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  #181  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 8:48 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
Government is not anymore prone to corruption than any other powerful organization. "Power corrupts" because power is literally the necessary component for corruption. The only guard that we have against corruption, whether it be by the government or private industry, is a strong system of laws.




Actually, the federal reserve has been discouraging investment in treasuries by keeping interest rates low. Interest rates over the past decade are just a fraction of what they were in the 1980s.
What is the point of your comments? they add nothing to the discussion nor do they refute what I said.

who cares what the federal reserve is doing about interests rates now there are bonds that go back decades that doesn't change that the largest holders of those bonds are wealthy citizens and companies.

As for your corruption comment, I cant say anything more than you are incorrect. The government bureaucracy for the most part does not have to appease public sentiment as they are not elected and they are the ones in control of monitoring corruption mainly its easier for corrupt elements to hide from themselves than a corporation that is subject to legal and consumer scrutiny

Then you just have the scale argument where the federal government is vastly larger and richer than any private organization and they have the power of the monopoly of force. Companies cant do the kinds of things governments can do like imprison people, eminent domain,use deadly force etc.

As a matter of scale alone, going off your assertion, that makes the state more likely ans susceptible to corruption than any private organization.
     
     
  #182  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 9:00 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by Obadno View Post
What is the point of your comments? they add nothing to the discussion nor do they refute what I said.

who cares what the federal reserve is doing about interests rates now there are bonds that go back decades that doesn't change that the largest holders of those bonds are wealthy citizens and companies.

As for your corruption comment, I cant say anything more than you are incorrect. The government bureaucracy for the most part does not have to appease public sentiment as they are not elected and they are the ones in control of monitoring corruption mainly its easier for corrupt elements to hide from themselves than a corporation that is subject to legal and consumer scrutiny

Then you just have the scale argument where the federal government is vastly larger and richer than any private organization and they have the power of the monopoly of force. Companies cant do the kinds of things governments can do like imprison people, eminent domain,use deadly force etc.

As a matter of scale alone, going off your assertion, that makes the state more likely ans susceptible to corruption than any private organization.
That's a lot of word soup if my comments "add nothing to the discussion nor do they refute what I said".
     
     
  #183  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 9:27 PM
Obadno Obadno is offline
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
That's a lot of word soup if my comments "add nothing to the discussion nor do they refute what I said".
Oh, I thought you were a serious person for a moment, I guess not.
     
     
  #184  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2019, 10:28 PM
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Originally Posted by jtown,man View Post
But we don't live in a world where governments play God*. I am not Jeff Bezos. I have not created a company that almost everyone buys from. I try not to buy from them, but just last night I got my GF some Christmas presents on there.

So no matter what seems to work better, we have to deal with reality. Some people are hyper-productive and revolutionize the world. Bezos has created a company that has made millions upon millions of people to have a better life by its convenience and affordability.

In any case, lets say the government took 80% of the extreme wealthies income every year. It's not like they are going to directly put that into middle-class folks pockets. A large amount would be eaten up by bureaucracy and inefficient programs etc..

*actually we do, and it usually ends up with a lot of unintended consequences
Jtown, but I didn’t suggest anything like this. I didn’t put a number on much tax they must pay, I didn’t say billionaires shouldn’t exist, I didn’t say governments invest wisely (nor private individuals for that matter).

I just described a real problem that might eventually hurt the society, which includes the said multimillionaires.
     
     
  #185  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2019, 3:51 AM
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The only meaningful caucasian immigration will come from white Hispanics. You might see resettlement of some folks from eastern bloc countries but not en masse.
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  #186  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2019, 5:20 AM
jtown,man jtown,man is offline
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Originally Posted by The North One View Post
You really think Bezos invented E-comerce? The concept is old and has been done before by numerous people. We would still have it if Bezos was never born.



As opposed to 100% of it being horded in an offshore account?
I never said he invented anything. He is just doing it a lot better than anyone else and it seems like from the amount of Amazon boxes in front of my neighbor's apartments that most people appreciate Amazon and see it as a net positive in their lives.

We would not have Amazon is Bezos didn't start it. We would have something like it, but not Amazon.
     
     
  #187  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2019, 5:00 PM
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You really think Bezos invented E-comerce? The concept is old and has been done before by numerous people. We would still have it if Bezos was never born.
There was some related tech that was developed in France as of the 1980s, before the internet protocol was made available to the general public sometime by the early or mid 90s.

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The Minitel was a videotex online service accessible through telephone lines, and was the world's most successful online service prior to the World Wide Web.

The service was rolled out experimentally in July 1980 in Saint-Malo, France, and from autumn 1980 in other areas, and introduced commercially throughout France in 1982 by the PTT (Postes, Télégraphes et Téléphones; divided since 1991 between France Télécom and La Poste). From its early days, users could make online purchases, make train reservations, check stock prices, search the telephone directory, have a mail box, and chat in a similar way to what is now made possible by the Internet.

In February 2009, France Télécom indicated the Minitel network still had 10 million monthly connections. France Télécom retired the service on 30 June 2012.
So, it was based on some ancient dial-up connection of some kind, just like the early general public internet of the 1990s, then people had these little terminals connected to their old phone lines.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel

We find it funny. They sometimes make fun of it here nowadays, like - damn, we could've done better when the US eventually developed the internet.
But it seems it wasn't so bad back then after all. Regular people in the US had nothing like this back then, right? It was probably something.

Anyway, yeah, the concept of online shopping is nothing much new. At least to us.
     
     
  #188  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2019, 5:03 PM
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Originally Posted by mousquet View Post
There was some related tech that was developed in France as of the 1980s, before the internet protocol was made available to the general public sometime by the early or mid 90s.



So, it was based on some ancient dial-up connection of some kind, just like the early general public internet of the 1990s, then people had these little terminals connected to their old phone lines.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minitel

We find it funny. They sometimes make fun of it here nowadays, like - damn, we could've done better when the US eventually developed the internet.
But it seems it wasn't so bad back then after all. Regular people in the US had nothing like this back then, right? It was probably something.

Anyway, yeah, the concept of online shopping is nothing much new. At least to us.
People here used to make fun of that all the time due to the constant references to "Minitel 3615 blablabla..." on TV shows imported from France.
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  #189  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2019, 9:15 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
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Immigration from Europe from 2013 to 2018 Census Estimates.

Orlando: 10,050
Miami/Fort Lauderdale: 9,316
Sacramento: 7,047
Los Angeles: 6,996
San Francisco: 6,862
Dallas/Fort Worth: 5,489
Phoenix: 5,002
Austin: 4,824
Seattle/Tacoma: 4,554
Houston: 3,786
Tampa: 3,751
Washington DC: 3,448
San Diego: 3,290
Minneapolis/St. Paul: 2,463
San Jose: 2,380
Riverside: 2,048
Boston: 1,403
Las Vegas: 1,040
Charlotte: 793
Philadelphia: -1,606
Denver: -1,629
Atlanta: -2,933
Detroit: -4,105
Cleveland: -4,177
Portland: -5,654
Chicago: -21,506
New York: -70,415 (NYC had growth in Eastern and Southern Europe, but huge losses in Northern and Western Europe)
     
     
  #190  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2019, 9:26 PM
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Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
Immigration from Europe from 2013 to 2018 Census Estimates.

Orlando: 10,050
Miami/Fort Lauderdale: 9,316
Sacramento: 7,047
Los Angeles: 6,996
San Francisco: 6,862
Dallas/Fort Worth: 5,489
Phoenix: 5,002
Austin: 4,824
Seattle/Tacoma: 4,554
Houston: 3,786
Tampa: 3,751
Washington DC: 3,448
San Diego: 3,290
Minneapolis/St. Paul: 2,463
San Jose: 2,380
Riverside: 2,048
Boston: 1,403
Las Vegas: 1,040
Charlotte: 793
Philadelphia: -1,606
Denver: -1,629
Atlanta: -2,933
Detroit: -4,105
Cleveland: -4,177
Portland: -5,654
Chicago: -21,506
New York: -70,415 (NYC had growth in Eastern and Southern Europe, but huge losses in Northern and Western Europe)
What does loss in immigration from a region mean? They returned to Europe (or left the US in general)? Or is it immigrants from there leaving that city (e.g. European born moving from NYC to Miami, say).

Does increase mean increase in someone born in Europe regardless of if it's European-born coming directly from Europe, or European born moving from another part of the US they resided in, or is it just gain from direct overseas immigration?
     
     
  #191  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2019, 9:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Capsicum View Post
What does loss in immigration from a region mean? They returned to Europe (or left the US in general)? Or is it immigrants from there leaving that city (e.g. European born moving from NYC to Miami, say).

Does increase mean increase in someone born in Europe regardless of if it's European-born coming directly from Europe, or European born moving from another part of the US they resided in, or is it just gain from direct overseas immigration?
I guess it's increase or decrease in the number of people born in Europe.
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  #192  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2019, 10:10 PM
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I guess it's increase or decrease in the number of people born in Europe.
I believe so--I think Chicago has lost a lot of Polish immigrants to the suburbs this decade as the Northwest side gentrifies.
     
     
  #193  
Old Posted Dec 12, 2019, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Handro View Post
I believe so--I think Chicago has lost a lot of Polish immigrants to the suburbs this decade as the Northwest side gentrifies.
These are metro numbers. Unless Dallas/Fort Worth means just the cities.
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  #194  
Old Posted Dec 12, 2019, 12:59 AM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by Capsicum View Post
What does loss in immigration from a region mean? They returned to Europe (or left the US in general)? Or is it immigrants from there leaving that city (e.g. European born moving from NYC to Miami, say).

Does increase mean increase in someone born in Europe regardless of if it's European-born coming directly from Europe, or European born moving from another part of the US they resided in, or is it just gain from direct overseas immigration?
I suspect this is absolute change in populations born in those regions. The Northeast and Great Lakes cities would be the places most likely to have aging European-born population that are now dying out.
     
     
  #195  
Old Posted Jan 13, 2020, 7:04 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
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Originally Posted by Handro View Post
I believe so--I think Chicago has lost a lot of Polish immigrants to the suburbs this decade as the Northwest side gentrifies.
After Poland joined the EU Polish immigration to the US basically stopped. There used to be a Russian community in West Hollywood but that community has declined with most of the Russian stores going out of business.
     
     
  #196  
Old Posted Jan 13, 2020, 7:06 PM
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Originally Posted by pdxtex View Post
The only meaningful caucasian immigration will come from white Hispanics. You might see resettlement of some folks from eastern bloc countries but not en masse.
White Hispanic immigration is relatively small. Some of the recent immigrants from from Venezuela to Miami might be from the White upper class.

In LA most immigrants from Latin America are more indigenous.

Last edited by RST500; Jun 20, 2021 at 9:40 PM.
     
     
  #197  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2020, 7:31 PM
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South Africans traveling to the US to escape persecution, find jobs:

https://www.tsln.com/news/symbiosis-of-need/
     
     
  #198  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 9:41 PM
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Originally Posted by RST500 View Post
White Hispanic immigration is relatively small. Some of the recent immigrants from from Venezuela to Miami might be from the White upper class.

In LA most immigrants from Latin America are more indigenous.
Venezuelan immigration has been massive over the past year but there is no demographic breakdown. If you count Afghans as White, we could see massive immigration from there if there is US withdrawal this year.
     
     
  #199  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 9:52 PM
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Venezuelan immigration to U.S. is mostly white. It's analogous to Cuban immigration to U.S.

Basically whiter, more prosperous folks who benefitted from previous dictatorships left, while poorer, browner folks who benefit from present dictatorships stayed.
     
     
  #200  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2021, 10:10 PM
RST500 RST500 is offline
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Venezuelan immigration to U.S. is mostly white. It's analogous to Cuban immigration to U.S.

Basically whiter, more prosperous folks who benefitted from previous dictatorships left, while poorer, browner folks who benefit from present dictatorships stayed.
Ironically if the rightwing wanted to Whiten immigration they would align with the left in Latin America. There has a been an American tradition of backing rightwing coup's from Reagan to Obama.
     
     
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