HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Global Projects & Construction > Proposals


    20 Times Square in the SkyscraperPage Database

Building Data Page   • Comparison Diagram   • New York Skyscraper Diagram

Map Location
New York Projects & Construction Forum

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #261  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2014, 10:21 PM
miesian's Avatar
miesian miesian is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: New York
Posts: 247
You know, whenever they plan a tower over the bus terminal, it signals the end of a building boom.....Let's hope this is not the case now.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #262  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2014, 12:34 AM
NYguy's Avatar
NYguy NYguy is offline
New Yorker for life
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Borough of Jersey
Posts: 51,838
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYrocks View Post
Is the development above the Port Authority Bus Terminal still a possibility? I think someone had posted about the planned having been shelved (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/15/ny...-terminal.html), and about the new development using the 20TS name, but their posts were moved / deleted.

Personally, I wouldn't want to skip out at lunch to find a bite to eat around there. I'd come back into work in a bad mood every afternoon. I'm not sure whether it's the weight or the type of pedestrian traffic which is the cause. <he says trying not to sound snobbish or alarmist>
I'm not sure what that means, but i'm in the area quite frequently, and don't notice any "type of pedestrian traffic". Maybe the bar hoppers over the weekend.



Quote:
Originally Posted by miesian View Post
You know, whenever they plan a tower over the bus terminal, it signals the end of a building boom.....Let's hope this is not the case now.
It wouldn't be the case now, the office building boom is really just beginning (minus the WTC which has been in rebuilding mode for a decade).

As far as a building over the bus terminal itself? There are still those air rights...



http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf...al_in_nyc.html


June 25, 2014


Quote:
Lipper said development rights for the air space above the existing terminal may be worth far more than previously estimated, and could provide financing for a new terminal to its capital plan.
__________________
NEW YORK is Back!

“Office buildings are our factories – whether for tech, creative or traditional industries we must continue to grow our modern factories to create new jobs,” said United States Senator Chuck Schumer.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #263  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2014, 12:39 AM
TechTalkGuy's Avatar
TechTalkGuy TechTalkGuy is offline
Mr. Technology
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,008
A new terminal?

I love that parking garage, specifically the rooftop parking with the sweeping views.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #264  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2014, 12:52 AM
NYguy's Avatar
NYguy NYguy is offline
New Yorker for life
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Borough of Jersey
Posts: 51,838
Quote:
Originally Posted by TechTalkGuy View Post
A new terminal?

I love that parking garage, specifically the rooftop parking with the sweeping views.

The days of the open Manhattan parking lot are numbered. If we get a new terminal, don't expect roof top parking.
__________________
NEW YORK is Back!

“Office buildings are our factories – whether for tech, creative or traditional industries we must continue to grow our modern factories to create new jobs,” said United States Senator Chuck Schumer.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #265  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2014, 1:28 AM
TechTalkGuy's Avatar
TechTalkGuy TechTalkGuy is offline
Mr. Technology
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,008
Rooftop gardens limit public access.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #266  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 12:39 AM
NYguy's Avatar
NYguy NYguy is offline
New Yorker for life
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Borough of Jersey
Posts: 51,838
http://www.capitalnewyork.com/articl...cost-estimates

Plans for a new bus terminal confront steep cost estimates





By Dana Rubinstein
Mar. 16, 2015


Quote:
It could cost more than $10 billion to replace the Port Authority Bus Terminal at its current location with a bigger, better facility, according to a Port Authority study whose preliminary results will be presented to the board of commissioners Thursday.

That's 10 times the $1 billion price estimate some officials circulated last year.

Were the construction and environmental review process to begin tomorrow—which it won't, because there is no funding on the immediate horizon—it would take at least 15 years to complete, according to three Port Authority officials who would only speak on background with Capital.

Asked for comment, Port Authority spokesman Chris Valens said in an emailed statement: "In 2040, more than 42,000 commuters each hour—the capacity of Citi Field—will use the Port Authority Bus Terminal during the afternoon peak. Through the master planning process, the Port Authority and leading private sector consultants ... are focused on creating a roadmap to address the significant demand for trans-Hudson bus capacity and ensure that hundreds of thousands of commuters each day will continue to help power the economy on both sides of the river for generations to come."

Port Authority officials say one of the reasons the full-replacement option on the existing site is so expensive is because of its ambition: namely to fully accommodate the rapid increase in ridership anticipated in the coming decades (an expectation based both on population projections and bus ridership growth that has, in recent decades, already rendered the Eighth Avenue terminal over capacity).

To meet the demands of ever-rising bus ridership, Port Authority officials are talking about building a five-level terminal that, with ramps, staging and parking, would cover 3.5 full city blocks. The existing three-level facility covers slightly more than 2 blocks.

But first, the Port Authority would have to build a temporary terminal to the west of the current station, then move all bus operations to that facility to allow for the demolition and replacement of the existing terminal.

Upon its completion, the temporary terminal would be used for bus parking, thereby cutting down on the number of buses that have to return to New Jersey after dropping off passengers in Manhattan in the morning, only to make the return trip in the evening, clogging up the tunnel and city streets along the way.

The proposal might also feature a skyscraper on the new terminal's north end.

Other options, which planners believe would cost between $8 billion and $10 billion and take between 10 years and 15 years to complete, include several variations. One could push the terminal a little west, thereby allowing the development of two skyscrapers on Eighth Avenue, with the proceeds from development-rights sales going to help fund the terminal. Another could move the entire terminal west of Ninth Avenue and give all of the existing terminal site over to development.


As even casual users of the facility will tell you, the existing terminal is over capacity and sub-modern.

The terminal handles more daily passengers than Grand Central Terminal. It struggles with delays, reliability issues and buses spilling onto neighborhood streets creating traffic congestion and air pollution. Its structural slabs are deteriorating, and it has a more than $100 million operating deficit.

"Daily operations have become increasingly a delicate balance of fragile elements," Diannae Ehler, who manages the bus terminal and adjacent Lincoln Tunnel, said at a recent City Council hearing.

She also said that by 2020, bus ridership to midtown is estimated to grow between 9 percent and 18 percent. By 2040, it's expected to grow by up to 51 percent.

Because New Jersey residents comprise 12 percent of Manhattan's workforce, the bus station is an essential, if unwieldy and aesthetically unpleasing, part of the region's economy.

In recognition of that, officials have been trying to replace the terminal since the mid-1990s.

In 1999, the Port Authority agreed to sell the air rights over the terminal to a real estate company, which would, in turn build a tower on top of the terminal and help finance the restoration of the bus station underneath.

Nothing much came of that except, perhaps, the enduring concept that a good way to help fund a new bus terminal is to auction of the air above it.

The concepts the Port Authority is considering continue to involve air rights sales, though no one believes that will provide anything near the amount of money required to rebuild the station.


A full rebuild, regardless of whether it's on the existing site, would require significant federal funding as well as support from state and city partners.

Not only is no federal politician championing that sort of thing just yet, but the west side has competing needs.

Amtrak, for example, is seeking federal support to build a new cross-Hudson rail tunnel, called Gateway, to midtown Manhattan. It will cost at least $15 billion and is also not yet funded.

The Port Authority is also exploring other, more short-term ideas, like putting bus storage and staging facilities in other locations in New York and New Jersey, developing a satellite terminal for inter-city buses elsewhere in Manhattan, and making more use of the Hudson River ferries.
__________________
NEW YORK is Back!

“Office buildings are our factories – whether for tech, creative or traditional industries we must continue to grow our modern factories to create new jobs,” said United States Senator Chuck Schumer.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #267  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 2:11 AM
BrownTown BrownTown is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,884
Good lord, how does a bus terminal end up costing $10 Billion? Is it clad in solid gold or something? I just can't even conceptualize what could make it cost so much.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #268  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 2:42 AM
Submariner's Avatar
Submariner Submariner is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,341
So, it's going to take them more time to build a terminal than it took America to put a man on the moon (from the start of project Mercury to Apollo 11).

Think about that for a minute.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #269  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 3:00 AM
scalziand's Avatar
scalziand scalziand is offline
Mortaaaaaaaaar!
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Naugatuck, CT/Worcester,MA
Posts: 3,506
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrownTown View Post
Good lord, how does a bus terminal end up costing $10 Billion? Is it clad in solid gold or something? I just can't even conceptualize what could make it cost so much.
It could include another stop on the 7 line, but that should barely account for $1 billion.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #270  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 3:01 AM
JR Ewing JR Ewing is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ancient Egypt
Posts: 835
They should demolish the whole thing. The ideal solution would have been a depot in NJ that has a connection to the No. 7 subway.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #271  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 3:36 AM
Ploppalopp Ploppalopp is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 161
10 billion dollars? Is that even possible?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #272  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 5:40 PM
TonyNYC TonyNYC is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ploppalopp View Post
10 billion dollars? Is that even possible?


In NYC when it comes to construction and any gov't agency, in this case the Port Authority, when they tell you it will cost 10 Billion and take 10 years to complete...Expect it to cost 20 Billion minimum and take 20-25 years to build.


disgraceful!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #273  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 5:42 PM
TonyNYC TonyNYC is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 189
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR Ewing View Post
They should demolish the whole thing. The ideal solution would have been a depot in NJ that has a connection to the No. 7 subway.
Right, at the costs that they are talking about 10 Billion now...20 Billion when it comes down to it, they could build the 7 train tunnel to Jersey and build a bus/ 7 train terminal in Jersey.

Eliminates all the buses coming into NYC and alleviates all the bus traffic in the Lincoln Tunnel. They could sell the land, 2 full blocks of prime Manhattan real estate, to help fund a portion of the costs. What can they get for two full blocks of NYC real estate..2-3 Billion?

That makes too much sense...would never happen!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #274  
Old Posted Mar 17, 2015, 6:36 PM
sparkling's Avatar
sparkling sparkling is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 765
Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyNYC View Post
Right, at the costs that they are talking about 10 Billion now...20 Billion when it comes down to it, they could build the 7 train tunnel to Jersey and build a bus/ 7 train terminal in Jersey.

Eliminates all the buses coming into NYC and alleviates all the bus traffic in the Lincoln Tunnel. They could sell the land, 2 full blocks of prime Manhattan real estate, to help fund a portion of the costs. What can they get for two full blocks of NYC real estate..2-3 Billion?

That makes too much sense...would never happen!
NJ Senate Dems want Port Authority to sell WTC
Proceeds would go toward New Jersey-Manhattan rail tunnel

Tess Hofmann
March 17, 2015 02:30PM

Quote:
New Jersey Senate democrats think that the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey should sell off all of its non-transportation related real estate and put the proceeds toward a rail tunnel.

The real estate would include assets such as One World Trade Center, Crain’s reported. Speaking at a news conference in Newark today, Senate President Steve Sweeney said that the proceeds from such a sale could generate up to $3 billion, which he believes should be used to finance Amtrak’s Gateway tunnel project connecting New Jersey to Manhattan. Sweeney said the action would send a message that the Port Authority is serious about fixing transportation issues.

Democrats control the New Jersey state legislature, which yesterday failed to override Governor Chris Christie’s veto of a bill that would have increased its power over the Port Authority. - See more at: http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/03/....sJKWBRrM.dpuf
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #275  
Old Posted Mar 18, 2015, 12:25 AM
NYguy's Avatar
NYguy NYguy is offline
New Yorker for life
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Borough of Jersey
Posts: 51,838
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR Ewing View Post
They should demolish the whole thing. The ideal solution would have been a depot in NJ that has a connection to the No. 7 subway.
What people fail to realize about the Port Authority is that it handles bus traffic not only from NJ, but from - and to - the rest of the country. We're not just talking about daily commuters here. People want direct access in and out of New York City. It's one thing to have airport rail connections, but there's no reason a major city like New York shouldn't have direct road connections, and God forbid there are the usual rail problems when service is shut down, then where the hell are they gonna put everybody? There won't be enough ferry/helicopter service.

The extra rail service for commuters is what will free up tunnel congestion, and ironically more efficient use of the bus network (the garage).

As far as the terminal itself goes, if they're going to us more real estate, then the air rights above should be utilized so that valuable Manhattan real estate is being maxed. Think of the WTC.
__________________
NEW YORK is Back!

“Office buildings are our factories – whether for tech, creative or traditional industries we must continue to grow our modern factories to create new jobs,” said United States Senator Chuck Schumer.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #276  
Old Posted Mar 20, 2015, 11:42 AM
sparkling's Avatar
sparkling sparkling is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 765
Port Authority rejects $9B terminal redo

Tom Acitelli
March 20, 2015

Quote:
The board of the port authority of new york and new jersey rejected a $9 billion plan for redeveloping the agency’s aging eighth avenue bus terminal. The board instead instructed port authority officials to find other options , including building a new depot in a different location, such as new jersey
http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article...l-program-cost
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #277  
Old Posted Mar 20, 2015, 12:44 PM
BrownTown BrownTown is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,884
Quote:
Originally Posted by sparkling View Post
Port Authority rejects $9B terminal redo
What really irks me is that only 6 Billion of the 10.5 Billion was going to be for actual construction, the rest was going to end up in mounds of paperwork and interest due to the slowness of the project. Basically the assessment is that it should cost 3 Billion, but then double that because the price of labor in NYC is so higher and then add 4.5 Billion more because the regulations in NYC are so difficult. This is why we can't ever have nice things.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #278  
Old Posted Mar 20, 2015, 3:11 PM
Onn Onn is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: The United States
Posts: 1,937
After the billions of dollars "the Port" spent on transportation hubs downtown is this really shocking to anybody? It's going to take them a decade to recover the costs, meanwhile the price of this project is going to keep climbing higher.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #279  
Old Posted Mar 20, 2015, 3:47 PM
Hypothalamus's Avatar
Hypothalamus Hypothalamus is offline
Homo sapiens sapiens
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: 3rd planet from the Sun
Posts: 1,666
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrownTown View Post
Good lord, how does a bus terminal end up costing $10 Billion? Is it clad in solid gold or something? I just can't even conceptualize what could make it cost so much.
When I first read their "estimate," I sunk in my chair. That's like 2.5 One WTCs...
__________________
“If I have done the public any service, it is due to my patient thought.” ― Isaac Newton

~ My Stamford, CT Thread ~~ My Danbury, CT Thread ~
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #280  
Old Posted Mar 20, 2015, 5:15 PM
BrownTown BrownTown is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,884
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hypothalamus View Post
When I first read their "estimate," I sunk in my chair. That's like 2.5 One WTCs...
I'd probably spend it on the next two phases of the Second Avenue Subway, but it's so depressing thinking this is needed just for the bus terminal. I understand it's incredibly well used, but it's still just a giant glorified parking garage. The real problem is just that nothing has gotten fixed in a long time and now everything is just sort of hitting all at once and there is no money to fix it all.

Oh yeah, plus they aren't even adding the infill station on the 7 subway line that people were hoping would be part of this and why the cost was so high. It looks like the new part of the bus terminal is going to be a looong walk from the subway as a result.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Global Projects & Construction > Proposals
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 6:07 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.