Rapid Transit - Page 4

coalminecanary · #61 Posted **Apr 14, 2008, 10:39 PM**

Well Ferguson today said (almost a direct quote) 'I refuse to support any [transit initiative] that permanently eliminates car lanes on main or king'. His reasoning is that the majority of taxpayers in this city drive a car and have no choice but to drive a car every day, and taking lanes away is going to cause permanent end-of-the-world scaled traffic problems.

So if anyone is turning this into an urban vs suburban battle, it's definitely not us on this forum.

hamiltonguy · #62 Posted **Apr 14, 2008, 10:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by coalminecanary

Well Ferguson today said (almost a direct quote) 'I refuse to support any [transit initiative] that permanently eliminates car lanes on main or king'. His reasoning is that the majority of taxpayers in this city drive a car and have no choice but to drive a car every day, and taking lanes away is going to cause permanent end-of-the-world scaled traffic problems.

So if anyone is turning this into an urban vs suburban battle, it's definitely not us on this forum.

Agreed. Ferguson (and his brother), Mitchell and McCarthy started this battle long ago.

What we need is a councilor or two who will fillibuster every meeting that Ferguson, Mitchell and McCarthy attend. They've blocked any meaningful progress in the city for years by refusing to discuss anything that they don't like, and its time we ended their careers.

HAMRetrofit · #63 Posted **Apr 14, 2008, 11:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by coalminecanary

Well Ferguson today said (almost a direct quote) 'I refuse to support any [transit initiative] that permanently eliminates car lanes on main or king'. His reasoning is that the majority of taxpayers in this city drive a car and have no choice but to drive a car every day, and taking lanes away is going to cause permanent end-of-the-world scaled traffic problems.

So if anyone is turning this into an urban vs suburban battle, it's definitely not us on this forum.

This sounds like propaganda. How can an individual refuse at the minimum understanding something that will have such a positive affect on the city. Even if the mighty tax base is pro LRT, is he still going to oppose it? Last time I checked we were a democracy over here or is that not the case anymore?

coalminecanary · #64 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 2:37 AM**

I'm telling you it was crazy. He and McCarthy were literally falling all over themselves to defend what they consider the silent majority -- car lovers. They were (with straight faces) saying that the majority of the city's taxpayers were "normal people" who drive to their jobs and pay their taxes. They said we never hear from these normal people who pay their taxes on time every year because they are so busy going to work every day that they don't have time to attend council meetings. They said that they needed to defend these people's rights to their lanes since they couldn't be there to defend themselves. I'm not even kidding. They are busy defending the people who DONT BOTHER TO LET THEIR COUCILLORS KNOW THEIR STANCE ON ANYTHING.

I got news for everyone who hasn't figured it out. "Those people" that they are defending are simply themselves. Clark came back with an awesome response that basically said "have you ever talked to your constituents? cause i have talked to mine, and a lot of them are stressed out because it costs them more in gas to commute to work than they make in a day -- they are looking for real alternatives to their cars". It was great. And then when ferguson went on about removing any mention about dedicated transit lanes form the report, clark was like "you know, if we dont have dedicated lanes, we might not actually GET any money form metrolinx"... well played.

It was an interesting morning, that's for sure.

Jon Dalton · #65 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 2:55 AM**

There is no need to even comment on where the councillors come from who oppose any rapid transit initiative: Their arguments speak for themselves. Any urban/suburban tangent this goes on won't help the argument. If the debate is LRT vs. BRT, Ferguson and Mitchell have already lost. It's either grid-connected light rail vehicles in dedicated lanes or diesel / hybrid / natural gas buses in dedicated lanes. There is no 'do nothing' alternative.

the dude · #66 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 2:59 AM**

sigh. it's so fatiguing to listen to such moronic banter, but i suppose it's par for the course at city hall.

here's another map. i figure all these routes could be had for a mere $10B. ;-)

DC83 · #67 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 12:27 PM**

Lloyd Ferguson - Ward 12 -

reducing lanes on Main Street for Rapid Transit "is rediculous"...

The story was IN the Spec, but not on TheSpec.com?

EDIT: sorry, internet was acting up

Council Contacts: http://www.myhamilton.ca/myhamilton/...tyCouncillors/

Lloyd Ferguson: lferguson@hamilton.ca

We need to email them ALL to lobby for LRT... I have already started

raisethehammer · #68 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 1:08 PM**

man, I love seeing those modern streetcar photos. I hope we do this.
Yea, those two idiots from the burbs are clueless....
the 'silent majority'??? I had no clue that the 'majority' of Hamiltonians are tickled pink with our city's economy and overall state.
It just goes to show you that they actually WANT Hamilton to remain as it's been for decades. Pretty scary when people like that are in public office.
Thankfully, it's only 2 of them. And we all expected it anyhow, so no worries.

This won't be one of those suburban-urban type of issues that sees mountain councillors on the suburban side as happens quite often. They are part of the old Hamilton and will benefit directly from this. I'd expect about 2/3 of council to support this.

raisethehammer · #69 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 1:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by the dude

sigh. it's so fatiguing to listen to such moronic banter, but i suppose it's par for the course at city hall.

here's another map. i figure all these routes could be had for a mere $10B. ;-)

FYI...these streetcars also come in the 5-section variety and are very cool:

http://www.skoda.cz/darkblue/produkt...2P1T1K61ID5586

Jon Dalton · #70 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 5:58 PM**

Great to see this on the Spec's front page again today. I wrote to Ferguson as surely many others have with all this coverage. Hopefully he's getting some response from his own ward as well as the lower city.

SteelTown · #71 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 6:58 PM**

Could trains oust lanes on Main?
Transit plan would hijack car lanes on major arteries
April 15, 2008
Nicole MacIntyre

A suburban councillor is warning the city's plans to reduce lanes on its main arteries to make room for rapid transit will provoke a "rebellion" among car drivers.

"It's absolutely ridiculous," Councillor Lloyd Ferguson declared yesterday after reviewing the transit proposal.

Preliminary plans show parts of Main and King streets would be reduced from four traffic lanes to two wider lanes to create exclusive space for rapid buses or a light rail system. A fifth lane, now devoted to unloading and parking, would remain.

"Where are the vehicles supposed to go?" asked Ferguson, predicting mass congestion.

But Scott Stewart, general manager of public works, said the city must make significant changes if it is going to achieve its goal of reducing car trips by 20 per cent over the next few decades. "It's about having a vision. We're not talking about traffic now. We're talking about traffic in 15 to 20 years."

The city is in the early stages of planning a rapid transit system for the lower city and the Mountain. Staff plan to consult with the public this spring about the two transit options -- rapid buses in dedicated lanes or a light rail line.

The city would prefer to keep transit separate from other vehicles to ensure a clear path for buses or light rail, an advantage staff hope would make transit more attractive.

After council picks a preferred transit option later this year, it will take at least two years for an environmental assessment and planning to be completed.

Mayor Fred Eisenberger has already thrown his support behind a light rail system in the lower city.

"We should aspire high," he said, noting there's hope the province will pay to build the system.

raisethehammer · #72 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 7:20 PM**

go check out the Hallmarks blog on the Spec site.
People are giving it to Lloyd. Nicole has had to edit a few comments so far. haha!
I hope he's reading it and thinks twice before listening to the babble from the 'establishment' in Hamilton suggesting he run for mayor.
He's an idiot and would be roundly turfed from the Hammer. Go back to Smart Centres, chump!!! Talk to the penguin!

DHLawrence · #73 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 7:44 PM**

You almost hope that comments like his were made on purpose to rally people in support of rapid transit when they wouldn't have been otherwise. I don't know if politicians are that smart, though.

raisethehammer · #74 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 8:42 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by DHLawrence

You almost hope that comments like his were made on purpose to rally people in support of rapid transit when they wouldn't have been otherwise. I don't know if politicians are that smart, though.

some of them might be.
He's not.

hamiltonguy · #75 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 9:07 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by DHLawrence

You almost hope that comments like his were made on purpose to rally people in support of rapid transit when they wouldn't have been otherwise. I don't know if politicians are that smart, though.

Some are. For Example Stephane Dion was a Professor, and Stephen Harper was considered by his professor to be his brightest student in economics.

But I don't think we have too many at the local level, although a few are pretty intelligent such as Brad Clark, Bob Bratina, Brian McHattie, and Eisenberger ring a bell.

realcity · #76 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 11:10 PM**

^ These are our best people on council right now. Eisenburger, Clark, Bratina and McHattie.

I've been really impressed with Clark lately. Forget Jackson (when I hear him speak it's so annoying, he's just a professional politician, never say or doing anything wrong, never do anything and you'll never do anything wrong also).... I think a good mayoral contest would be between Eisenburger and Clark... at least whoever would win out of that, Hamilton would win in either case.

I'm not sure Bratina and McHattie have mayoral ambitions.. if they did that would be great too. But Clark is ramping it up.

SteelTown · #77 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 11:14 PM**

I'd love to see Marie Bountrogianni run for Mayor, she's got good leadership skills.

realcity · #78 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 11:17 PM**

nice transit routes Dude

here's my wish
http://www.raisethehammer.org/index.asp?id=454

FairHamilton · #79 Posted **Apr 15, 2008, 11:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

I hope he's reading it and thinks twice before listening to the babble from the 'establishment' in Hamilton suggesting he run for mayor.

Wouldn't you want him to run for mayor?? That would be the way to vote him out of city politics. If he continues to run in his ward anyone outside his ward can't vote against him. Running for mayor gives everyone (i.e. Hamilton Centre) the opportunity to vote him away.......

the dude · #80 Posted **Apr 16, 2008, 7:37 AM**

^stranger things have happened - bush was 'elected' president...twice! the same thing could happen here. be afraid, be very afraid.