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  #101  
Old Posted Feb 26, 2017, 4:20 AM
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Originally Posted by logan5 View Post
Electric carts are perfect for Vancouver, but I think the lack of charging stations is what's holding them back, not the cars themselves. People living in the most urbanized areas of the city do not have a garage, so they have no where to charge their vehicle.

THe price of batteries are dropping fast and it won't be long til an E car is priced comparably to an ICE car. The change over is going to happen faster than people realize. Most likely my next car will be electric.
Very true, people again and again (continue to) underestimate technologies like EV's and PV Solar. The technology for boat is advancing at an astounding rate, something which might be more clear if we were having this discussion in Europe or East Asia.
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  #102  
Old Posted Feb 26, 2017, 4:40 PM
Kisai Kisai is offline
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Very true, people again and again (continue to) underestimate technologies like EV's and PV Solar. The technology for boat is advancing at an astounding rate, something which might be more clear if we were having this discussion in Europe or East Asia.
Unfortunately PV Solar is effectively useless in BC and mostly useless in the rest of Canada other than the southern prairies.
https://ecosmartsun.com/solar-map-ca...-carousel-1088

Could be worse. While most of BC is in the 1.2Kwh range, most of the US is in the 4K range except for California-Nevada-Arizona-Utah-Colorado which hits 7Kwh. So that just means you need a larger installation, and hence the ROI is negative for large installations. Smaller installations designed just to fuel EV cars along the highway with no other utility power are obviously a possibility regardless of the ROI.

The West coast is actually prime area for geothermal energy since this is where all the volcanic activity is. But you can't just plop one of those down anywhere, and many of the potential locations are also tourism areas with existing natural hotsprings.

Personally, I'd want a Tesla if I could get any EV car, but my needs don't even approach needing a car for anything right now. So I'm content to wait for better technology.
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  #103  
Old Posted Feb 26, 2017, 4:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Kisai View Post
Unfortunately PV Solar is effectively useless in BC and mostly useless in the rest of Canada other than the southern prairies.
https://ecosmartsun.com/solar-map-ca...-carousel-1088

Could be worse. While most of BC is in the 1.2Kwh range, most of the US is in the 4K range except for California-Nevada-Arizona-Utah-Colorado which hits 7Kwh. So that just means you need a larger installation, and hence the ROI is negative for large installations. Smaller installations designed just to fuel EV cars along the highway with no other utility power are obviously a possibility regardless of the ROI.

The West coast is actually prime area for geothermal energy since this is where all the volcanic activity is. But you can't just plop one of those down anywhere, and many of the potential locations are also tourism areas with existing natural hotsprings.

Personally, I'd want a Tesla if I could get any EV car, but my needs don't even approach needing a car for anything right now. So I'm content to wait for better technology.
Wasn't referring to Bc just the tech as a whole.
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  #104  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 2:08 AM
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So Tesla has delivered a record 25,000 cars this quarter and is now worth slightly more than Ford. I think it's starting to become pretty clear than the momentum behind EVs is not going to slow and we will be seeing a pretty major shift in the next few years. Along with the Bolt we are starting to see EVs enter the main stream in a big way.

Will be interesting to see how the transition continues in Met Van, I hope to see Public EV infrastructure expanded significantly. Some consistent large Ev charging stations along from Chillawack to Whistler seems like a good idea. Hopefully it's something we can see in the future.
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  #105  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 3:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Reecemartin View Post
So Tesla has delivered a record 25,000 cars this quarter and is now worth slightly more than Ford.
If Elon Musk has his way, by this time next year that 25,000 cars in a quarter is going to look pretty small compared to Model 3 production. But there are a lot of challenges still to be met before that happens, and even if it does it will still be pretty tiny beside Ford's actual production and revenues (not to mention the other auto makers). Tesla's share price is all about future potential.

Elon is a visionary, that's for sure. If his plans come to fruition he's going to go down in history as one of the great innovators, leaving people like Jobs and Gates in the dust, IMHO. I've heard him referred to as a "real life Tony Stark", and I can't think of anyone else who would better fit that description.
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  #106  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 5:08 AM
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I feel like condo building charging is going to be our biggest hurdle locally. Some building codes and builders are changing, but there are hundreds of thousands of residences where this will be somewhat of a barrier to EV ownership.
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  #107  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 12:06 PM
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I feel like condo building charging is going to be our biggest hurdle locally. Some building codes and builders are changing, but there are hundreds of thousands of residences where this will be somewhat of a barrier to EV ownership.
All the more reason public charging infrastructure could be a good idea.
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  #108  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 3:21 PM
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I feel like condo building charging is going to be our biggest hurdle locally. Some building codes and builders are changing, but there are hundreds of thousands of residences where this will be somewhat of a barrier to EV ownership.
Yeah, the existing condos are a problem. But at least for new buildings Vancouver is requiring actual charging receptacles at 20% of the parking spaces and (more importantly) electrical room space to accommodate the equipment that would be required to provide chargers for all parking spaces.
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  #109  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 3:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Reecemartin View Post
So Tesla has delivered a record 25,000 cars this quarter and is now worth slightly more than Ford.
I find that ridiculous considering Ford sold over 230,000 cars in just the US in March alone.
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  #110  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 3:45 PM
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I find that ridiculous considering Ford sold over 230,000 cars in just the US in March alone.
Tesla has very few liabilities compared to Ford, and nobody knows what kind of revenue they could achieve selling battery powered systems.

Their potential to replace grid power supplies for the sunnier parts of the world I think is worth more than their cars. They'll be selling solar roofs and battery systems as an integrated unit which will be immensely valuable for a lot of people.

In terms of scale, their battery plant under construction will likely be able to put out $30-60B worth of battery packs per year at current prices.
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  #111  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 3:50 PM
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Tesla has very few liabilities compared to Ford, and nobody knows what kind of revenue they could achieve selling battery powered systems.

Their potential to replace grid power supplies for the sunnier parts of the world I think is worth more than their cars. They'll be selling solar roofs and battery systems as an integrated unit which will be immensely valuable for a lot of people.

In terms of scale, their battery plant under construction will likely be able to put out $30-60B worth of battery packs per year at current prices.
Tesla is also massively in debt, misses virtually every single target, hasn't proven itself able to even build 100,000 vehicles in a year, does not have a worldwide dealer network, relies on still expensive technology in its infancy, has taken on massive liabilities and risks with regards to SolarCity....

Don't get me wrong, I like Tesla. I even reserved a Model 3 (although I'm thinking of cancelling). I just don't think it's worth what the market currently values it at.
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  #112  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 4:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Jebby View Post
Tesla is also massively in debt, misses virtually every single target, hasn't proven itself able to even build 100,000 vehicles in a year, does not have a worldwide dealer network, relies on still expensive technology in its infancy, has taken on massive liabilities and risks with regards to SolarCity....
The news release shows that they're on track to produce 100K S/X's this year. 25.4K cars built in the last quarter.

The liabilities they brought on with Solar City are mostly bonds tied to the lease of their solar systems If you want to count that as the bad variety of debt, then Ford has over $120B in debt tied to it's leased vehicles.

I'm also not sure how much of an asset I'd count dealers as. They eat into margin, they have control over the end user experience, and they don't necessarily drink the corporate cool-aid, especially if they sell multiple brands. Most people with Chevy Volts like I have, generally find that the dealers aren't that well prepared to deal with EVs, and don't like selling them as much as gas powered vehicles because they get less recurring cash flow in terms of maintenance.

I keep getting maintenance reminders for random engine related maintenance on my Volt, like oil changes or fuel injection cleaning. Literally the only thing that needs doing on a regular basis is tire rotations, and washer fluid refills. The oil needs changing once every couple years because a bit of moisture can accumulate. So far the car is amazing, but the dealer is annoying. Forums tell me this is pretty common.
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  #113  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 4:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Reecemartin View Post
All the more reason public charging infrastructure could be a good idea.
Even if I had public charging across the street from my condo, it would still be a huge PITA and wouldn't encourage me to convert to an EV. In fact it would do the opposite. Home charging is key.
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  #114  
Old Posted Apr 4, 2017, 4:55 PM
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The dealer network is such a huge liability. Along with Real Estate, it's still one of the government mandated middlemen... what a joke.
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  #115  
Old Posted Apr 5, 2017, 4:58 AM
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The dealer network is such a huge liability. Along with Real Estate, it's still one of the government mandated middlemen... what a joke.
I don't think it is government mandated. I think dealer exist for historical reasons.
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  #116  
Old Posted Apr 5, 2017, 5:21 AM
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I don't think it is government mandated. I think dealer exist for historical reasons.
I can't speak for Canada, but in the US state laws prohibit the big automakers from selling direct to customers. The dealer lobby raised a big fuss about Tesla, but they were exempt in most states because they have never had a dealer network. There are a few states that they can't sell in, though.
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  #117  
Old Posted Apr 5, 2017, 5:36 AM
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I don't think it is government mandated. I think dealer exist for historical reasons.
Selling direct to customers is illegal in many states.
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  #118  
Old Posted Apr 5, 2017, 6:27 AM
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Originally Posted by aberdeen5698 View Post
I can't speak for Canada, but in the US state laws prohibit the big automakers from selling direct to customers. The dealer lobby raised a big fuss about Tesla, but they were exempt in most states because they have never had a dealer network. There are a few states that they can't sell in, though.
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Selling direct to customers is illegal in many states.
we don't have that issue in Canada, that is an American thing. some like the US system, some don't, i don't know enough about it to say if it works or not.

but the biggest hurdle to electric cars are condo buildings. if you cant charge in your own spot, that is a a huge barrier for people getting them. even if they are on the street out front, a lot of people wouldn't want to bother with constantly moving a car, having it sit outside, etc.
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