Anti-2010 protesters aim to disrupt Olympics beginning with Opening Ceremony

[Yume-sama]

Hopefully they didn't convince their European anti-G8 friends to come over

The ORN's website proudly features videos of them rioting, throwing rocks, etc.

The protesters created a "police state" by threatening violence, arson, etc., so they could then complain about a police state. There were clear threats.

This is the reaction, and yes, it is what they wanted, BUUUT, are the police supposed to not respond to these threats?

[SpongeG]

its so annoying bunch of whiners need to get off the pot and live in the real world

I am tired of reading people whine that no more condos should be built in the DTES that the DTES BELONGS to them and the poor

[GeeCee]

no it doesn't, only the poor natives since all the land was stolen from the natives, right?

[SpongeG]

I was reading some article todayabout some women who says all development must stop in the DTES it doesn't belong there - like get a clue woman

anyway my point is people are sick to death of these people and if something happens to them most people won't care if the police step in and do something they are the minority and do not garner the support of the general public

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by invisibleairwaves

The excessive security and suspensions of civil liberties are creating protesters, not the other way around.

Sure, there were always going to be a few nutjobs (looking at the native extremists and anti-capitalists...) but VANOC created more of them every time they made it clear that the IOC and its corporate sponsors superseded the rights of Metro Vancouver residents and taxpayers.

At the end of the day, I care much more about the successful implementation of the Games and the safety and security of citizens, spectators, athletes, media, and dignitaries.

What you call "excessive security and suspensions of civil liberties" has been the result of anti-Games protesters actions and activities over the last few years including their stunts like ruining the 3-year countdown/clock unveiling, ruining the Olympic Train concert, and excessive violent threats against the Games. What's most important is that these so-called "excessive security and suspensions of civil liberties" are temporary.

VANOC hasn't done anything to provoke these people. It's the fact that these are simply the "Olympic Games" that has provoked them.

[mooks28]

Oh, we need to chill. These are the usual suspects every time. There are going to be thousands of people in the streets. Only the hard core protesters are going to show. There are a lot of anti-olympic people who wouldn't be caught dead in an anarchist anti-globalization protest.

[invisibleairwaves]

Originally Posted by mr.x

At the end of the day, I care much more about the successful implementation of the Games and the safety and security of citizens, spectators, athletes, media, and dignitaries.

What you call "excessive security and suspensions of civil liberties" has been the result of anti-Games protesters actions and activities over the last few years including their stunts like ruining the 3-year countdown/clock unveiling, ruining the Olympic Train concert, and excessive violent threats against the Games. What's most important is that these so-called "excessive security and suspensions of civil liberties" are temporary.

VANOC hasn't done anything to provoke these people. It's the fact that these are simply the "Olympic Games" that has provoked them.

Yeah, it's just because it's the Olympics. Right. Nobody cares about the massive bill, forcing cuts to such minor services as healthcare and education. Nobody cares about the fact that the poorest urban neighbourhood in Canada is a couple blocks from the biggest venues. Nobody cares about the idea that your rights as a citizen can be suspended for a sports event. It's all just blind hatred of the concept of the Olympics.

I'll concede that the protests are, at this point, pretty futile. But, like it or not, they have the right to voice their opinion, even if it makes your precious games look bad. I am hoping the security force respects that right, leaves peaceful protesters alone and completely swears off the use of agent provocateurs. But I'll believe it when I see it.

[Yume-sama]

It's actually not really about the Olympics at all, at least for those who are spearheading the issue. That's the biggest mis-understanding. Chris Shaw IS a professional protester. He protests the G8, the G12. The Vancouver Olympics kind of fell in to his lap, even he admits, and it has been a very good movement to further his biggest cause... himself. But along the way he was a vocal anti-Chicago 2016 advocate, and now, he has seemingly moved on to being anti-2016 Toronto Pan Am Games advocate. He is just, quite simply, against whatever is in the news. So that he can get in the news himself and sell his book Yes, he has gained some followers, however, they are more anti-capitalist, anti-globalization. anti-whatever, than particularly anti-Olympic.

To further his goal of being "anti-whatever" he clings on to special interests in any given city. He doesn't ACTUALLY really care.

Let's all hope he moves to Rio and becomes anti-2016 Olympics. But, there's less bleeding heart lefties to pander to down there.

I have a feeling he would find out what a police state is, if he tried, anyways.

And, I do ask, what rights have been taken away because of the Olympics? What can you not do that you could do before? It's fun to say, but there are never any examples.

I really don't care if people protest. Hell, there's a couple of protests per day in Vancouver. It's what we do. But these people have no intention of being "peaceful".

[mr.x]

Originally Posted by invisibleairwaves

Yeah, it's just because it's the Olympics. Right. Nobody cares about the massive bill, forcing cuts to such minor services as healthcare and education. Nobody cares about the fact that the poorest urban neighbourhood in Canada is a couple blocks from the biggest venues. Nobody cares about the idea that your rights as a citizen can be suspended for a sports event. It's all just blind hatred of the concept of the Olympics.

I'll concede that the protests are, at this point, pretty futile. But, like it or not, they have the right to voice their opinion, even if it makes your precious games look bad. I am hoping the security force respects that right, leaves peaceful protesters alone and completely swears off the use of agent provocateurs. But I'll believe it when I see it.

At this point, regardless of your support of the Games, it is in your interest that the Games go off successfully without any problems. They can protest all they want, as long as they are non-disruptive (not blocking streets, respective of those that support the Games and are watching events) and especially non-violent.

Cuts to healthcare and education largely have to do with the Liberal government's first few years when they were tackling their budget deficit and dealing with changing demographics and lower school enrollment in small B.C. towns.

The poorest neighbourhood in Canada is often made out to be Vancouver's own problem when it's a national problem with frigid winter major cities pass their homeless problems onto our shoulders and WE encourage that by building a never ending supply of social services and social housing. Yet still, Canada's poorest neighbourhood is NOTHING compared to many, many American cities. And yet, we are working on improving the DTES. The Olympics have been a blessing for social housing, social programs, and homeless shelters.

It's better to be more concerned about the cost efficiency of things that are part of our day to day life. Things that have annual budgets many multiples of the one-time Olympic expenditure, year after year after year. And of course things like federal stimulus money that is being not as wisely spent due to arbitrary spending deadlines that could be fixed in one short statement from the feds. To claim that the Olympics is the reason behind all our shortfalls is lazy and unacceptable when the real problems are those departments themselves.

Any society needs to balance things. If we only concentrate on the basics we will become austere and things like the Sistine Chapel, Cathedral de Notre Dame or the Sydney Opera House would have never been, we wouldn't have art or culture and the things that define us would be gone. There would be no creative development and art and culture (which I include sport to be) is a pure expression of spirit and soul, it gives us an insight into ourselves that we can't see by just looking at the numbers. And it provides enjoyment and an escape. Art and sport have existed since before civilization and they continue to be an important part of society and culture. To ignore this is to be willfully ignorant and to that there is no excuse.

[NetMapel]

Don't attend the games if you don't want to, but check out the events at the Cultural Olympiad. There are sooo many events there from music concert, theatres, visual arts and more. Go pick up the event calendar and see for yourself It's quite awesome.

[jlousa]

I'm going to carry a large sign stating "No Protesters on Stolen Native Land"

I will be one of the games supporters that will turn on the protesters should they disrupt my right to enjoy the games.

[Stingray2004]

Originally Posted by jlousa

I will be one of the games supporters that will turn on the protesters should they disrupt my right to enjoy the games.

I'll second that. And I will again re-iterate that there will be perhaps 100,000 people milling about the downtown core enjoying the games every day.

[AlexYVR]

Originally Posted by invisibleairwaves

The excessive security and suspensions of civil liberties are creating protesters, not the other way around.

Sure, there were always going to be a few nutjobs (looking at the native extremists and anti-capitalists...) but VANOC created more of them every time they made it clear that the IOC and its corporate sponsors superseded the rights of Metro Vancouver residents and taxpayers.

I agree with most of your points - such as the rights for peaceful, non-violent protest if people wish - but you're overlooking the fact that Metro Vancouver residents signed on the dotted line for all of this when 64% voted to host the Olympics in 2003. This isn't just a majority but a supermajority, showing true support for what's happening. There have been cost overruns and compromises, but these are part of any undertaking of this scale. Like ANY democratic process, it is the citizenry's right to make themselves heard - peacefully - even if they are in the minority. The Olympics are not taking these rights away. It's democracy, guy.

[johnjimbc]

In all seriousness, let me share the benefit of living in DC. Do not under any circumstances do direct or even seemingly benign confrontation of protesters. It might lead you to get swept up in any arrests that take place.

I can't count the number of times that innocent bystanders in DC ended up being rounded up if the police dealt with a protest growing confrontational. It didn't happen all the time, but there were sporadic reports from protests large and small the entire time I lived there.

I can recall protests where people walking to work or tourists checking out the sites stopped at a pedestrian walk, and ended up being "on the wrong side of the street" when the arrests began. The only decision they faced once that happened was to run or stay to explain their circumstances. But when arrests begin, police procedure is almost always to take everyone in and deal with it at the station. Result: Uninvolved people wasting hours explaining themselves to security.

The best bet is just to move away and contact authorities if they are not already present. Do that no matter how angry you may feel if someone is disrupting a peaceful crowd, or defacing property, or whatever etc. Obviously if someone is in danger, that's a different matter. But that's typically not the case. A window or street-lamp or bus stop are not worth getting involved.

A couple of other quick thoughts:

Yume, I know you hate the CBC but you should really give it a rest sometimes . It's not related to every topic. I read the CBC, and I think you and I probably agree on nearly every topic on here so what does that say? I seriously doubt millions of CBC readers have anything to do with folks planning protests in Vancouver. My sense is they must be doing a pretty good job as a new agency to be decried as both elitists and jobless wannabees . . . . that's quite a diverse range of insults . Globe and Mail provides some decent reporting, but I find the comments there nuttier than anything I see on CBC (not to mention the cultish camp quality . . . commenters at G&M actually "know" and address each other via the comment boards there which is just weird . . . its a news site not a blog . And the National Post, well, don't even get me started. Having a point of view is one thing, but the amount of blatantly incorrect information I've read in their articles astounds me. Besides, I don't think any of those news organizations are major sources of information to the "network" hoping to gather in Vancouver.

Last thought on the topic is I pity the mental refuge of someone whose attitude is, "We're peaceful but, hey, if any of the folks we're dredging up to ask to join us start breaking windows, oh well." That's the strangest display of passivism I've ever witnessed. I imagine they'd invite Charles Manson to a holiday party as well? I'm sure they'll be nowhere to be found if things go awry. Geez.

[David]

the fact that Metro Vancouver residents signed on the dotted line for all of this when 64% voted to host the Olympics in 2003.

...that's not true. It was a non-binding plebiscite which only residents of the City of Vancouver voted on

[mooks28]

Originally Posted by David

...that's not true. It was a non-binding plebiscite which only residents of the City of Vancouver voted on

That's true. I suspect that number would have been much higher than 64% if all of Metro got to vote.

[Yume-sama]

I don't have a problem with CBC reporting. In fact, I read their articles quite often.

I was more or less commenting on the deranged people who comment on every single CBC article with stuff so far out there you need a telescope to figure out what they're talking about.

And they are definitely in the majority there. And because of this have the twisted view that normal people agree with them.

[deagleman]

Originally Posted by invisibleairwaves

Yeah, it's just because it's the Olympics. Right. Nobody cares about the massive bill, forcing cuts to such minor services as healthcare and education. Nobody cares about the fact that the poorest urban neighbourhood in Canada is a couple blocks from the biggest venues. Nobody cares about the idea that your rights as a citizen can be suspended for a sports event. It's all just blind hatred of the concept of the Olympics.

I'll concede that the protests are, at this point, pretty futile. But, like it or not, they have the right to voice their opinion, even if it makes your precious games look bad. I am hoping the security force respects that right, leaves peaceful protesters alone and completely swears off the use of agent provocateurs. But I'll believe it when I see it.

Not many do care nor did they care even before the Olympics. We wouldn't have fixed our ills without the Olympics and most likely our governments would have wasted cash elsewhere.

I don't care for the Olympics much, though I do plan to enjoy it, but I simply can't stand people coming out all morally superior and self-righteous only during special occasions. Yes I get it, help poor people, save schools. I donate, pay taxes and volunteer so let me just enjoy the 2 weeks in peace without the fear that my beloved city will become an international laughing stock.

[WBC]

Originally Posted by mooks28

That's true. I suspect that number would have been much higher than 64% if all of Metro got to vote.

Depends on how you ask the question. The question was:

"Do you support or do you oppose the City of Vancouver's participation in hosting the 2010 Olympic Winter Games and Paralympic Winter Games?"

That's like asking - "would you like to participate in having fun"? And that's with Yes side being financed by the province and the no side not being financed by anybody (88 to 1 in favor of "yes" campaing spending).

It's water under the bridge at this point anyway. I know that most people on this forum are very gang ho about the Olympics (due to demographics), but you have to realize that there is a small minority that is very much for it and we'll participate in it; there is even smaller minority that is hell bent to oppose it; and then there is the majority of population that has no interest in it, won't spend money on it, and is trying their best to avoid being inconvenienced by it, if at all possible (i.e. run for the hills approach practiced by most Olympic city residents around the world).

(The above is based on my informal survey at work which resulted only in one person in 20 asked going to an event and only because they got deeply discounted tickets due to their connections to the Sweedish skiing team )

I for once am going to try to focus on tangible benefits of the games - we got Canada Line!

[djmk]

if i'm enjoying myself at these olymips and a protester gets all hot and bothered in my face, my fist will be in theirs.

it's as simple as that. bring it on boys. there will be beer in me.

you may read this and say that this is nothing but internet bravado, but let me tell you... i know i am not the only one that thinks this way. many are getting sick of these people.