Southern Company Seeks Wind Power For Georgia

[dante2308]

Leases sought to test wind turbines off Ga. coast

Southern Co. has asked the U.S. Department of the Interior for ocean leases off the coasts of Jekyll Island and Savannah to erect research towers to determine the feasibility of constructing offshore wind turbines.

The Atlanta-based company wants to construct towers to support equipment to measure wind speeds and directions, hurricane resistance and to gather other data determine if wind turbines may be viable as an alternative energy source in Georgia.

A two-year study the company conducted with Georgia Tech found favorable conditions for wind turbine technology five miles off Georgia' coast, where average wind speed was 16 to 17 mph.

Bloomberg/Business Week

[dante2308]

To highlight the significance, There are zero wind turbines off the coast of the United States.

Also, the Southern Company has resisted all forms of renewable energy for decades with the slight exception of hydro instead focusing on coal and nuclear. Here is one article describing the shift:

Southern Company (NYSE: SO) wants to test the feasibility of wind turbines off the coast of Georgia near Jekyll Island and Savannah, according to an Associated Press report.

Southern Company owns numerous utilities in the southeast including Georgia Power, Alabama Power and Gulf power. The company has been criticized for owning some of the largest and dirtiest coal-fired power plants in the country and also for being slow to pursue renewable resources like solar and wind instead of new nuclear power.

However, that may be starting to change. The company reportedly has asked the Department of Interior for ocean leases to build research towers to gather information on wind speed and direction.

A study the company conducted with Georgia Tech found average wind speeds of 16 to 17 mph five miles off the Georgia coast--ideal for offshore wind turbines.

Other signs that the company may be getting serious about clean energy: last month Southern Co. purchased a solar project in New Mexico in conjunction with Ted Turner's renewable energy company; and Southern company recently announced plans for a couple biomass plants.

[dante2308]

To further highlight the significance:




To be fair, the onshore potential in the South is a bit lower than average, however the offshore potential is substantial.

[dante2308]

To anyone who doesn't realize or know, as much as 43% of new power capacity built in the US in 2009 was wind power and not only does the US lead in wind power production, it is on track to become the single largest source of electricity.

Current super projects include the Titan Wind Project which will bring 12 GW of power to North Dakota and transmits the energy to Chicago. 12 GW is the equivalent of 14 nuclear power plants and several multiples of the power demand of North Dakota.

Current US wind power capacity is greater than 35 GW up from 25 GW in 2008. The stimulus package is independently bringing 16 GW of renewable energy online by the end of this year.

[cybele]

Well, what percent of our power comes from wind and what will those big windmills look like. I don't think I'd want one in my backyard.

I'm not saying I'm against them but I read somewhere the Chinese are getting into this big.

[dante2308]

The current trajectory is 20% wind power by 2020 up from the Bush era estimate of 20% from 2030. With the energy legislation, it moves it to 20% by 2016.

Wind power in Georgia will be offshore and will most likely be imported from other states with more renewable investment mechanisms.

The Chinese are building quickly but we are building just as fast and we have a head start. You can see the ten year difference in the maps I provided. Current capacity is at 9 million homes with a doubling every two years or three years.

As for a wind turbine in your yard, if you had one, it would power 300 homes and you would get a grant to build it from the stimulus package. there are several designs:

Onshore:


Offshore:


Novel Offshore floating Wind/Wave facility:

[cybele]

Originally Posted by dante2308

As for a wind turbine in your yard, if you had one, it would power 300 homes and you would get a grant to build it from the stimulus package.

Well, that sounds like a no-brainer. If the stimulus people are doling out the taxpayer's money and you can 300 homes off the thing I'll gladly put up a bunch of them. There should be some 1-800 number or such unless it's just for the lucky ones.

[dante2308]

You have to get it approved by your local authorities and get through a protracted fight with the Southern Company to get transmission line usage. You have to submit the project before the final deadline and demonstrate viability.

Otherwise you should be fine. Several individuals and companies like Google are building wind farms.

[cybele]

Well, I've got two friends who work for the Google and neither one knows a dang thing about farming. I'm glad to hear normal people can get the stimulus money which comes from the taxpayers in the first place, instead of just corporations and other governments, all of which takes their big cut out of it. I don't see why I need a bunch of approvals to put windmills on my own land. If the Georgia Power is serious about it they orto be glad to have people selling them electricity and whatnot since they got a monopoly and just mark it up and sell it down the line.

[dante2308]

What do you mean, a full third of the stimulus was tax cuts for the working and middle class and another third was for teachers, firemen and unemployment benefits, and the rest was construction jobs on things like the 14th street bridge and wind turbines.


Anyway:

Google invests in North Dakota wind farms

By JAMES MacPHERSON (AP) – 2 days ago

BISMARCK, N.D. — Google Inc. has bought a $38.8 million stake in two North Dakota wind farms — an investment that a state regulator believes will spur more interest in the state's growing wind energy industry.

Google spokesman Jamie Yood said it was the Mountain View, Calif.-based Internet company's first direct investment in a renewable energy project. He called North Dakota "a tremendous wind resource."

"We figured this makes financial sense for us and allows us to accelerate deployment of clean energy," Yood said Friday.

The wind farms — one in eastern North Dakota and the other in the central part of the state — are operated by Juno Beach, Fla.-based NextEra Energy Resources LLC. Together they generate about 170 megawatts of power, enough to power about 55,000 homes, Yood said.

NextEra spokesman Steve Stengel said the projects include 33 turbines that generate 49.5 megawatts in northern Burleigh County, north of Bismarck, and 80 turbines that generate 120 megawatts in Griggs and Steele counties in eastern North Dakota.

[cybele]

Well, we didn't get a nickel.

[echinatl]

Do you make more than 250K a year? If you do then you didn't get a tax cut, but if you make less then you definitely did.

[dante2308]

Let me highlight that Georgia's record peak energy demand is 16,044 MW (25k MW capacity) or less than half the current US wind power capacity.

Texas wind power generation currently stands at over 9,500 MW (I say over because stats are reported yearly and construction is several MW daily). Texas was using excess transmission capacity to distribute the power however they have met their capacity and about 16 months ago began a project to build 18,500 MW of new transmission capacity.

When it is particularly windy, electricity rates in North Texas often fall to zero as the excess energy is so extensive and mostly wasted. With the new transmission capacity the city Dallas CSA will be able to meet all of its energy needs from wind alone.

To be fair the average generation of wind power is a percentage of the nameplate capacity however new generations of turbines reach peak power at lower wind speeds.

Georgia power production by source (2008 from EIA)
Coal-62.78%
Nuclear-23.27%
Natural Gas-9.86%
Wood-1.95%
Hydro-1.57%

This is a crying shame. I fall inside the tiny hydro area or I'd feel bad having this computer on.

Here is what the local lobby has said about it:

Southeast raises concerns

A national electricity standard has faced opposition from Southeastern lawmakers, who fear that it'll benefit states with big wind and good sun. Southeastern states are largely dependent on coal and nuclear power.

"We're not opposed to renewables, but we're of the opinion that states should come up with their own plans," says David Wright, past president and current commissioner of the Southeastern Association of Regulatory Utility Commissioners. If the Southeast benefits from growth in biomass, he wonders if it'll lose jobs if coal plants close.

Renewable energy also remains more expensive than coal. Mandates that drive up its use could result in higher energy prices, which could result in lost jobs, says Max Schulz, analyst at the Manhattan Institute, a free-market think tank.

"There's no question that if you have a national standard, you'll see an increase in green jobs," Schulz says. "But you'll also have harmful effects."

[trainiac]

Originally Posted by dante2308

I saw some of these in Atlantic City over the weekend. They looked to be about 20 stories tall. Really cool looking

[dante2308]

They go from 50-100 meters high just up to the center of the rotor. I haven't seen any myself yet. I really should leave the South more often. The one in AC are onshore though.

[cybele]

Originally Posted by dante2308

This is a crying shame. I fall inside the tiny hydro area or I'd feel bad having this computer on.

Well, the juice could be coming from somewhere else. Once it gets into the wires it can go anywheres so there is no need to be guilty.

Another thing nobody talks about is the leaf blower. Just knocking the clumps off the lawn takes quite a bit of gas. These scientists orto figure out how to get more blowing per gallon out of it so as to cut back on the fossil fuels and so forth, then multiply it by millions.

[echinatl]

Originally Posted by cybele

Well, the juice could be coming from somewhere else. Once it gets into the wires it can go anywheres so there is no need to be guilty.

Transmission Loss

Originally Posted by cybele

Another thing nobody talks about is the leaf blower. Just knocking the clumps off the lawn takes quite a bit of gas. These scientists orto figure out how to get more blowing per gallon out of it so as to cut back on the fossil fuels and so forth, then multiply it by millions.

What?

[cybele]

Originally Posted by echinatl

What?

Well, I'm just saying if everybody's blower was fixed to save gas you'd save millions a year.

On the transmission thing it seems like you'd get that no matter where it started out unless it started out right there in your back yard.

[dante2308]

It is exceedingly expensive to transmit power over distances. Your power is almost always local with the emergency exception of very extreme cases.

The Texas transmission plan I spoke about was $4.93 billion, the North Dakota to Chicago one was $10-12 billion.

[echinatl]

Cybele I got ya, I read what you wrote differently. I totally agree that part of the solution is to make the things that use energy more efficient. Look at the new V6 Mustang, it produces 305HP. When i was in HS the V6 option made 160hp. I don't have time to check but I bet the 305hp V6 even gets better mileage than the 160hp version.

Dante, maybe right now it's expensive but that's bound to change over the next few years. And also how much more expensive is it then paying people, and building and maintaining trucks, and paying for fuel costs to drive gas around. Or the cost to pipe hydrogen around. The numbers you quoted are one time fees that 'should' pay for themselves eventually. Plus advances in solar panels and wind turbines continue to make the tech cheaper, and more efficient, while also making them look better. Bladeless wind turbines and solar panels that look like shingles. Things are looking pretty good so far.