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  #81  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2009, 8:51 PM
ravman ravman is offline
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Originally Posted by deasine View Post
I can't see how you can blame the BC Liberals for all of this. This mess can't just be blamed in any way by the Liberals. Whoever should be blamed is the person who cause the fire.
I forgot to mention that homelessness has increased and David Chudnovsky, the Homelessness critic has been working on a movie "finding our way home" to highlight the problem of the homeless. I heard on the news that that area was used by the homeless and if they were living in a home, maybe the "Little P" (the Big P is the Port mann) would be open today!

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Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
I like your spirit Ravman, if the NDP supported gateway then i would vote for them, but sadly they seem to have no foresight in road expansion/maintenance. It seems all transit or nothing, while i am more of a 50/50 person. I want to see the skytrain to Coquitlam and UBC ASAP along with many new buses, but i also want the #1 to become safer with better designed interchanges, longer merge lanes and a new Port Mann bridge that will no longer be a choke point. (seeing how it is the heart of the entire road system and our main roadway bridge connecting us to the rest of Canada) I also want to see the SFPR road built, along with major highway improvements in the interior, such as what is being done between Golden and the Alberta border. I feel with the NDP back this next term all this will be cancelled, and all the money spent on designing, pre-loading and studying will be thrown out the window and our roads again will be inadequate and left to decay. I also feel they are simply taking a stance against gateway just to buy votes from those who oppose it.
hold on there! the NDP is not opposed to the entire Gateway! The problem is that we have Gordo playing political games here... you take everything and put in to one big title. i mean the NDP is not against the new Pitt River Bridge and the prov govt introduced Gateway before they introduced their "transportation plan". That is where the problem lies, the govt is spending massive amounts of money on road building and ignoring transit and then a couple years later... here is our transportation plan that wont be dont for the next 20 years. The NDP did build the HOV lanes and fix up the Coquitlam interchange ( there used to be a mess on Lougheed Highway leading towards highway 1 and they redid the entire thing. i mean adding an HOV lane or an Commerical vehicle lane is one thing, but twinning the Port Mann is simply not needed. (the toll and the p3 are a totally different issue). IF the Twin Port Mann were to be built today, we would only have 2 "free" alternatives to cross the fraser as the Little P is burnt out. Gordo takes some good things and some bad things and lumps it all into one and says you are either with us or against us in a hardball tactics. The bottom line, the NDP is in favour of some portions of Gateway and against others!


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Originally Posted by SpongeG View Post
the late news said that skytrain was going to start running at 4:20 am from surrey dyring the bridge down time

thats what an hour early?

maybe they should start it as a normal thing
what about maintainance and yeah a good thing!

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Originally Posted by Hong Kongese View Post
The only chance I would vote for NDP is when Ravman would run for the NDP in Surrey.

Seriously, I don't think the NDP really that much against the SFPR project, am I right, Ravman?
"The South Fraser Perimeter Road will pave 260 acres of prime ALR farmland and further compromise the integrity of Burns Bog and thus "reduce biodiversity of highly productive delta lands and foreshore, and jeopardize habitat for millions of migratory wildfowl and destroy shallows at the mouth of the Fraser River essential to migrating salmon".

I think that is the major issue is the destruction of the ALR
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  #82  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2009, 9:16 PM
twoNeurons twoNeurons is offline
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Building a two lane bridge of that scale at the time shows no sense of foresight.
It was 1937. IT was a huge feat at the time... and those two lanes were likely built to be expanded to 4 lanes. Cars travelled slower, it was built around the great depression, people didn't travel or commute like they do now. It would be hard to have that much foresight to see the changes that happened. Bridges before that time lasted a LOT longer before needing to be widened.

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Originally Posted by deasine View Post
Oh my we have to replace the wooden section? And we are building another one soon? =O
Ironically, it may save money. That section was due to be replaced soon to keep the bridge operational until the bridge's replacement. Without the need to throttle traffic and close lanes down during replacement of that section, work will likely proceed more quickly and more efficiently. That's my guess, anyhow.
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  #83  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2009, 9:17 PM
cornholio cornholio is offline
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the road capacity over the river needs to be atleast doubled, anyone who says otherwise is not living in reality.

if this lasts a month then the economic damage will be huge, though its not like we will ever see real numbers since its hard to measure...but it will be there.

and now just imagine a major accident on Port Man or Alex Fraser that would shut down a couple lanes during rush hour. if bin laden is watching then right now he can kick a western olympic city where it hurts. i mean just imagine if just one more bridge for what ever reason was shut down, this entire city and region would be the laughing stock of the entire world all the way until the olympics.(though even bad publicity is still publicity)
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  #84  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2009, 10:03 PM
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back than didn't they also have the train that linked the area with vancouver?

I know my friends grandma lived in new west and way back in the day going to vancouver was a very rare thing and it was like a day trip for them

now people go downtown for coffee

anyway - did anyone see the news at noon?

the Alex fraser back up went way into surrey - like scott road or something

it took one guy 30 minutes to travel 10 blocks and he was no where near the bridge

its gonna be a messy month or so
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  #85  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2009, 10:18 PM
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I heard on the radio this morning that 99 was backed up to King George? Is this true? If so, that is absolutely INSANE.
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  #86  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2009, 11:40 PM
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Port Mann live webcam, looking busy:

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  #87  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 12:00 AM
The_Henry_Man The_Henry_Man is offline
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I heard on the radio this morning that 99 was backed up to King George? Is this true? If so, that is absolutely INSANE.
Very soon, Metro Vancouver will be known by the Guiness Book of Records as the city of having the longest traffic backups in the world!!!
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  #88  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by mr.x2 View Post
Port Mann live webcam, looking busy:
Its all fogged now, can't really see anything.


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Originally Posted by The_Henry_Man View Post
Very soon, Metro Vancouver will be known by the Guiness Book of Records as the city of having the longest traffic backups in the world!!!
This is nothing. When I was in Taiwan about 15 years ago, during some holidays, the main freeway was backed up all the way from km 0 to the end at km 372.
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  #89  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 12:24 AM
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152nd was backed up to 96th this morning - normally it might get backed up to 108th sometimes 106th
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  #90  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 12:55 AM
deasine deasine is offline
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If another thread goes sidetracked because of politics, I will not only close down the thread but ban all of those blurbing out unnecessary political views. Whether you are a communist, a socialist, a capitalist, a liberal, I don't care, I don't want to hear anything from you. You may express your political opinions inside the Politics Subforum, but no where else. This is a warning for everyone, and I will not hesitate to ban anyone for once and for all.

Let's not ruin it for everyone.
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  #91  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 2:33 AM
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When I was in the army which seems like an eternity ago now, they had trucks that could make a bridge within hours. The bridges were floating so wouldn't be useful here as there is alot of boat traffic.
But we are only taking a span of 60ft and over land, you could demo that whole thing in a couple of days and then use two or three of these guys to fill the gap while you contruct a new span.



They are 26m in length and able to deploy in 8minutes and can withstand more weight then the current bridge could. Unfortunately they belong to Norway and we don't own any.
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  #92  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 2:37 AM
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^ your last sentence was such a huge downer. I was all la-dee-da on this thing actually existing, then it was like somebody took a shovel to my head.
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  #93  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 3:45 AM
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Originally Posted by jlousa View Post
But we are only taking a span of 60ft and over land, you could demo that whole thing in a couple of days and then use two or three of these guys to fill the gap while you contruct a new span.
You have a good point and I'd like to expand upon same. For instance, a one-lane Bailey Bridge is extant over the Nicomekl River along the King George Hwy in South Surrey. It's been there for an eternity and is around 60 ft. in length??

Even using a worst case scenario for having only one, one-lane Bailey Bridge covering the Pattullo gap, that would still allow for a reversible lane during rush hour taking some pressure off the rest of the system for that ~one month construction time-frame. Perhaps even two Bailey Bridges could be put into place.

Maybe the guys at Translink will eventually clue into same???

Typical Bailey Bridge: [which can be set-up very quickly]

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  #94  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:18 AM
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What about that bridge that they used on the Lions Gate Bridge?
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  #95  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:31 AM
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The pics in the paper seemed as if the span could be replaced with an earth-filled abuttment.

Install a concrete retaining wall (even those precast blocks) and back-fill and then pave over top - that would probably last the 10 years til the new bridge is built.

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  #96  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:34 AM
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Is the Pattulo bridge made out of wood? How could it have been set on fire? So are they going to plan to replace the bridge now?
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  #97  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Vancity View Post
Is the Pattulo bridge made out of wood? How could it have been set on fire? So are they going to plan to replace the bridge now?
the approach at the south end is made of wood, and that's what burned. the main span is made of steel.

there are plans to replace it, but you likely won't be driving accross a replacement for another decade or so.

-----------


WRT the Port Mann queue jumper:

I dont think the plan was to add an extra lane to the bridge, but rather an extra lane leading up to the bridge, so the buses could skip all the pre-bridge congestion, and then just merge into the regular traffic lanes when they hit the bridge.
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  #98  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:41 AM
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they found a homeless camp under that part and they suspect the homeless fire started it?

is that the story?
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  #99  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:48 AM
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Originally Posted by officedweller View Post
The pics in the paper seemed as if the span could be replaced with an earth-filled abutment.

Install a concrete retaining wall (even those precast blocks) and back-fill and then pave over top - that would probably last the 10 years til the new bridge is built.
As for a final fix, that sounds like a reasonable idea. One problem though... the wood frame section was originally built due to the soft soils at that point.

Longer term pre-loading might be required to provide for soil compaction. Otherwise the pavement might eventually dip quite severely.

But the final fix still does not address an interim solution during the construction period as discussed above.
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  #100  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2009, 4:53 AM
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the old bridge would continue to be used while the new one is built next to it
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