HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Alberta & British Columbia > Vancouver > Transportation & Infrastructure


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #1  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 4:35 AM
arashi_1987 arashi_1987 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 71
Easing Road Congestion in Downtown Vancouver

Sitting at home and suddenly thought about this. Maybe I'm not the first one to bring this up but maybe a way to decrease traffic congestion in the downtown core is to toll roads going into the downtown area (simiar to Singapore's Electornic Road Pricing scheme--ERP).

Perhaps Translink could consider putting gantries with electronic tolls up at several locations:

Map:

1) Lions Gate Bridge (or somewhere along the Stanley Park Causeway Road)
2) Burrard Street Bridge
3) Granville Street Bridge
4) Cambie Street Bridge
5) Expo Blvd (west of Quebec Street)
6) Dunsmuir Viaduct
7) Pender Street (west of Abbot Street)
8) Hastings (west of Abbot Street)
9) Abbot Street (north of Cordova Street)
10) Water Street (west of Carrall Street)
11) Waterfront Road (west of Main Street)

Pricing could be a flat rate per entry depending on time of day. $2 during rush hour? $1 other times, free late night when public transit is not running and infrequent. And of course during special days (e.g. New Years Eve, Canada Day, Celebration of Lights, the tolls could be increased?). Tolls collected would fund road and transit infrastructure!

There would be no gates for roads that lead out of downtown (e.g. Georgia Viaduct). However, a shortfall in this is that no tolls would be collected from traffic generated from and travelling within the downtown core.

Is this a crazy idea? Does anyone see any problems with this idea for Downtown Vancouver?

Last edited by arashi_1987; Sep 14, 2009 at 4:42 AM. Reason: URL added
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 4:38 AM
Yume-sama's Avatar
Yume-sama Yume-sama is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Vancouver / Calgary / Tokyo
Posts: 7,523
And when businesses all over the Downtown Core go out of business, or move, we'll have bigger problems than congestion... which isn't even that bad.

And you thought we couldn't get corporate HQ's before...
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 4:40 AM
Metro-One's Avatar
Metro-One Metro-One is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Japan
Posts: 16,806
Because that is exactly what downtown needs, another reason to choke off business.

They do it in some cities where the metro population is well over 10 million, we are currently 2.3 million. And in most of those cities there are underground or elevated freeways/expressways into the city core, which make paying a toll much more justified since one is able to drive downtown in reasonable time.
__________________
Bridging the Gap
Check out my Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/306346...h/29495547810/ and Youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV0...lhxXFxuAey_q6Q
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #4  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 4:41 AM
Yume-sama's Avatar
Yume-sama Yume-sama is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Vancouver / Calgary / Tokyo
Posts: 7,523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
Because that is exactly what downtown needs, another reason to choke off business.

They do it in some cities where the metro population is well over 10 million, we are currently 2.3 million. And in most of those cities there are underground or elevated freeways/expressways into the city core, which make paying a toll much more justified since one is able to drive downtown in reasonable time.
Not to mention much more sophisticated public transit systems, in the form of subways and many train lines that run at a high frequency to all parts, connecting to a "central" station.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #5  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 4:53 AM
Metro-One's Avatar
Metro-One Metro-One is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Japan
Posts: 16,806
Quote:
And when businesses all over the Downtown Core go out of business, or move, we'll have bigger problems than congestion... which isn't even that bad.
Thats true, driving downtown really isn't that bad, it is what one expects in a downtown core!
__________________
Bridging the Gap
Check out my Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/306346...h/29495547810/ and Youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCV0...lhxXFxuAey_q6Q
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 5:10 AM
mr.x's Avatar
mr.x mr.x is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 12,805
lol, road tolls? Not a good idea.


Ideally, i'd have Downtown Vancouver's business districts turned into a tax-free zone to bring back business.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #7  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 5:12 AM
mersar's Avatar
mersar mersar is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Calgary, AB
Posts: 10,083
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro-One View Post
Thats true, driving downtown really isn't that bad, it is what one expects in a downtown core!
Yep.

Personally from my trip there a couple weeks ago I actually find traffic in downtown Calgary to be far worse then what I experienced in downtown Vancouver, the only real bad traffic I experienced was on the Sunday when I first arrived and there had been an accident on the Port Mann just shortly before.
__________________

Live or work in the Beltline? Check out the Official Beltline web site here
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #8  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 5:22 AM
EastVanMark EastVanMark is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,600
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.x View Post
lol, road tolls? Not a good idea.


Ideally, i'd have Downtown Vancouver's business districts turned into a tax-free zone to bring back business.
Yes! Finally some sanity. We need to improve access and promote business growth, not things that discourage and drive them out.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #9  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 5:43 AM
arashi_1987 arashi_1987 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 71
Interesting. So there seems to be quite a bit of negative consequence on businesses. But then how bad of an effect does downtown's pay parking have on this though?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #10  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 5:45 AM
Spork's Avatar
Spork Spork is offline
Shoebox Dweller
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Vancouver
Posts: 1,784
The toll to get into downtown London has been shown not to reduce traffic congestion. However, the extra money from the tolls could always be put into transit, as it seems to face a chicken/egg problem in some cases.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #11  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 2:01 PM
jlousa's Avatar
jlousa jlousa is offline
Ferris Wheel Hater
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 8,371
Tax free zones are just another form of business subsidies. They should all be banned. They are one of my biggest peeves and I look forward to the day when they are made illegal on a global scale.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #12  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 5:55 PM
EastVanMark EastVanMark is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,600
Quote:
Originally Posted by arashi_1987 View Post
Interesting. So there seems to be quite a bit of negative consequence on businesses. But then how bad of an effect does downtown's pay parking have on this though?
Downtown businesses and their respective associations were all dead set against the increase in the price of already expensive street parking but as per usual in Vancouver, their complaints fell on deaf ears.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #13  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 9:23 PM
DKaz DKaz is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Kelowna BC & Edmonton AB
Posts: 4,259
The average cost of parking a car in downtown Calgary is $465 a month, the average cost in downtown Vancouver is $210, yet Calgary gets all the HQs. Downtown is dead non-business hours though.

I'm not worried about downtown Vancouver though, it's often the place to be. And on-street parking, as expensive as it is, as soon as one car pulls out, five drivers eye that spot immediately but only one can get in.

The lot on Thurlow and Alberni is struggling to get drivers in even though parking is only $190 a mo there. Lots of vacant monthly spots. I guess they were counting on redeveloping their site but missed the boom.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #14  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 9:54 PM
lightrail lightrail is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spork View Post
The toll to get into downtown London has been shown not to reduce traffic congestion. However, the extra money from the tolls could always be put into transit, as it seems to face a chicken/egg problem in some cases.
Where's your source for this bold statement?

Check this out:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...ic-781505.html
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #15  
Old Posted Sep 14, 2009, 11:14 PM
wrenegade's Avatar
wrenegade wrenegade is offline
ON3P Skis
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Lower Lonsdale, North Vancouver, BC
Posts: 2,593
The traffic isn't really that bad downtown. Once the Granville street reconstruction is finished and we have all of our east/west lanes open it will get a little better. Living through the summer when it was down to 2 lanes on Georgia has given me a new appreciation for how quickly you can get through downtown. I too think tolls are a bad idea for local roads. The only one I would be in favour of would be one on the Lions Gate. But it would have to come with the promise of more lanes Even just 1 would make a huge difference. However, because that won't ever happen, no tolls there either. So long as you give yourself an extra 5-10 minutes to walk for a bit for wherever you are going downtown, you can find a place to park pretty easily and cheaply.

The West End is another story, I hate my car when I am down there. Denman is a disaster on weekends in the summer and everywhere you want to park is permit only. However I don't see anything that can be done about that (apart from digging holes and making underground parkades...which doesn't make any economic sense) so I've accepted that fact as well.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #16  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2009, 12:17 AM
fever's Avatar
fever fever is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,019
Ticket drivers for blocking intersections.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #17  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2009, 1:39 AM
LeftCoaster's Avatar
LeftCoaster LeftCoaster is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Toroncouver
Posts: 12,624
^Agreed x1,000,000
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #18  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2009, 2:03 AM
BCPhil BCPhil is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Surrey
Posts: 2,578
The easiest way to improve traffic in Downtown Vancouver is to outlaw the use of road lanes as construction zones.

Seymour hasn't been at 100% capacity end to end for at least the last 10 years. Right now lanes are closed near Robson for where they are building on the old Capital Theater site. Previously it was lanes closed at the corner of Nelson, and before that near the corner of Drake, and on and on.

And every road is like that. When was the last time that every road in the Downtown core was unimpeded by construction projects? How long was Dunsmuir half blocked so they could work on Holt Renfrew? How long was the capacity of the Viaduct reduced (did we even get those road lanes back?)?

It is absolutely insane how much everyone who is traveling in downtown is inconvenienced so that a few rich snobs can get their sub-penthouse condos built hanging over the street. If a construction project can't use the land they OWN during construction, they shouldn't be allowed to use public land.

I don't understand how there is universal outrage at the Olympics for closing some roads and banning some parking for a month at the most, when construction has been having a worse impact on traffic for the last 10 years.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #19  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2009, 3:55 AM
delboy delboy is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 653
Quote:
Originally Posted by lightrail View Post
Where's your source for this bold statement?

Check this out:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...ic-781505.html
I'm from the UK, it is still congested, maybe less congested but congested all the same (wow that was a lot of congesteds). However, there are some 14 million people living in greater london and a deplorable road system. Can't compare to vancouver. A similar plan was scrapped in manchester which has a metro poplulaiton comparable to vancouver.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #20  
Old Posted Sep 15, 2009, 3:57 AM
delboy delboy is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 653
Quote:
Originally Posted by awvan View Post
The traffic isn't really that bad downtown. Once the Granville street reconstruction is finished and we have all of our east/west lanes open it will get a little better. Living through the summer when it was down to 2 lanes on Georgia has given me a new appreciation for how quickly you can get through downtown. I too think tolls are a bad idea for local roads. The only one I would be in favour of would be one on the Lions Gate. But it would have to come with the promise of more lanes Even just 1 would make a huge difference. However, because that won't ever happen, no tolls there either. So long as you give yourself an extra 5-10 minutes to walk for a bit for wherever you are going downtown, you can find a place to park pretty easily and cheaply.

The West End is another story, I hate my car when I am down there. Denman is a disaster on weekends in the summer and everywhere you want to park is permit only. However I don't see anything that can be done about that (apart from digging holes and making underground parkades...which doesn't make any economic sense) so I've accepted that fact as well.
I agree. I think downtown centres and bad traffic are just part of the reality. As long as the city continues to improve infrastructure and transit I can live with it. Also the beauty of vancouver is how accessible the city is without a car. I rarely use mine on the weekend when I'm off.
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Alberta & British Columbia > Vancouver > Transportation & Infrastructure
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 2:55 PM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.