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  #11041  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 3:38 AM
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Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
My point is that JT chose the make-up of his cabinet based on gender and racial inclusivity as it's principal feature. I think this is blatantly wrong.

Just choose the best damned people for the job - some of them will be female and/or minorities, I guarantee it........
I may regret asking this, but how many cases have there been where one could reasonably say "this portfolio would almost certainly have been handled better by [specific sitting white male Liberal MP] than it has been by [specific female and/or non-white cabinet minister]"?
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  #11042  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 3:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I've always found it odd that we don't have a Minister of Culture either.
Well, it's because we have no culture

Although maybe if we had a Minister of Culture, we would.
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  #11043  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 3:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Bcasey25raptor View Post
I'm rather pissed off they punted Stephane Dion who was one of the few Liberal cabinet ministers with guts.
He actually seems (to me) like he'd be an excellent diplomat in a francophone country/environment.
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  #11044  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 4:11 AM
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Originally Posted by 1overcosc View Post
Overall I approve of today's shuffle. Freeland is a great choice for Foreign Minister. Good to see Mihychuk out; she was pretty ineffective. I'm a little disappointed Monsef is still in, though. Champagne and Hussen are great picks.. they were some of the best rising stars in the backbenches and I look forward to seeing what comes out of them.

It's interesting to note that today's shuffle offends the regional balances a bit, though. One Manitoban, one Ontarian, and one Quebecer were taken out of cabinet.. and one Quebecer and two Ontarians were added in.
Another weakness of the archaic form of government we continue to saddle ourselves with.
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  #11045  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 5:40 AM
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Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
Education is also predominantly female and law is probably at least half female (if not more).

These are all high value occupations, with stable employment and good salaries. Some of these programs have an anti male bias (like nursing).
Both education and nursing have affirmative action programs in place that actually favour men, at least here in Ontario. Many hospitals and school boards actually have mandated quotas for increasing the percentage of nurses & elementary teachers that are male.

It's very difficult to get a job as a teacher in Ontario because demand is so high. If you're going into elementary, having a penis is a magic ticket to more or less instant full time employment... whereas women going into elementary teaching stay stuck on substitute lists for years. It's actually one of the most unfair affirmative action programs I've ever seen.
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  #11046  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by 1overcosc View Post
Yes, but here's the rub: the female majority stems from the massive female over representation in Bachelor of Arts programs. In the university programs that actually get you a good job--like engineering, computing, mathematics, and business--enrollment is still quite male-dominated.
I suspect many of the men went off into well-paying but low-hanging-fruit jobs like... in the oil patch. What is the female representation level there?
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  #11047  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 1:02 PM
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I thought I might drop this in here - a little primer on the moral underpinnings and discomfort regarding discrimination and unequal treatment.

Video Link
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  #11048  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 1:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Aylmer View Post
I thought I might drop this in here - a little primer on the moral underpinnings and discomfort regarding discrimination and unequal treatment.
I've always loved "Crash Course". A good quote from this one:

"If I'm a white guy passed over for a job that I'm qualified for, that sucks, and it's unfair. But the reason it feels unfair to me now is that I've reaped the spoils of white mail privilege for so long. When you're already so far ahead, it can feel really bad to be held back and asked to wait for others to catch up, but if we're actually aiming at equality, that's exactly what the people at the front are gonna have to do."
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  #11049  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 2:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Hali87 View Post
Well, it's because we have no culture

Although maybe if we had a Minister of Culture, we would.
I could be wrong, but I believe the provinces consider matters of culture to be within their jurisdiction.
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  #11050  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 2:24 PM
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Originally Posted by GernB View Post
I could be wrong, but I believe the provinces consider matters of culture to be within their jurisdiction.
I'd say it's an area of shared jurisdiction.

We do have a federal Minister of Culture. Her name in Mélanie Joly. She is just not known by that title specifically.
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  #11051  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 2:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Hali87 View Post
I may regret asking this, but how many cases have there been where one could reasonably say "this portfolio would almost certainly have been handled better by [specific sitting white male Liberal MP] than it has been by [specific female and/or non-white cabinet minister]"?
I doubt the issue has ever arisen in such a specific way. The only real issue, istm, is whether the PM is willing to shuffle the cabinet periodically to move/drop underperformers.
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  #11052  
Old Posted Jan 11, 2017, 11:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Vorkuta View Post
I suspect many of the men went off into well-paying but low-hanging-fruit jobs like... in the oil patch. What is the female representation level there?
Small but steadily growing representation. Working in the patch is generally a trades person but lots of operators as well. Seeing more and more women on the operations side as well as getting involved with the trades.
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  #11053  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 1:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Rollerstud98 View Post
Small but steadily growing representation. Working in the patch is generally a trades person but lots of operators as well. Seeing more and more women on the operations side as well as getting involved with the trades.
The companies like women to drive the dump trucks and operate the dragger hoes and shovels. It is not really a heavy manual job at all (electric drives, large comfortable cabs) and women are far easier on the equipment.
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  #11054  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 1:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Bcasey25raptor View Post
I'm rather pissed off they punted Stephane Dion who was one of the few Liberal cabinet ministers with guts.
Trump would have totally steamrollered over Dion with his bookish Pepe LePew demeanour. Freeland is a far better choice. Dion should have been Minister of Enrvironment. I guess if he and McCallum are going this means two byelections?
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  #11055  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 2:06 AM
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Trump would have totally steamrollered over Dion with his bookish Pepe LePew demeanour. Freeland is a far better choice. Dion should have been Minister of Enrvironment. I guess if he and McCallum are going this means two byelections?
Dion in charge of the environment would have been an economic disaster. I hope he does retire from anything to do with politics. #NotAFan
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  #11056  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 2:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Corndogger View Post
Dion in charge of the environment would have been an economic disaster. I hope he does retire from anything to do with politics. #NotAFan
Where ya been? He already has.
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  #11057  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 2:19 AM
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Originally Posted by 1overcosc View Post
Yes, but here's the rub: the female majority stems from the massive female over representation in Bachelor of Arts programs. In the university programs that actually get you a good job--like engineering, computing, mathematics, and business--enrollment is still quite male-dominated.



The first part of our statement doesn't connect with the second, really. Men are more likely to get cancer, yes, but male-specific cancers are not as common as female-specific cancers; males are more likely to get cancers that either sex can have (like lung cancer). Furthermore, cancers of male organs tend to be less severe and more treatable. Masculine cancers (testicular, prostate, penile, etc.) mostly have cure rates in the 80s and 90s whereas feminine cancers (breast, overian, cervical, etc.) have much lower rates. Breast cancer is about 75% and cancers of the female reproductive system are often less than 50%.

Breast cancer is also highly genetic. Every single woman on my mother's side has had breast cancer--my mom, my maternal grandma, and both of my maternal grandma's sisters. My sister has to live her life knowing that her breasts are basically a ticking time bomb. Not pleasant.
But nothing of what you have said changes the preference for women over men in these areas in Canada. My father had Alzheimer's and yet every morning I hear an ad that states 72% of Alzheimer's patients are women. I have never once heard an ad that about 75% of suicides in Canada are men.
Face it, men do not matter in our gynocentric society. As well, there are more men than women in these professions (engineering, computing, mathematics, and business) because men are more interested in them, not because women are not allowed. In fact there have been programs get more women into them, They just chose not to.

Last edited by DLLB; Jan 12, 2017 at 2:30 AM.
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  #11058  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 2:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Vorkuta View Post
I suspect many of the men went off into well-paying but low-hanging-fruit jobs like... in the oil patch. What is the female representation level there?
A Bachelor of Arts won't get you into those jobs. That is what happened.
As well, when you look at the fatality rate in the most dangerous and difficult jobs, 94% are male. These are not "low-hanging-fruit jobs". They are the dangerous and dirty jobs that men do and die doing them at a horrible rate. We never really hear about this aspect of the workplace and female representation in these,
do we!
Occupation...........Fatality rate per 100,000 workers.... % Male
Logging.............................132.7.....................................97.2
Fishing.................................54.8....................................99.9
Roofers................................39.7....................................97.7
Iron Workers.......................29.8....................................97.8
Truck Drivers........................25.2....................................94.9
Power-Line Workers............20.5....................................97.7
Construction Workers.........15.6.....................................97.3
Concrete Manufacture........13.5.....................................99.8
Mining (Not oil/gas)............12.4.....................................99.9
Mining Support...................12.2.....................................99.9
Mining (Not oil/gas)............11.4.....................................99.9
Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics,

Last edited by DLLB; Jan 12, 2017 at 3:42 AM.
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  #11059  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 3:30 AM
Corndogger Corndogger is online now
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
Where ya been? He already has.
When did he confirm that he doesn't even want to be a diplomat?
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  #11060  
Old Posted Jan 12, 2017, 5:47 AM
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Originally Posted by DLLB View Post
A Bachelor of Arts won't get you into those jobs. That is what happened.
As well, when you look at the fatality rate in the most dangerous and difficult jobs, 94% are male. These are not "low-hanging-fruit jobs". They are the dangerous and dirty jobs that men do and die doing them at a horrible rate. We never really hear about this aspect of the workplace and female representation in these,
do we!
Occupation...........Fatality rate per 100,000 workers.... % Male
Logging.............................132.7.....................................97.2
Fishing.................................54.8....................................99.9
Roofers................................39.7....................................97.7
Iron Workers.......................29.8....................................97.8
Truck Drivers........................25.2....................................94.9
Power-Line Workers............20.5....................................97.7
Construction Workers.........15.6.....................................97.3
Concrete Manufacture........13.5.....................................99.8
Mining (Not oil/gas)............12.4.....................................99.9
Mining Support...................12.2.....................................99.9
Mining (Not oil/gas)............11.4.....................................99.9
Source: Bureau of Labor Statistics,
stats from the USA?
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