PHILADELPHIA | River Walk | Two Towers | 363 FT & 315 FT | 32 FLOORS & 28 FLOORS - Page 55

wanderer34 · #**1081** Posted **Mar 8, 2021, 12:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by TonyTone

Well IMO The ACC was actually the slimmer and better styled one, in fact the CITC is a copied version of it.

But the ACC didn't fit into the Philly skyline like the CITC does. The CITC just matches its older brother and fits our skyline.

We must respect our tall skyscraper kings

The USB stick and the Vape.

What do you mean the ACC didn't fit the skyline, it was perfect for Philadelphia!!! The CITC's roof is shorter than the Comcast Center, which is a problem if you're going to claim to be Philadelphia'a and PA's tallest building, that's why I have a hard time accepting it as the "it" tower for Philly the way Liberty Place served as the "it" tower from 1987 to 2007, and prior to Liberty Place, City Hall. Plus, speaking of imitations, let's not forget which building the CITC imitated (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBC_Tower)

NYC's "it" tower's are the WTC (both past and present), the Empire State Building, and the Chrysler Building. Chicago had the Sears Tower and the John Hancock Center. Boston has the Prudential and John Hancock Buildings, DC has the Capitol. the White House, and the Washington Monument, Toronto has the CN Tower, and SF has the Transamerica Pyramid that are the "it" buildings.

I leave it as it is, but the ACC was very unique in it's design and Philadelphia missed a huge opportunity to claim a habitable building that was tallest in North America until the Freedom Tower was topped out in 2014. The CITC doesn't do any justice for Philly's aesthetics and I kinda miss the old skyline pre-CITC. I could say that from 2008 to 2014 was the best years of Philly's skyline and it's highest potential. If people like the CITC, that's your opinion, but the city is going to be a one-company town and I wouldn't be surprised that it happens soon.

PHL10 · #**1082** Posted **Mar 8, 2021, 1:31 PM**

^^^ I believe the highest floor of CITC is higher than Comcast so I'm not sure how you are defining roof height. It seems you want to count Comcast's mechanical structure above the highest floor but then not use the same standard for CITC.

thoughtcriminal · #**1083** Posted **Mar 8, 2021, 2:54 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wanderer34

What do you mean the ACC didn't fit the skyline, it was perfect for Philadelphia!!! The CITC's roof is shorter than the Comcast Center, which is a problem if you're going to claim to be Philadelphia'a and PA's tallest building, that's why I have a hard time accepting it as the "it" tower for Philly the way Liberty Place served as the "it" tower from 1987 to 2007, and prior to Liberty Place, City Hall. Plus, speaking of imitations, let's not forget which building the CITC imitated (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NBC_Tower)

NYC's "it" tower's are the WTC (both past and present), the Empire State Building, and the Chrysler Building. Chicago had the Sears Tower and the John Hancock Center. Boston has the Prudential and John Hancock Buildings, DC has the Capitol. the White House, and the Washington Monument, Toronto has the CN Tower, and SF has the Transamerica Pyramid that are the "it" buildings.

I leave it as it is, but the ACC was very unique in it's design and Philadelphia missed a huge opportunity to claim a habitable building that was tallest in North America until the Freedom Tower was topped out in 2014. The CITC doesn't do any justice for Philly's aesthetics and I kinda miss the old skyline pre-CITC. I could say that from 2008 to 2014 was the best years of Philly's skyline and it's highest potential. If people like the CITC, that's your opinion, but the city is going to be a one-company town and I wouldn't be surprised that it happens soon.

the ACC 's main tower was fine. for me, the problem was the hotel building that was connected to it. I'm not sure why the hotel couldn't have been integrated into the tower. As it was shown in the renderings, it would have been connected by skybridge to the tower, but was a separate structure itself. looked like an after thought.

PurpleWhiteOut · #**1084** Posted **Mar 8, 2021, 7:02 PM**

Can we just get a permanent ACC thread for the people who can't stop talking about it?

Jawnadelphia · #**1085** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 2:11 AM**

I'd be fine with never reading another ACC post. It wasn't even the best or most realistic miss of that last cycle, that of course being Richard Meier's razor thin, sexy Mandeville Place. And the empty lot still sits for the taking! Ok, now I am waxing poetic for a long since deceased masterpiece... guilty.
https://www.richardmeier.com/?projec...eville-place-2

anyways...Riverwalk!

https://www.instagram.com/p/CMK9xPsDRrg/

TK2001 · #**1086** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 8:21 PM**

The GIANT store is very close to completion. And there is glass on the north side of the south tower now, at ground level

wanderer34 · #**1087** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 9:06 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHL10

^^^ I believe the highest floor of CITC is higher than Comcast so I'm not sure how you are defining roof height. It seems you want to count Comcast's mechanical structure above the highest floor but then not use the same standard for CITC.

I wasn't just referring to just floor height, but the actual height, which is the problem with the CITC in comparison to the Comcast Center. The roof height for the Comcast Center is 975' while the roof of the CITC is 911'. The CITC is counted as a supertall due to the spire but then again, you could've at least erected a tower that was at least 1000'+ tall as opposed to the cheater spire.

Quote:

Originally Posted by thoughtcriminal

the ACC 's main tower was fine. for me, the problem was the hotel building that was connected to it. I'm not sure why the hotel couldn't have been integrated into the tower. As it was shown in the renderings, it would have been connected by skybridge to the tower, but was a separate structure itself. looked like an after thought.

I think that's what made the ACC very distinctive, the fact that it had three parts, one for commercial space, another for the hotel, and a third part used for retail. CITC pretty much copies what the ACC offered except the developers placed the hotel portion on the highest floor, plus I don't really like how the CITC interacts with the 18th St streetscape. It looks too corporate and too dark. The ACC seemed to brighten up that streetscape and enhance it as well with an angled entrance.

And as for Riverwalk, hopefully this helps the east bank of the Schuylkill. All along the eastern bank you have midrises all along the Schuylkill. Yes, I do wish a project like the Mandeville would've gotten off the drawing board long before the 2008 recession, which would've further enhanced the Philadelphia skyline, but I'm looking at the Riverwalk as yet another notch in the Philadelphia skyline sans CITC.

Zapatan · #**1088** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 9:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by wanderer34

I wasn't just referring to just floor height, but the actual height, which is the problem with the CITC in comparison to the Comcast Center. The roof height for the Comcast Center is 975' while the roof of the CITC is 911'. The CITC is counted as a supertall due to the spire but then again, you could've at least erected a tower that was at least 1000'+ tall as opposed to the cheater spire.

The roof of CITC is 996', the cooling tower counts as the roof. 911' is the lower roof. Kind of like ESB (although not occupied).

The visual mass of the original Comcast Center is a bit higher, but the lantern (too thick to be a spire IMO) has its own roof. Several people could easily stand up there.

PHL10 · #**1089** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 9:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapatan

The roof of CITC is 996', the cooling tower counts as the roof. 911' is the lower roof. Kind of like ESB (although not occupied).

The visual mass of the original Comcast Center is a bit higher, but the lantern (too thick to be a spire IMO) has its own roof. Several people could easily stand up there.

There's a stairwell inside as well.

wanderer34 · #**1090** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 10:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapatan

The roof of CITC is 996', the cooling tower counts as the roof. 911' is the lower roof. Kind of like ESB (although not occupied).

The visual mass of the original Comcast Center is a bit higher, but the lantern (too thick to be a spire IMO) has its own roof. Several people could easily stand up there.

People consider that to be a spire, whether it's a part of the structure of just an addition, it's technically a spire. The conclusion is that despite your claim that the CITC's roof is 996', the point of the matter is that most of the CITC's roof (the flat part of the tower and not the spire" reaches up to 911', therefore the reason that people conclude that the CITC isn't as tall as the Comcast Center w/o the spire.

The point of the matter is that when the Comcast Center was erected, people felt that the Comcast should've slapped another 25 to 50 feet to officially make it a supertall, and people (myself included) were disappointed that it never happened. Either way, we were happy that another skyscraper was built and we forgot about the height.

The CITC doesn't engage people's imaginations the way City Hall, Liberty Place, and even the Comcast Center does because much of the roof is 911' from the ground. Maybe the only people that are engaged with the CITC are the skyscraper nerds here on this site, but I don't see any awe about this tower from most people who live in this city not from the tourists. If the developers want to consider the spire a part of the roof, it's up to them, but rightfully so, I still wouldn't be shocked if the CITC gets panned from time to time, with one sticking sore point (no pun intended) happens to be that it used a spire to cheat to achieve the height of 1,121', when it could've done so by elevating it's roof height but even so, it's still a cheater skyscraper, I rest my case!

PurpleWhiteOut · #**1091** Posted **Mar 9, 2021, 11:45 PM**

Oh my god wanderer can you stop wandering off topic?

Plokoon11 · #**1092** Posted **Mar 10, 2021, 1:16 PM**

I agree, the wanderer is getting annoying with his obsession of ACC. More River Walk talk.

JohnIII · #**1093** Posted **Mar 10, 2021, 3:46 PM**

Pertaining to the 2 skyscrapers on River Walk; the tower yet to be topped off will be the tallest; is there however any word on exterior lighting? Will there be any particularly on the crown?

Also I wonder how this tower will affect the PECO Building especially because in future that will be a tower to the south of the River Walk complex.

TK2001 · #**1094** Posted **Mar 10, 2021, 3:47 PM**

Riverwalk growing into the Philadelphia skyline by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Here's some Riverwalk talk. The south tower is past the halfway height of the north tower and I saw a crane operator in the crane as rebar was being lifted to the highest floor plate. The GIANT store looks very complete from the outside and as I said, glass has started on ground level on the north face. I say the south tower will top out sometime

summersm343 · #**1095** Posted **Mar 10, 2021, 4:40 PM**

^^Cool shot. These towers add a lot of dimension from this view.

TK2001 · #**1096** Posted **Mar 10, 2021, 6:52 PM**

Philadelphia skyline from South Street Bridge by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

SEFTA · #**1097** Posted **Mar 12, 2021, 4:32 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jawnadelphia

I'd be fine with never reading another ACC post. It wasn't even the best or most realistic miss of that last cycle, that of course being Richard Meier's razor thin, sexy Mandeville Place. And the empty lot still sits for the taking! Ok, now I am waxing poetic for a long since deceased masterpiece... guilty.
[/URL]

Oh my god.
Finally ACC was a hideous fantasy that never had a chance in hell
ENOUGH!

The MANDEVILLE WAS A WORK OF ART and I still hold out hope that it will reemerge!

TonyTone · #**1098** Posted **Mar 12, 2021, 7:25 AM**

What are the chances of the schuylkill becoming a dockside with boats & restaurants?

Can boats even access this area? Is it deep enough?

Or is it only for rowboats & ducks?

Imagine this side of the city having boat traffic & people. However we do have the Delaware riverfront for that eh.

JawnyJawnson · #**1099** Posted **Mar 12, 2021, 7:50 AM**

as awesome as that would be, idk if i see it happening. theres just not many areas it would work there. if im not mistaken, the schuylkill was just in the process of being dredged and the company said they couldnt do it that way bcus of all the debris they were bringing up... if philly can ever get their riverscene together, start bringing the delaware activity back... with all the new construction going on on Del ave, i feel its only a matter of time considering theres already piers

wanderer34 · #**1100** Posted **Mar 12, 2021, 2:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SEFTA

Finally ACC was a hideous fantasy that never had a chance in hell

We're already in Hell! Gas is already $3 in the city, the economy hasn't opened up yet, rents are skyrocketing, gentrification is in full swing, and we've lost major business like Lincoln Financial, Sunoco, and Sovereign. And Joe Biden doesn't seem to know what he's doing, who he's hired or where he's at, with all that dementia even though he was elected "by the American electorate". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXwNF_lPWIw

But the Riverwalk is a nice project for Philadelphia and that's my opinion. HAPPY???!!!