Which 2nd language would you choose to have implemented on skytrain if need be?

[SFUVancouver]

I nominate the langauge Charlie Brown and the kids hear whenever an adult is talking. That would sound right at home over a loudspeaker system.

[Hed Kandi]

Originally Posted by Canadian Mind

How else does one describe it?

Exactly!

[agrant]

There's no point to this. The ticket machines are already in multiple languages, and you only need to ride the system once before you figure everything out.

[Millennium2002]

Hmm... how about if there's no multilingual signage we instead label all of our stations with a letter + number (like airport gates) and then have signage telling people what train to take based on travel time. As an example:

E1 Waterfront
E2 Burrard
E3 Vancouver City Centre - Granville
E4 Stadium - Chinatown
E5 Main St - Science World
E6 Commercial - Broadway
E7 Nanaimo
E8 29th Ave
E9 Joyce - Collingwood
E10 Patterson
E11 Metrotown
E12 Royal Oak
E13 Edmonds
E14 22nd St
E15 New Westminister
E16 Columbia
E17 Scott Road
E18 Gateway
E19 Surrey Central - SFU Surrey
E20 King George

M25 Columbia
M24 Sapperton
M23 Braid
M22 Lougheed Town Centre
M21 Production Way - SFU Burnaby
M20 Lake City Way
M19 Sperling - Burnaby Lake
M18 Holdom
M17 Brentwood Town Centre
M16 Gilmore
M15 Rupert
M14 Renfrew
M13 Commercial - Broadway
M12 VCC - Clark
(M11 - M1 reserved)

C1 Waterfront
C2 Vancouver City Centre - Granville
C3 Olympic Village (Southeast False Creek)
C4 Broadway - Cambie - City Hall
C5 King Edward
C6 Oakridge - 41st Ave
C7 Langara - 49th Ave
C8 Marine Drive
C9 Bridgeport

C.10 Aberdeen
C.11 Lansdowne
C.12 Richmond - Brighouse

C.a Templeton
C.b Sea Island Way
C.c YVR - Airport

[deasine]

The issue is that we'll have problems with the Evergreen Line HAHA.

[fever]

Numbering stations isn't necessary. Nobody would remember the numbers.

Our lines are indicated as in London, primarily with a name but also with a colour. Berlin does it a little differently because it has more types of rail transit. It indicates subway lines and overground lines with a U or S, respectively, followed by a number, each with a unique colour. The lines aren't named. Surface lines are indicated with an M followed by a number, but are not given a colour. Paris gives metro lines a number and colour, and regional lines a letter and colour.

I prefer Berlin's system, but it's not needed yet. Under that naming convention, the WCE would be S1 and purple, expo would be U1 and blue, millennium would be U2 and orange, canada would be U3 and light blue (or red), and the streetcar would be M1.


I'm still hoping the Evergreen line is changed to Coquitlam. Everyone will start using the Coq line after work. The naming rights could be worth something.

[g35]

Originally Posted by cabotp

I do realize the a lot of people who come here can not speak a word of english when they arrive.

But lets say they start speaking Mandarin on the Canada Line. Next thing we know someone else will want Cantonese. And then we will have Punjab and Sikh, and Spanish, and well the list goes on. I just don't want to be sitting on the train and listening to 15 minutes worth of what the next station is in every language. Meanwhile we've passed that station already cause it took to long to say what station it was.

FYI, Sikh is not a language.

I think a simple solution would be to have a help phone at each station, with a multilingual sign on top of it saying what it is for. Someone can pick up the phone, ask how to get wherever, and the Translink employee would tell them which station to go to. It would even help them to learn the names of the stations, if they see the words "King George" associated with the sound they hear on the phone. Is there something I have overlooked here?

Oh yeah, forgot to add that they would need people on the other end speaking whatever languages...I don't know how much something like this would cost, though. I bet the people at 604-953-3333 speak many languages between them.

[BCPhil]

Originally Posted by agrant

There's no point to this. The ticket machines are already in multiple languages, and you only need to ride the system once before you figure everything out.

Exactly. If you don't understand any English at all, I think you'll have more trouble with important things, like finding a job, securing a place to live, or buying a meal, than figuring out the Canada Line. And the Canada Line is only a part in a large system, in a large city. If only the Canada Line was in Mandarin, I don't see how that makes everyone's lives better. Once you step off the train, everything is in English again.

In Vancouver you should be encouraged to learn English, just as if you moved to Paris you should be encouraged to learn French, or in Berlin you learn German, or in Boston you learn a different accent.

[cabotp]

Originally Posted by g35

FYI, Sikh is not a language.

Whoops I assumed there was such a language

Originally Posted by BCPhil

Exactly. If you don't understand any English at all, I think you'll have more trouble with important things, like finding a job, securing a place to live, or buying a meal, than figuring out the Canada Line. And the Canada Line is only a part in a large system, in a large city. If only the Canada Line was in Mandarin, I don't see how that makes everyone's lives better. Once you step off the train, everything is in English again.

In Vancouver you should be encouraged to learn English, just as if you moved to Paris you should be encouraged to learn French, or in Berlin you learn German, or in Boston you learn a different accent.

Exactly. If I were to ever go and live in Paris. I can't expect everything to be in English just to help me. I have to learn to get by with learning and understanding french.

[nova9]

Originally Posted by cabotp

Whoops I assumed there was such a language



Exactly. If I were to ever go and live in Paris. I can't expect everything to be in English just to help me. I have to learn to get by with learning and understanding french.

I don't necessarily want more than French and English on governement/public signs and I do find my way quite easily in other countries. But that's largely because I'm used to the english alphabet.

Not that i'm making excuses for people visiting or immigrating but the transition from characters or icons and symbols to an alphabet is a large gap. As well, learning a language comes in many forms and most people actually learn conversational english - literate and practical literacy comes much later. Just saying....

[vansky]

hahaha

put both french and chinese on it, who cares... and the ppl who vote for only english, give me a good reason why?

let's be different from others, it can be a creative move.

[jlousa]

I vote for no language just to be different. I'd have led screens in all cars like the richmond line, telling you the next station and destination in English only and no announcements whatsoever. I travel a bit and I always make sure I know where I'm going before I get on the train, even though I don't speak the language I find a way to get where I need. It about bringing back personnal responsiblity, there is too much hand-holding in society today.

[llamaorama]

so if someone asked for directions you'd tell them to fuck off? brilliant.

Anyways, I was thinking of a better idea. Instead of changing the language of the announcements, instead provide maps with in smaller text the translations of station names in different alphabets like Chinese, Korean, Hindu, Arabic, Cyrillic, and so forth. Then when the speaker says "Approaching Waterfront Station", a Chinese rider could look at his paper map with "Waterfront" spelled phonetically in Chinese symbols, and upon hearing the word realize that was his stop.

Because think about it, a French speaker could probably interpret an English announcement, or vice versa. It's the eastern languages and their different writing systems that would truly leave someone confused, unable to turn to a written sign or map

Also, for announcements, things like "doors closing" or even "emergency-evacuate the train!" I don't think verbal messages over intercom should be solely relied on either. Instead the train interior should feature light-up signs and chime noises that indicate such things. For instance, the train stops at an island platform going north, so the doors open to the left. There should be a loud "bing" and orange lights should flash along the opening doors.

[Millennium2002]

Originally Posted by deasine

The issue is that we'll have problems with the Evergreen Line HAHA.

Oh right. =O

How about the designation P? (for Port Moody?)

Then it'd be...

P1 Lougheed Town Centre
P2 Burquitlam
P3 Port Moody
P4 Ioco-Moray
P5 Coquitlam Central
P6 Douglas College - Coq City Hall

[nova9]

Originally Posted by llamaorama

Anyways, I was thinking of a better idea. Instead of changing the language of the announcements, instead provide maps with in smaller text the translations of station names in different alphabets like Chinese, Korean, Hindu, Arabic, Cyrillic, and so forth. Then when the speaker says "Approaching Waterfront Station", a Chinese rider could look at his paper map with "Waterfront" spelled phonetically in Chinese symbols, and upon hearing the word realize that was his stop.

Well you don't spell things in Chinese. And if you were going to put, as an example, chinese text anyways, it would be foolish to put anything other than the direct translation. 'Waterfront Station' translated would seriously just be 3 or 4 characters.

But I agree with jlousa, even if he was jsut kidding. But iconography solves a lot of problems. I remember when I went to the skytrain unconference last fall that many of us spoke about that. GOOD, keyword good, symbols are just easier.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by jlousa

I vote for no language just to be different. I'd have led screens in all cars like the richmond line, telling you the next station and destination in English only and no announcements whatsoever. I travel a bit and I always make sure I know where I'm going before I get on the train, even though I don't speak the language I find a way to get where I need. It about bringing back personnal responsiblity, there is too much hand-holding in society today.

Originally Posted by nova9

Well you don't spell things in Chinese. And if you were going to put, as an example, chinese text anyways, it would be foolish to put anything other than the direct translation. 'Waterfront Station' translated would seriously just be 3 or 4 characters.

But I agree with jlousa, even if he was jsut kidding. But iconography solves a lot of problems. I remember when I went to the skytrain unconference last fall that many of us spoke about that. GOOD, keyword good, symbols are just easier.

I wouldn't go all out and remove English, but yes, I agree, having clear symbols that are used throughout the entire system is often good enough. As much as people complain about the Canada Line's signage being small, at least they have large, clear icons, albeit all icons used on the Canada Line aren't used on the other SkyTrain lines.

Porto Metro has a really clear signage system, using mainly icons and a little bit of Portuguese.

Photography by hhaduong of Flickr

[Hourglass]

Originally Posted by CLC

Hong kong is a bilingual "city-state" too, English is always an official language of hong kong.

Actually trilingual, with Cantonese acknowledged as the defacto official spoken language and standard Mandarin as well. Thus, MTR announcements are made in Cantonese, Mandarin as well as English.

Skytrain should only have announcements English or English/French as the official languages of Canada, with multilingual LCDs for other common languages as well.

The exception is the Canada Line. I think it would be acceptable for the Canada Line to/from YVR to have multilingual announcements for the most common foreign languages (it would be interesting to find out where most non-English speaking tourists visiting Vancouver come from).

[jlousa]

Originally Posted by llamaorama

so if someone asked for directions you'd tell them to fuck off? brilliant.

Where did I say that anywhere in my post? If someone asked me for directions I would give them to them. I do all the time. In fact just asking for directions is a sign of personal responsiblity instead of expecting the directions to be handed to you.

[twoNeurons]

More maps and a flashing LED telling you where you are when you're on the train ( like the new MkIIgs ) should be fine.

[metroXpress]

Seattle's system has English only...while Portland's MAX and LA's Metro has both English and Spanish.