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  #1221  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2018, 5:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Roger Strong View Post
They're not claiming to be from the US. It's not unusual for refugees to cross several countries where they're unwelcome, to reach a safe haven.


Actually the standard practice is to immediately turn themselves into police or border officials. As such, they're not crossing illegally.

The problem is that thanks to an agreement with the US, they can't turn themselves in at official border crossings and still get their refugee claim heard.

That was OK until recently; they could claim refugee status in the US. But not any more now that white nationalists control the US government.
A lot them were rejected by the US govt. for various reasons and with many of them that occurred during the Obama administration, and the Bush and Clinton administrations....

One guy that came across last winter had lived in the US for seventeen years.

I have no problem with the govt. accepting actual refugees from Syria or from war and earthquake ravaged countries like Haiti but many of those coming here are economic migrants with no skills who just end up being a burden on society. As some of you get older and wiser and start to pay a shitload of taxes you'll begin to understand that we can't help everyone.
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  #1222  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2018, 5:25 PM
Tacheguy Tacheguy is online now
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Again this is incorrect information. Economic migrants are not allowed to stay as refugees. You really should stick to Breitbart or some other storm trooper website. And I pay plenty of taxes by the way..
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  #1223  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2018, 5:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Tacheguy View Post
Again this is incorrect information. Economic migrants are not allowed to stay as refugees. You really should stick to Breitbart or some other storm trooper website. And I pay plenty of taxes by the way..
Why is it that those on the left always attack those on the right and never offer a logical and coherent rebuttal?
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  #1224  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2018, 7:29 PM
Tacheguy Tacheguy is online now
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Perhaps a second reading would help you understand the rebuttal. After all you are the one with the big brain.
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  #1225  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2018, 8:17 PM
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Originally Posted by borkborkbork View Post
I'd kind of think the opposite. Right now, your weed dealer probably already sells other substances.

When weed is legalized, you'll buy it from a place that *only* deals in weed.

In other words, I'll go from having to deal with people who sell all sorts of drugs (with whatever risks you think may come with that) to not having to ever deal with anyone who sells hard drugs.
The consumer.

You're forgetting the service provider. These people aren't going to retire, or seek gainful employment, or start moderating SSP. They're going to the next most marketable product they have and push the shit out of it, and find an end user. They always have.

Kids respond to stigmas as well as to the thrill, and this is about the psychology of it all... regardless of how weed isn't bad compared to other drugs, it was the illegal gateway drug. The curious consumer, or cool consumer, will look for the next illegal gateway drug. The danger might be relative to them. A lot of people will get bored with the legality of weed.

More crucially, they may have trusted relationships with these dealers, who will push products on them.

If Drake is signed to label 1, and gets picked up by label 2 (the gov in this case), label one is going to find someone to replace him. And since he's the softest rapper of all time, they're going to replace him with something harder.
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  #1226  
Old Posted Jan 9, 2018, 8:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Wolf13 View Post
The consumer.

You're forgetting the service provider. These people aren't going to retire, or seek gainful employment, or start moderating SSP. They're going to the next most marketable product they have and push the shit out of it, and find an end user. They always have.

Kids respond to stigmas as well as to the thrill, and this is about the psychology of it all... regardless of how weed isn't bad compared to other drugs, it was the illegal gateway drug. The curious consumer, or cool consumer, will look for the next illegal gateway drug. The danger might be relative to them. A lot of people will get bored with the legality of weed.

More crucially, they may have trusted relationships with these dealers, who will push products on them.


If Drake is signed to label 1, and gets picked up by label 2 (the gov in this case), label one is going to find someone to replace him. And since he's the softest rapper of all time, they're going to replace him with something harder.
Just wondering if the labeling on packaging of legal cannabis will have to contain the horrific pictures and wording that cigarettes packages in Canada must now exhibit?
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  #1227  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2018, 6:49 PM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
A lot them were rejected by the US govt. for various reasons...
And nevertheless many, even those rejected by the US government, are still refugees. Others, if not refugees, still deserve consideration as immigrants.

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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
As some of you get older and wiser and start to pay a shitload of taxes you'll begin to understand that we can't help everyone.
I'm older. I pay a lot of taxes. That doesn't make my humanity or compassion go away. Nor do I consider them a burden on my taxes in the long run:

When I was in high school it was the immigrants - from Asia, Russia, the Philippines, etc. - who did their homework and got the highest marks. They got the work ethic from their parents. Later I've worked for immigrants who set up businesses here.

We all know people with grand plans to improve their lives. They're going to move to the west coast. Or overseas if the wrong party wins the election. They're going to save up, quit their jobs and go back to school. They're going to run for office and fix things.

But most never do. They're stuck in the inertia of their own lives, unable to drop or stop making new commitments even in the long term. Or unable to save, or to put in the extra effort. Or just too nervous about taking a leap into a new life.

Immigration acts as a filter. You get only the people who DO the things they said. Who got over their fears. Who put in the extra effort and made the big leap.

These are the kind of people you want as citizens. The kind who ALSO tend to start businesses and create jobs. It's just one reason why immigration is a good deal for the countries they head for.

Don't believe this?

Wall Street Journal: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

...including Google, SpaceX, Tesla, Uber, Cloudfare and more.

And it doesn't even count second generation immigrants. For example Apple, founded by the son of a Syrian refugee and the son of Polish immigrants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Why is it that those on the left always attack those on the right and never offer a logical and coherent rebuttal?
Why is it that the Breitbart crowd always thinks that those who disagree with them are on the left?
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  #1228  
Old Posted Jan 10, 2018, 7:27 PM
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^ Well said. I take no issue with refugees... in a chaotic world, we are a wealthy and safe enclave. Why wouldn't we lend a hand to help people in dire straits?

The amount of money that goes to helping refugees is small potatoes in the grand scheme of things. I don't know why anyone would get worked up about that... even if it is just a question of dollars and cents to someone, there are other things you could take issue with that have far greater implications than some refugees. It might push the emotional buttons of some, but in reality it just isn't a big financial deal. It's not like if you shut the door to refugees today that we'd be cutting income taxes 10 per cent tomorrow.
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  #1229  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 1:50 AM
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  #1230  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 5:56 AM
Curmudgeon Curmudgeon is offline
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Why is it that those on the left always attack those on the right and never offer a logical and coherent rebuttal?
I'm a centrist but I agree with you. The left has gone completely insane, dangerously so in fact.
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  #1231  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 6:04 AM
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^ Well said. I take no issue with refugees... in a chaotic world, we are a wealthy and safe enclave. Why wouldn't we lend a hand to help people in dire straits?
Smelling the roses is lovely. Canada is not all that wealthy really, I believe this country has slipped to 14th place in living standards. It also has real unemployment estimated to be around 17%, stagnant or even declining real wages, a housing crisis and a healthcare crisis. Economists are also warning that 30 to 40% of existing jobs may disappear by 2030. It is not an appropriate time to be packing the country with additional people. Immigration should be cut to near zero.
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  #1232  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 6:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Wolf13 View Post
The consumer.

You're forgetting the service provider. These people aren't going to retire, or seek gainful employment, or start moderating SSP. They're going to the next most marketable product they have and push the shit out of it, and find an end user. They always have.

Kids respond to stigmas as well as to the thrill, and this is about the psychology of it all... regardless of how weed isn't bad compared to other drugs, it was the illegal gateway drug. The curious consumer, or cool consumer, will look for the next illegal gateway drug. The danger might be relative to them. A lot of people will get bored with the legality of weed.

More crucially, they may have trusted relationships with these dealers, who will push products on them.
No.

This will never happen. Have you ever read about the prohibition of alcohol? The people who bought illegal booze did not suddenly switch to heroin or cocaine, once prohibition ended. They simply bought booze legally. The same will happen with pot. You're just repeating the same argument that the anti-legalization groups spew out. Nothing will change if marijuana becomes legal. Numerous studies in North America and Europe have proven this for nearly a century.

Besides, one can argue the biggest pusher of min altering drugs is the pharmaceutical industry. Death from overdoses of opiods and opiod derivatives has risen dramatically in the last 15 years.

Last edited by Jets4Life; Jan 25, 2018 at 6:34 AM.
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  #1233  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 11:35 AM
Tacheguy Tacheguy is online now
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Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
Smelling the roses is lovely. Canada is not all that wealthy really, I believe this country has slipped to 14th place in living standards. It also has real unemployment estimated to be around 17%, stagnant or even declining real wages, a housing crisis and a healthcare crisis. Economists are also warning that 30 to 40% of existing jobs may disappear by 2030. It is not an appropriate time to be packing the country with additional people. Immigration should be cut to near zero.
and yet there are more people employed in Canada today than ever before. jobs will disappear but also be created at a quickening pace. I think there is a pretty broad consensus among economists that Canada has an urgent need for more people. cutting off immigration would be economic suicide. you cite some real problems in Canada and I don't disagree that we have them. I just think they are policy-induced as well as resulting from the aging baby boom phenomenon. rather than reducing immigration we should probably be doubling it. and I consider myself a centrist too.
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  #1234  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Why is it that those on the left always attack those on the right and never offer a logical and coherent rebuttal?
In the age of Donald J. Trump that statement is actually pretty funny.
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Last edited by OTA in Winnipeg; Jan 25, 2018 at 2:58 PM. Reason: sp
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  #1235  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 2:03 PM
TimeFadesAway TimeFadesAway is offline
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Why is it that those on the left always attack those on the right and never offer a logical and coherent rebuttal?
I think you mixed up left and right in that sentence.
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  #1236  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 2:19 PM
dmacc dmacc is offline
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Originally Posted by TimeFadesAway View Post
I think you mixed up left and right in that sentence.
You realize you just proved his point by not providing an intelligent rebuttal. All you did was say "I know you are but what am I", like I used to do on the play ground.
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  #1237  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 2:53 PM
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Originally Posted by dmacc View Post
You realize you just proved his point by not providing an intelligent rebuttal. All you did was say "I know you are but what am I", like I used to do on the play ground.
I provided an intelligent rebuttal up above.

You ignore it, as expected, because alt-right types simply can't handle an intelligent rebuttal. When it comes from those on the right, you simply declare them to be on the left and keep parroting Breitbart mythology.
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  #1238  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 3:00 PM
TimeFadesAway TimeFadesAway is offline
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You realize you just proved his point by not providing an intelligent rebuttal. All you did was say "I know you are but what am I", like I used to do on the play ground.
What, pray tell, would be an intelligent rebuttal to "Why is it that those on the left always attack those on the right and never offer a logical and coherent rebuttal?"
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  #1239  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 3:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
Smelling the roses is lovely. Canada is not all that wealthy really, I believe this country has slipped to 14th place in living standards. It also has real unemployment estimated to be around 17%, stagnant or even declining real wages, a housing crisis and a healthcare crisis. Economists are also warning that 30 to 40% of existing jobs may disappear by 2030. It is not an appropriate time to be packing the country with additional people. Immigration should be cut to near zero.
You describe yourself as a centrist? I think you're having a severe identity crisis.
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  #1240  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2018, 3:21 PM
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Originally Posted by rrskylar View Post
Just wondering if the labeling on packaging of legal cannabis will have to contain the horrific pictures and wording that cigarettes packages in Canada must now exhibit?
I think they're planning to use photos of fictional cops from 90s TV shows. Pretty scary.
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