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  #961  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2018, 10:06 PM
whatnext whatnext is offline
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Originally Posted by misher View Post
Your so racist and dumb its disgusting. Maybe move somewhere with a significant population of like minded Neo-Nazis?
You can cry about it at your next United Front meeting.
     
     
  #962  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2018, 10:18 PM
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fredinno fredinno is offline
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
The price cap you refer to is for increases for existing tenants. It doesn't apply to the landlord if a tenant vacates and he re-rents the suite.



Studies don't bear that out:

....Every time rent control is proposed, the landlord-lobby communications playbook kicks into high gear with the same refrain: rent control stops landlords from building rental housing. Costs are said to be going up. Profits are never mentioned.

From Ontario last year to B.C., Illinois and California today, every time rent control is raised, armeggedon in the rental housing sector is promised.

The only problem is, there’s zero empirical evidence to back this up.

When Harris gutted rent control in the 1990s he promised “thousands and thousands of rental units” and of course, they never emerged — housing development totally flatlined.

Similarity, rent control was expanded in Ontario last year we were told the usual stories: 1,000 units were lost, projects were cancelled, and landlords would stop renting. But reality is a funny thing: one year later, far from cratering rental housing development it has surged to its highest levels in decades.....


https://www.thestar.com/opinion/cont...trols-yes.html

New Rental doesn't magically appear or disappear, it's a long-term process and trend. You know as much as I do that new RE projects can take over half a decade to materialize.


There was a massive demand for rental in Toronto during the time rental controls were lifted. On the long term, vacancy rates soared to 4% once demand flatlined, and rent price growth dropped to 1%, until the demand started to soar again.


And in any case, none of these studies have demonstrated why rental is somehow exempt from the basic laws of supply and demand.

https://iea.org.uk/blog/we-are-the-6...-rent-controls

Quote:
Let’s have a look at how ‘unfounded in evidence’ these arguments are. Perhaps the most comprehensive review of the economic evidence on the subject is the paper ‘Rent Control: Do Economists Agree?’ by Blair Jenkins, which discusses over sixty different studies on various forms of rent control. She concludes:

“[E]conomic research quite consistently and predominantly frowns on rent control. My findings cover both theoretical and empirical research on many dimensions of the issue, including housing availability, maintenance and housing quality, rental rates, political and administrative costs, and redistribution […] “[T]he economics profession has reached a rare consensus: Rent control creates many more problems than it solves”.

“The analysis of rent control is among the best-understood issues in all of economics, and – among economists, anyway — one of the least controversial. In 1992 a poll of the American Economic Association found 93 percent of its members agreeing that ”a ceiling on rents reduces the quality and quantity of housing.” […] Bitter relations between tenants and landlords, with an arms race between ever-more ingenious strategies to force tenants out – what yesterday’s article oddly described as ”free-market horror stories” – and constantly proliferating regulations designed to block those strategies? Predictable. […] [T]he pathologies of San Francisco’s housing market are right out of the textbook, that they are exactly what supply-and-demand analysis predicts. But people literally don’t want to know. A few months ago, when a San Francisco official proposed a study of the city’s housing crisis, there was a firestorm of opposition from tenant-advocacy groups. They argued that even to study the situation was a step on the road to ending rent control – and they may well have been right, because studying the issue might lead to a recognition of the obvious.”

The basic problem is that rents, like other prices, are messengers. A high price of X tells us that X is in short supply (relative to demand), and a low price of X tells us that there is plenty of X. A price ceiling is, however, worse than just shooting the messenger. It means forcing the messenger to tell a lie. A capped rent is a messenger, who, at gunpoint, informs us that everything is fine, and that rental properties are available in great abundance. But while we can force the messenger to say anything we want to hear, the trouble is that that does not make it any truer. The shortage is still there. It will just manifest itself in other ways.
Even imposing strict price caps on existing rentals is shooting the messenger in this context; the prices for existing tenants artificially deflate prices overall, discouraging investment in new properties.

It also encourages landlords to kick current tenants out, if possible to take advantage of a higher-rent new tenant.


Unless, of course, all those economists are being paid for by the landlord lobby?


In which case, I guess all those climate scientists peddling climate change are being paid by the Green Energy lobby and George Soros?

You can read the paper linked in the article for yourself.
     
     
  #963  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2018, 10:22 PM
Vin Vin is offline
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Originally Posted by scryer View Post
misher, I am surprised at you. In the past you have made posts with a greater intellectual impact on these forums. Playing the over-played racism card is just corny these days, especially on the internet where you don't really know who you're talking to. You should take a time-out. I've done it myself (no shame in it).

But all you MF's have jumped to neo/Nazism (?), racism, the holocaust, and anti-semitism way too quickly; which is typical of mediocre internet snowflakes these days. Now that you've said it let's take on a new progressive narrative.

Why not discuss solutions and policies aimed to prevent criminals (not nationals) and other people cheating the system, from cleaning their money via real estate? Surely we can all agree on that?
This country is not built on bigotry, get it? That's why we put down those who even try to stir the pot. I do agree that we should be discussing about how to solve the current problems, but without bringing the Nazi past, these bozos just don't get it. They may not mean to be racist, but they fan the hatred targetting a "certain demographics" by their rhetoric. Just look through all the threads now: such blatant racist postings are getting from bad to worse. Time to put a stop to that, and you should know better.


Famous quote by Niemöller :

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.
     
     
  #964  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2018, 11:13 PM
scryer scryer is offline
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...And now I'm logging out of this thread.
     
     
  #965  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2018, 11:32 PM
rofina rofina is offline
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
What, the real estate cartel mouthpiece objecting to rental controls? Colour me surprised. With the right incentives to build there's no reason this would effect newbuilds. They will set new rents to account for it. And flip the example around. You own a 10 unit building. Each year two of the units turn over as tenants vacate. Currently you can jack up the rent 100% for the new tenant even though your costs may have only increased minimally.
If you had long term tenants in, chances are they were paying much below market. Often a doubling in rent is not that outrageous for units that had been occupied for years.
     
     
  #966  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2018, 11:34 PM
svlt svlt is offline
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Nothing triggers Vancouver netizens like real estate and racism

Point and counterpoint; There has been an obscene amount of illicit wealth funneled through the province's lax laws that have contributed to the unhealthy real estate environment we now have. A not-insignificant proportion of that source came from China and this origin should be heavily scrutinized and penalized. It's one thing to say we shouldn't be "racist"; it's another to sweep a clear and obvious fact under the rug.

However, racism is a real thing here. I'm downtown most of the week and see it frequently. An Asian looking person simply cannot walk in many parts of downtown east of Granville with a feeling of safety against being randomly provoked by, well, frankly a white person that looks like a victim of drug abuse and high rents. This was almost never an issue in the previous decade. To pretend it is not a problem in small l liberal BC is yet another product of white privilege.

Ideally, we can have a healthy debate about the source of some of the problems and what can be done to fix it without branding an entire ethnic group.
     
     
  #967  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2018, 12:21 AM
whatnext whatnext is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rofina View Post
If you had long term tenants in, chances are they were paying much below market. Often a doubling in rent is not that outrageous for units that had been occupied for years.
You're assuming that tenants had been in place for years. They could easily have been students there for 1-2 years. To recap, nothing would have raised the landlords costs anywhere near 100% in that time.
     
     
  #968  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2018, 12:35 AM
retro_orange retro_orange is offline
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Originally Posted by misher View Post
Yes Chinese are responsible for all our problems from drugs to real estate prices to high rents.

Does this remind anyone of who was blamed during the 1920-30's for the German depression?



Even if Chinese are responsible for all our drug problems (they aren't), it feels to me like this is just justice after we forced China to let us sell opium to their addicts less than 200 years ago?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium_Wars

That was the British you dummy. And after Jewish people, the British were the next people the Nazis wanted to eliminate. Red Herring alert.

Last edited by retro_orange; Nov 27, 2018 at 12:47 AM.
     
     
  #969  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2018, 12:45 AM
retro_orange retro_orange is offline
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Location: East Van
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svlt View Post
Nothing triggers Vancouver netizens like real estate and racism

Point and counterpoint; There has been an obscene amount of illicit wealth funneled through the province's lax laws that have contributed to the unhealthy real estate environment we now have. A not-insignificant proportion of that source came from China and this origin should be heavily scrutinized and penalized. It's one thing to say we shouldn't be "racist"; it's another to sweep a clear and obvious fact under the rug.

However, racism is a real thing here. I'm downtown most of the week and see it frequently. An Asian looking person simply cannot walk in many parts of downtown east of Granville with a feeling of safety against being randomly provoked by, well, frankly a white person that looks like a victim of drug abuse and high rents. This was almost never an issue in the previous decade. To pretend it is not a problem in small l liberal BC is yet another product of white privilege.

Ideally, we can have a healthy debate about the source of some of the problems and what can be done to fix it without branding an entire ethnic group.

Yeah because no Asian/Chinese person is ever racist right?
     
     
  #970  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2018, 12:46 AM
whatnext whatnext is offline
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Originally Posted by Vin View Post
This country is not built on bigotry, get it? That's why we put down those who even try to stir the pot. I do agree that we should be discussing about how to solve the current problems, but without bringing the Nazi past, these bozos just don't get it. They may not mean to be racist, but they fan the hatred targetting a "certain demographics" by their rhetoric. Just look through all the threads now: such blatant racist postings are getting from bad to worse. Time to put a stop to that, and you should know better.


Famous quote by Niemöller :

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for the Jews,
I remained silent;
I wasn't a Jew.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.
And what did you do when the Mainland Chinese Money Launderers came for your house?

It is you and misher who stoke racism by equating Mainland Chinese money laundering with All Chinese People. The thinking person would say "yes, it's a problem how can we deal with it". That's what Melody Ma, Justin Fung and others have done. But the two of you instantly go to "this is racist" when the devastating effects of Mainland Chinese capital on Vancouver's housing market is brought up.

Far more Filipinos and Indians immigrate to Canada yearly than Chinese, do you see any posts complaining of money laundering from those groups? If it was all some racist conspiracy surely they would be targetted as well.
     
     
  #971  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2018, 2:14 AM
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jlousa jlousa is offline
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What a bunch of kids you guys are. Wow. This thread is closed for now and the mods will be discussing suspensions.
     
     
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