Regional differences in urban form/typology

[Docere]

How does urban form/typology/development differ across Canada?

Interestingly what made me think of this question was noticing some similarities between Vancouver and Winnipeg. What the two have in common is they are the "old" Western cities which meant they really took off around the turn of the 20th century and don't have much of a 19th century element. Can't quite put my finger on it, but there's some similarities between the Exchange District and Gastown. Also River Heights and Tuxedo look rather similar to West Side Van neighborhoods like Point Grey, Dunbar and Kerrisdale. There's also a rather sharp geographic divide historically in those cities (east/west in Van, north/south in Winnipeg) and that was reflected in the strong class-based politics in the early 20th century. There was more of "a working class side of town" than there was in Toronto for example.

[hipster duck]

It varies by space (region) and time throughout Canada.

Within Ontario alone, I'd see prewar differences in the following places that can be loosely clumped together:

Inner city Toronto's tight semi-detached home districts. Some shades of inner city Toronto in Lower Hamilton, parts of Ottawa

Eastern Ontario - Kingston, Brockville, Port Hope, Cobourg, PEC, the towns along the Rideau canal and Lanark Counties.

The Grand and Speed River valley towns - Guelph, Elora, Fergus, Galt, Paris.

Windsor's Detroit influence.

Northern Ontario's frontier look

Franco-Ontario's (lower Ottawa river valley + Cornwall) Quebec influence

[niwell]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

It varies by space (region) and time throughout Canada.

Within Ontario alone, I'd see prewar differences in the following places that can be loosely clumped together:

Inner city Toronto's tight semi-detached home districts. Some shades of inner city Toronto in Lower Hamilton, parts of Ottawa

It's interesting that while parts of Hamilton share broad similarities with Old Toronto's built form it feels "airier" and noticeably less eclectic. More speculatively built homes resulting in uniform rows as reflective of big industry in the past. Ottawa does have that eclecticism in some old areas, but also proportionately more small apartment blocks.

Inner Toronto is pretty unique in the apparent SFH typology yet very tightly packed and often designed for multiple units. Most places of similar density had more apartment blocks and obvious row-housing. Lots of reasons for this which have been discussed on here before.

[SignalHillHiker]

The main differences I've noticed in my travels on the mainland have been:

- Other cities tend to have neutral colours for homes. There are some bright colours, especially in the Maritimes, but it's not the norm as it is here.
- We have very few brick homes compared to most other places. There are some here, brick or stone, but most have been commercial buildings for generations now and don't even read as homes to me anymore.
- We have one house that I've seen here clad with stucco and it feels like someone airlifted it here from mainland Canada every time I see it. In Winnipeg, almost every house was stucco. In my mind, it reads as the spray-on fire-retardant insulation. It all looks unfinished.
- There's a band of duplexes around the entire core that serves as bit of the missing middle for us. It's clear-cut, car-centric, and completely suburban with absolutely no other saving grace other than existing as a housing option for people.
- We have true exurbia, which is a negative and fortunately doesn't seem to exist in much of mainland Canada. Especially on the prairies, suburbs tend to lead directly into farmland. Here we have that typically American urban form with houses dotted everywhere well beyond suburban subdivisions.
- We don't do small town downtowns here. The smallest prairie towns have a better main street than any municipality on this island except St. John's. We have towns of 20K+ that couldn't compete with, say, Beausejour, Manitoba. And we have dozens of towns of 1-5K that have no main street to speak of, and almost no amenities.

[urbandreamer]

Winnipeg and Edmonton are very similar: long main streets with failing small businesses, empty storefronts surrounded by neat rows of tree-lined woodframed semis and further out, small 1920s-50s bungalows. Many parking lots downtown, a distinct government area, shiny ambitious but rather pathetic attempts at urban infill/renewal and really the main growth being cheap ugly suburban sprawl. Separate university campuses with decent prewar built form across the river.

Brandon, Lethbridge, Regina, Moose Jaw are very similar to smaller Ontario cities like Windsor, Sarnia, Orillia, Lindsay, Peterborough, Stratford. Moose Jaw could be Woodstock or Chatham.

Most of Canada's cities were laid out by railroad executives between the 1860s & 1890s so of course they'll be similar, built by Scottish/Scots-Irish Masons with English catalog architecture, mostly reflecting smaller cities and towns across England, Scotland and Ireland.

Today I was exploring Fairbanks/Earlscourt/Oakwood areas of Toronto: again aside from the brick cladding, the built form with a mix of tiny bungalows, detached and semis with quite a number of apartment buildings is seen anywhere from Edmonton to South of Broadway Vancouver to Regina etc.

Canada: mostly built by the Scots and designed by the English. More Ulsterman in Ontario/West vs Glaswegians in Montreal and Empire Loyalists/English Yankees in Sherbrooke/Eastern Townships and Upper Class English/French in Quebec City.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

The main differences I've noticed in my travels on the mainland have been:

- Other cities tend to have neutral colours for homes. There are some bright colours, especially in the Maritimes, but it's not the norm as it is here....

At least in Southern Ontario, bright house colours tend to be associated with low class/poor taste. I recall reading an article once that compared bright house colours to "a bloody gash" in the winter landscape. I have noticed, however that some larger structures in Ottawa have started to sprout brightly coloured panels, so maybe things are changing. Bright colours on front doors have also become more common.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Winnipeg and Edmonton are very similar: long main streets with failing small businesses, empty storefronts surrounded by neat rows of tree-lined woodframed semis and further out, small 1920s-50s bungalows. Many parking lots downtown, a distinct government area, shiny ambitious but rather pathetic attempts at urban infill/renewal and really the main growth being cheap ugly suburban sprawl. Separate university campuses with decent prewar built form across the river.

Yes Edmonton is kind of like an overgrown Winnipeg in the oilpatch.

[urbandreamer]

Grimsby's painted ladies were built for the Upper Class English. The Beach also has colorful homes. Oh and Buffalo! The posh middle class areas are in glorious colors, and of course Vancouver! This idea that color is low class is nonsense. Grey is cheap, and all these grey new builds a sign that New Canadians are very cheap peasants.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Today I was exploring Fairbanks/Earlscourt/Oakwood areas of Toronto: again aside from the brick cladding, the built form with a mix of tiny bungalows, detached and semis with quite a number of apartment buildings is seen anywhere from Edmonton to South of Broadway Vancouver to Regina etc.

York Township (i.e. old borough/city of York) and the former municipality of South Vancouver (city south of King Edward and east of Cambie) were both working class fringe areas in the early 20th century.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

It varies by space (region) and time throughout Canada.

Within Ontario alone, I'd see prewar differences in the following places that can be loosely clumped together:

Inner city Toronto's tight semi-detached home districts. Some shades of inner city Toronto in Lower Hamilton, parts of Ottawa

Eastern Ontario - Kingston, Brockville, Port Hope, Cobourg, PEC, the towns along the Rideau canal and Lanark Counties.

The Grand and Speed River valley towns - Guelph, Elora, Fergus, Galt, Paris.

Windsor's Detroit influence.

Northern Ontario's frontier look

Franco-Ontario's (lower Ottawa river valley + Cornwall) Quebec influence

Is Peterborough an Eastern Ontario city in your view?

[Build.It]

Some random observations:

- Edmonton probably has the most consistent street grid in the country. The newer areas have cul-de-sacs, but anything built before the 80s is made up of a set of almost square grids, with alleys in between.

- On the topic of alleys - that is very much a prairie province thing. Almost all homes in Calgary and Edmonton have a detached garage backing onto an alley in out back.

- Another interesting thing in Edmonton at least, is that there is about a 1.5" height gap between peoples' driveways and the road. This always confused me until the first winter arrived and I realized they don't plow the roads. Over the course of the winter the snow gets compacted/crushed, and basically levels out with the driveways.

- On the topic of concrete ... in Southern Ontario at least half of the utility poles and street lighting poles are made of concrete. There's nowhere else in Canada that you will find such a large use of concrete poles - considering how heavy they are to work with, and expensive to transport. The reason for this of course is that Southern Ontario is the hotbed of concrete production (numerous quarries, St. Marys, Lafarge are all here, as are a large number downstream finished good producers), so the all-in cost is relatively cheap - but this only applies in Ontario. Once you get about 200km away, steel becomes cheaper because of the extra transportation costs. It doesn't surprise me that the Ontario Tall Wall, which uses a lot more concrete than Jersey barriers, comes from Ontario. What steel is to Pittsburgh, concrete is to Ontario (to an extent).

- Where Edmonton is consistent street grid, Kitchener-Waterloo-Cambridge is the complete opposite. It's a mishmash of windy curvy roads, many of which will sometimes start going north, then west, then south for a minute, back west, etc. It takes about 2 weeks to get to know Edmonton's streets, but about 6 months to get to know KW's streets lol. KW also has an absurd number of roundabouts. Most of them are okay, but some of them are overkill, eg. this example of two massive roundabouts 100m apart:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/drdwpPbbm13M9Y6V8

- The GTA's freeways are on a completely different level. There is nowhere else in Canada that you will find multiple highways that are each 10 lanes wide for such long distances. They are also all consistently 100 km/h. Montreal is the closest equivalent, however the freeways are smaller, and a lot of them have 70 km/h speed limits. There is also nowhere else in Canada that I've seen signs on highways saying "Minor collision? Steer it and clear it." ... meaning, unless someone's dying get the f out of the way, our traffic is bad enough already.

- Windsor and Niagara Falls have a LOT of war-time bungalows as a % of their housing stock. I suspect it's due to a slow down in their growth starting in the 70s, so while other places kept building new houses with new architecture, these two slowed down. But it pretty cool when you enter them and see all these well maintained houses built in the 40s. Most of these that were built in the GTA have been torn down by now, but not in Windsor and Niagara Falls it seems.

- Calgary has a lot of clay-tile roofs. Only place in Canada that I've seen this. It reminded me of the houses you would see in and around Johannesburg (where they also get torrential hail storms).

- A very high percentage of cars in Windsor (my estimate is 80% or so), are made by one of the Big 3 American automakers. Makes sense given the proximity to Detroit and the local production. But it's interesting none-the-less that the automotive pride crossed the border. Of course when you cross the border into Detroit it's like 90% lol. Barely any Toyotas across the river, but not very many Windsor either.

- St Thomas, ON has a 2-lane grade separated expressway (map link). Granted it's a very short section, but this is very rare to see and I found it interesting. I believe St John's has one as well.

- Quebec City has by far the most advanced freeway network of our mid-sized cities, even beating larger cities like Edmonton and Calgary in this regard.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by Build.It

- Calgary has a lot of clay-tile roofs. Only place in Canada that I've seen this. It reminded me of the houses you would see in and around Johannesburg (where they also get torrential hail storms).

This is a comparison I've never heard before! I wouldn't say they're exactly common in Calgary, but it still seems to have significantly more than any other Canadian city. The only part of the city that has enough to make an impression IMO are the neighbourhoods West of Sarcee but East of 69th SW - Signal Hill, Coach Hill etc. My dad/stepmom's place has one just west of the city and they had to have a significantly more reinforced ceiling joists to support the weight. They're everywhere in Joburg but houses tend to be much more low-slung - thatch roofs are very common too.

I can see the similarity between Signal Hill and Greenstone, which is one of the most "North American" feeling places in Joburg (though more like Southern California)

Signal Hill: https://maps.app.goo.gl/GYwKpJRu515PkP3K7
https://maps.app.goo.gl/zDVfdDcinexMdFJX6

Greenstone: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Hp4o6fCMj4mpEq127
https://maps.app.goo.gl/TUtBVJco8HVZY4cg6

I will say that while impressive, the thunderstorms / hail storms I experienced growing up in the West of Calgary had nothing on the big summer Joburg storms. Really felt like the sky was just falling.

[Drybrain]

Not really a difference in typology, but something I was reminded of when I was visiting Calgary last week: in both Calgary and Edmonton (and I’m guessing other prairie cities?) it looks to me as if there is a lot of tear-down and rebuild of inner-city houses when new owners acquire an old property. Whereas in central and eastern Canada, the tendency is more to renovate—in some cases basically down to the studs, but renovate nonetheless. This has lent the inner residential parts of the prairie cities with a constantly evolving look reflective of current design trends more than a past vernacular.

Not sure why this is, and I can’t back it up with data, but it’s an impression I’ve long had. If I had to guess, I’d guess that it has to do with older western houses often being perhaps smaller and plainer when built, something like this, whereas in other parts of the country they were generally larger and continue to suit current residents reasonably well, size-wise—purely a hunch, but I’d be curious if there’s any info on the average size a Calgary house in the 1920s and a Toronto house of the time.

But just as a general impression, it feels as if inner-city areas in, say, Toronto or Halifax are largely full of old houses—to use some Halifax examples, they may be a little worse for wear, or beautifully restored, or given a stripped down modern look, but the structures are old.

Whereas in Calgary there is a lot of new building like this. If you look through areas like Mission and Hillhurst and Sunnyside and look back through Streetview’s historical imagery, you can see the process unfold over the years—lots of before and after.

Not saying either is better; there’s local logic to both. (Though the wisdom of maintaining all these single family houses in the urban core—whether old ones or larger, newer ones—is another matter.)

[jonny24]

Originally Posted by Drybrain

Not sure why this is, and I can’t back it up with data, but it’s an impression I’ve long had. If I had to guess

Permitting difference? Maybe it's easier to get approval for a new build, vs if it's a pain in the ass you just renovate?

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

It varies by space (region) and time throughout Canada.

Within Ontario alone, I'd see prewar differences in the following places that can be loosely clumped together:

Inner city Toronto's tight semi-detached home districts. Some shades of inner city Toronto in Lower Hamilton, parts of Ottawa

Eastern Ontario - Kingston, Brockville, Port Hope, Cobourg, PEC, the towns along the Rideau canal and Lanark Counties.

The Grand and Speed River valley towns - Guelph, Elora, Fergus, Galt, Paris.

Windsor's Detroit influence.

Northern Ontario's frontier look

Franco-Ontario's (lower Ottawa river valley + Cornwall) Quebec influence

Northern Ontario has some huge differences within it. The biggest difference is between remote First Nations you can't drive to and anywhere you can drive to. Different societies and lifestyles. Timmins is much more like Toronto than anywhere on the James Bay coast.

[niwell]

To Calgary's credit in inner-city areas they often tear down 1950s bungalows on large lots and replace with a semi-detached or two houses. On the downside it's destroying the original character of the neighbourhood but also creating areas with a bit more density to support local services.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by Loco101

Northern Ontario has some huge differences within it. The biggest difference is between remote First Nations you can't drive to and anywhere you can drive to. Different societies and lifestyles. Timmins is much more like Toronto than anywhere on the James Bay coast.

Yes! I've posted this before but a lot of Timmins neighbourhoods remind me of the York "unplanned suburbs" era of Toronto where people just built houses on platted land. The Earlscourt area urbandreamer referenced above. It's not as tightly packed but kind of a similar vibe.

Sudbury has vestiges of urban Southern Ontario amongst more modern stuff. It looks like it was meant to be a big city in certain areas. Dryden reminds me of larger cities in Alberta in form. TBay is a bit of it's own thing.

[Docere]

[deleted]

[Djeffery]

Originally Posted by Build.It

- St Thomas, ON has a 2-lane grade separated expressway (map link). Granted it's a very short section, but this is very rare to see and I found it interesting. I believe St John's has one as well.

The province is planning to twin this and put in a new section around Talbotviille, joining up with highway 4 to provide 4 lane access from the 401 to the new VW battery plant. Will be full freeway standard from the east end of St Thomas to some point between the Wonderland interchange and highway 4.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

The main differences I've noticed in my travels on the mainland have been:

- Other cities tend to have neutral colours for homes. There are some bright colours, especially in the Maritimes, but it's not the norm as it is here.
...

Vancouver's older houses were wood siding to begin with, and on many older properties the stucco has been removed. Because wood construction lends itself to colour, there are some similarities to be found, like on this street. It is interesting to note the differences in the colour choices between the two coasts.


https://maps.app.goo.gl/p69ZZj3gQ7m4HrLg8