Edmonton bid for 2017 or 2020 World's Fair - Page 13

Shodan · #**241** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 1:45 PM**

A year-long party for $2.3B
Planners unveil vision for city's Expo 2017 bid

Gordon Kent
Edmonton Journal

Tuesday, December 01, 2009

Vowing Alberta will celebrate Canada's 150th birthday with a year long party in 2017 if Edmonton wins its Expo bid, Mayor Stephen Mandel joined other backers Monday in unveiling the ambitious $2.3-billion plan.

Officials from the city, the volunteer bid committee and the University of Alberta held a splashy news conference Monday to make public their proposal for holding the world's fair after developing it behind closed doors for more than a year...

© Edmonton Journal 2009

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MalcolmTucker · #**242** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 3:29 PM**

Year long party? Expo lasts 3 months.

Coldrsx · #**243** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 3:47 PM**

^not in the best city in the best province in the best country it don't.

noodlenoodle · #**244** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 4:17 PM**

I'm excited by the notion of Expo2017.
I'm unexcited about the bid.

kcantor · #**245** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 5:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir.Humphrey.Appleby

Year long party? Expo lasts 3 months.

no, it lasts for at least a lot longer than a year. you have everything from volunteer training sessions leading up to opening day to visits from dignitaries and potential participants and you have one to three years worth of construction and bridge openings and you have a presence at every fair between now and 2017 and you have national and international interest in your bid and your city whether you win or not and negotiations with pavilion construction and arranging to provide space etc. for nations that can't afford to attend on their own...

you have your wind up parties and your building turnovers after the fair and you have your followup meetings with governments and business and ngo's and visitiors that lasts long after the fair (i.e. the eifel tower, the space needle in seattle, vancouver's love affair with the legacy of false creek and the image of the sails over the canada pavillion or habitat in montreal...).

anyone that thinks an expo only lasts 3 months or only provides value for 3 months doesn't fully understand them or the process involved in hosting one. that doesn't mean everyone will or even should unconditionally support everything about them, but if you aren't going to support something you should be at least as knowledgeable about it as those that do.

MalcolmTucker · #**246** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 5:48 PM**

The article specifically said it was a 'year long party'. I don't take issue with doing it, but they better sell it honestly to the people. Is a small short expo worth $2.3 billion for the city?

It isn't like an Olympics where television rights cover a large portion of the capital cost. They will need the province and feds to step up pretty soon, and convince one of the three levels of government to pick up possible overruns. The city really needs to commit to its 1/3 aswell. Toronto's bid a few years back died from similar issues in the financing stage.

240glt · #**247** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 5:59 PM**

"sell it honestly to the people"

oh please, when has any major city taken a pragmatic and sober approach to selling an event like this ? It's all about creating the excitement and buzz around the event, and trying to mitigate losses as much as possible.

I could care less about South campus but the upgrades in & around the legislature and Rossdale, complete with a new bridge will be a fantastic addition to the city.

ue · #**248** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 7:07 PM**

^+hopefully spur the quarters. w/o the 2017 expo happening, it'll be so long before much happens there, unfortunately. the city doesn't seem like it has the motive.

noodlenoodle · #**249** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 7:17 PM**

Which $2B would you rather have, Expo or SE/WLRT?

240glt · #**250** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 7:29 PM**

^ Funny, I don't recall the city saying that all public transit projects are going on the shelf to finance Expo. Must've been written in the Sun.

noodlenoodle · #**251** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 7:43 PM**

How many $2 billion dollar cheques are you expecting the Feds to write?

MalcolmTucker · #**252** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 7:57 PM**

Well, there is only so much money in the pot, and the city still has to raise 1/3rd. At minimum, that 1/3rd is debt room that the city can't use for transit, roads, etc. Not to say that it is a bad idea, because the Expo would be good, but the city needs to go in eyes open, knowing that hosting Expo does not create out of nowhere all the money it takes to run it. In Canada, most of the money comes out of existing programs, which means it is money Edmonton would have been given anyways.

noodlenoodle · #**253** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 8:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir.Humphrey.Appleby

Well, there is only so much money in the pot, and the city still has to raise 1/3rd. At minimum, that 1/3rd is debt room that the city can't use for transit, roads, etc. Not to say that it is a bad idea, because the Expo would be good, but the city needs to go in eyes open, knowing that hosting Expo does not create out of nowhere all the money it takes to run it. In Canada, most of the money comes out of existing programs, which means it is money Edmonton would have been given anyways.

So the City'll have to find $700m, and we'll have to deal with reallocations of a further $1.5b taken from other programs' funding?

MalcolmTucker · #**254** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 8:30 PM**

^ Not entirely, due to sponsorships, gate revenue, fees from participating countries, sale of properties afterwards, but I wouldn't be surprised if the cities hit would be north of $300 million in the end, plus similar reallocations from other levels of government.

noodlenoodle · #**255** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 8:40 PM**

Here's the cost slide.

If we deal with $300m from each of the three levels of government, where's the other $1.1billion from?

(As a side note, the Expo2017 site is using Flickr to host the images in the Virtual Open House in violation of Flickr's own TOS. Bad form, and will get the images yanked in short order if Flickr notices the bandwith spike or someone reports it.)

MalcolmTucker · #**256** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 8:54 PM**

All depends on recoveries from asset sales at the end, which you can't really predict right now. I hadn't read the bid book to be honest, so was estimating from my knowledge with PanAm, Vanoc, and the Calgary & Toronto bids (albeit those were full Expos).

I think Edmonton might be going a bit overboard with the capital expenditures here - it is remarkably close to the cost projected for Toronto's much large proposed fair years ago.

noodlenoodle · #**257** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 8:59 PM**

Well we ARE the city with a $260m interchange and the most expensive LRT per km of track in the world. We've got a reputation of overspending to maintain here...

feepa · #**258** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 9:39 PM**

I'd like to see a more detailed list of what the 2.3 B covers

noodlenoodle · #**259** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 9:48 PM**

Likewise. A breakdown would be lovely to determine how much is legacy vs expo-centric spending and might get me a little more behind the bid.

SHOFEAR · #**260** Posted **Dec 1, 2009, 9:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by feepa

I'd like to see a more detailed list of what the 2.3 B covers

Indeed. If that list includes leg ground makeovers and building construction at the south campus (all things that were likely to happen anyways and paid for by the province) then the actual cost for new projects that must by split between various levels of governments and the "real" cost of the expo is far far less.