Decision 2012: Alberta Politics Thread

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by Tropics

You own an oil and gas company?

Nope, but my I make my living in the industry and so does basically every other Albertan like it or not (specific industry doesn't matter), what's good for the O&G companies is for the most part good for Alberta. That said the government needs to control the environmental impacts of the industry better than they have been (head in sand isn't a valid environmental policy).

If these rebates are coming from the energy royalties, they need to be invested in the health, education, infrastructure, and future of this province rather than paid out as a dividend. Dividends aren't great on the stock market why would they be any better from a government and only cause a spending spike in an already overheated economy causing further inflation. Make our systems the best in the world and make sure that we have a huge rainy day fund for the rest of this world’s existence ($500+ billion).

That said if the money is that unnecessary why collect it in the first place the amount of money spent collecting it and subsequently redistributing it is a waste. Rather if they insist on redistributing to people, why not create a variable tax rebate for every taxpayer determined by the previous year's revenue? Tax burdens are then decreased based on the economy and only those who are contributing to the economy receive it. And no government will have to increase tax rates rather they decrease the rebate. I think the whole reluctance to raise taxes is a bit of a made up fear, I for one wouldn't complain if the government raised my taxes so long as I know that it's being spent efficiently and effectively, and I bet most of the people in this province wouldn’t have an issue either.

[MalcolmTucker]

So taxes down when times are good, and up in a recession? Talk about making downturns worse.

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by MalcolmTucker

So taxes down when times are good, and up in a recession? Talk about making downturns worse.

Isn't that pretty much what the dividend would do, government giving spending money out during the good times and removing it when the economy tanks?

Untimately the whole idea should die in the bin, it's a bad vote buying tactic that should have left politics when Ralph left.

[MalcolmTucker]

Originally Posted by Full Mountain

Isn't that pretty much what the dividend would do, government giving spending money out during the good times and removing it when the economy tanks?

Untimately the whole idea should die in the bin, it's a bad vote buying tactic that should have left politics when Ralph left.

Since tax rates can't be changed as fast as dividends or not, the policy is EVEN worse.

[floobie]

Just did my requisite perusal of all the party's platforms so I could get a nice, consolidated, clear understanding of their platforms. I'm stumped, frankly.

As usual, I like most of the NDP's social ideals, but disagree with quite a bit of their economic platform. Ditto with the liberals, more or less. The Wildrose is the opposite. Economically, they work for me. But socially they seem iffy. That dividend thing they're proposing comes across as a relatively empty vote-buying gesture to me, though. As for the PCs... I don't trust a damn thing they say anyway.

Basically, I disagree with too much of every party's platform for me to feel good about voting for any of them. This feels a lot like last year's federal election...

All I can do is hope the PCs don't win yet again. Some change, even if I feel iffy about it, is probably better.

[Coldrsx]

If the Wildrose get into power and delay my new Provincial museum or arena project, I am going to be very very upset.

[ChillN]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

If the Wildrose get into power and delay my new Provincial museum or arena project, I am going to be very very upset.

If it's delayed it will be cancelled. Remember how quickly the feds pulled the funding when they thought the province wasn't going to provide funding?

She said again she'd open the airport debate. I see massive cuts to the government in downtown Edmonton. A overall cut in infrastructure funding even with the new system. She's just out of step with the city.

Anyone but WR please. It would be a distaster for Edmonton.

[Jarrod]

I know who I'm NOT voting for and that's the WR. They scare the living daylights out of me.

With that one eliminated, I'm not sure who I'm going to vote for. I'm not thrilled with the PC's, but I could live with them... I guess the enemy you know. I just don't trust anyone of them.

It's frustrating

[MalcolmTucker]

Just remember, change takes time. A lot of the old guard isn't running again, and a bunch of the backroomers left for the Wildrose.

[SHOFEAR]

Have to go with the PC's.

Strategic and it certainly appears they are become more palatable with what appears to be a shift towards the middle... I'd probably most closely align with the liberal party but the name is so toxic it is for the most part a waste, NDP...lol.

I'm curious to see what the Alberta Party develops into over the next couple of years. Unfortunately for them this PC vs Wildrose battle is going to force a lot of votes from that party to people voting strategically against the WR.

[Tropics]

Originally Posted by Full Mountain

Nope, but my I make my living in the industry and so does basically every other Albertan like it or not (specific industry doesn't matter), what's good for the O&G companies is for the most part good for Alberta.

Yeah agreed, but this is not additional money that Alberta is taking from the O&G companies in increased royalties and taxes, this is money that they already take in that goes either to A)the heritage fund or B) the $300 cheque to each citizen of Alberta.

They are not collecting something and redistributing it to the same people they collected it from as you were alluding to, which would indeed be a waste of time and resources. This is how royalties are distributed/used. They ARE going to be collected from the O&G companies either way, it is how they are then used that is in question.

[MrOilers]

I think Redford really wants to clean up the apathetic and crooked "rot" that has plagued the PC party, but she ran out of time. Her "half-done" job is playing into the hands of the Wildrose and other non-PC parties right now.

I think if Stelmach had stepped down a year earlier, and Redford would've had a lot more time to change the culture of the party, the PCs would be polling better than they are right now.

[Tropics]

Originally Posted by MrOilers

I think Redford really wants to clean up the apathetic and crooked "rot" that has plagued the PC party, but she ran out of time. Her "half-done" job is playing into the hands of the Wildrose and other non-PC parties right now.

I have a hard time believing that given the flip flop she did on the non-meeting committee and the return of the money they had collected. She only finally folded on that issue and demanded the return of the money AFTER public opinion on the matter forced her hand and in a time when an election was not right around the corner I have a hard time believing that she would have demanded the return of the money at all given her initial (5 months) thing.

[DizzyEdge]

Conflicting stories emerge after Alberta Tory’s campaign-trail clash
JOSH WINGROVE
CALGARY— Globe and Mail Update
Published Saturday, Apr. 07, 2012 10:20PM EDT
Last updated Sunday, Apr. 08, 2012 2:51AM EDT

Police were called to a North Edmonton home Saturday evening after a physical altercation between the homeowner and a Progressive Conservative candidate.

Precisely what happened, however, isn't clear.

Education Minister Thomas Lukaszuk was door-knocking in his north Edmonton riding of Castle Downs Saturday when he was, according to the PC party, “assaulted by a constituent.” But the homeowner told reporters he shoved Mr. Lukaszuk to get him off his property.

“I grabbed him by the sweater and turned him around and started pushed him off my property,” Al Michalchuk, a supporter of the Wildrose Party, told CTV. “And he still, he would turn around and he wouldn't leave.”

More at: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle2395168/

[ChillN]

I definitely believe Lukaszuk.

I've done tons of doorknocking and encountered angry people from all political backgrounds, had doors slammed in my face and been chased by someone with a shovel.

I'd say two things are important to consider here. Firstly, you really don't want to get into a physical altercation with potential voters, it looks bad and why would you want to fight anyone in the first place? Secondly, it's a waste of time to speak with someone who is passionately oppossed to you when there are infinite numbers of people that you could talk to. He's an experienced politician who is well versed in the art of doorknocking. I just don't see him wasting that much time on someone who was violently opposed to him. Doesn't make sense.

[DizzyEdge]

Globe and Mail infographic:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/.../?from=2395809



http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/.../?from=2395809

[MalcolmTucker]

I wouldn't take 308 to heart, they have things like Kent Hehr coming third. Wildrose winning in Mountain View.

[240glt]

I have to admit that the prospect of the NDP and Liberals holding the balance of power in a minority government is fairly tittilating

[DizzyEdge]

I'm still pretty torn about who to vote for, my distaste for the WR is tempered by by the fact that we need a change after 40 yrs. That said I can't decide if I'd prefer a WR majority or minority victory. On one hand I'd like a minority since any extremism in the party will be tempered and since all parties will need to work together we'll likely get some good legislation and governing. On the other I'd like a majority since that will give the WR free reign to show their true colours, and if it's too extreme we can vote them back out in a few years. I wish I could get some polling results from my own riding, any idea how that might be possible?

[MalcolmTucker]

Where do you live Dizzy?

As for the projections, even projections based on much better polling than this are not very good due to the difficulty in projecting turnout, new riding boundaries, and the collapse of the Liberal vote and emergence of the Wildrose.