So canada Line is now open - so what should be next?
Thought I'd start this thread to stir the pot a bit. I know Evergreen is on the books and long promised, but does it really make sense to build it, or should the money be used elsewhere?
My two cents - I think Translink needs to build the "missing link" - that is, extend Millenium Line to Broadway City Hall to provide a much needed connection between Canada Line and the eastern provinces served by Expo and Millenium trains. To me, the density along Broadway and the potential 200,000 plus riders is a much better bang for your buck than Evergreen. I know Evergreen will contribute to future development in the area and has it's own pluses, but to me, the Missing Link should be next - at least Broadway City Hall to VCC-Clark.
I still think that they should run any UBC extension down W. 4 Avenue and not Broadway. This would mean that it would meet up with the C-Line at Olympic Village and not Broadway-City Hall.
That said, lets build the Evergreen Line and Expo Line extension next.
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Should do both, right after the other. If it comes down to one or the other label them as a single "Millenium line extension" project.
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A Canada line extension to the North Shore and along Marine drive to Park Royal.
Do it now while there's still space on Marine. Serve existing communities before sprawl.
The North Shore isn't priority considering all the growth happening elsewhere, and it's far too expensive at this point to extend it to there. But certainly, sometime in the future.
More importantly, the Canada Line lacks capacity for such an extension....trains are full already.
I still think that they should run any UBC extension down W. 4 Avenue and not Broadway. This would mean that it would meet up with the C-Line at Olympic Village and not Broadway-City Hall.
That said, lets build the Evergreen Line and Expo Line extension next.
But then, you'd miss the most vital part of Central Broadway.
Just remember that Broadway-City Hall was built with a Millennium Line extension in mind, the station is far larger with larger corridors for this purpose. Olympic Village wasn't designed for those massive transfer volumes.
West Fourth is not a major transportation destination. Broadway corridor will be the extension of downtown essentially and a high capacity rapid transit system needs to be there in order to support the growing area. Not only that, but the City of Vancouver has not met goals for public transit, cycling, and walking within the Broadway Corridor and the Millennium Line would be a vital link for that.
Evergreen Line, simply because it is the furthest along in studies, alignment and funding.
Also, is it not a good idea to let memories fade and tempers cool first before they suggest ripping up Broadway? Seems like a really bad idea to me to walk directly back into the lions den without a breather!
evergreen line, millenium line extension on broadway all the way to ubc, another line from hastings park (or farther out) through waterfront station to the west end, maybe to denman... well maybe not that last one. add trains & cars, expand stations, reduce headways as much as safely possible, upzone the lots around the canada line stations etc etc build gondola(s) to SFU, build double-decker tram system downtown... keep building!
Last edited by amor de cosmos; Aug 20, 2009 at 5:00 AM.
Also, is it not a good idea to let memories fade and tempers cool first before they suggest ripping up Broadway? Seems like a really bad idea to me to walk directly back into the lions den without a breather!
Good idea. Show them the way we would be doing it with the tunnel portion of the Evergreen Line.
An extension to the north shore isn't going to happen via the RAV line, but lets pretend it did. It wouldn't affect the current capacity very much, almost all the passengers from North Van would be disembarking in Vancouver and not traveling thru to Richmond. Even the ones that do, they would be traveling opposite inbound rush hour traffic, so it would do nothing to reduce the current capacity and would serve to greatly increase ridership numbers.
An extension to the north shore isn't going to happen via the RAV line, but lets pretend it did. It wouldn't affect the current capacity very much, almost all the passengers from North Van would be disembarking in Vancouver and not traveling thru to Richmond. Even the ones that do, they would be traveling opposite inbound rush hour traffic, so it would do nothing to reduce the current capacity and would serve to greatly increase ridership numbers.
The issue is the configuration of Waterfront Stn. It would be a major transfer point for many people, and the stn at its current state cannot handle that number of people. However, assuming that the extension could occur, the platforms can be easily extended, shortening the corridor. I do believe a direct transfer between Expo and Millennium Lines and the Canada Line platform is needed.
My post was in direct response to the question of the Canada Line being able to handle the additional traffic. I agree that Waterfront itself is in need of upgrading, and as we know it's in the works. But even if we continue pretending that the RAV were to extend across the inlet, the increase in traffic would not hurt the E-M lines either as those passengers would still be travelling against rush hour traffic and there is lots of spare capacity going the other way.
My post was in direct response to the question of the Canada Line being able to handle the additional traffic. I agree that Waterfront itself is in need of upgrading, and as we know it's in the works. But even if we continue pretending that the RAV were to extend across the inlet, the increase in traffic would not hurt the E-M lines either as those passengers would still be travelling against rush hour traffic and there is lots of spare capacity going the other way.
I don't think Canada Line could be extended north as the station and Skytrain are in the the way. If any lines goes to the North shore it would be easier as an extension of the Expo Line. It's not going to happen.
Also - anybody notice that when travelling from Vancouver City Centre to Waterfront on Canada Line, the tunnels rise up and then go down to the Waterfront - this is so Canada Line can pass over the Skytrain tunnel - it clears it by only 1.5 metres
We know it's not possible, we're only pretending. even if the lines weren't in the way the inlet is too deep for conventional means, and the cost to prohibitive for alternative means. The ridership couldn't justify it.
Canada line's tracks end almost right behind the wall of lower waterfront station that is visible from the Expo Line. So extending the Canada line north is impossible. Also, as jlousa says, the elevation drop down Burrard inlet is very steep on both sides. It would be impossible to build a subway across.
Even if it were possible it wouldn't be worth it. I live on the North Shore and say that. There isn't, and won't be in the foreseeable future, the population anywhere close to justifying a train to the North Shore. They should look at the pros/cons of running not only more, but faster Seabuses. What is the ride time now, 12 minutes? Think that could be cut to 8 or 9, plus double the frequency? Perhaps 10 years down the road.
For now I say build the damn Evergreen line and get to work on the planning stages for the UBC extension. Then Expo line extenion and an SFU Gondola. That would be fairly easy to do by comparison. Let's get that going.
Even if it were possible it wouldn't be worth it. I live on the North Shore and say that. There isn't, and won't be in the foreseeable future, the population anywhere close to justifying a train to the North Shore. They should look at the pros/cons of running not only more, but faster Seabuses. What is the ride time now, 12 minutes? Think that could be cut to 8 or 9, plus double the frequency? Perhaps 10 years down the road.
For now I say build the damn Evergreen line and get to work on the planning stages for the UBC extension. Then Expo line extenion and an SFU Gondola. That would be fairly easy to do by comparison. Let's get that going.
I agree and disagree. A street car from Ambleside to Deep Cove would better serve the North Shore than ALRT like SkyTrain would.
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The Brain: Pinky, are you pondering what I'm pondering?
Pinky: I think so, Brain, but this time, you put the trousers on the chimp.
The issue is the configuration of Waterfront Stn. It would be a major transfer point for many people, and the stn at its current state cannot handle that number of people. However, assuming that the extension could occur, the platforms can be easily extended, shortening the corridor. I do believe a direct transfer between Expo and Millennium Lines and the Canada Line platform is needed.
This would be a top priority. It invloves not just the platform to platform connections, but also the whole redesigning of the transportation hub.
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add trains & cars, expand stations, reduce headways as much as safely possible, upzone the lots around the canada line stations etc etc build gondola(s) to SFU, build double-decker tram system downtown... keep building! 
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