Where the West begins

[Doady]

The West and East begin at Yonge St as far as I'm concerned.

[Docere]

Nah, I don't think you're really "out west" until you pass Bathurst St.

[lio45]

You guys might be joking but in Sherbrooke that's actually going to be the serious default interpretation for everybody for "the East". Probably the case for Montreal as well.

"The North" would probably be half and half between the North Ward of Sherbrooke and Northern Quebec. "The West" would be more likely to be BC/Prairies than the neighborhood between the Magog river and U de S.

(I mean when talking about context-free statements like "Bob just bought himself a new property in the north and intends to move there" that could be realistically interpreted both ways. If you say you're going out west to do errands this afternoon, you're obviously heading to the neighborhood next to the francophone uni.)

[trueviking]

There is no such thing as central Canada. Where are people getting this? Canada is not the United States.

Western Canada starts at Manitoba. It has for 150 years. Ridiculous discussion.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 240glt

It seems no one wants to be lumped in with Manitoba for some reason

That's mainly you.

[240glt]

^ lol, actually no, looking through this and the Dangerfield thread it seems to be a popular theme

Me personally I don't really care, never been to Manitoba, it's of zero consequence to me. It just seems like Manitoba is orphaned by the east and the west

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by trueviking

There is no such thing as central Canada. Where are people getting this? Canada is not the United States.

Nobody in the Maritimes thinks of Toronto as being the East. There are four Canada's as far as we're concerned:

- Atlantic Canada
- Quebec
- Upper Canada
- The West

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 240glt

^ lol, actually no, looking through this and the Dangerfield thread it seems to be a popular theme

Me personally I don't really care, never been to Manitoba, it's of zero consequence to me. It just seems like Manitoba is orphaned by the east and the west

Manitoba is culturally and historically a part of Western Canada... that much is a matter of fact. This would be stone-cold clear to anyone who has ever read a book about the history of Canada. You would have quite an uphill climb on your hands if you tried to suggest otherwise.

[MonctonRad]

Indeed. Winnipeg is the gateway to the Canadian west just like St. Louis was the gateway to the American west.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Indeed. Winnipeg is the gateway to the Canadian west just like St. Louis was the gateway to the American west.

I think a lot of the chatter in this thread comes from the Canadian fetish of not wanting to be "comme les autres"... everyone's region is special and unique and not to be equated with any of the other run of the mill, plain-jane provinces or regions.

[shappy]

^ ha, agree. It's the SSP Canada way.

MonctonRad, so Toronto's located in Upper Canada according to Maritimers? Interesting. No reference to Lower Canada?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by shappy

So Toronto's located in Upper Canada according to Maritimers? Interesting. No reference to Lower Canada?

You don't hear many references to Lower Canada these days... it seems to be passé.

[240glt]

Originally Posted by esquire

Manitoba is culturally and historically a part of Western Canada... that much is a matter of fact. This would be stone-cold clear to anyone who has ever read a book about the history of Canada. You would have quite an uphill climb on your hands if you tried to suggest otherwise.

Like I said before, the view is much different from further west, especially BC

In a historic context, absolutely. In a contemporary context, Manitoba just doesn't seem to fit.

It's more a prairie province than a western province. Or mid west. But people freak out about that too.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 240glt

Like I said before, the view is much different from further west, especially BC

There is a clear tendency in this thread to think of west = everything west of me and east = everything east of me. But that kind of self-centred view doesn't reflect reality.

[240glt]

^ i agree

But you're doing the exact same thing

It's all perception

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 240glt

^ i agree

But you're doing the exact same thing

It's all perception

My argument is the one supported by 150+ years worth of socio-cultural history. At no point in Canadian history was it ever conventionally held wisdom that Manitoba was not part of western Canada.

You're making the point that it shouldn't be considered as such any longer which is fair enough, that's your opinion and you're certainly entitled to it. But that would require quite a big change in the current line of thinking, and just because you want it that way doesn't make it so. I mean, have you tried googling Western Canada?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by shappy

^ ha, agree. It's the SSP Canada way.

MonctonRad, so Toronto's located in Upper Canada according to Maritimers? Interesting. No reference to Lower Canada?

It's said in jest but in my experience "Upper Canada" is something you may occasionally hear in Atlantic Canada to refer to Ontario.

[Laceoflight]

Originally Posted by 240glt

^ i agree

But you're doing the exact same thing

It's all perception

It's not perception, it's history. Facts. Litterature. Articles. Monographies. A collective mindset.

The american continent as a whole was constructed socially and in our collective psyche as the european explorations and settlements progressed further into the West. As previously written, the western barrier has shifted with every new conquest. At first, for example, the West was the Pays des Outaouais, starting at Montreal and Lachine rapids. Then, it became the Pays d'en Haut, as the explorations progressed (La Vérendrye, D'Iberville, Jolliet, etc.) After, the Pays d'en Haut turned into Upper Canada or Canada West. When this piece of land was finally settled, at the turn of the 19th century, the western frontier moved towards the canadian prairies and the Rockies, as a way for the British to be sure that the aggressive colonization of the West would not only be exclusive to the USA.

It's not said that this situation will never change. For example if, in a few centuries, the West coast and the Rockies represent the majority of this country's population, and with a steady input of new Canadians that don't relate to our national history, things may evolve quite differently. But for now...

[240glt]

^ look I recognize there's some cognitive dissonance here no doubt. I reiterate that I really don't care, the perception from out west is that Manitoba isn't really part of it. It's a perception that is based on geography among other factors, ligitimate or not. That's all I'll say about this

[esquire]

Originally Posted by 240glt

^ look I recognize there's some cognitive dissonance here no doubt. I reiterate that I really don't care, the perception from out west is that Manitoba isn't really part of it. It's a perception that is based on geography among other factors, ligitimate or not. That's all I'll say about this

Fair enough, it's 2017, alternative facts are a thing