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  #21  
Old Posted Sep 30, 2007, 1:24 AM
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NEWS RELEASE

For Immediate Release

2007OTP0142-001210

Sept. 28, 2007
Office of the Premier





PROVINCE PROVIDES $50 MILLION TO EXPAND GREEN TRANSIT







VANCOUVER – The Province will provide an additional $50 million this year for BC Transit to purchase new, clean buses and expand public transit service across B.C., Premier Gordon Campbell announced today at the Union of BC Municipalities convention.



“In the coming weeks, we will lay out our vision for transit,” said Campbell. “It will be on a scale and scope aimed at making our province a global leader in public transit. Today I can tell you we will also act to help communities across B.C. upgrade their bus fleets.”



Campbell confirmed that the Province will ensure the Evergreen Line is built as soon possible, connecting neighbourhoods in Coquitlam, Port Moody and Burnaby with SkyTrain.



“Today, the percentage of transit ridership in the Metro Vancouver region is about 12 per cent. The leading cities of the world, be they London, Paris or Hong Kong, see ridership in the 20 to 25 per cent range,” said Campbell.



Campbell said the Province will proceed with the Gateway Program, including the twinning of the Port Mann Bridge, which will re-establish rapid bus service transit across the span for the first time in 20 years. Up to 2,700 transit passengers per hour will benefit. For the first time ever, it will create a safe, new cycling network across the Fraser River from Langley to Vancouver.




“That project will relieve congestion, reduce emissions from idling, lower travel costs and strengthen our goods movement capabilities,” said Campbell.



The Gateway Program includes the twinning of the Port Mann Bridge, North and South Fraser Perimeter Roads and a new Pitt River Bridge and Mary Hill Interchange.
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  #22  
Old Posted Sep 30, 2007, 5:29 AM
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  #23  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2007, 3:43 AM
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Provincial politicians studiously avoid tolling issues

By Jeff Nagel
Black Press

Sep 30 2007

Lost amid Thursday’s war of words between NDP leader Carole James and Transportation Minister Kevin Falcon over the Gateway program was any mention of expanded tolling to fund transit.

The two politicians studiously avoided raising the topic and tip-toed carefully when questioned Thursday.

Both essentially say a move to broader tolling of the region — an option overwhelmingly favoured by transportation experts — isn’t viable here until transit improves and offers a viable alternative.

“We don’t have those alternatives — you would be punishing people without giving them an alternative,” Falcon said.

“We’re not opposed to tolls,” James added. “But when you don’t have an opportunity to take a bus or a SkyTrain, it’s not practical.”

So don’t expect any quick changes to B.C.’s tolling policy, which decrees that new tolls only go on significant upgraded bridges or routes — and only when there’s an untolled alternative.

It means the Lower Mainland can expect to see tolls roll out gradually one bridge at a time rather than a more broadly-based congestion solution.


TransLink director and Vancouver Councillor Suzanne Anton said that’s unfortunate.

“It’s kind of a chicken or the egg,” she said. “If you put in wider tolling, you’d get good transit lickety split.”

Besides the potential to fund major transit upgrades, variable tolls allow lower rates or free use at off-peak times or for high-occupant vehicles, encouraging more efficient use of roads and bridges.

“We should have minor tolling in many places,” Anton said, adding that would be more palatable and fair across the region than the higher tolls of $3 or more expected for the Golden Ears and Port Mann bridges.

James made exactly one mention of tolls on the Port Mann Bridge in her speech to UBCM delegates: “It will be more expensive to take transit across the Fraser than to drive your car and pay the toll.”

Asked later by Black Press whether that meant she’d set a higher toll for the twinned bridge, she said no.

“I’m saying you could reduce the cost of transit,” she said.

James went on to say the Liberals climate change plan would be judged by history as “empty rhetoric” if they persist with bridge expansion ahead of much expanded transit.

- Falcon ruled out rumours that the Evergreen Line will be rerouted to a southern route along the Lougheed Highway to Coquitlam rather than north from the Millennium Line through Port Moody.

- Asked about a possible Fraser Highway extension of SkyTrain through Surrey toward Langley, Falcon said it was his “personal vision and not a government policy.”

- While conceding “a bridge will need to be built across the river” James said it’s not yet clear whether than should be a twinned Port Mann, twinned Pattullo or another route.

- James also vowed to fight legislation the government intends to pass to restructure TransLink.
     
     
  #24  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2007, 4:05 AM
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Falcon ruled out rumours that the Evergreen Line will be rerouted to a southern route along the Lougheed Highway to Coquitlam rather than north from the Millennium Line through Port Moody.
well I can only see two things in that point:

(A)We are still keeping same route with LRT or SkyTrain.
(B)We will have a southern SkyTrain route that is not called the Evergreen Line.

I hope its option B.

Quote:
Asked about a possible Fraser Highway extension of SkyTrain through Surrey toward Langley, Falcon said it was his “personal vision and not a government policy.”
I don't really sponsor extending it on hte Fraser Highway... very few stations in between... waste of money. Extending it south will be much better alternative... and have BRT to Langley instead.

Tolling will happen for sure. But then I don't think a bridge should be tolled unless there is rapid transit close by. Right now, South of Fraser is underserved by transit. Until there are enough buses and more rapid transit extnesions/new routes... there shouldn't be any tolls.
     
     
  #25  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2007, 6:06 AM
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Biting the bullet and tolling most of our crossings is a necessary evil, IMO. I would gladly spend a few years of paying tolls if it means rapid transit everywhere and sooner. With our current govt and trends, theres no way we could ever see the large amount of transit expansion that we could with immediate region-wide tolling.

I for one am getting tired of campbell and falcon. Commitment to the environment? Please... Gateway, 200 busses, the hydrogen highway and more Evergreen rumors. Can we please hear some solid major announcements that will actually "bring us to London ridership levels" or is this just more hot air? I really hope the soon to come announcement justifies all of this hype.
     
     
  #26  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2007, 7:41 AM
The_Henry_Man The_Henry_Man is offline
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the proposed Cape Horn interchange is massive, it will rival some of Canada's largest. this is a mini 401.

- http://www.eao.gov.bc.ca/epic/output...d70a214df5.pdf

the proposed grandview - willingdon section is badly needed.

- http://www.eao.gov.bc.ca/epic/output...d70a214df5.pdf

I really hope the major interchanges in the Gateway Project will have the collector system commonly found in Toronto's highways. This way it wouldn't affect the thru-traffic as much. Looks like the Willingdon one will have it, but not the Cape Horn one.
     
     
  #27  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2007, 4:16 AM
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Campbell's vision collides with Falcon's freeway plans

Ian Bruce, Special to the Sun
Published: Thursday, October 04, 2007

Premier Gordon Campbell's bold move to legislate British Columbia's greenhouse-gas targets is a solid step in reducing our contribution to global warming.

His leadership stands in sharp contrast to Prime Minister Stephen Harper's endorsement of President George W. Bush's meaningless "aspirational" and voluntary emissions target approach. However, Campbell's goals could be derailed by his transportation minister.

TransLink estimates that to achieve the premier's emissions target, the percentage of trips now made by transit would have to grow from 11.5 per cent today to 25 to 30 per cent by 2020, at least doubling transit service in Metro Vancouver.

Transportation Minister Kevin Falcon's plans to expand freeways preceded the premier's new vision, and are based primarily on moving people in cars. The two plans are inconsistent and are on a collision course.

We know that people will get out of their cars when good alternatives are made available: In 1997, 34 per cent of UBC students drove to campus, while only 18 per cent took transit. By 2005, after the introduction of the B-Line and the U-Pass for students, almost 42 per cent of students took transit, while fewer than 20 per cent drove.

Unfortunately, plans to build more freeways, including twinning the Port Mann Bridge, are inconsistent with plans to reduce greenhouse-gas emissions.

The focus on expanding highways throughout Metro Vancouver will lock our communities into a car-dependent design, encouraging more vehicles and congestion, and increasing commuting distances. The B.C. government's own reports show carbon emissions will rise, not fall, because of the project.

Spending more on roads will actually discourage people from using transit: A recent TransLink report concluded that the Highway 1/Port Mann project would lead to ridership declines on the Expo SkyTrain line of up to 500 trips during the morning rush hour, and as much as five per cent in total on the Millennium Line.

Then there's the Falcon-appointed TransLink governance review panel, which completed the current proposal for transportation funding several weeks before the premier's announcement of new climate-change policies.

Falcon's panel proposed a funding structure based on the assumption that fuel-tax revenues will grow at one per cent per year -- the current rate of current fuel (gas and diesel) consumption. In fact, if the B.C. government plans to achieve the premier's carbon-emissions target, transportation fuel consumption in B.C. will need to decrease by a third by 2020. Instead of moving us to the forefront of the low-carbon economy, the outdated approach of Falcon's panel will result in an increase in harmful emissions and a significant decrease in TransLink's transit funding.

The contradiction between Falcon's proposals and the goals set out by the premier are clear.

Falcon's plans are out of date, but the premier's truly impressive vision is weakened by Falcon's short-sighted strategy. We can only hope that the premier's announcement Friday to unveil within weeks a plan to make "B.C. a global leader in public transit" will be a signal for Falcon to overhaul his transportation plans for the 21st century.

Campbell has a huge opportunity to steer B.C. in a new direction. To accomplish this, we suggest that he:

- Provide long-term funding for affordable, clean, and efficient public transportation system by annually allocating a fixed portion of B.C.'s transportation budget to transit and biking and walking infrastructure. This can be achieved by re-allocating spending from urban highways to transit.

- Contribute a substantial portion of provincial gas-tax revenue to transit. It's only fair that those who are creating the problem by burning fossil fuels help pay for the solution.

- Support the regional government and provide TransLink with the legal tools to use regional tolling to ease congestion and pay for transit and maintenance. It's only fair that road users pay user fees the same as transit riders.

- Facilitate better land-use planning to concentrate jobs in areas well-served by transit.

Ian Bruce is a climate change specialist with the David Suzuki Foundation in Vancouver.


© The Vancouver Sun 2007
     
     
  #28  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2007, 5:13 AM
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^ CABINET SHUFFLE!!

Reassign Falcon to sweeping the Legislature floors.
     
     
  #29  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2007, 5:15 AM
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^HAHA I would love to see that happen!
     
     
  #30  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2007, 5:19 AM
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^ CABINET SHUFFLE!!

Reassign Falcon to sweeping the Legislature floors.
I was thinking of bus driver.
     
     
  #31  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2007, 7:25 PM
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Watts: We need Rapid Bus now
Waiting for Gateway is too long

Frank Luba, The Province
Published: Thursday, October 04, 2007

Rapid Bus, a form of rapid transit new to the region, isn't arriving soon enough for Surrey Mayor Dianne Watts.

Premier Gordon Campbell made a passing reference in his speech to the Union of B.C. Municipalities last week about nearly a quarter of a billion dollars for public transit as part of the controversial Gateway Program.

Campbell was talking about $50 million for cycling expansion and about $200 million for Rapid Bus.

But Rapid Bus won't be up and running until Gateway is finished in 2013. Further details are to come.

Watts said waiting until then is "totally unacceptable."

"The demand is here and now," she said. "We don't have the buses or the capacity which we can currently absorb."

Transportation Minister Kevin Falcon said that Rapid Bus "virtually replicates a rapid-transit system in that it moves you quickly enough that you actually get almost the same benefit as from a rapid-transit system."

The buses would presumably use the high-occupancy-vehicle lanes being built as part of Gateway's expansion of the Trans-Canada Highway from Langley to Vancouver.

NDP transportation critic Maurine Karagianis reserved her final judgment on the plan until the details are released.

But problems will arise if Rapid Bus is grafted on to HOV lanes, she said.

"As long as you have transit intermingling with other forms of transportation, you do degrade the underlying express plan [of moving transit faster]," said Karagianis.

She remains critical of Gateway.

"The fact the government is now being forced to add this on as an addendum to the Gateway expansion . . . is because of the public pressure on this," Karagianis said.

fluba@png.canwest.com


© The Vancouver Province 2007
     
     
  #32  
Old Posted Oct 5, 2007, 7:55 PM
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B.C., TransLink plan rapid bus service for Port Mann Bridge

Vancouver Sun

Published: Friday, October 05, 2007

VANCOUVER - An agreement signed today between the province of British Columbia and TransLink will ensure rapid bus service across the Port Mann Bridge, benefiting 21,600 commuters daily, according to a news release.

The Memorandum of Understanding, signed by Premier Gordon Campbell and TransLink chair Malcolm Brodie, outlines the terms for the $180-million cost-sharing project, which is part of a broader vision for rapid transit throughout Greater Vancouver. It will provide fast, frequent bus service between Burnaby, Coquitlam, Surrey and Langley, with connecting buses to Abbotsford and communities north of the Fraser River via the new Golden Ears Bridge.

"Providing rapid bus service across the Port Mann Bridge for the first time means that commuters can travel all the way from Langley to Coquitlam or Burnaby in less than 25 minutes," said Campbell. "An effective, efficient transit system is vital to ensure we are able to develop sustainable communities. This agreement is another step towards providing people with an option to get out of their vehicles and to get to and from work quickly, with a reduced impact on the environment."

The new, eight-lane Port Mann Bridge will restore transit service across the bridge, as well as expand networks for high-occupancy vehicles (HOV), cyclists and pedestrians, for the first time ever. The express bus service will be connected directly to HOV lanes and will not mix with general traffic, so travel time for the full trip between Langley and Burnaby will be less than 25 minutes - as fast, or faster, than by car.

"Bringing transit back to Highway 1 after 20 years will be a significant improvement to our rapid transit network, providing quality service that will give thousands of people an effective and efficient public transit option for their commute," said Brodie. "An express bus service will establish transit's presence along this corridor, which leaves the way open for future rail options depending on growth and development in the south-of-Fraser region."

Government is contributing $150 million, and TransLink is contributing $30 million for buses and facilities needed for the project, which will include:

- Initially, 20 buses, providing 10- to 15-minute frequency during rush hours (increasing over time as ridership increases).

- A transit-only priority two-way access ramp to/from the median HOV lanes via Government Street, for access to Lougheed Town Centre Station in Burnaby.

- Median on/off ramps for HOV and buses at the 156th Street interchange in Surrey.

- A transit loop either within or in the vicinity of the 156th Street interchange in Surrey.

- Median on/off ramps for HOVs and express buses in the vicinity of 200th Street to 204th Street in Langley.

- A transit loop in the vicinity of the 200th Street interchange in Langley.

- A minimum of 1,000 park-and-ride spaces south of the Fraser River.

Rapid bus service over the new Port Mann Bridge is an important part of the Province's plan to reduce greenhouse gas emissions by 33 per cent by 2020, to 10 per cent below 1990 levels.

The new express bus service will be an integrated component of the overall transportation network, with connections to SkyTrain, West Coast Express, other bus routes via transit hubs and loops, and new park-and-ride facilities.

Last week, Premier Campbell announced $50 million this year to purchase new, clean buses and expand public transit service across the province.

Last edited by Stingray2004; Oct 5, 2007 at 8:10 PM.
     
     
  #33  
Old Posted Oct 6, 2007, 4:44 AM
twoNeurons twoNeurons is offline
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I'm so sick of them using the whole "first time transit will cross the Port Mann bridge" line. It's such an obvious tactic to elicit public favor.

It's not that it's not a good idea, but a bus across the fraser won't cure the transit woes. Not by a long shot.

Surely Electric transportation would do a WHOLE lot more for reducing the province's greenhouse gas emissions. It would also be more attractive to commuters (why would people take a bus from Guildford Mall to Lougheed Mall?)

It connects them better with Coquitlam, perhaps, but it still is a roundabout way to get to Coquitlam Centre. Seriously, Surrey Central Skytrain station isn't much better than this. 5 minutes by bus to the station and 20-25 minutes to braid station.

This will be a bus that goes from Guidford to Lougheed, where the commuter will have to get on either a skytrain to Braid and catch a bus or a supposed evergreen line.

If the Southern Route is chosen, this bus makes even LESS sense... as you would have to go back on yourself.

I appreciate that they're doing something, but really, they're merely throwing a bone here.

I'll reserve judgement until I see the planned route and details... but it seems to me that there wouldn't be a HUGE demand for a bus on a route that parallels a recently expanded highway.

The only possible thing that would widely swing in favor of the bus is that there will be a possible $3 toll to contend with.
     
     
  #34  
Old Posted Oct 6, 2007, 8:11 PM
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Port Mann twinning will only likely lead to tripling it later

Pete McMartin, Vancouver Sun
Published: Saturday, October 06, 2007


At Premier Gordon Campbell's press conference Friday -- and it was all his, despite double-billing with Transportation Minister Kevin Falcon -- almost all the mayors and MLAs of the south Fraser and northeast suburbs were arrayed below him in a row of chairs, like satraps at the feet of the Great King. I believe some of them genuflected when the premier entered.

Curiously, Vancouver Mayor Sam Sullivan was not there, even though the event was staged in the Pan Pacific Hotel, on Sam's home turf, and which, as is the mewling custom nowadays, the premier alluded to being on traditional Squamish tribal lands. I thank them for being allowed to trespass.

The premier had come to announce express bus lanes for the new twinned bridge to the Port Mann -- a bridge, the premier boomed, "that will be built!" just in case anyone was getting the idea the government was having second thoughts. It is not.

You will have read elsewhere in the paper about the details of the plan -- express buses as far as Langley, 20 buses in rush hour running across the new bridge at 10 to 15 minute intervals -- and you will have read in Vaughn Palmer's column the political coup de grace Campbell has delivered against the hapless NDP leader Carole James, whose opposition to the twinned bridge has won her the respect of David Suzuki, but not the majority of voters in Surrey, Langley, Coquitlam, Port Moody, Burnaby and Abbotsford.

The premier's glee at this was brought into sharp focus when a television guy lobbed him a soft one, and asked him if he would like to have this an election issue.

"We'll be GLAD to have this as an election issue!" Campbell beamed. The Great King is wise and crafty. The NDP are dead.

So, too, are the naysayers who would oppose the twinned bridge on environmental grounds. Or, at least, the sting of their complaints has been nullified, because this bridge covers both sides of the street. While the premier gives car commuters another bridge to get across, he salves their collective conscience by offering a transit alternative on the same bridge.

Hey, all you eco-freaks! Quit your complaining! You got your freakin' transit! Now shut up. Buses are the Hail Marys that will atone for the sins of all that car traffic.

None of this, however, makes those opponents any more wrong for their opposition. The twinned bridge and the huge investment in road infrastructure that goes with it only proliferates the car culture it is there to serve. The bridge and the Gateway project are the status quo, and then some.

The premier, however, painted it as an eco-initiative, saying the buses will remove 15,000 tons of greenhouse gases annually. But will it affect the number of vehicles on the road?

There are 127,000 vehicles crossing the Port Mann a day now, with predictions of 164,000 by 2017. The same number of cars is predicted to be using both bridges by 2017.


And studies have shown that new freeways soon find their maximum capacity. They encourage motorists to make more trips, not fewer. There will undoubtedly be a period of grace when the new bridge opens and traffic congestion will momentarily lessen.

But I predict that will end within two or three years. It will be business as usual, except with two traffic jams backing up over the Fraser, not one.

Add to that the fact that car ownership per family is increasing, the number of car trips is increasing, the number of cars on the road is increasing and the percentage of single-occupancy trips is increasing, and you have trouble. Also, transit ridership is almost stagnant. And as we grow older -- as we are as a society -- studies show we take less transit and drive more.

But there is also this:

The Gateway project and the twinning of the Port Mann are primarily about moving goods, not people. As Campbell and Falcon kept on reiterating, they want Vancouver to be the gateway to the Pacific, so we can maintain the affluence to which we have become accustomed, and continue to revel in "the freedoms we enjoy." (Cheap, slave-labour goods from China will keep us free!)

Why do we need this massive road infrastructure? Because we need a bigger gate. We must accommodate the huge increase the government wants to see in our ports -- to a factor of five, I believe it is, at least in the increase of container cargo. What's going to carry them here? Freighters, one of the single biggest sources of greenhouse gases in the Lower Mainland.

And what's going to transport those containers on those roads once they are unloaded? Trucks. Lots and lots of them. Enough, I bet, to neutralize the 15,000 tons in greenhouse gases Campbell boasts of saving. That's progress, but of an obsolescent kind.

And 20 years down the road after we've cut the ribbon on the twinned bridge? Triplets!

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© The Vancouver Sun 2007
     
     
  #35  
Old Posted Oct 7, 2007, 11:21 PM
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what he fails to bring up is even though not announced i am sure within that time period there will be LRT

not to mention the new Pitt river bridge and Golden Ears bridge will alleviate traffic

as well as much improved roads within surrey itself

there are a lot of people who commute from langely to surrey only and its a disaster in rush hour - much worse than Vancouver - most of surrey has dinky little roads - it lacks the great roadways that vancouver has

but it is getting better with a lot of former one lane roads being doubled and more routes being laid out

Surrey will become a vibrant city with the central surrey home to a robson street like shopping area and offices etc. so people will not need to leave that side of the river - finally
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  #36  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2007, 5:12 PM
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Just got an email stating the South of Fraser transit plan Information Sessions:
Dates are as follows:
  • Delta
    • Nov. 6 - Ladner Leisure Centre, 4600 Clarence Taylor Way 2PM - 8PM\
    • Nov 8 - London Drugs - Trenant PArk Square : 10am-6PM
    • Nov 9 - ScottsDale Mall - 7031 120th St. 9:30am - 9PM
    • Nov 14 - Sun God - 7815 112 st : 2pm - 8 pm
  • Langley
    • Nov 3 - Willowbrook Mall : 9:30am - 6pm
    • Nov 5 - Aldergrove Kinsman Community Centre 26770 29th Ave : 2pm - 8pm
    • Nov 19 - Langley City Hall Public Library : 20399 Douglas Cres. : 9am - 8pm
    • Nov 22 - Walnut Grove Rec Centre - 8889 Walnut Grove Dr. : 2pm - 8pm
  • Surrey
    • Nov 7 - Central City SFU Mezzanine : 12pm - 9pm
    • Nov 10 - Guildford Mall : 9am - 6pm
    • Nov 13 - Newton Wave Pool : 2pm - 8pm
    • Nov 15 - Fleetwood Community Centre : 9am - 8pm
    • Nov 28 - Cloverdale Kwantlen Univ. College : 12pm - 9pm
     
     
  #37  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2007, 7:41 PM
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What these nay-sayers tend to ignore is the fact that the current "freeway" is merely a 4 lane rural highway with inadequate interchanges (on/off ramps) east of the Port Mann; and a mere 6 lane (2 of which are already HOV) with in adequate and dated interchanges (on/off ramps) west of the Port Mann. These interchanges in particular contribute greatly to the congestion on the highway as there isnt adequate room for traffic to merge or exit. They were designed when the region supported a much smaller population and severly need upgrading.

The myth that expanding the "freeway" will only encourage more growth on the south side of the Fraser is completely ubsurd. This growth is going to happen regardless. People will continue to migrate to this region whether or not the "freeway" is widened or not. The cost and availability of land on the south side of the Fraser will be more of an influencing factor on development patterns than a measly additional 1 lane in each direction added to highway 1.

Suppose Highway 1 was left as is - and that money was invested into more transit service.

Growth in Surrey & Langley continues too boom. Congestion only worsens on the approach to the Port Mann.

There are still only 2 lanes leading into Vancouver from the Fraser Valley and rest of Canada - TWO. This is less than almost any arterial road in the City of Vancouver. Hardly a "Freeway".

Traffic is backed up all the way to Abbotsford, attempting to merge at interchanges along the route via inadequate on-ramps designed for rural traffic flow. The situtation is a complete mess.

Population growth continues at a rapid pace only worsening the situation.

People are forced to take transit? I highly doubt it. People generally do not like transit. Transit is a horrible experience in most cases. It would take decades to densify south of the Fraser to warrent more rapid transit service. In that time you expect people to take the bus? Let's be honest here, nobody wants to do that.

Overly quoted studies that suggest widening freeways does nothing to improve congestion are correct in most cases. They are also usually based on projects in which an existing freeway (already at 6, 8 even more lanes) is being widened to 10, 12, 14 maybe more. In those cases, widening the freeway beyond 8 lanes is pretty much pointless. That additional capacity will be just as congested within years. The thing to note here is that an actual, adequate, urban-standard freeway, is already in place in most if not all of these studies. Metro Vancouver does not have an adequate, urban-standard freeway to begin with (unless you count the stretch of highway 1 from Coquitlam to the Vancouver-Burnaby border with its 2 multi-purpose lanes in each direction.

Widening Highway 1 to 8 lanes west of the Port Mann and 6 lanes east of the Port Mann is hardly an aggressive freeway expansion program that will jepordize the regions liveability, cause more pollution, sprawl...etc etc. It is simply bringing us up to a basic basic basic standard of what an urban freeway should be to facilitate traffic and goods flow.
     
     
  #38  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2007, 9:06 PM
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Originally Posted by westcoast604 View Post
What these nay-sayers tend to ignore is the fact that the current "freeway" is merely a 4 lane rural highway with inadequate interchanges (on/off ramps) east of the Port Mann; and a mere 6 lane (2 of which are already HOV) with in adequate and dated interchanges (on/off ramps) west of the Port Mann. These interchanges in particular contribute greatly to the congestion on the highway as there isnt adequate room for traffic to merge or exit. They were designed when the region supported a much smaller population and severly need upgrading.

The myth that expanding the "freeway" will only encourage more growth on the south side of the Fraser is completely ubsurd. This growth is going to happen regardless. People will continue to migrate to this region whether or not the "freeway" is widened or not. The cost and availability of land on the south side of the Fraser will be more of an influencing factor on development patterns than a measly additional 1 lane in each direction added to highway 1.

Suppose Highway 1 was left as is - and that money was invested into more transit service.

Growth in Surrey & Langley continues too boom. Congestion only worsens on the approach to the Port Mann.

There are still only 2 lanes leading into Vancouver from the Fraser Valley and rest of Canada - TWO. This is less than almost any arterial road in the City of Vancouver. Hardly a "Freeway".

Traffic is backed up all the way to Abbotsford, attempting to merge at interchanges along the route via inadequate on-ramps designed for rural traffic flow. The situtation is a complete mess.

Population growth continues at a rapid pace only worsening the situation.

People are forced to take transit? I highly doubt it. People generally do not like transit. Transit is a horrible experience in most cases. It would take decades to densify south of the Fraser to warrent more rapid transit service. In that time you expect people to take the bus? Let's be honest here, nobody wants to do that.

Overly quoted studies that suggest widening freeways does nothing to improve congestion are correct in most cases. They are also usually based on projects in which an existing freeway (already at 6, 8 even more lanes) is being widened to 10, 12, 14 maybe more. In those cases, widening the freeway beyond 8 lanes is pretty much pointless. That additional capacity will be just as congested within years. The thing to note here is that an actual, adequate, urban-standard freeway, is already in place in most if not all of these studies. Metro Vancouver does not have an adequate, urban-standard freeway to begin with (unless you count the stretch of highway 1 from Coquitlam to the Vancouver-Burnaby border with its 2 multi-purpose lanes in each direction.

Widening Highway 1 to 8 lanes west of the Port Mann and 6 lanes east of the Port Mann is hardly an aggressive freeway expansion program that will jepordize the regions liveability, cause more pollution, sprawl...etc etc. It is simply bringing us up to a basic basic basic standard of what an urban freeway should be to facilitate traffic and goods flow.
What do you define as urban-standard freeway?

You are correct in that most studies analyzing the effect of latent demand in traffic have focused largely on the widest, most heavily used US freeways, but the phenomenon generally occurs on smaller highways and arterials as well. But there is no standard for capacity or number of lanes to which the GVRD (Metro Vancouver) should seek because even the best transportation planners are well aware that the system will again become congested in a short period of time.
     
     
  #39  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2007, 9:52 PM
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westcoast604 westcoast604 is offline
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^I would suggest a consistant 6-lane freeway as an urban standard. That is hardly a wide highway and likely smaller than you would find in any other major city our size. I'm not discounting the fact that even when smaller highways/arterials are widened, congestion will return. I think that is a given. I believe even when traffic volumes reach capicty again on the widened highway it will will be an improvement from what we have now, as there will be improved on-ramps from 152nd street, longer off ramps, an additional lane for merging traffic which will allow for more free flowing traffic on the inner lanes than what we currently have.
Highway 1 is 4 lanes east of the Port Mann. To bring it up to 6 lanes, the Port Mann needs to be twinned, because there is simply no room to add a 6th lane to the bridge.

Last edited by westcoast604; Oct 31, 2007 at 10:08 PM.
     
     
  #40  
Old Posted Oct 31, 2007, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westcoast604 View Post
What these nay-sayers tend to ignore is the fact that the current "freeway" is merely a 4 lane rural highway with inadequate interchanges (on/off ramps) east of the Port Mann; and a mere 6 lane (2 of which are already HOV) with in adequate and dated interchanges (on/off ramps) west of the Port Mann. These interchanges in particular contribute greatly to the congestion on the highway as there isnt adequate room for traffic to merge or exit. They were designed when the region supported a much smaller population and severly need upgrading.

The myth that expanding the "freeway" will only encourage more growth on the south side of the Fraser is completely ubsurd. This growth is going to happen regardless. People will continue to migrate to this region whether or not the "freeway" is widened or not. The cost and availability of land on the south side of the Fraser will be more of an influencing factor on development patterns than a measly additional 1 lane in each direction added to highway 1.

Suppose Highway 1 was left as is - and that money was invested into more transit service.

Growth in Surrey & Langley continues too boom. Congestion only worsens on the approach to the Port Mann.

There are still only 2 lanes leading into Vancouver from the Fraser Valley and rest of Canada - TWO. This is less than almost any arterial road in the City of Vancouver. Hardly a "Freeway".

Traffic is backed up all the way to Abbotsford, attempting to merge at interchanges along the route via inadequate on-ramps designed for rural traffic flow. The situtation is a complete mess.

Population growth continues at a rapid pace only worsening the situation.

People are forced to take transit? I highly doubt it. People generally do not like transit. Transit is a horrible experience in most cases. It would take decades to densify south of the Fraser to warrent more rapid transit service. In that time you expect people to take the bus? Let's be honest here, nobody wants to do that.

Overly quoted studies that suggest widening freeways does nothing to improve congestion are correct in most cases. They are also usually based on projects in which an existing freeway (already at 6, 8 even more lanes) is being widened to 10, 12, 14 maybe more. In those cases, widening the freeway beyond 8 lanes is pretty much pointless. That additional capacity will be just as congested within years. The thing to note here is that an actual, adequate, urban-standard freeway, is already in place in most if not all of these studies. Metro Vancouver does not have an adequate, urban-standard freeway to begin with (unless you count the stretch of highway 1 from Coquitlam to the Vancouver-Burnaby border with its 2 multi-purpose lanes in each direction.

Widening Highway 1 to 8 lanes west of the Port Mann and 6 lanes east of the Port Mann is hardly an aggressive freeway expansion program that will jepordize the regions liveability, cause more pollution, sprawl...etc etc. It is simply bringing us up to a basic basic basic standard of what an urban freeway should be to facilitate traffic and goods flow.
I agree with everything that was said here. What people tend to forget in GVRD is how bad our road infrastructure is to begin with (especially off and on ramp infrastructure, some of which is bordering on negligent). I am sorry people we cannot go into the future with bike paths and busses/trams despite what Bus Riders Union and other extreme left wingers say. That is not to say that I don’t support all forms of transportation - they all have their place. But realisticly our roadways are so far behind that it is emberasing to ride on them. Gateway+UBC Extension+Evergreen(Skytrain)+commuter rail to Valley is a good first step...
     
     
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