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  #41  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:17 AM
kwoldtimer kwoldtimer is offline
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Originally Posted by Architype View Post
The importance of a city within a country or internationally can really only be measured in terms of GDP or population, things like political or cultural influence are subjective and cannot really be measured accurately.

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Vancouver
4. Calgary
5. Ottawa

(no surprises)
God forbid a discussion of rankings in this forum should get subjective!
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  #42  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:29 AM
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Speaking of subjective, what year did the Toronto CMA pass the Montreal CMA?
Montreal could have still been no 1, except for what reason?
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  #43  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:30 AM
geotag277 geotag277 is offline
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Originally Posted by Ramako View Post
Objectively speaking, how could Montreal possibly be social heart of the country and more influential than Toronto when its culture and language is distinct from most of the country?
Culturally distinct? All Canadian culture has roots in Montreal.

And this distinctively un-Canadian psychological projection of language as a dividing line (or worse, as a limiting factor) is exactly why Toronto will always be a pretender.
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  #44  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:35 AM
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Originally Posted by geotag277 View Post
Culturally distinct? All Canadian culture has roots in Montreal.

And this distinctively un-Canadian psychological projection of language as a dividing line (or worse, as a limiting factor) is exactly why Toronto will always be a pretender.
An arguably somewhat dated view of Canadian culture, but yes Montreal has always been, and remains, the seat of bilingual and bicultural Canada.
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  #45  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geotag277 View Post
Culturally distinct? All Canadian culture has roots in Montreal.
Hey it's Jean Lesage's term, not mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by geotag277 View Post
And this distinctively un-Canadian psychological projection of language as a dividing line (or worse, as a limiting factor) is exactly why Toronto will always be a pretender.
A laughable claim considering that Toronto is one of the most multicultural cities in the world, with your average Torontonian regularly and peaceably interacting with fellow citizens who speak completely different languages. The last time I checked, it was the Quebecois (49.42% to be exact) and not Torontonians who consider language as being a unbridgeable cultural dividing line.

And your projection (to use your word) of my opinion as necessarily representing that of the entire city of Toronto, and thereby giving you a reason to denigrate the city, demonstrates your anti-Toronto bias.

Last edited by Ramako; Jul 2, 2017 at 2:58 AM.
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  #46  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:42 AM
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Relevance?
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  #47  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geotag277 View Post
Culturally distinct? All Canadian culture has roots in Montreal.

...
Don't tell the Newfoundlanders.
How do you say "cod tongues" in French?
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  #48  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 2:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Pinion View Post
No need for the attitude. That doesn't provide much, and is four years old.



Only if Vancouver housing crashes and oil rebounds. Metro Vancouver is nearly the size of Edmonton and Calgary combined.
And metro Montreal is the size of metro Vancouver and Calgary combined. Just sayin'
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  #49  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Architype View Post
Don't tell the Newfoundlanders.
How do you say "cod tongues" in French?
He said Canadian.
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  #50  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Architype View Post
The importance of a city within a country or internationally can really only be measured in terms of GDP or population, things like political or cultural influence are subjective and cannot really be measured accurately.

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Vancouver
4. Calgary
5. Ottawa

(no surprises)
This (and yes no surprises). I see no major changes for a couple of decades; probably for the next 50 years. After which, who knows?
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  #51  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:24 AM
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Things change all the time.

Quote:
1871
1 Montreal, Quebec
107,225
Ranked #2 in 2016.
2 Quebec, Quebec
59,699
Ranked #11 in 2016.
3 Toronto, Ontario
56,092
Ranked #1 in 2016.
4 Halifax, Nova Scotia
29,582
Ranked #14 in 2016 as a regional municipality.
5 Saint John, New Brunswick
28,805
Ranked #83 in 2016.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...by_census#1871
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  #52  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:26 AM
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Things were different 146 years ago? You don't say...
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  #53  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker View Post
He said Canadian.
I knew someone would catch that, it's a matter of interpretation. They were featured in a book about Canadian food recently.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
Things were different 146 years ago? You don't say...
That was my point, yes.
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  #54  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Architype View Post
The importance of a city within a country or internationally can really only be measured in terms of GDP or population, things like political or cultural influence are subjective and cannot really be measured accurately.

1. Toronto
2. Montreal
3. Vancouver
4. Calgary
5. Ottawa

(no surprises)
That's fine, but then you have to put Edmonton in #5 both by population and GDP (the latter by a significant margin):
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/tables-tabl...emo05a-eng.htm
http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quoti.../t001b-eng.htm

Last edited by urbanroo; Jul 2, 2017 at 4:09 AM.
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  #55  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 3:43 AM
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Originally Posted by balletomane View Post
How would you rank be Canada's 5 most important cities and why?
The premise of this thread is meaningless. Who thinks in terms of Canada's "5 most important cities"? Since when has this ever been a thing? You might as well ask for the seven most important crustaceans in Hungary or the four best drummers who played with Jimi Hendrix.

In terms of economics, culture, influence, importance, whatever, Canada has two major cities. Not three, not five. Two. We all know there are only two, and we all know which ones they are.

The second tier of Canadian cities consists of Vancouver.

Then in the third tier you have the remaining large-ish metros: Ottawa, Calgary, Edmonton, Winnipeg, Quebec City. What order you'd rank them in is debatable.

Nobody wonders what the top five most important cities in Spain are. Or Italy. Or Japan. Or the UK. Or even the US, for that matter. Americans will do a top ten, or they'll talk about New York and Los Angeles, but it would be a vapid exercise to declare "New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Dallas and Houston--yep, those are the top five most important cities in the United States."

Top five Jewish majority countries? Top five members of Rush? Top five Jamaican medal-winners at the Winter Olympics? Top five James Dean movies? Nobody asks these questions.
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  #56  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 4:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I am open to differing views but with all due respect, you're out to lunch on a few of these.

For starters, there is no way Vancouver tops Montreal in economic matters at the moment. If anything, it might arguably that's third and ahead of Vancouver.

In terms of politics, Montreal is roughly tied with Toronto in second place IMO. Calgary is also a fairly important city politically in Canada now.

And Ottawa needs to be there in terms of historical importance as it's been the capital of Canada for over 150 years (some time before Confederation).
1. In terms of politics, you are right. A lot of prominent Canadian politicians/politics/political institutions have roots in Montreal. It probably belongs in 3rd place after Ottawa and Toronto. I was kind of using Quebec City in my rankings to represent the political prominence of Quebec writ large, but this is much too crude. Calgary of course is important but surely not more so than Edmonton as the provincial capital.

2. In terms of historical importance, sure Ottawa is important, but it really depends on the sort of history you are interested in. Vancouver has a fascinating history looking across the Pacific, which the eastern cities don't capture, so I put it before Ottawa in order to represent that. It's political role aside, I can't see placing Ottawa ahead of the other 4 in terms of history.

3. In terms of economy, thanks for the GDP charts, which do indeed show a larger GDP in Montreal than Vancouver. I guess I was thinking that Vancouver plays more of a role as an economic regional hub for shipping and for people to park their money in terms of real estate, and these things may not fully factor into the GDP ranking. Vancouver, like the other western cities, feels richer and more economically vibrant than Montreal, I must say, but the numbers don't lie, so I'm happy to switch 2 and 3.
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  #57  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 4:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Architype View Post
Speaking of subjective, what year did the Toronto CMA pass the Montreal CMA?
Montreal could have still been no 1, except for what reason?
Around 1980.
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  #58  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 4:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
The premise of this thread is meaningless. Who thinks in terms of Canada's "5 most important cities"? Since when has this ever been a thing? You might as well ask for the seven most important crustaceans in Hungary or the four best drummers who played with Jimi Hendrix.

In terms of economics, culture, influence, importance, whatever, Canada has two major cities. Not three, not five. Two. We all know there are only two, and we all know which ones they are.

The second tier of Canadian cities consists of Vancouver.

Then in the third tier you have the remaining large-ish metros: Ottawa, Calgary, Edmonton, Winnipeg, Quebec City. What order you'd rank them in is debatable.

Nobody wonders what the top five most important cities in Spain are. Or Italy. Or Japan. Or the UK. Or even the US, for that matter. Americans will do a top ten, or they'll talk about New York and Los Angeles, but it would be a vapid exercise to declare "New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Dallas and Houston--yep, those are the top five most important cities in the United States."

Top five Jewish majority countries? Top five members of Rush? Top five Jamaican medal-winners at the Winter Olympics? Top five James Dean movies? Nobody asks these questions.
An attempt to rank the cities differently than what is normally agreed upon?
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  #59  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 4:31 AM
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Toronto, Montreal, and Ottawa are the cultural, financial, economic, political, and media capitols of the country with Toronto and Montreal being well ahead of Ottawa in terms of population and economic scale.
My ranking.......Toronto/Montreal/Ottawa/Vancouver/Calgary
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  #60  
Old Posted Jul 2, 2017, 7:04 AM
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Originally Posted by MolsonExport View Post
And metro Montreal is the size of metro Vancouver and Calgary combined. Just sayin'
So? I never argued against Montreal's status as second most important, for the third time. You guys sure are touchy for such an economic powerhouse.
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