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  #181  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2015, 8:34 PM
CoryB CoryB is offline
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Call it a hunch but if Mady was hoping to bring Sobey's to the table for SkyCity Centre that deal might have chilled just a little.
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  #182  
Old Posted Feb 5, 2015, 12:23 AM
DearSummer DearSummer is offline
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I wonder if Ben will be back to comment further on Mady's "health issues". Is all of this a surprise to you? Was it a lack of due diligence or an active choice to not disclose this information to your investors?
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  #183  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2015, 3:10 AM
bmyers bmyers is offline
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Wink

When I posted last time I didn't realize my good bubby DearSummer made his way over to the Winnipeg thread, also looks like Mr Pi himself is here too. Great, appreciate all the support you've thrown behind our Ontario projects.

I wanted to engage this forum, but obviously from the response I received in the previous thread, posters to this thread were not interested in engaging in professional discourse.

The reason I am making this post is I want to come to the defense of Mr Mady. The suggesting that we would make up an illness is in very poor taste and quite a reflection on the persons that have made it. Chuck is an outstanding individual that has provided homes and business to people for over 40 years, he has loving children and grandchildren that may lose him and that is very sad.

We have not hidden the fact that the Collier Centre has cost overruns. We update our investors with direct emails and they can call our customer service at any time, we linked the Barrie Advance article in our Twitter feed and the email to investors. In the era of Google and social media, you cannot hide anything, nor do we want to. They are well aware of the liens and the plan to fix the problem. I'm not going to pretend the result is not extremely disappointing and was a huge surprise to me. I'm not going to pretend I understand the construction business enough to know what occurred there, but I want to make clear it was not because of Mady's health issues.

The positive in Barrie is that the construction lender is working with Mady to source the funds required to complete the project and has not pushed it into a power of sale position, which would have significantly delayed the exit of our investor's funds.

I posted the press release earlier, and made the public aware of the changes to the shareholder agreements to Winnipeg and Avenue Road, as we want to make sure the right partners are in place to move these projects towards completion and we don't want anyone to be upraised when they see a new developer associated with the project.

I figured people would be able to read between the lines on that press release, but it appears not, so I will clarify. The costs overruns on Collier Centre will likely make it very difficult to source construction financing for future projects with Mady, so it makes sense for us to bring in new partners or take control of those developments ourselves. They wouldn't likely accept Mady as a loan guarantor with his illness either.

We will continue to work with Mady and Hal Kersey on Sky City, but the project will be branded solely as a Fortress project moving forward. I wish I could post some pics of the new blackline renderings and the progress of the scale model, but that will have to wait. The Sky City website and the Sky City page on the Fortress website continue to be inundated with traffic on a daily basis, so I'm hoping they are truly interested buyers. We are just wrapping up the contract with Ellis Don to build the sales centre.

A conclusion on our other project with Mady will be announced soon:
http://m.insidehalton.com/news-story...hanging-hands/

Thank you to those that have supported the project, and hope that some of you will send well wishes to Mr Mady.

Our latest exit: Oakville <-- many more planned this year

We could also have over 10 construction starts this year in addition to the 11 sites that are currently U/C: http://fortressrealdevelopments.com/...r-winter-2015/

Lastly, if you missed it, we have Winnipeg architects 546 on our Tree House site in Toronto and one of our Edmonton sites as well.

Last edited by Jasonhouse; Feb 6, 2015 at 6:03 PM. Reason: removed personal name of a member
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  #184  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2015, 6:35 AM
DearSummer DearSummer is offline
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You thought "people would read between the lines"? Is that a joke? Do you have any morals at all? Why should your investors have to "read between the lines"?

How many investors got burned on this one: http://www.niagarathisweek.com/news-...ers-announced/

Would love to hear what the ROI for investors on Port Place was...
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  #185  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2015, 6:02 PM
Jasonhouse Jasonhouse is offline
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bmyers - Please refer to members only by their usernames, not their personal/given name, if you happen to know it through other means.

It's a simple privacy thing. If a member wants others to know their name here, they can give it themselves.



Otherwise, thank you for the post. It was informative.
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  #186  
Old Posted Feb 6, 2015, 6:10 PM
Simplicity Simplicity is offline
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Originally Posted by bmyers View Post
When I posted last time I didn't realize my good bubby DearSummer made his way over to the Winnipeg thread, also looks like Mr Pi himself Adriano Fernandes is here too. Great, appreciate all the support you've thrown behind our Ontario projects.

I wanted to engage this forum, but obviously from the response I received in the previous thread, posters to this thread were not interested in engaging in professional discourse.

The reason I am making this post is I want to come to the defense of Mr Mady. The suggesting that we would make up an illness is in very poor taste and quite a reflection on the persons that have made it. Chuck is an outstanding individual that has provided homes and business to people for over 40 years, he has loving children and grandchildren that may lose him and that is very sad.

We have not hidden the fact that the Collier Centre has cost overruns. We update our investors with direct emails and they can call our customer service at any time, we linked the Barrie Advance article in our Twitter feed and the email to investors. In the era of Google and social media, you cannot hide anything, nor do we want to. They are well aware of the liens and the plan to fix the problem. I'm not going to pretend the result is not extremely disappointing and was a huge surprise to me. I'm not going to pretend I understand the construction business enough to know what occurred there, but I want to make clear it was not because of Mady's health issues.

The positive in Barrie is that the construction lender is working with Mady to source the funds required to complete the project and has not pushed it into a power of sale position, which would have significantly delayed the exit of our investor's funds.

I posted the press release earlier, and made the public aware of the changes to the shareholder agreements to Winnipeg and Avenue Road, as we want to make sure the right partners are in place to move these projects towards completion and we don't want anyone to be upraised when they see a new developer associated with the project.

I figured people would be able to read between the lines on that press release, but it appears not, so I will clarify. The costs overruns on Collier Centre will likely make it very difficult to source construction financing for future projects with Mady, so it makes sense for us to bring in new partners or take control of those developments ourselves. They wouldn't likely accept Mady as a loan guarantor with his illness either.

We will continue to work with Mady and Hal Kersey on Sky City, but the project will be branded solely as a Fortress project moving forward. I wish I could post some pics of the new blackline renderings and the progress of the scale model, but that will have to wait. The Sky City website and the Sky City page on the Fortress website continue to be inundated with traffic on a daily basis, so I'm hoping they are truly interested buyers. We are just wrapping up the contract with Ellis Don to build the sales centre.

A conclusion on our other project with Mady will be announced soon:
http://m.insidehalton.com/news-story...hanging-hands/

Thank you to those that have supported the project, and hope that some of you will send well wishes to Mr Mady.

Our latest exit: Oakville <-- many more planned this year

We could also have over 10 construction starts this year in addition to the 11 sites that are currently U/C: http://fortressrealdevelopments.com/...r-winter-2015/

Lastly, if you missed it, we have Winnipeg architects 546 on our Tree House site in Toronto and one of our Edmonton sites as well.
Ben, in the future, save your words. There isn't a person in the entire industry across this vast country that puts any stock in what you have to say. Your entire business model is predicated on greed and empty promises. Even the analyst you paid to assess your bonds noted you as junk. The cracks are only beginning to show and they're going to result in a lot of people being wiped out. That you can pretend this has anything to do with the health of a man is beyond unconscionable. That you would drag his children and grandchildren into this is even more shameless, but what would one expect from somebody who goes to work with two convicted con artists? Like attracts like.

It took people exposing you to get you to admit that you're lying about Mady. There is no merit to the claim whatsoever that he's just sticking around to secure a grocer. That is an abject lie. Especially ironic and shameless given that Sobey's is at the verge of pushing him into bankruptcy, but no less something completely in your wheelhouse.

You only show up around here because it has a high google ranking. One of these days you'll actually address the fact that your project is already in financial trouble because you're two years behind, but evidently that won't be today.

I sincerely wonder how you sleep at night. Doing what you do - the constant lying, the intereference-running, the obfuscating, the intentional misreading of economic data, the skewed claims of returns for both investors and condo purchasers - leaves you in the realm of somebody with a sociopathic disorder. And your bosses are the same.

The worst part about all this is that the ultimate comeuppance for you just leaves yours investors in the biggest trouble because you guys ensure you take all your fees off the top.
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  #187  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2015, 12:23 AM
SD1 SD1 is offline
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"we cannot hide anything, nor do we want to"

Well, Benny, since you brought it up...

That independent analyst report on the SkyCity bonds indicated that you had ~20 syndicated mortgages set to mature on various projects in 2014. It's clear from the push back on twitter that some of them have not paid investors back as promised. Case in point:

https://twitter.com/WaltCunha/status/556146171799154689

So, in the name of "not hiding anything", what exactly is that number? How many were scheduled to complete and how many actually did exit as planned?

It's also notable that Glenn May-Anderson over at FDS seems to have a habit of blocking anyone who raises this point. Example:

https://twitter.com/AFernandes78/sta...48782781399040

Which seems kind of at odds with your comment above.
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  #188  
Old Posted Feb 7, 2015, 12:56 AM
Winnipeg Architect Winnipeg Architect is offline
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Sky City will never happen.

54321 are terrible architects.

They may not be paid their outrageous fees now on the Tree House.

Take a look at Block10 on Corydon and see how they installed the Hardie Reveal Panels without using Fry-Reglet aluminum extrusions.

It will rot.............water................ice..............insects.........and the cantilevers....................at Centre Village on Balmoral, the cantilevers all deflected and needed major repairs done at 3AM so no one would see the crew.....and the rust on the white stucco because the exterior steel stairs are rusting.........................

Not to mention BGBX which will never be finished and has been going on for over 10 years now.....................U-Cube.............still not finished.......3 levels of useless space as the stairs take 1/2 the area............Spaceship.....................we'll see I guess.

Nice track record............but all those awards..............the madness of it all.
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  #189  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 7:24 PM
BuildUpWpg BuildUpWpg is offline
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Hello everyone, I'm a new member to the forum but have been following along with the Winnipeg related posts on and off for the past couple of years.

I have 3 questions that I'm hoping the experts here can answer with something easy to understand to the layman. Excuse my ignorance here as I know I have a lot to learn.

1. Why in Winnipeg are condos so much less affordable compared to the housing market when in other Canadian cities it's the other way around?

2. Why is it so difficult to build a hi-rise condo building in Winnipeg, when in other Canadian cities, condo construction is through the roof? Take Toronto for example...look at all the 30+ story towers that are either under construction or in the planning stages. Yet so many of them are barely 50% sold and occupied. Where are the developers getting financing from and how are they not losing their shirts?

3. With all the bad press surrounding Fortress, how the heck are they getting enough sales to allow them to build so many projects this year?
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  #190  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 7:38 PM
dennis dennis is offline
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Originally Posted by BuildUpWpg View Post
Hello everyone, I'm a new member to the forum but have been following along with the Winnipeg related posts on and off for the past couple of years.

I have 3 questions that I'm hoping the experts here can answer with something easy to understand to the layman. Excuse my ignorance here as I know I have a lot to learn.

1. Why in Winnipeg are condos so much less affordable compared to the housing market when in other Canadian cities it's the other way around?

2. Why is it so difficult to build a hi-rise condo building in Winnipeg, when in other Canadian cities, condo construction is through the roof? Take Toronto for example...look at all the 30+ story towers that are either under construction ojr in the planning stages. Yet so many of them are barely 50% sold and occupied. Where are the developers getting financing from and how are they not losing their shirts?

3. With all the bad press surrounding Fortress, how the heck are they getting enough sales to allow them to build so many projects this year?
Would it be better to compare winnipeg's condo market to more similar sized cities? I.e. Quebec City or Hamilton.
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  #191  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 7:40 PM
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cheswick cheswick is offline
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Originally Posted by BuildUpWpg View Post
Hello everyone, I'm a new member to the forum but have been following along with the Winnipeg related posts on and off for the past couple of years.

I have 3 questions that I'm hoping the experts here can answer with something easy to understand to the layman. Excuse my ignorance here as I know I have a lot to learn.

1. Why in Winnipeg are condos so much less affordable compared to the housing market when in other Canadian cities it's the other way around?

2. Why is it so difficult to build a hi-rise condo building in Winnipeg, when in other Canadian cities, condo construction is through the roof? Take Toronto for example...look at all the 30+ story towers that are either under construction or in the planning stages. Yet so many of them are barely 50% sold and occupied. Where are the developers getting financing from and how are they not losing their shirts?

3. With all the bad press surrounding Fortress, how the heck are they getting enough sales to allow them to build so many projects this year?
1. They aren't. Looking at the latest RBC affordability index (http://www.rbc.com/newsroom/_assets-...0141126-HA.pdf pg6). The average detached bungalow in Manitoba sold for $313k, average two storey house sold for $323K and the average condo sold for $210k. When looking at the actual affordability measure which looks at the average income in the province servicing housing costs for the average home, Manitoba condos are the second most affodable behind Alberta.
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  #192  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 8:08 PM
Simplicity Simplicity is offline
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Originally Posted by BuildUpWpg View Post
Hello everyone, I'm a new member to the forum but have been following along with the Winnipeg related posts on and off for the past couple of years.

I have 3 questions that I'm hoping the experts here can answer with something easy to understand to the layman. Excuse my ignorance here as I know I have a lot to learn.

1. Why in Winnipeg are condos so much less affordable compared to the housing market when in other Canadian cities it's the other way around?

2. Why is it so difficult to build a hi-rise condo building in Winnipeg, when in other Canadian cities, condo construction is through the roof? Take Toronto for example...look at all the 30+ story towers that are either under construction or in the planning stages. Yet so many of them are barely 50% sold and occupied. Where are the developers getting financing from and how are they not losing their shirts?

3. With all the bad press surrounding Fortress, how the heck are they getting enough sales to allow them to build so many projects this year?
I'll answer 3 because the other two are exceptionally long answers and this one isn't.

Fortress uses a brokerage called the Condo Store. Their main objective is to sell people in international markets who never intend to take possession with pre-construction condos as an investment. It's called a 'push'; you purchase the pre-construction rights to the condo at a discount and try to 'push' it to the next guy in line. Ostensibly, those people are willing to pay more because the risk declines as the building goes up. Of course, they neglect to mention the costs involved in trying arbitrage condominiums to other people, not to mention that the very person who sells you the unit is going to turn around and dilute your unit value by building more, but this has been a fools game that's persisted since the commoditization of living space began.

But that's how they do it. And this used to be done by larger investment companies or even contractor syndicates pushing to get a project financed because their interest lay more in the construction contract rather than the purchase contract. But then the banks got wise and started realizing those guys don't mind walking away from their deposits once the construction is rolling should the shit start hitting the fan. As such, they started to demand to know the 'investor' base versus the 'end-user' base and you needed a certain ratio. The easiest way to fudge this information was to get a bunch of people who appeared to be end-users but weren't. those were the one-off condo purchasers looking for an investment who couldn't afford to walk away from $40K even if the unit value never increased because 100 units hit the market at once. And this happens all the time. There's a large movement away from this in Toronto now with a realtor named David Fleming essentially devoting his life's work to tearing down the myth of real gains in the 'push' market. But since there's a sucker born every minute, companies like Fortress make it their life's work to find them and sell them something.

A lot of that probably answers your occupancy question. The building is 'sold' enough that the developer is fine, it's those stuck with units they've never intended to occupy either hold out hope that they can still sell it or eventually turn around and rent it. Which is part of the reason why real rents are down in Toronto.
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  #193  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 8:44 PM
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So what is the profile of a typical investor in a project like Skycity? When you say "international markets" are we talking mainland China, HK, Europe, ???

Presumably one needs to have a few smarts to have enough money to dump into something like this... there must be some level of sophistication on the part of the investors.
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  #194  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 9:02 PM
Simplicity Simplicity is offline
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So what is the profile of a typical investor in a project like Skycity? When you say "international markets" are we talking mainland China, HK, Europe, ???

Presumably one needs to have a few smarts to have enough money to dump into something like this... there must be some level of sophistication on the part of the investors.
Everywhere. Money doesn't equal sophistication.

But I'll pass along an interesting little anecdote from an Asian client of mine who spent an inordinate amount of time having to fend off Ernie Walter from his family and close community members. He told me that in places like China and Hong Kong - even Vietnam - Winnipeg is Canada. So is Toronto, Vancouver, and Calgary. To them, they see a relative bargain by comparison. They're not up on the intricacies of every micro-market as far as the global markets are concerned, they just see what appears to be a Canadian discount. And many don't have a real estate savvy friend or family member on the ground to give them the ins and outs. They're relying entirely on the renderings, layouts, spec sheets, and pro formas provided by the agent. In fact, Ernie Walter used to have two Mandarin speaking sales people who would support Chinese sales efforts where investors were being promised 10% annual returns on buying condos for rent.

This isn't a new game. But part of the reason you don't see very many sales efforts here for these downtown mega projects is because this isn't the market. Glasshouse was the same. The investors are considered priority one. If a local comes along and wants to buy a unit, fantastic. They'll sell it to him. But marketing 480 square foot units for purchase to a local is a fools errand and they know it.
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  #195  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2015, 9:42 PM
BuildUpWpg BuildUpWpg is offline
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Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
Everywhere. Money doesn't equal sophistication.

But part of the reason you don't see very many sales efforts here for these downtown mega projects is because this isn't the market. Glasshouse was the same. The investors are considered priority one. If a local comes along and wants to buy a unit, fantastic. They'll sell it to him. But marketing 480 square foot units for purchase to a local is a fools errand and they know it.
So why can't Winnipeg be a market...as you mentioned, Winnipeg is Canada? If 30,000+ fools can be found to buy most of those new condos in Toronto, why can't only 150-200 fools be found to get SkyCity going? Maybe there's hope for this project after all?
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  #196  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2015, 12:02 AM
Simplicity Simplicity is offline
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Originally Posted by BuildUpWpg View Post
So why can't Winnipeg be a market...as you mentioned, Winnipeg is Canada? If 30,000+ fools can be found to buy most of those new condos in Toronto, why can't only 150-200 fools be found to get SkyCity going? Maybe there's hope for this project after all?
Conning a bunch of people into assuming there's a market for that here is only the first step. And that's really the easy step because, as you said, you don't need that many ignorant fools. The difficulty lies largely in the nearly universal incompetence within the Fortress organization. They're not developers - they're just con artists. Just like they weren't bankruptcy trustees and credit counselors, they were just con artists looking to capitalize on desperate people and that's really where they excel.

But they have a lot of people to con. They need shady 'mortgage brokers' to move a land offering at 3 times the actual value, then those same 'brokers' have to go out and sell bonds they can't understand secured by the paper it's written on to lots of unsophisticated people at triple the market rate, and then they have to get shady 'realtors' to move units. That's a lot a bullshit to coordinate. And it's expensive bullshit because it's motivated entirely by greed. But most of them time you can't. At least not on the right schedule. This project here is already blown because they're two years behind and the market has only softened. Just ask the city of Barrie what happens when you run behind. Their project would be similar to ours but it's about to be pushed into receivership and all the units are sold. That's a lot of incompetence at work. And there are numerous other projects that are maturing this year where investors have stopped receiving money already. Of course, everybody's just 'refinancing' but there's no merit to that. Just like Mady, the bank isn't interested in bailing out your incompetence unless you're gone. And who knows how it even happens. If I'm the bank, I'm asking every investor for cash to get that equity stake up to mitigate my risk. Rest assured, every single person in that project has lost money.

Except for one: Fortress. They took everybody's money up front
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  #197  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2015, 12:32 AM
Winnipeg Architect Winnipeg Architect is offline
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Originally Posted by Simplicity View Post
Everywhere. Money doesn't equal sophistication.


This isn't a new game. But part of the reason you don't see very many sales efforts here for these downtown mega projects is because this isn't the market. Glasshouse was the same. The investors are considered priority one. If a local comes along and wants to buy a unit, fantastic. They'll sell it to him. But marketing 480 square foot units for purchase to a local is a fools errand and they know it.
I agree, but they have sold a few 500SQF non-bedroom units at the Spaceship.

Winnipegers like space and I feel anything less than 700SQF is a hard sell.
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  #198  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2015, 1:00 AM
Simplicity Simplicity is offline
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I agree, but they have sold a few 500SQF non-bedroom units at the Spaceship.

Winnipegers like space and I feel anything less than 700SQF is a hard sell.
I'd agree. A 500 square foot one-bedroom is a terrible thing to own, anyway.
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  #199  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2015, 8:53 AM
DearSummer DearSummer is offline
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Originally Posted by BuildUpWpg View Post
Hello everyone, I'm a new member to the forum but have been following along with the Winnipeg related posts on and off for the past couple of years.

I have 3 questions that I'm hoping the experts here can answer with something easy to understand to the layman. Excuse my ignorance here as I know I have a lot to learn.

1. Why in Winnipeg are condos so much less affordable compared to the housing market when in other Canadian cities it's the other way around?

2. Why is it so difficult to build a hi-rise condo building in Winnipeg, when in other Canadian cities, condo construction is through the roof? Take Toronto for example...look at all the 30+ story towers that are either under construction or in the planning stages. Yet so many of them are barely 50% sold and occupied. Where are the developers getting financing from and how are they not losing their shirts?

3. With all the bad press surrounding Fortress, how the heck are they getting enough sales to allow them to build so many projects this year?
To answer #2:

Developers need something like 70% to 80% presages to get bank financing for construction. I haven't heard of anything getting build with 50% presales.
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  #200  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2015, 7:08 PM
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oftheMoon oftheMoon is offline
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I'd agree. A 500 square foot one-bedroom is a terrible thing to own, anyway.
Of interest, District Condo on James Ave have sold 14 units that are 635 sq. ft. or less. Most under 600, and 5 of them under 500.
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