smaller long term profit. Ignoring the environment may also lead to the flooding of Saint John by the end of the century, an ice-age relatively soon (like possibly in our great-grandchildren's or great-great-grandchildren's lives), and nobody to buy your products (since you're so worried about your profit line).

Didn't your mother ever tell you that you can't have everything your way? Oh wait, I forgot we're talking about the Irvings for a second there.
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  #189  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2007, 5:23 AM
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I agree that we want to see Saint John pollution free but Kyoto (CO2) has nothing to do with pollution. That is one of the major misunderstandings of all this enviro-hype lately.

The pollution from the current refinery comes from SO2 which Irving is currently improving by adding a Hydrogenation/Amine Tail Gas Unit.

In ten years, Kyoto will still be about CO2 and not pollution.

Also, the 'science' of Kyoto is still greatly debated by highly qualified environmental scientists in spite of what the media is telling us all.
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  #190  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2007, 7:24 AM
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I would respond, but the Kyoto debate is another thread and doesn't belong in Saint John Projects thread. The input is appreciated though.
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  #191  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2007, 5:41 PM
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Not enough development on the west side apparently. Heard this on 88.9 news radio...some people want to bring back the old City of Lancaster.

This is also the first confirmation that I've seen of Wal-Mart coming to that new power centre on the west side. I wonder if this kills plans for a KV store...can't see a city that size having 3 Wal-Marts.

Mayor reacts to West Side Business Association wanting to separate from city
February 20, 2007 - 12:13 pm
By: Graham Brown - News 88-9 Staff

SAINT JOHN, NB - Mayor Norm McFarlane says you can' t tell developers where to locate.

That in response to word that the West Side Business Association wants to separate because it feels not enough development is going west.

McFarlane says developers tend to go east and you can't force them to go to a specific area.

He says no one has approached him yet.

"People have the right to voice their opinion and if that's what they feel then I'm sure they'll do some work on it. We'll set at City Hall and wait. Nobody has come to City Hall to talk to us. We're open, so come and talk to us." McFarlane said

McFarlane says they are working on a development for the west side.

He says it's to be located along Fairville Boulevard.

It involves Wal-Mart as an anchor store.

Last edited by kirjtc2; Feb 20, 2007 at 6:10 PM.
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  #192  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2007, 8:07 PM
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Yes I also can't see 3 wal-marts in Saint John

Moncton is the shopping center of the maritimes and we only have 2! lol (that being said one of those is the largest in Atlantic Canada)...but still!

Saint John and Moncton have a similar population (no debates please) and Moncton has much more of a retail pull than SJ, The following info is from the "Financial Post Ranking of Retail sales, 2006" it is the "Per Capita Retail Sales Dollars" of any city over 100,000 in population

Atlantic Canada

1) Moncton - 13,100$ (11th Nationally)
2) St. Johns - 12,800$ (16th Nationally)
4) Cape Breton - 12,300$ (17th Nationally)
3) Halifax - 11,700$ (23rd Nationally)
4) Saint John - 10,600$ (28th Nationally)

So if Moncton only has 2, I dont know how SJ would try to pull off three. I am only comparing Moncton here because its what I know btw, not trying to start anything.

heres the link to that info (its on the second page): http://www.gpaedc.on.ca/pdfs/Retail%...R%202006r1.pdf
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  #193  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2007, 9:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stu_pendousmat2 View Post
Yes I also can't see 3 wal-marts in Saint John

Moncton is the shopping center of the maritimes and we only have 2! lol (that being said one of those is the largest in Atlantic Canada)...but still!

Saint John and Moncton have a similar population (no debates please) and Moncton has much more of a retail pull than SJ, The following info is from the "Financial Post Ranking of Retail sales, 2006" it is the "Per Capita Retail Sales Dollars" of any city over 100,000 in population

Atlantic Canada

1) Moncton - 13,100$ (11th Nationally)
2) St. Johns - 12,800$ (16th Nationally)
4) Cape Breton - 12,300$ (17th Nationally)
3) Halifax - 11,700$ (23rd Nationally)
4) Saint John - 10,600$ (28th Nationally)

So if Moncton only has 2, I dont know how SJ would try to pull off three. I am only comparing Moncton here because its what I know btw, not trying to start anything.

heres the link to that info (its on the second page): http://www.gpaedc.on.ca/pdfs/Retail%...R%202006r1.pdf
In my mind, Halifax is more sophisticated than Moncton as shopping center but at this point Moncton is doing a really good job better than Saint John by far
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  #194  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 1:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stu_pendousmat2 View Post
Yes I also can't see 3 wal-marts in Saint John

Moncton is the shopping center of the maritimes and we only have 2! lol (that being said one of those is the largest in Atlantic Canada)...but still!

Saint John and Moncton have a similar population (no debates please) and Moncton has much more of a retail pull than SJ, The following info is from the "Financial Post Ranking of Retail sales, 2006" it is the "Per Capita Retail Sales Dollars" of any city over 100,000 in population

Atlantic Canada

1) Moncton - 13,100$ (11th Nationally)
2) St. Johns - 12,800$ (16th Nationally)
4) Cape Breton - 12,300$ (17th Nationally)
3) Halifax - 11,700$ (23rd Nationally)
4) Saint John - 10,600$ (28th Nationally)

So if Moncton only has 2, I dont know how SJ would try to pull off three. I am only comparing Moncton here because its what I know btw, not trying to start anything.

heres the link to that info (its on the second page): http://www.gpaedc.on.ca/pdfs/Retail%...R%202006r1.pdf
Saint John might not be able to support three full sized Walmart Supercentres but perhaps the other two will on a smaller scale? In the United States many very small communities (3,000 or 4,000 - I'm thinking Calais,ME here) support Walmarts. Surely 160,000 could manage three.

In their West Side and KV branches Canadian Tire has simply built smaller stores. The same is true of the KV branch of Kent's. I'm sure Walmart has scalable store models and that three could but put in the CMA, though perhaps not all supercentres.

I certainly think it would be more viable to build a Walmart in KV but the West Side seems more inviting - Rothesay doesn't want Walmart ruining its reputation (that was part of the last refusal) though I wonder why Quispamsis hasn't stepped up?
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  #195  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 2:55 AM
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Walmart is expanding pretty rapidly, including venturing into small towns. CBRM has had two since WalMart took over the Woolco stores, one in Mayflower Mall (now relocated to SPAR Rd) and the other in Sydney River. Fredericton is about to get its second WalMart and Woodstock (pop 5,000 and about an hour up the TCH) just got a WalMart about a year ago. That said, I can't see any area in the Maritimes (save Halifax) being able to support three WalMarts.
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  #196  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 3:37 AM
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Walmart is expanding pretty rapidly, including venturing into small towns. CBRM has had two since WalMart took over the Woolco stores, one in Mayflower Mall (now relocated to SPAR Rd) and the other in Sydney River. Fredericton is about to get its second WalMart and Woodstock (pop 5,000 and about an hour up the TCH) just got a WalMart about a year ago. That said, I can't see any area in the Maritimes (save Halifax) being able to support three WalMarts.
Agree, unless like MTL said, the other two are 1/2 size wal-marts. (then it would be the equilivent of haveing 2 full size ones like most areas of similar size.
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  #197  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 7:54 AM
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Just for fun I made a little (crappy) diagram and pulled up some #s to make a little list (I love lists lol) depicting the retail market area for each of the cities listed.




Halifax

Metro - approx 400,000
Retail Pull - approx 680,000

Moncton

Metro - approx 130,000
Retail Pull - approx 445,000

St. Johns

Metro - approx 175,000
Retail Pull - approx 300,000

Cape Breton Regional Municipality

Metro - approx 110,000
Retail Pull - approx 250,000

Saint John

Metro - approx 130,000
Retail Pull - approx 165,000

As always I would love to be corrected on anything here
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  #198  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 8:01 AM
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Moncton power.
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  #199  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stu_pendousmat2 View Post
Agree, unless like MTL said, the other two are 1/2 size wal-marts. (then it would be the equilivent of haveing 2 full size ones like most areas of similar size.
That's more or less what's happening. The Woodstock and Houlton Wal-Marts are both fairly small - the new northside Fredericton one may be as big as both of them combined. It's not a Supercentre, but there's enough room to expand to one if desired (I give them 10 years). I heard rumors a few months back of a Supercentre coming to Quispamsis, though they didn't say anything then and probably won't now.

In a perfect world, McAllister Drive would be Saint John's "flagship" Wal-Mart, with smaller locations on the west side and in Quispamsis. But that's not the Wal-Mart way - gotta go big, build supercentres, leave tons of abandoned shells behind (see Loch Lomond Mall, Chaleur Centre in Bathurst or Penhorn Mall in Dartmouth).

As for the small town comment: Wal-Mart's reputation in the US grew as a small-town retailer. Look at Maine: they opened stores in Calais and Houlton around the same time they came to Portland or Bangor. But since Woolco was mostly only in mid-sized and larger cities (with a few exceptions like Port Hawkesbury and Carbonear), that's the base they had to start with in this country and it took them time to expand to the smaller markets.

Where there were 4 Woolcos in NB when they went under, there are now 11 Wal-Marts by my count, with at least 3 more (Fredericton North, Saint John West and Tracadie) proposed or under construction. They've got to reach critical mass eventually. I really only see 2 or 3 more places at most in this province where they could realistically go.
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  #200  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2007, 12:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stu_pendousmat2 View Post
Just for fun I made a little (crappy) diagram and pulled up some #s to make a little list (I love lists lol) depicting the retail market area for each of the cities listed.




Halifax

Metro - approx 400,000
Retail Pull - approx 680,000

Moncton

Metro - approx 130,000
Retail Pull - approx 445,000

St. Johns

Metro - approx 175,000
Retail Pull - approx 300,000

Cape Breton Regional Municipality

Metro - approx 110,000
Retail Pull - approx 250,000

Saint John

Metro - approx 130,000
Retail Pull - approx 165,000

As always I would love to be corrected on anything here
Moncton is not a retail pull for PEI. Sure people from PEI shop in Moncton at some time however it should not be included in the retail area. People from PEI shop in Halifax more so than Moncton. So I think you can remove 145,000 from your Moncton retail area.

People from PEI shop in Charlottetown as their main centre.

Last edited by billy1; Feb 21, 2007 at 2:54 PM.
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