Winnipeg Surface Lots (Downtown)

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by CoryB

I am all for developing surface parking lots into something more productive however I am concerned when surface lots are converted to buildings which increase parking demand and the parking is either lost completely, reduced ot not expanded to account for the added demand.

We don't allow retail development in the sururbs that does not properly address its own parking needs and should not be making an exemption for downtown surface lots. Also, saying that the parkade across the street owned by someone else will meet the parking needs of your development is not a proper solution either.

One can only dream of such a terrible problem for downtown Winnipeg.

Here's some dude pointing at that silly parking lot map on CBC.
http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/#!/content/1.2666617

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by ediger

Currently, I never have a problem getting a spot within a few blocks of where I need to be. Considering most of the buildings that have been taking up surface lots include parkades with as many or more parking spots than the previous lot, I don't think parking will be an issue in the future either.

The key phrase there is currently. I used to frequent the bars in the Exchange area and never had trouble finding parking. There has been a push to develop housing in the area, often without on-site parking. My more recent experience, and those I have heard from other people, is finding parking in the Exchange is now an issue. If it wasn't an issue where is there a push to have the City fund the development of a parkade in the Exchange?

The Convention Centre expansion is a net loss of parking even before adjusting for the change to demand the development will generate. The One Portage and Main proposal included effective zero spots on a surface lot. Credit Union Central and 360 Portage Ave included minimal on-site parking while having significant affects on demand. CentrePoint seems like it will have a neutral impact even with a significant parkade component. Other projects, including SoPo, SkyCity Centre, the new Police HQ and the convention centre hotel have not released enough information to really evaluate their impact however it is not looking too positive.

[esquire]

^ There should still be parking, but perhaps provided a little more efficiently than with surface parking lots.

I really don't think that any parts of downtown are reaching the breaking point for parking availability other than the east Exchange, where, as it turns out, the city is working on getting a parkade built. You can always get parking downtown provided that you're willing and able to pay for it... it just may mean that some people might turn to the bus, carpools, or other alternatives to paying ever-increasing monthly parking fees.

[cheswick]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The key phrase there is currently. I used to frequent the bars in the Exchange area and never had trouble finding parking. There has been a push to develop housing in the area, often without on-site parking. My more recent experience, and those I have heard from other people, is finding parking in the Exchange is now an issue. If it wasn't an issue where is there a push to have the City fund the development of a parkade in the Exchange?

The Convention Centre expansion is a net loss of parking even before adjusting for the change to demand the development will generate. The One Portage and Main proposal included effective zero spots on a surface lot. Credit Union Central and 360 Portage Ave included minimal on-site parking while having significant affects on demand. CentrePoint seems like it will have a neutral impact even with a significant parkade component. Other projects, including SoPo, SkyCity Centre, the new Police HQ and the convention centre hotel have not released enough information to really evaluate their impact however it is not looking too positive.

I used to work at Credit Union Central. The indoor parkade they have for employees is large enough for the size of the building imo. But I digress.

I spend a lot of time in Montreal. Have to say there is FAR more available parking in downtown Winnipeg than there is in Montreal in terms of ratio to people in the area. Yet downtown Montreal is where people want to be. You take transit downtown when you want to have a night out. My point is I don't see lack of parking as a large deterant to people spending time in an area if it becomes desirable enough.

[steveosnyder]

Originally Posted by CoryB

The key phrase there is currently. I used to frequent the bars in the Exchange area and never had trouble finding parking. There has been a push to develop housing in the area, often without on-site parking. My more recent experience, and those I have heard from other people, is finding parking in the Exchange is now an issue. If it wasn't an issue where is there a push to have the City fund the development of a parkade in the Exchange?

Originally Posted by cheswick

I spend a lot of time in Montreal. Have to say there is FAR more available parking in downtown Winnipeg than there is in Montreal in terms of ratio to people in the area. Yet downtown Montreal is where people want to be. You take transit downtown when you want to have a night out. My point is I don't see lack of parking as a large deterant to people spending time in an area if it becomes desirable enough.

I agree with this -- a lack of [close, free] parking is not a large deterant to people spending time in the exchange if we get it to a point of desirability. If you ask any of the businesses in the area what they think about the "parking situation" in the exchange I am willing to bet none of them have noticed a drop in business as a result of the preceived lack of parking.

[Riverman]

Originally Posted by cheswick

You take transit downtown when you want to have a night out.

We do that here and our friends think we're nuts.

[steveosnyder]

Originally Posted by Riverman

We do that here and our friends think we're nuts.

I must be nuts... But I actually do hear this from some of my friends. My mother always asks me if I want to borrow the car when I am taking baby out and she looks at me weird when I say no.

[Riverman]

Originally Posted by steveosnyder

I must be nuts... But I actually do hear this from some of my friends. My mother always asks me if I want to borrow the car when I am taking baby out and she looks at me weird when I say no.

"How are you getting there tonight?"

"We're taking the bus."

"You're WHAT?"

[bomberjet]

Why wouldn't anyone take the bus downtown? Don't have to worry about anything. If you're scared of crime, why would you leave your car unattended downtown for hours on end? Hypocritical thinking without even realizing it. I guess most hypocrites don't realize it.

I have relatives who live in St. B, they have Jets season tix. They drive to every game because they think it's better and faster than taking the bus. In the next breath, they wait 30-45 mins to get out of the parkade after games... Wtf is that? You live in St. B! it takes me 15 mins to walk from MTS Centre to their place! Hop on the bus outside MTS centre on Portage, straight into St. B. Probably take 10 mins. Takes me 20-25 mins from MTS Centre to my front door on the bus. Take twice that driving, wading through traffic. Seems pretty clear to me what the answer is.

[cheswick]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Why wouldn't anyone take the bus downtown? Don't have to worry about anything. If you're scared of crime, why would you leave your car unattended downtown for hours on end? Hypocritical thinking without even realizing it. I guess most hypocrites don't realize it.

I have relatives who live in St. B, they have Jets season tix. They drive to every game because they think it's better and faster than taking the bus. In the next breath, they wait 30-45 mins to get out of the parkade after games... Wtf is that? You live in St. B! it takes me 15 mins to walk from MTS Centre to their place! Hop on the bus outside MTS centre on Portage, straight into St. B. Probably take 10 mins. Takes me 20-25 mins from MTS Centre to my front door on the bus. Take twice that driving, wading through traffic. Seems pretty clear to me what the answer is.

For whatever reason too many people in this city look down their noses at transit. As if it's below them to take a bus. I don't quite understand it.

[Riverman]

Loser cruiser.

Welfare wagon.

I prefer 32 window coupe.

[rypinion]

This was linked to on twitter today, relevant to discussion:

How Parking Lots Became the Scourge of American Downtowns

http://www.citylab.com/commute/2014/...ntowns/372207/

“Parking lots create a vicious cycle,” Norman Garrick tells me. A professor at the University of Connecticut, Garrick has spent much of his career documenting the effects that acre upon acre of surface parking can have on a city’s health. “When more parking was provided, more people drove.”

[BrickJunkie]

I agree that transit is a solution, as are parkades and underground parking. I've also lived / spent lots of time in Vancouver and Calgary, and compared to Winnipeg both cities obviously have a) better downtown transit options, b) less surface area parking, c) far higher parking prices in the core.

I contend that Winnipeg has an abundance of parking compared to the aforementioned cities, and it's certainly less expensive. Ideally future developments will incorporate both parking and mass transit options in harmony with one another, but I've lost a lot of faith in recent years regarding our civic leadership's competency regarding urban planning.

At any rate, if we're even going to pretend to be progressive and "big league" we need to start developing with a 50 year plan in the back of our minds. Transit and residential infill / density is clearly the way to go.

[scryer]

Originally Posted by Cyro

City considers grants for developing downtown parking lots
By: Aldo Santin





Source

Tax the lot owners accordingly and they will think, Subsidize them and they will build like there is no tomorrow.

Finally some good news about Winnipeg's downtown!!

It will be a nice pull to the centre from the sprawl that seems to be trailing in every direction in this city. If these developments include parkades/underground parking then they really have it made. I hope that proposals are already being put together.

For those of you concerned about parking, transit is part of the solution to it. I will agree that it is hard to see it as a solution because Winnipeg has such crappy transit. If these developments happen, they will put more demand on public transit solutions. For example, I think that it would be nice to park your car at a park-and-ride BRT station and take the BRT to downtown. The downtown scenes in larger Canadian cities almost pegs parking and driving as a turn off. It is much easier to get around in Toronto and Vancouver via public transit or walking... Which puts more people on the sidewalks.

I agree with BrickJunkie about developing with a 50 year plan. It would be nice for Winnipeg to approach the future with a possible vision of itself in mind.

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by trueviking

Here's some dude pointing at that silly parking lot map on CBC.
http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/#!/content/1.2666617

I still like this map. It's received much publicity and commentary over time.

This is circa 2007, but with a few exceptions represents the parking situation today. Red is surface lots, yellow is parking garages, blue is underground parkades.

Source