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  #61  
Old Posted Aug 30, 2016, 5:26 PM
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What it all really boils down to is this: the government should only operate where private interests cannot compete efficiently and effectively, and when there would be limited or no competition in the free market, in order to keep costs down and at a fair price for everyone. For instance, roads, police, jails, fire, primary health care and utilities. Mobile, internet and television content providers, are indeed utilities. There are very limited distinguishing qualities in service between providers, the cost of infrastructure is relatively astronomical and thus there is little room for innovation and profit growth besides simply raising prices. Most cities in Canada only have 2 real options for television and internet, and 3 real options for mobile (4 in Sask). We already know that it is almost impossible for new players to come in and compete in these markets, save for some smaller ISPs sharing lines from the big 3. Harper failed to bring in competition for mobile. Let's not kid ourselves to think bringing in an American carrier would help. They have similar issues down there as we do. Even Google may be pulling out of their ambitious Google Fibre plans due to costs. SaskTel needs to stay a Crown corporation, otherwise the oligopoly of the big 3 will get even stronger. We should be talking about breaking up the vertically integrated media oligopoly and not about making it bigger.

Last edited by djforsberg; Aug 30, 2016 at 8:02 PM. Reason: Spelling/grammar/clarification
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  #62  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2016, 1:08 AM
BrutallyDishonest2 BrutallyDishonest2 is offline
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Originally Posted by djforsberg View Post
What it all really boils down to is this: the government should only operate where private interests cannot compete efficiently and effectively, and when there would be limited or no competition in the free market, in order to keep costs down and at a fair price for everyone. For instance, roads, police, jails, fire, primary health care and utilities. Mobile, internet and television content providers, are indeed utilities.
If this is your argument then it fails pretty much out of the gate.

You might not like Telus, Rogers or Bell, but they have deployed perfectly good systems, simply at a higher cost. As I've mentioned earlier, Telus has more of Alberta covered than SaskTel does of Saskatchewan. And you can get get cheaper home internet in Alberta too.
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  #63  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2016, 2:55 PM
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Originally Posted by BrutallyDishonest2 View Post
If this is your argument then it fails pretty much out of the gate.

You might not like Telus, Rogers or Bell, but they have deployed perfectly good systems, simply at a higher cost. As I've mentioned earlier, Telus has more of Alberta covered than SaskTel does of Saskatchewan. And you can get get cheaper home internet in Alberta too.
Yes, but look at a map. SaskTel has coverage basically from La Ronge south, and some coverage north of La Ronge up through Buffalo Narrows, Stanley Mission etc.

The reason Telus covers so much more of the north is because there are way, way more people living in the north. Draw a line west from La Ronge through Alberta and look north of that line.

You have Fort Mac with 60K (plus thousands north of Fort Mac in work camps), Slave Lake with 7k, Peace River with 7k, Grande Prairie with 3k, Grimshaw with 3k, Fairview with 3k.
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  #64  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2016, 6:57 PM
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Yes, but look at a map. SaskTel has coverage basically from La Ronge south, and some coverage north of La Ronge up through Buffalo Narrows, Stanley Mission etc.

The reason Telus covers so much more of the north is because there are way, way more people living in the north. Draw a line west from La Ronge through Alberta and look north of that line.

You have Fort Mac with 60K (plus thousands north of Fort Mac in work camps), Slave Lake with 7k, Peace River with 7k, Grande Prairie with 3k, Grimshaw with 3k, Fairview with 3k.
Yes, but they also have the middle of nowhere covered too. So it's not like Saskatchewan is the only place doing it.
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  #65  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2016, 7:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrutallyDishonest2 View Post
If this is your argument then it fails pretty much out of the gate.

You might not like Telus, Rogers or Bell, but they have deployed perfectly good systems, simply at a higher cost. As I've mentioned earlier, Telus has more of Alberta covered than SaskTel does of Saskatchewan. And you can get get cheaper home internet in Alberta too.
OK, so beyond infrastructure, what significant differences in products and service are there between mobile carriers? I should mention that I work for TELUS (not retail).
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  #66  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2016, 8:37 PM
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Originally Posted by BrutallyDishonest2 View Post
Yes, but they also have the middle of nowhere covered too. So it's not like Saskatchewan is the only place doing it.
Except that Alberta is the only other place it's really been done in Canada, so it's still the exception rather than the norm... And part of Alberta's story is the incredible amount of resource extraction (volume and value) that has been done in the north. Telus isn't doing this for altruistic purposes. If they were, you'd see Northern Ontario, Northern Quebec, and the territories completely lit up on the coverage maps.
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  #67  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2016, 11:55 PM
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SaskTel Sign fell off its HQ building in Regina today. Witnesses report seeing this guy on the roof:



http://cjme.com/article/838008/downt...k-drive-regina
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  #68  
Old Posted Sep 1, 2016, 5:39 PM
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Yes, but they also have the middle of nowhere covered too. So it's not like Saskatchewan is the only place doing it.
The middle of no-where in Alberta has nearly 4x the people the middle of no-where Saskatchewan has. (AB Pop 4.1M, SK Pop 1.1M)

The more people/traffic the easier it is to make a business case to build the infrastructure.
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  #69  
Old Posted Sep 8, 2016, 10:26 PM
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Yes, but they also have the middle of nowhere covered too. So it's not like Saskatchewan is the only place doing it.
Middle of nowhere AB is populated, north of Edmonton is literally covered in oil/gas wells and communities supported by it. Your argument is invalid.

http://www.ertyu.org/steven_nikkel/cancellsites.html
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  #70  
Old Posted Sep 9, 2016, 1:53 AM
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Middle of nowhere AB is populated, north of Edmonton is literally covered in oil/gas wells and communities supported by it. Your argument is invalid.

http://www.ertyu.org/steven_nikkel/cancellsites.html
6 people on a rig do not count. Your arrogance is unwarranted.
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  #71  
Old Posted Sep 9, 2016, 3:44 AM
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6 people on a rig do not count. Your arrogance is unwarranted.
Unless the oil companies are/were willing to help shell out for ensuring the communications infrastructure is in place? (Not sure if they did, but it's certainly a possibility).

... Notwithstanding the arrogance of some previous commentary.
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  #72  
Old Posted Feb 16, 2017, 8:27 PM
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  #73  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2017, 3:12 PM
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Bell purchase of MTS approved with a closing date of March 17th. I am surprised the government only paid lip service to the "4 providers" idea by making them help Xplorenet. I figured they'd force them to send customers to SHAW.
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  #74  
Old Posted Feb 17, 2017, 3:58 PM
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I am starting to think that the sale of Casinos Regina and Moose Jaw is more likely than a SaskTel sale.
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  #75  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2017, 11:44 PM
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  #76  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2017, 1:18 AM
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Surprisingly, it was a very unpopular law

They did leave the "wind-up" provision 5hough, so I guess the major crowns are safe, but smaller ones could go, à la STC.
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  #77  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2017, 1:18 PM
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Unless the oil companies are/were willing to help shell out for ensuring the communications infrastructure is in place? (Not sure if they did, but it's certainly a possibility).

... Notwithstanding the arrogance of some previous commentary.
All of the monitoring gear on the oil wells is sending data in real-time back to Calgary where it is remotely monitored and acted on. The cell network plays a big part in making all of that work.
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  #78  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2018, 3:58 PM
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  #79  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2018, 4:54 PM
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Originally Posted by The Bess View Post
"“It shouldn’t be surprising that efficiency is going to go up when you privatize something because Crown corporations aren’t chasing efficiency in the same way,” Childs said.
Childs countered that the primary public and private goals are simply different,
"

Drives me nuts when public entities and private entities are compared using the same scale. Public entities do not exist for the same purpose as private ones... trying to run a Crown (or a government, for that matter), as you would a private sector organization is fundamentally flawed.

(Heads-up: I'm intentionally being hyperbolic here)
What's the ROI of a publicly-funded hospital saving one person's life? What's the return on that one life being saved? What's the Cost/Benefit to the City of putting out an isolated house fire? Does saving that one house really benefit the City's shareholders (taxpayers?) What's the benefit to the average 'shareholder' (taxpayers -a significant portion being urban taxpayers) - of a person in a remote, northern community having relatively affordable access to power, gas, or telephone services?

Debating the need for a specific Crown, or public entity is perfectly valid. PetroCan; Air Canada; PotashCorp; CN Rail; Cameco all used to be Crowns... a reasonable debate can be had about whether they should have existed in the first place (what public policy goal were they aiming to achieve?), and whether they should have been privitized. But to compare entities with completely different goals using the same yard stick? Flawed.
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  #80  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2018, 5:00 PM
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Originally Posted by The Bess View Post
Nothing mentioned in the article about the fact SaskTel and most crowns are utilities in a natural monopoly (power, energy) or oligopoly (telecom) market. If I remember correctly from Econ 101, these types of companies don’t perform well even if privately held or publicly traded and aren’t good at all for consumers.
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