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  #6381  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 2:54 AM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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lol the Wild as popular or more popular than the Twins! no, just no.

You are confusing sports played with popularity. There are probably more people playing and watching high school hockey, college hockey and pro hockey combined than there watching and playing high school baseball, college baseball and pro baseball in the Twin Cities, but as far as the Twins vs. Wild there is no contest as to which is more popular.
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  #6382  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 3:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
You are confusing sports played with popularity.

but as far as the Twins vs. Wild there is no contest as to which is more popular.
How do we gauge popularity without resorting to anecdotal evidence, then?
Twitter followers:
Wild 684K
Twins 609K
Instagram followers:
Wild: 352K
Twins: 270K
Reddit subscribers:
Wild: 16K
Twins: 11K
Facebook:
Wild: 657K likes / 621K follows
Twins: 1.1M likes / 1.1M follows

The Twins managed 100% capacity at Target Field in its inaugural season but have since slipped down to sub 70% each season since 2015. Yeah, the Twins have been really bad, but that didn't stop the Wild from having a 400+ game sellout streak when the team began play in 2000 and they have consistently exceeded 100% capacity since 2012. The Twins only seem capable of doing this when the stadium is new, at least for now.

In 2014-2015, the Wild averaged a 4.2 market share for 71 games broadcast locally in Minnesota. In 2014, the Twins averaged a 3.64 market share for prime-time games. In a good year the Twins get slightly higher (to 4.5).

From what i've been able to google in 20 minutes: The Wild are more popular on social media, achieve better capacity utilization in their arena, and have equal TV ratings.

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  #6383  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 1:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
How do we gauge popularity without resorting to anecdotal evidence, then?
Twitter followers:
Wild 684K
Twins 609K
Instagram followers:
Wild: 352K
Twins: 270K
Reddit subscribers:
Wild: 16K
Twins: 11K
Facebook:
Wild: 657K likes / 621K follows
Twins: 1.1M likes / 1.1M follows

The Twins managed 100% capacity at Target Field in its inaugural season but have since slipped down to sub 70% each season since 2015. Yeah, the Twins have been really bad, but that didn't stop the Wild from having a 400+ game sellout streak when the team began play in 2000 and they have consistently exceeded 100% capacity since 2012. The Twins only seem capable of doing this when the stadium is new, at least for now.

In 2014-2015, the Wild averaged a 4.2 market share for 71 games broadcast locally in Minnesota. In 2014, the Twins averaged a 3.64 market share for prime-time games. In a good year the Twins get slightly higher (to 4.5).

From what i've been able to google in 20 minutes: The Wild are more popular on social media, achieve better capacity utilization in their arena, and have equal TV ratings.

Personally I wouldn't dispute that the Wild are number two in the Twin Cities. The Red Wings are arguably number two in Greater Detroit, and this may also be true of the Flyers in the Philadelphia area as well.

I wouldn't say that's the case for any of the other U.S. cities that have NBA-NFL-MLB-NHL. Not even Boston or Chicago.
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  #6384  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 3:38 PM
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It's been a few years since I've actually visited Minneapolis other than brief stops at the airport, but in the past it was abundantly clear that the sports scene in MSP was basically

Vikings................Twins........Wild...Gophers...Timberwolves with the last three more or less interchangeable depending on who was doing well at a given time.

You can throw social media numbers around all day along but at the end of the day I'm going to believe what I see on the ground in terms of what's in the papers, on the news, what team gear people are wearing, etc. over instagram follows.

I suspect that the NHL would rank higher had it not gone through the disruption of being without a team for several years and then starting up again with a new franchise.

Anyway, I'll be down there this weekend and it will be interesting to see what it looks like now.
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  #6385  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 5:25 PM
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Social media will tend to skew towards a younger audience, but that makes it a good indicator of growth and sustainability. Baseball is undoubtedly the "oldest" sport in the States in terms of the audience it brings in. I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins are still the second team in Minneapolis, but you can bet Grandpa Smith wearing his Twins hat isn't posting on their Subreddit or following them on Twitter. It also makes sense that Facebook is the only platform that the Twins outperform the Wild in, given that it's definitely the site most utilized by the >40 crowd. If The MLB can't capture a younger audience the way the NBA has with its focus on superstar personalities on social media, they may find those social media comparisons will come to mirror the actual popularity of the team.
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  #6386  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 5:41 PM
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When I was in Milwaukee four years ago, it was Packers #1, Brewers #2, Bucks #3. I saw exactly one person with Bucks gear. It was a retro tshirt with the old cartoon deer on it. And it was at the Brewers game. He might have been wearing it because it looked cool as opposed to liking the team for all I know.

But I just saw that the Bucks have more Twitter followers than the Brewers, but I definitely saw several people with Brewers gear while touring around.

As I started to drive towards Madison for the football game that's when I saw more UW gear.

I just looked at Chicago Twitter followers. Says Bulls have 3m while Cubs is 1.5m.

I was in Chicago on the same trip for three days and took Hawks preseason game and one game each for Cubbies and Chi Sox.

On the streets I saw only a few cases of Bulls gear. It was the off season mind you, and they've been mediocre since the Michael days. But Cubs have also been mediocre and I was there just a couple years before their WS win. In terms of gear, it was Cubs by far over all other teams.


I will agree that social media heavily skews towards the younger crowd. Which is not a surprise. But I also think that people get an invite to like a team from their friend and they just click on okay for the hell of it and don't actually care all that much for the team. I've seen some of the phones from teenagers and their inboxes or whatever are littered with crap they don't care about anymore or never did. But they're too lazy to unsubscribe from it.

However, I should point out, I've never used any social media other than FB, and I only use that once a month. So not an expert.
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  #6387  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 6:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by suburbanite View Post
Social media will tend to skew towards a younger audience, but that makes it a good indicator of growth and sustainability. Baseball is undoubtedly the "oldest" sport in the States in terms of the audience it brings in. I wouldn't be surprised if the Twins are still the second team in Minneapolis, but you can bet Grandpa Smith wearing his Twins hat isn't posting on their Subreddit or following them on Twitter. It also makes sense that Facebook is the only platform that the Twins outperform the Wild in, given that it's definitely the site most utilized by the >40 crowd. If The MLB can't capture a younger audience the way the NBA has with its focus on superstar personalities on social media, they may find those social media comparisons will come to mirror the actual popularity of the team.
I included social media because the stereotypical breakdown is:
Social media: Under 30
Facebook: over 30
TV: over 35
Attendance: All ages

Social media is a good glimpse into team sponsorship revenue potential in younger generations. The Twins wouldn't be able to pull a Snapchat filter like the Timberwolves could, just like how the Wolves can't compete with the Twins senior generation and their usage of cable TV.
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  #6388  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 10:16 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
How do we gauge popularity without resorting to anecdotal evidence, then?
Twitter followers:
Wild 684K
Twins 609K
Instagram followers:
Wild: 352K
Twins: 270K
Reddit subscribers:
Wild: 16K
Twins: 11K
Facebook:
Wild: 657K likes / 621K follows
Twins: 1.1M likes / 1.1M follows

The Twins managed 100% capacity at Target Field in its inaugural season but have since slipped down to sub 70% each season since 2015. Yeah, the Twins have been really bad, but that didn't stop the Wild from having a 400+ game sellout streak when the team began play in 2000 and they have consistently exceeded 100% capacity since 2012. The Twins only seem capable of doing this when the stadium is new, at least for now.

In 2014-2015, the Wild averaged a 4.2 market share for 71 games broadcast locally in Minnesota. In 2014, the Twins averaged a 3.64 market share for prime-time games. In a good year the Twins get slightly higher (to 4.5).

From what i've been able to google in 20 minutes: The Wild are more popular on social media, achieve better capacity utilization in their arena, and have equal TV ratings.

Older people do not use social media for the most part so that is not truly representative of the popularity of baseball vs. hockey across all demographics - the former has an older fanbase. As for correlating sellouts/attendance with the popularity of two different sports...a little disengenous. The Twins play 81 home games a year in a 40,000 seat stadium while the Wild play 41 homes games in a 18,000 seat arena. Much more difficult to fill a stadium on a consistent basis than an arena half the size.

Having discussed the matter with a number of hockey fans in the Twin Cities on forums and in person, the vast majority, if not all, tell me the Twins are the more popular team.
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  #6389  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 10:19 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esquire View Post
It's been a few years since I've actually visited Minneapolis other than brief stops at the airport, but in the past it was abundantly clear that the sports scene in MSP was basically

Vikings................Twins........Wild...Gophers...Timberwolves with the last three more or less interchangeable depending on who was doing well at a given time.

You can throw social media numbers around all day along but at the end of the day I'm going to believe what I see on the ground in terms of what's in the papers, on the news, what team gear people are wearing, etc. over instagram follows.

I suspect that the NHL would rank higher had it not gone through the disruption of being without a team for several years and then starting up again with a new franchise.

Anyway, I'll be down there this weekend and it will be interesting to see what it looks like now.
I more or less agree with your rankings although I tend to think the Gophers might have a slightly larger following in Minny/St. Paul all things being equal (teams being equally "good" or "bad").
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  #6390  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 10:26 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
I included social media because the stereotypical breakdown is:
Social media: Under 30
Facebook: over 30
TV: over 35
Attendance: All ages

Social media is a good glimpse into team sponsorship revenue potential in younger generations. The Twins wouldn't be able to pull a Snapchat filter like the Timberwolves could, just like how the Wolves can't compete with the Twins senior generation and their usage of cable TV.
Forbes numbers are not broken down into various categories like sponsorship revenues but...

Twins - $261 million in revenues (2017)
Wild - $139 million in revenues (2017)

Stark difference. TV accounts for a significant portion but I'm confident sponsorships are greater for the Twins than the Wild.
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  #6391  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Older people do not use social media for the most part so that is not truly representative of the popularity of baseball vs. hockey across all demographics - the former has an older fanbase.
Younger people don't watch TV which is why I included numbers for both social media (heavy on young people) and TV (heavy on old people).

Quote:
Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
As for correlating sellouts/attendance with the popularity of two different sports...a little disengenous. The Twins play 81 home games a year in a 40,000 seat stadium while the Wild play 41 homes games in a 18,000 seat arena. Much more difficult to fill a stadium on a consistent basis than an arena half the size.
Other MLB teams have no problem filling their stadium for 81 home games in a season. Minnesota had no issues when their stadium was new. Wild tickets cost twice as much according to Forbes.

Since we're on this subject: typically only three or four MLB teams attain 95%+ capacity utilization over the course of a season in their stadium (usually St. Louis, Philadelphia, San Francisco, Boston, or the Chicago Cubs), which is a good indicator as to why MLB stadiums are being downsized. Yankee Stadium, for example, has been progressively downsizing and reducing its capacity since it opened.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Having discussed the matter with a number of hockey fans in the Twin Cities on forums and in person, the vast majority, if not all, tell me the Twins are the more popular team.
Good anecdotal evidence. Internet forums skew towards an older demographic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Forbes numbers are not broken down into various categories like sponsorship revenues but...

Twins - $261 million in revenues (2017)
Wild - $139 million in revenues (2017)

Stark difference. TV accounts for a significant portion but I'm confident sponsorships are greater for the Twins than the Wild.
Yes - MLB teams make much higher revenue than NHL teams. As you stated, the cable TV industry is a big difference in revenues amongst the four major sports.
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  #6392  
Old Posted May 14, 2018, 11:48 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
Younger people don't watch TV which is why I included numbers for both social media (heavy on young people) and TV (heavy on old people).


Other MLB teams have no problem filling their stadium for 81 home games in a season. Minnesota had no issues when their stadium was new. Wild tickets cost twice as much according to Forbes.


Good anecdotal evidence. Internet forums skew towards an older demographic.


Yes - MLB teams make much higher revenue than NHL teams. As you stated, the cable TV industry is a big difference in revenues amongst the four major sports.
The Wild have been a competitive playoff contender for several years while the Twins have been one of the worst teams in MLB baseball the past decade plus.

Most if not all teams have trouble "filling the ballpark" in MLB

Here's a comparison:

NHL 2017-18 attendance - 13 teams averaged 100% or greater capacity, 10 teams averaged 95%-99% capacity, 6 teams averaged less than 90% capacity, 0 teams averaged less than 70% capacity

http://www.espn.com/nhl/attendance

MLB 2017 attendance - 0 teams averaged 100% capacity, only 4 teams averaged over 90% capacity, only 4 teams averaged between 80% - 90% capacity, 15 teams averaged less then 70% capacity.

http://proxy.espn.com/mlb/attendance...sort=homeTotal

With the size of baseball stadiums, the number of baseball games each season and the time sink involved in attending those games it is highly improbable that MLB teams will come anywhere close to filling their stadiums on a consistent basis...even when said team has several consecutive playoff seasons.
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  #6393  
Old Posted May 15, 2018, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
With the size of baseball stadiums, the number of baseball games each season and the time sink involved in attending those games it is highly improbable that MLB teams will come anywhere close to filling their stadiums on a consistent basis...even when said team has several consecutive playoff seasons.
This is a conversation more well-suited to the Marketing/Attendance thread...

I already went over this in my previous post (which you neglected to copy over in your quote) - this problem is why MLB teams are downsizing their stadiums. As I stated, some teams are capable of consistently filling their stadiums, others are not and will not. Downsizing allows them to drive ticket prices up via scarcity.

To bring this thread back on topic:

There was a QMJHL finals game in Blainville this past week and one of those intermission games-for-fans things was kicking a soccer ball into one of the hockey nets from the blue line. First time I had seen this sort of sport crossover at a hockey game before.
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  #6394  
Old Posted May 15, 2018, 12:50 AM
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Originally Posted by JHikka View Post
There was a QMJHL finals game in Blainville this past week and one of those intermission games-for-fans things was kicking a soccer ball into one of the hockey nets from the blue line. First time I had seen this sort of sport crossover at a hockey game before.
Yet one more piece of evidence showing how soccer is taking over the Canadian sports landscape.
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  #6395  
Old Posted May 15, 2018, 1:32 AM
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Dakoda Shepley Visualizes a Jets Career
Randy Lange NYJets.com Contributor May 10, 2018

Every few years, the Jets become a temporary home for players sharing a common background.

A decade ago, three players born in the Pacific — Sione Po‘uha (Tonga), Ropati Pitoitua (Samoa) and Josh Mauga (Hawai‘i) — were stout islands in the Jets defense. Two offseasons back, Australian punters were the rule, as Lachlan Edwards and Tom Hackett briefly vied for the Green & White job, which Edwards won and still holds.

This rookie minicamp the accent was on Canadians in the trenches. Third-round DL Nathan Shepherd, we know about and hope to continue to hear about. Undrafted free agent guard Dakoda Shepley played right tackle and right guard for the University of British Columbia. And tryout Mark Korte played LT at the University of Alberta.

"I know a few of the players here," Shepley told me last week during the Jets' rookie minicamp. "I trained with Bentley Spain [another tryout, from North Carolina], and Mark is from the same conference, and he just got drafted fourth overall in the CFL Draft yesterday. He's going to try and make the team, and if not, he's got a pretty nice Plan B."

Oh, those Canadians, always so polite and modest. While talking up Korte's spot in the draft, not once did Shepley say, oh, by the way, I was taken fifth overall. But it's true. Korte was the first-round pick of the Ottawa Redblacks while Shepley was tabbed next by the Saskatchewan Roughriders.

But while Korte has yet to be asked back by the Jets, Shepley is under contract and is starting out at right guard.

"It's a heavy playbook so far, more than I'm used to, but I mean, it's not unmanageable," Shepley said. "I'm dealing with it pretty good. I think the coaches are happy with how I'm progressing. I'm a visual learner, so being on the field and having the walkthrough really helped me. Overall I think I'm solid so far."

Shepley checks in at 6'5", 290. He also was tops among O-linemen at the National CFL Combine with 27 reps in the 225-pound bench press and a 5.27 time in the 40. Both figures would've come in seventh among all guards at this year's NFL Combine. He also did 31 bench reps at Eastern Michigan's pro day, which would've tied for fifth among all offensive linemen at the NFL Combine.

Some might think the Canadian rules could make Shepley's NFL transition tougher. It's complicated north of the border. As he explained, British Columbia high schools play under American rules, but Simon Fraser University (where Nathan Shepherd started his college career) is the only Canadian college in the NCAA (Division II).

And since Shepley played his high school ball in Ontario, he's had about eight years of Canadian football and none of American ball, which for offensive linemen mean he's always had his defensive opponents lined up a yard off the ball before every snap.

"No, it's all football to me," he countered. "A lot of people think the line of scrimmage will make a big difference, but for me, I haven't noticed it yet. As a guard, you're not really lined up on the ball anyways, you're behind it, so you still have that yard."

Shepley returned home at the end of the minicamp, but he and his fellow rookies are due back to join the veterans for OTAs after Mother's Day. At that time he'll find himself a member of a new exclusive group on the Green & White, who already have a veteran guard by the name of Dakota (Dozier). And he'll continue on his personal Plan A:

"There's still a lot of work to be done. ... I feel like I've got a job and now I'm only on probation. I still need to earn my spot."
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  #6396  
Old Posted May 15, 2018, 9:06 PM
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Dakoda Shepley gets suitably profane shoutout from Trailer Park Boys
Justin Dunk 3downnation.com May 15, 2018

New York Jets Canadian offensive lineman and Saskatchewan Roughriders drat pick, Dakoda Shepley appears to have some fans in the Sunnyvale Trailer Park.

Shepley’s dad Vince is a huge fan of the Trailer Park Boys and even has his own Sunnyvale jersey. And he knew that Shepley’s best friend’s band, Huttch, has the same public relations person as the Trailer Park Boys, Sheila Roberts.

“My dad surprised me and sent me the video and said ‘my friends want to congratulate you for signing with the Jets‘. It was hilarious. I never thought I would see that,” Shepley said.

https://instagram.com/p/BizURlbhifl/?utm_source=ig_embed

Shepley had just finished a practice with the Jets on Tuesday morning when he saw the video shoutout.

“I actually played in the band before they were Huttch when it was called State of Us. I had to quit the band to move to British Columbia for university. My good friend Robbie Cervi started playing drums in the band when I left and they changed the name to Huttch to get a fresh start. I was in the band for about five years”

Because of the connection with Roberts and the Trailer Park Boys, Huttch went on a tour to release their own line of beers and Bubbles played the guitar for the band.

Shepley posted the video message on his Instagram from the stars of the Trailer Park Boys – Ricky, Bubbles and Julian – offering their support and some advice for the 6-foot-4, 306-pounder.

The video starts with Ricky, notorious for his malapropisms, messing up Shepley’s name, only to be corrected by Bubbles: “Ricky, it’s ‘Dakoda’ not ‘Da Yoda,’ he’s not a fucking Jedi.”

After Bubbles offers his congratulations on becoming “a superstar football player” Ricky says “it’s amazing, I don’t know how you did it, especially considering all the dope you smoke.”

Responds Bubbles: “He’s going to get investigated now.”

“I was joking about the dope stuff. Maybe,” says Ricky.

Julian offers to manage Shepley and “get him all set up when you want to retire. Or get injured.”

Ricky finishes it up: “New York Fucking Jets. Way to go, Dakoda.”

“Sorry,” says Bubbles.

The Trailer Park Boys, played by Robb Wells, Mike Smith and John Paul Tremblay, is still going strong after 12 seasons and is available on NetFlix.
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  #6397  
Old Posted May 17, 2018, 9:30 PM
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http://www.espncricinfo.com/story/_/...gue-begin-june

Quote:
Global T20 Canada, the new six-team franchise league organized by Cricket Canada and Mercuri Group based out of Chennai, will take place between June 28 and July 15.

Each team will play six games in the league phase: an initial round-robin followed by a single-match second round in which the teams will play one other opponent. The top four teams after the league phase advance to the playoffs beginning on July 12.

Similar to the IPL, the top two teams will play in the first playoff, with the winner going into the tournament final while the loser gets a second chance by playing the winner of the first elimination playoff between the third and fourth-placed teams. The final will take place on July 15 at 2pm local time, the same day as the FIFA World Cup Final in Moscow.

Though Cricket Canada president Ranjit Saini told ESPNcricinfo in February that the tournament would be spread across three venues in the greater Toronto area, the schedule unveiled this week lists all games to be held at Maple Leaf Cricket Club, 25 miles north of downtown Toronto in King City.

Saini had indicated that there may be difficulty getting permits for access to certain venues such as the centrally-located Toronto Cricket, Skating & Curling Club, which hosted the Sahara Cup ODI series between India and Pakistan in the late 1990s.

While no permanent infrastructure exists at Maple Leaf CC beyond a small clubhouse, the venue has installed temporary seating in the past to accommodate fans for a quadrangular series in 2008 between Canada, Pakistan, Sri Lanka and Zimbabwe. The Global T20 Canada website lists the seating capacity for the tournament matches at Maple Leaf CC as 7,000, meaning temporary bleachers are expected to be brought in once more for the tournament.
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  #6398  
Old Posted May 18, 2018, 2:06 PM
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Originally Posted by FrankieFlowerpot View Post
First I've heard of this. Sounds interesting. I went to the Asia/Canada vs International match at the Dome in 2011. Some very good old and current players took part. Though Lara sat in the dugout.

So apparently Steve Smith might make his return at this tournament. #1 batsman in the world and on course to be one of the greatest of all time. Then he admits to his part in ball tampering. Will forever tarnish his legacy. And he may never be the same player again.

I bet quite a few people will be interested in watching whatever team he plays for if he does indeed attend.

Hmmm... thinking I should check out a match on the way to the cottage. Not far off the 400.
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  #6399  
Old Posted May 20, 2018, 11:59 PM
elly63 elly63 is offline
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Canadian Dakoda Shepley has a chance to stick with Jets
Sean Saint Jacques jetswire.usatoday.com May 14, 2018

With the offensive line still somewhat of a concern, the Jets may have found some depth north of the border.

New York recently signed undrafted free agent Dakoda Shepley, an Ontario native who played at Canada’s University of British Colombia. There he lined up as a right tackle and right guard. Now, he’s hoping he can catch on with the Jets.

Step 1: master the playbook.

“It’s a heavy playbook so far, more than I’m used to, but I mean, it’s not unmanageable,” Shepley told the Jets’ website. “I’m dealing with it pretty good. I think the coaches are happy with how I’m progressing. I’m a visual learner, so being on the field and having the walkthrough really helped me. Overall I think I’m solid so far.”

Shepley will also have to familiarize himself with NFL rules. In Canada, the defense lines up a yard off the ball before every snap.

After being invited to rookie minicamp, Shepley is set to be back for veteran OTAs this week. He will continue to push for a spot on the offensive line, which was a huge disappointment for the Jets last year.

A large reason for that was due to injuries and ineffective play at center. The Jets are hoping those issues are solved, but last season proved that’s it’s best to have depth in the trenches.

While Shepley is far from the only insurance policy New York brought in this offseason, he could just find himself needed in a unit that seemed to run out of effective bodies last year.
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  #6400  
Old Posted May 21, 2018, 12:09 AM
isaidso isaidso is offline
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Originally Posted by elly63 View Post
As he explained, British Columbia high schools play under American rules, but Simon Fraser University (where Nathan Shepherd started his college career) is the only Canadian college in the NCAA (Division II).
Wait what?????
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