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  #101  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2011, 8:32 PM
markbarbera markbarbera is offline
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Originally Posted by flar View Post
The architectural significance in this case is the damage to the urban fabric this would cause. Yes it's an eyesore on a major thoroughfare, but it's demolition would result in a gigantic empty lot. It will really change the look of the city for the worse in my opinion.

The real problem here is that it will not be replaced for many years, if ever. If somebody were actually going to build something here, I wouldn't care if it were demolished. I don't care about the friezes either.
I can appreciate your point here, and normally I would agree with your concern about the potential damage to urban fabric. But the damage to this block was already been done years ago. This is the last rotting tooth in a toothless block. Whether it stands in its current state or is demolished will make no difference to the block's health. Redevelopment may be slow to realize if it is demolished, but odds are it will be even slower if it continues to stand.
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  #102  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2011, 11:43 PM
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Historic Holbrook sculptures to stay on former federal building

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/ar...deral-building

Plans for the former federal government offices at Main and Caroline streets no longer call for razing the entire building — a change that will keep six relief sculptures by Hamilton artist Elizabeth Holbrook in place.

Downtown Councillor Jason Farr says the newest designs include keeping the facades along Caroline and Main streets intact and demolishing the remainder of the building.

“There’s been somewhat a change of heart, and I think that change of heart will appeal to those who protested the demolition in the first place,” said Farr.

However, the federal building project, led by high-profile developer Darko Vranich and his company, Vrancor, is still in its conceptual stages and is closely tied with the same company’s plans for a Staybridge hotel development at George and Caroline streets.

Vrancor spokesperson Tyler McDiarmid says the hotel project — expected to break ground this summer — is the first priority.

“When we have renderings of the completed plans, I very much look forward to sharing them,” McDiarmid wrote in an email. “Until then, our focus will be working with the city to get construction of the new Staybridge started this summer.”

Gunther Bluesz, a designer working with Vrancor on the project, said initial plans called for a joint underground parking lot between the hotel development and the federal building. This would have required the building to be totally demolished.

“At that point in time, we thought tearing it down was the best thing,” Bluesz said.

The new plan will allow Vrancor to maintain the heritage facades of the federal building while creating underground parking in the areas where the remainder of the building will be demolished.

The future of the bas relief sculptures and of the building itself caused contention among arts and heritage advocates earlier this year after Vranich filed a demolition permit for the building.

In late January, the municipal heritage committee tried to block the demolition by endorsing an 11th-hour proposal to designate the building under the Ontario Heritage Act. However, the planning committee rejected the request, arguing it sent the wrong message to the development community.

In February, the Ontario office of Public Works and Government Services Canada sent a letter to Vranich reminding him that he signed a covenant when he bought the building from the feds in 2004. In the document, Vranich promised to “conserve, protect and maintain” the heritage features of the building.

Vranich had agreed to protect the sculptures and vowed to foot the bill for removing and storing the art.

Holbrook was born and raised in Hamilton and died in 2009. She has sculptures in more than 50 public collections around the world, including the Smithsonian Institution in Washington and the Parliament building in Ottawa.
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  #103  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2011, 3:16 AM
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realcity realcity is offline
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I hope that Staybridge is not as horrible as the one on Market St. I hate that building (whatever it's called now), blank walls and pitched roof, stubbiness and all. It's like it was built by Home Depot's Sheds dept. Okay you get the point. Nevermind about our stupid height limits, we should have height minimums. If it was up to me, I would make the current height limits the minimums.. lol. In the City's community cores, Concession, Locke, Dundas etc. a minimum 2 floors, and if you're building in a streetwall with a neighbour at 3-floors that be the min.

I won't even begin ranting about the crap, soviet, Bay St Fed building, and across the street that gawd awful brick-box City Terraces building. That area seems to attract the current architecture in Hamilton, which is zero architecture. I'm not even sure they were designed, but made from stock building plans. Hamilton needs to have an "Architectural Review Board", made up a rotating term board of an architect, a couple citizens, the Ward Cslr, and a local artist -- any discipline. I'm a scraper fan, and design fan, so what can else can I say.

I was in Athens and total street walls entirely 11-floors tall. It was very cool. Athens would build taller but because of earthquakes they don;t. As long as you have a visual landmark you can walk around and kinda get lost but not really because you can use the Parthenon as a compass.

I plan on visiting D.C. (Washington not DC88) and they have a similar built city, so that nothing is taller than the Washington Monument. Ottawa also has very low height restrictions so nothing is taller than the Parliament bldg. It makes for great infilled streets, but makes a skyline worse than London, a city one-third its population.

I guess I did rant.

Last edited by realcity; Jun 9, 2011 at 3:39 AM.
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  #104  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2011, 8:00 AM
bigguy1231 bigguy1231 is offline
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Originally Posted by realcity View Post
I hope that Staybridge is not as horrible as the one on Market St. I hate that building (whatever it's called now), blank walls and pitched roof, stubbiness and all. It's like it was built by Home Depot's Sheds dept.
That building was originally Canada Posts garage. So yes it was built like a shed. They didn't do too bad of a job converting it to a hotel considering it's original purpose. It wouldn't have been my choice for a conversion but they did do it and it served it's purpose. It's an old folks home now, so I guess it's back to being a warehouse.

I'm like you when it comes to buildings and architecture. I like them tall and with some detail. I like a good skyline, to me a good looking skyline denotes prosperity even if that might not be the case.
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  #105  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2011, 8:08 AM
bigguy1231 bigguy1231 is offline
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Originally Posted by DC1983 View Post
Bratina? Is that you? How do you really feel about the south side of King St between James & John? lol
Considering most of those buildings have been empty for years with no real prospect of them ever being restored they might as well be demolished. Other than them being filler they serve no useful purpose unless of course you have tens of millions lying around that you could contribute for their restoration. But I doubt you do, so you'll just keep trying to tell other people how to spend their money.
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  #106  
Old Posted Jun 11, 2011, 10:48 PM
DC1983 DC1983 is offline
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Originally Posted by flar View Post
The architectural significance in this case is the damage to the urban fabric this would cause. Yes it's an eyesore on a major thoroughfare, but it's demolition would result in a gigantic empty lot. It will really change the look of the city for the worse in my opinion.

The real problem here is that it will not be replaced for many years, if ever. If somebody were actually going to build something here, I wouldn't care if it were demolished. I don't care about the friezes either.
Please come back! Hamilton needs more ppl w/ common sense like you and I! It's a rare commodity in this City :s

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigguy1231 View Post
Considering most of those buildings have been empty for years with no real prospect of them ever being restored they might as well be demolished. Other than them being filler they serve no useful purpose unless of course you have tens of millions lying around that you could contribute for their restoration. But I doubt you do, so you'll just keep trying to tell other people how to spend their money.
HI-larious! This was the response I was expecting.
One has to wonder whether you've been downtown at all? Infact, the storefronts along (North)King, James-John are all occupied by retail! Lots even have residential units on top (Ginos has an awesome two-storey true-loft above it). Many units above the stores are used for storage. The only wasteful ones that pop into mind are the Subway/Money Mart upper floors as they're covered by a logo-tarp.

Maybe you should go downtown and realize that Urban Alley (which is now half Urban wear, half Skater gear), Crystal Shoes, Ginos & National Pizza, Subway, Money Mart, the Employment Ctr, Tim Horton's Right House, Delta Bingo (X20), Cheapies, Christophers, The Jump Off (which has several locations across Southern-Ont.) and PIzza Pizza/Pagoda are ALLLLLLLL BUSY! All the time!!!

Anyone who tries to tell me otherwise is simply making an ignorant statement!
I invite them to a latte and walk around this area!
To my amazement, Gore Park is even busy!

I believe Bratina hates this stretch (which he continuously says he wants razed), as ppl actually stop, talk, look and 'loiter' which makes ppl form his generation 'uneasy' or 'uncomfortable'. How dare they stop and socialize!


*EDIT* I forgot to mention that the only building I hate along this stretch is Show World which I'm sure we can all agree MUST GO! The bldg is fine.. the business is not :s

Last edited by DC1983; Jun 11, 2011 at 11:07 PM. Reason: added quote/response
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  #107  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2011, 12:48 AM
bigguy1231 bigguy1231 is offline
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Originally Posted by DC1983 View Post
Please come back! Hamilton needs more ppl w/ common sense like you and I! It's a rare commodity in this City :s



HI-larious! This was the response I was expecting.
One has to wonder whether you've been downtown at all? Infact, the storefronts along (North)King, James-John are all occupied by retail! Lots even have residential units on top (Ginos has an awesome two-storey true-loft above it). Many units above the stores are used for storage. The only wasteful ones that pop into mind are the Subway/Money Mart upper floors as they're covered by a logo-tarp.

Maybe you should go downtown and realize that Urban Alley (which is now half Urban wear, half Skater gear), Crystal Shoes, Ginos & National Pizza, Subway, Money Mart, the Employment Ctr, Tim Horton's Right House, Delta Bingo (X20), Cheapies, Christophers, The Jump Off (which has several locations across Southern-Ont.) and PIzza Pizza/Pagoda are ALLLLLLLL BUSY! All the time!!!

Anyone who tries to tell me otherwise is simply making an ignorant statement!
I invite them to a latte and walk around this area!
To my amazement, Gore Park is even busy!

I believe Bratina hates this stretch (which he continuously says he wants razed), as ppl actually stop, talk, look and 'loiter' which makes ppl form his generation 'uneasy' or 'uncomfortable'. How dare they stop and socialize!


*EDIT* I forgot to mention that the only building I hate along this stretch is Show World which I'm sure we can all agree MUST GO! The bldg is fine.. the business is not :s
Maybe you should re read your post that I was referring to. You said the South side, and thats the side I was commenting on. I am well aware of the commercial activities on the North side.
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  #108  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2011, 2:01 AM
DC1983 DC1983 is offline
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Originally Posted by bigguy1231 View Post
Maybe you should re read your post that I was referring to. You said the South side, and thats the side I was commenting on. I am well aware of the commercial activities on the North side.
Thanks. Perhaps if you had any idea as to the on-goings on Downtown/Bob Bratina, you would have realized exactly where I was referring
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  #109  
Old Posted Jun 12, 2011, 4:18 AM
bigguy1231 bigguy1231 is offline
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Originally Posted by DC1983 View Post
Bratina? Is that you? How do you really feel about the south side of King St between James & John? lol
This is the quote I was referring to. If you had something else in mind you should have spelled it out more clearly.

As for what is going on downtown I am well aware of what is going on. I am down there almost every day.
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  #110  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 4:33 PM
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SteelTown SteelTown is offline
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I have the site plan for the hotel, 6 storey with 127 guest rooms and commercial on the ground floor.

It's an C shape building with a front court yard. There's a setback at the 3rd floor and up. Architect is DCYSA.
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  #111  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 4:43 PM
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It's a Staybridge Suite Hotel.
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  #112  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 4:58 PM
DC1983 DC1983 is offline
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Originally Posted by SteelTown View Post
I have the site plan for the hotel, 6 storey with 127 guest rooms and commercial on the ground floor.

It's an C shape building with a front court yard. There's a setback at the 3rd floor and up. Architect is DCYSA.
Basée à Montréal!?

http://www.dcysa.ca

Last edited by DC1983; Jun 14, 2011 at 7:22 PM.
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  #113  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 4:59 PM
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SteelTown SteelTown is offline
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Yes, them.
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  #114  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 5:02 PM
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Here's the other proposed hotel....

http://www.dcysa.ca/5-residences/6059-Homewood-Suites/

In addition to 182 rooms and suites, this 17-story hotel comes complete with a restaurant, bar, exercise room and indoor swimming pool as well as a large convention centre built to meet the needs of the city of Hamilton.
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  #115  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 5:21 PM
DC1983 DC1983 is offline
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Originally Posted by SteelTown View Post
Here's the other proposed hotel....

http://www.dcysa.ca/5-residences/6059-Homewood-Suites/

In addition to 182 rooms and suites, this 17-story hotel comes complete with a restaurant, bar, exercise room and indoor swimming pool as well as a large convention centre built to meet the needs of the city of Hamilton.
Wil the Conv. Ctr. be built in the giant gaping hole Vranic's designers left at the exact corner of Main & Bay?
If not, that empty space looks stupid!
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  #116  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 5:28 PM
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You can see the Homewood Suite along George St/Bay.

From DCYSA.....



http://www.dcysa.ca/5-residences/6059-Homewood-Suites/

Last edited by SteelTown; Jun 14, 2011 at 5:38 PM.
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  #117  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 6:22 PM
DC1983 DC1983 is offline
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Originally Posted by SteelTown View Post
You can see the Homewood Suite along George St/Bay.

From DCYSA.....



http://www.dcysa.ca/5-residences/6059-Homewood-Suites/
Are you sure? The one in the Spec render looks to be twice as wide as the Architect's rendering.

Just more proof that this is a scham! Vranic = Schamich!
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  #118  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 6:27 PM
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Yes, I'm positive it's the same building. The site plan looks stretched.
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  #119  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 6:38 PM
DC1983 DC1983 is offline
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The site plan looks stretched.
As do any truths in this project..
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  #120  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2011, 7:12 PM
jgrwatson jgrwatson is offline
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Originally Posted by markbarbera View Post
Anyone who has followed the posts that bigguy1231 makes here knows that he most definitely is not Bratina... I don't think he'll thank you for the comparison.

Bigguy and I don't always see eye to eye, but I think we are in agreement that the former Fed building has little architectural significance outside of the friezes.
Mark,

First off, I really do think you are well informed and a positive person to have on these posts. But I am actually shocked by the above comments. Urban fabric is everything. Perception, links to the past. The way a city is perceived....heritage isn't just about "looks". We designate only the beautiful, it is a very North American mentality. The fenestration alone is interesting and adds a unique perspective to the streetscape.

I completely disagree, but appreciate your opinions!

- Jesse
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