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  #1101  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 8:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
Sure didn't see any Bilbao effect or packed hotels as predicted on here by most. I'd call it an outright flop.
Have to agree with Riverman here, the only time the museum is busy in on the first Wed. of every month (free night) Free admissions count for half the visits. The number of visitors from out of town is negligible, the BS that got spewed that this would become a huge draw to Winnipeg is as laughable now as it was when this thing was in the planning stage.
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  #1102  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 8:58 PM
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The people of St. B are Provencher's worst enemy
Wasn't there a proposal for a hotel on provencher at some point? That would certainly breathe some life into that strip.
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  #1103  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 9:00 PM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Have to agree with Riverman here, the only time the museum is busy in on the first Wed. of every month (free night) Free admissions count for half the visits. The number of visitors from out of town is negligible, the BS that got spewed that this would become a huge draw to Winnipeg is as laughable now as it was when this thing was in the planning stage.
Is any one of ottawa's museums (any ONE) such a big draw? What about Halifax's pier 21? I think the CMHR no different.
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  #1104  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 9:04 PM
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^yup, but Ottawa has the fortune of being the Nation's Capital and benefits from thousands of tourists.
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  #1105  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 9:15 PM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Have to agree with Riverman here, the only time the museum is busy in on the first Wed. of every month (free night) Free admissions count for half the visits. The number of visitors from out of town is negligible, the BS that got spewed that this would become a huge draw to Winnipeg is as laughable now as it was when this thing was in the planning stage.
Did they really serve up the Bilbao effect?
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  #1106  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 9:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Coldrsx View Post
^yup, but Ottawa has the fortune of being the Nation's Capital and benefits from thousands of tourists.
Yes, but that is a result of the aggregate of what Ottawa has. Should the CMHR have been built in Ottawa. At least we got one museum here. Our tourist numbers have gone up, but it could be related to a number of factors.
From the firewalled free press:

"They’re using polar bears, beluga whales, great food and fun festivals to lure more American tourists to Manitoba, and industry officials said Tuesday it seems to be working.

Statistics Canada data show 26,306 American tourists took an overnight automobile trip to Manitoba during the first four months of 2016. That’s an increase of 17.7 per cent, or 3,952 visits, from the same period in 2015."

From: http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/bus...389025981.html
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  #1107  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 9:25 PM
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I guess would have it been better to build it in Ottawa instead of Winnipeg. Maybe a few more people would have seen it there as opposed to Winnipeg. Should have it been built at all, but hen should have any one of Ottawa's or halifax's fave been built? It took someone from here to have the vision to build it and a huge private commitment as an added bonus. So I think we deserve the CMHR, and are lucky to have it.
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  #1108  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 9:55 PM
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the tourism angle is an interesting one. the last time I was at cmhr I met an elderly couple from Zurich. they had just been up to Churchill and were spending an extra day in Winnipeg to see the cmhr. for Winnipeg to be successful from a tourism development perspective we need to do two things. first, get people who are coming here to stay a little longer and second, to get people who are passing through to stay here at all. these are achieved by having an attractive cluster of things to visit and to get people downtown who otherwise might just overnight by the perimeter or airport. I don't think even the most bloody minded critics of the museum would argue that people who are in the area for whatever reason aren't going to be drawn to the site, and that is a small but good thing.

as well, if you talk to people in the convention promotion business they will tell you that the museum is a great arrow in their quiver when pitching this destination. Will international travellers dedicate a visit to Winnipeg around the museum -- in some cases yes, where there is a strong connection to certain issues such as lgbt rights or disability issues. in general though I dont think even the most ardent supporters of the museum would make the case that it is a stand alone international tourism magnet. it was oversold that way in the early days by its promoters in my opinion.
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  #1109  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by dennis View Post
Yes, but that is a result of the aggregate of what Ottawa has. Should the CMHR have been built in Ottawa. At least we got one museum here. Our tourist numbers have gone up, but it could be related to a number of factors.
From the firewalled free press:

"They’re using polar bears, beluga whales, great food and fun festivals to lure more American tourists to Manitoba, and industry officials said Tuesday it seems to be working.

Statistics Canada data show 26,306 American tourists took an overnight automobile trip to Manitoba during the first four months of 2016. That’s an increase of 17.7 per cent, or 3,952 visits, from the same period in 2015."

From: http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/bus...389025981.html
What's really working is the Canada/US$ exchange rate!
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  #1110  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 10:32 PM
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Maybe cmhr just isn't advertising well abroad. I refer people there every day and when I mention human rights museum, especially to americans who make up the bulk of tourists, they say "what's that? "
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  #1111  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Riverman View Post
Sure didn't see any Bilbao effect or packed hotels as predicted on here by most. I'd call it an outright flop.
Did many people here actually say that? I do recall people calling into radio programs when the funding was finalized more or less stating that this would provide a noticeable boost to tourism in Winnipeg.

I never thought this museum would provide a dramatic boost to our tourism numbers as it did in Bilboa. Bilboa already had a respectable amount of tourism prior to the opening of the museum with its rich culture, interesting architecture and year-round temperate climate compared to Winnipeg. It's also relatively close to other major tourist hotspots in the country and can enjoy some residual effects from that. Winnipeg has a fraction of those things and has an inhospitable climate to most of those from abroad for 4-5 months of the year.

I do enjoy having this museum in the city as it gives a small boost to its profile and provides an additional attraction.

Last edited by blueandgoldguy; Aug 22, 2016 at 8:52 PM.
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  #1112  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2016, 11:56 PM
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^ I don't think the proponents ever came out and promised the Bilbao effect in Winnipeg, but I think it's fair to say that it was implied to at least some extent.

There's no question that CMHR is on the must-see list for out of town visitors so it isn't surprising that you'd find out of towners there. But I doubt anyone is making the trip just for that. Then again, of all the museums I've been to (and there have been many), I can't think of many times where I've visited a city mainly to see a museum.
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  #1113  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 2:36 AM
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People from the upper mid west make up the bulk of our tourists. Even after our dollar increases in value relative to the US dollar, of course their numbers will drop, but they just might be up even a little bit more than before when we were at par knowing we have a few more attractions including the CMHR, Assiniboine Park upgrades etc. Some may say Winnipeg is a pretty good city. Let's go there again for the weekend. Or just maybe recommend it to friends. I am not saying that we will get people in say Germany saying lets go to Winnipeg to see the museum, but people closer to us. Going to Fargo and The Twin Cities I popular for us Manitobans, why not have the opposite. Even Tourism Winnipeg (or is it Tourism Manitoba) is now focusing on our culture as a selling point, more so than our natural attractions.
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  #1114  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 1:41 PM
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Originally Posted by dennis View Post
I guess would have it been better to build it in Ottawa instead of Winnipeg. Maybe a few more people would have seen it there as opposed to Winnipeg. Should have it been built at all, but hen should have any one of Ottawa's or halifax's fave been built? It took someone from here to have the vision to build it and a huge private commitment as an added bonus. So I think we deserve the CMHR, and are lucky to have it.
You and I, and the rest of Winnipeg's population. The City and Government of Manitoba are paying for most of it. In other words, we're paying for it. That's not vision, that's corporate welfare.

The Asper's could have paid for it mainly by private funding, and everyone would be happy. Even the majority of "private" funding that the CMHR did get was from Unions and Crown Corporations. It's all good now, as it still has that "Shiny New Toy" image.

How will history judge the CMHR? Only time will tell...

Last edited by Jets4Life; Aug 20, 2016 at 3:36 PM.
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  #1115  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 1:47 PM
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You seem to be judging it now.
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  #1116  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 1:56 PM
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Originally Posted by dennis View Post
People from the upper mid west make up the bulk of our tourists. Even after our dollar increases in value relative to the US dollar, of course their numbers will drop, but they just might be up even a little bit more than before when we were at par knowing we have a few more attractions including the CMHR, Assiniboine Park upgrades etc. Some may say Winnipeg is a pretty good city. Let's go there again for the weekend. Or just maybe recommend it to friends. I am not saying that we will get people in say Germany saying lets go to Winnipeg to see the museum, but people closer to us. Going to Fargo and The Twin Cities I popular for us Manitobans, why not have the opposite. Even Tourism Winnipeg (or is it Tourism Manitoba) is now focusing on our culture as a selling point, more so than our natural attractions.
As a born and raised Winnipegger, who has lived elsewhere, I can give an impartial view of what people outside of Southern Manitoba would visit the area surrounding Winnipeg (in order of preference):

-family/friends
-beaches and lakes of Manitoba
-fishing on lakes close to Winnipeg
-Assiniboine Park and Zoo
-drinking age of 18
-The Forks (not including CMHR)
-Wpg Folk Festival
-The Villages (Corydon and Osborne)
-Folklorama
-WSO and RWB
-Festival du Voyageur
-CMHR

I may have forgotten a couple but that CMHR is not bringing anyone from outside Manitoba, that would come just to see the museum. If we built a Holocaust Museum, an Museum of First Nations people/culture, or even a Rock and Roll museum, I have no doubt that would have happened.
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  #1117  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 3:46 PM
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Just go and read the reviews on Trip Advisor. They're already very numerous and massively positive, with any negative ones almost invariably being from Winnipeggers. People from all over the world are calling it world-class or similar ... They're blissfully unaware that it's impossible for Winnipeg to have anything good (they'd need to be lectured by locals to learn that tragic fact, I guess).

The idea isn't that it is going to make a lot of people embark on a long journey just for that one thing. It's that people won't so readily bypass the city and will stay longer when they do come -- and spread the word about how Winnipeg has an outstanding and unique attraction.
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  #1118  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 3:47 PM
EastK EastK is offline
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Originally Posted by Jets4Life View Post
As a born and raised Winnipegger, who has lived elsewhere, I can give an impartial view of what people outside of Southern Manitoba would visit the area surrounding Winnipeg (in order of preference):

-family/friends
-beaches and lakes of Manitoba
-fishing on lakes close to Winnipeg
-Assiniboine Park and Zoo
-drinking age of 18
-The Forks (not including CMHR)
-Wpg Folk Festival
-The Villages (Corydon and Osborne)
-Folklorama
-WSO and RWB
-Festival du Voyageur
-CMHR

I may have forgotten a couple but that CMHR is not bringing anyone from outside Manitoba, that would come just to see the museum. If we built a Holocaust Museum, an Museum of First Nations people/culture, or even a Rock and Roll museum, I have no doubt that would have happened.
Give it 20 years and maybe we can turn that beautiful building into a science museum or something like that. As good as the message is, who really wants to go learn about human rights more than once at a museum with no artifacts..... "Hey kids want to go learn about human rights again"? "But Dad we were there 2 months ago"!
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  #1119  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 7:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Tacheguy View Post
the tourism angle is an interesting one. the last time I was at cmhr I met an elderly couple from Zurich. they had just been up to Churchill and were spending an extra day in Winnipeg to see the cmhr. for Winnipeg to be successful from a tourism development perspective we need to do two things. first, get people who are coming here to stay a little longer and second, to get people who are passing through to stay here at all. these are achieved by having an attractive cluster of things to visit and to get people downtown who otherwise might just overnight by the perimeter or airport. I don't think even the most bloody minded critics of the museum would argue that people who are in the area for whatever reason aren't going to be drawn to the site, and that is a small but good thing.

as well, if you talk to people in the convention promotion business they will tell you that the museum is a great arrow in their quiver when pitching this destination. Will international travellers dedicate a visit to Winnipeg around the museum -- in some cases yes, where there is a strong connection to certain issues such as lgbt rights or disability issues. in general though I dont think even the most ardent supporters of the museum would make the case that it is a stand alone international tourism magnet. it was oversold that way in the early days by its promoters in my opinion.
Well said, couldn't agree more.

And to others, an "outright fail" would be if no one is going at all. It is still putting up decent numbers and will likely see a gain as The Forks and even downtown get more developed.

And people complaining that it was "over sold" ... every single development in the history of developments have been oversold. Portage Place, MTS Centre, CC expansion, Centrepoint, have all said they would "transform downtown" or "breathe new life" — we all know that's not true. It's just one more attraction to have in our arsenal and the more we add the more they help each other and the more tourists and residents will come here.
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  #1120  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2016, 9:10 PM
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Just go and read the reviews on Trip Advisor. They're already very numerous and massively positive, with any negative ones almost invariably being from Winnipeggers. People from all over the world are calling it world-class or similar ... They're blissfully unaware that it's impossible for Winnipeg to have anything good (they'd need to be lectured by locals to learn that tragic fact, I guess).

The idea isn't that it is going to make a lot of people embark on a long journey just for that one thing. It's that people won't so readily bypass the city and will stay longer when they do come -- and spread the word about how Winnipeg has an outstanding and unique attraction.
You think reviews on Trip Advisor are from real visitors and tourists!
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