PITTSBURGH | Development Rundown III

[BrianTH]

Yeah, we still have lots and lots of great sites available in and around Downtown and the East End. As long as things are moving at a decent pace overall, I don't need (or want) everything to be done all at once.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I haven't seen it discussed in any news articles, but demolition permits have gone out for the three historic buildings at the corner of W North Ave and Federal.

As a quick recap of how we got here, there was a plan in place to save these buildings. The Trek Development project would have integrated the facades into a new 60-unit residential building. The developer worked with the local community groups and had broad support. However, given the area is zoned Local Neighborhood Commercial (LNC) zoning variances were needed regarding height and other matters to move the project forward. Two individuals - eventually just one individual - sued in state court and got the variances the ZBA accepted overturned, and killed the project. The person in question isn't even a resident of the city - he's a property owner on Boyle Street who lives in NYC. A single rich guy who could hire a lawyer scuttled the entire project.

Trek was unable to come up with a method to make the project make financial sense under the current zoning limitations, and the buildings continued to deteriorate. Ultimately the community groups came to support the idea of demolition last spring, because there was recognition that the current setup was not advancing their development, while surrounding buildings were successfully rehabbed. The same two "NIMBYs" who blocked their redevelopment were leading a campaign to block their demolition - tipping their hand when they argued the URA should sell off the individual buildings to smaller-scale developers - tipping their hand I think as to what this fight was really about.

Regardless, thanks to these two fucks (whether they are scheming businessmen as they seem, or well-meaning preservationists who just think they know better than anyone else), we're losing three historic buildings which could have been retained in part. And whatever finally replaces them is going to have to conform to LNC zoning - which means height of only 45 feet/three stories, and a lot less square footage for apartments or any other use.

Such a messed up story. I hate that 1 person can have that big of an impact in a major city. It's just not right.

Is LNC zoning usually this much of a problem for even responsible redevelopment? Maybe it needs to be changed.

[Don't Be That Guy]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

Such a messed up story. I hate that 1 person can have that big of an impact in a major city. It's just not right.

Is LNC zoning usually this much of a problem for even responsible redevelopment? Maybe it needs to be changed.

This right here. All of this turmoil over a variance from what is really inappropriacy zoned property. a three-story 45ft height limit in the middle of a supposedly major city is ridiculous. With a couple of exceptions, the city's zoning code is not conducive to a true urban form with any real height.

[bmust71]

https://buildingpittsburgh.com

There is reference in the latest post to Turner Construction being awarded the $125 million 1501 Penn Avenue Tower, which is the Wholey's building. Last update was a 15-20 story building, right?

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

Is LNC zoning usually this much of a problem for even responsible redevelopment? Maybe it needs to be changed.

I think LNC is needlessly restrictive. That said, apartment projects involving variances do get built in LNC areas pretty commonly. See for example Lawrenceville, where many of the small/medium sized infill apartments are four stories tall. Or that new senior apartment building in Squirrel Hill which was just finished near the corner of Murray and Forward.

The real issue though is even if you can convince the ZBA to agree to the variances you're looking for and the community is broadly behind you, it only takes one person willing to hire a lawyer to drag an appeal into state court. This is the worst example I'm aware of, but similar things happened with Holy Family Church in Lawrenceville (which may still be lost).

There was an attempt, BTW, to get that block rezoned as Urban Neighborhood Commercial (UNC) instead. But that was not enough. You can build up to 85 feet in UNC, but only if it's at least 200 feet from residential zoned property - which the block clearly wasn't. And a height limit of 60 feet didn't make the finances workable.

I think Pittsburgh is - finally - heading in the right direction with the new zoning for Uptown and the riverfront areas. My guess is that rather than do a comprehensive alteration of zoning across the city they'll just continue to do this over more and more areas Honestly if they expanded the Oakland Public Realm districts and created a new one for the Baum-Centre corridor/downtown East Liberty, I think that might be enough, since it would cover just about everywhere that there's a lot of construction demand.

[photoLith]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

Such a messed up story. I hate that 1 person can have that big of an impact in a major city. It's just not right.

Is LNC zoning usually this much of a problem for even responsible redevelopment? Maybe it needs to be changed.

I say we find them and throw Molotov cocktails through their likely McMansion windows in more than likely Cranberry. But in all seriousnous, these people make me want to punch a hole through a wall.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I think LNC is needlessly restrictive. That said, apartment projects involving variances do get built in LNC areas pretty commonly. See for example Lawrenceville, where many of the small/medium sized infill apartments are four stories tall. Or that new senior apartment building in Squirrel Hill which was just finished near the corner of Murray and Forward.

The real issue though is even if you can convince the ZBA to agree to the variances you're looking for and the community is broadly behind you, it only takes one person willing to hire a lawyer to drag an appeal into state court. This is the worst example I'm aware of, but similar things happened with Holy Family Church in Lawrenceville (which may still be lost).

There was an attempt, BTW, to get that block rezoned as Urban Neighborhood Commercial (UNC) instead. But that was not enough. You can build up to 85 feet in UNC, but only if it's at least 200 feet from residential zoned property - which the block clearly wasn't. And a height limit of 60 feet didn't make the finances workable.

I think Pittsburgh is - finally - heading in the right direction with the new zoning for Uptown and the riverfront areas. My guess is that rather than do a comprehensive alteration of zoning across the city they'll just continue to do this over more and more areas Honestly if they expanded the Oakland Public Realm districts and created a new one for the Baum-Centre corridor/downtown East Liberty, I think that might be enough, since it would cover just about everywhere that there's a lot of construction demand.

Thanks for the info. I really think the Northside is the perfect place for density. It has so much potential.

Originally Posted by photoLith

I say we find them and throw Molotov cocktails through their likely McMansion windows in more than likely Cranberry. But in all seriousnous, these people make me want to punch a hole through a wall.

Pretty sure his he lives in the Mexican War Streets. But its irrelevant. I'll ready my pitchfork. Let's go.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

Looks pretty cool:



Of course it would be nice to add a cool development at the former The Edge site (or Upper Station Square as I like to think of it).

I love the massing. It's great to have high density right next to a T station. It makes perfect sense.

While driving past the site yesterday this is the rendering on the billboards at street level too.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

I love the massing. It's great to have high density right next to a T station. It makes perfect sense.

I also love the distinctively Pittsburgh-flavor you get with the river/bridge in front, the wooded ridge/incline behind, and then more buildings on top of the ridge. Even though I grew up in a super flat area (metro Detroit), these days when I go to flatter cities I am typically thinking, "Ugh, everything is so flat and where are all the bridges and trees?"

Slowly but surely we are starting to play up more and more of that multi-level effect, which is definitely cool.

[eschaton]

Planning Commission okayed the demolition of 214/216 Boulevard of the Allies, but several Planning Commission members indicated they would not look so kindly on an attempt by Troiani to demolish the remaining buildings mostly on Market Street, which are not currently condemned.

There's also a paywalled article about LG Realty's initial presentation of the "phase 1" building at the Penn Plaza site. There's not much too the article really - LG is confident that the building will go forward now there's a consent order agreement, and some protesters did show up for the meeting.

I'm still mad at what the protesters did. Having no housing at all on the site is a worse outcome than having rich people housing, since East Liberty is still gonna be gentrified, only some of the 200 tech bros who could have been housed there are going to look at buying up houses in the neighborhood instead.

[daviderik]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

I also love the distinctively Pittsburgh-flavor you get with the river/bridge in front, the wooded ridge/incline behind, and then more buildings on top of the ridge. Even though I grew up in a super flat area (metro Detroit), these days when I go to flatter cities I am typically thinking, "Ugh, everything is so flat and where are all the bridges and trees?"

Slowly but surely we are starting to play up more and more of that multi-level effect, which is definitely cool.

Speaking of Detroit. I recently watched an episode of "Grand Tour" on Amazon prime. The whole show was shot in Detroit. And wow. So many unbelievable grand old buildings just sitting empty. As much as I wanted Amazon to choose Pgh for their second HQ. After watching that I would have loved to see them move to Detroit. Rebirth of those sites would have been awesome.

[Austinlee]

Originally Posted by BrianTH

I also love the distinctively Pittsburgh-flavor you get with the river/bridge in front, the wooded ridge/incline behind, and then more buildings on top of the ridge. Even though I grew up in a super flat area (metro Detroit), these days when I go to flatter cities I am typically thinking, "Ugh, everything is so flat and where are all the bridges and trees?"

Slowly but surely we are starting to play up more and more of that multi-level effect, which is definitely cool.

Preach!

And I didn't know you were from Detroit. Awesome city. I love the urban renewal happening there. I sometimes go to Detroit Electronic Music Festival (Movement) at Hart Plaza and stay downtown. It's so much fun and I love seeing the city. I stayed in the $200 million renovated Westin Book Cadillac one year and it was the nicest hotel ever.

[eschaton]

ZBA up for 2/21:

1. Spring Hill Brewing is asking for an additional variance. I have to say that I've not been up there since it's opened, so I'm not sure how what they're asking for (second floor as public assembly area, 20 more off-street parking spaces) will affect things.

2. Conversion of this warehouse - directly across from the East End Co-op - into a restaurant.

3. Three new infill houses in Garfield (here).

Everything else pretty boring this week.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by daviderik

Speaking of Detroit. I recently watched an episode of "Grand Tour" on Amazon prime. The whole show was shot in Detroit. And wow. So many unbelievable grand old buildings just sitting empty. As much as I wanted Amazon to choose Pgh for their second HQ. After watching that I would have loved to see them move to Detroit. Rebirth of those sites would have been awesome.

I still have family there. Parts are coming back, but others are still pretty shocking. Lots of potential though, with some positive momentum, much like Pittsburgh a while back really.

[BrianTH]

Originally Posted by Austinlee

And I didn't know you were from Detroit. Awesome city. I love the urban renewal happening there. I sometimes go to Detroit Electronic Music Festival (Movement) at Hart Plaza and stay downtown. It's so much fun and I love seeing the city. I stayed in the $200 million renovated Westin Book Cadillac one year and it was the nicest hotel ever.

My Dad worked his whole career for General Motors (as a physicist in their research labs). We lived in boring suburbs growing up, and I couldn't wait to leave.

My Dad retired and then built a (very) small empire of rental homes during the Great Recession. He passed a bit ago and I was tasked with selling off the homes, which ended up generating a nice return thanks to that part of the area (around Royal Oak/Berkley) recovering. My sister took his house in Pleasant Ridge (same town he grew up in), and we visit her sometimes (I got his 1964 Corvette, and I like Pittsburgh, so she can have the house). That area is really cool--very hip with lots of neat old houses. We also visit Downtown and it is amazing to see it now (after what it was like growing up).

Long story short--it is almost surreal how different our experiences there now are from what it was like growing up there in the generic suburbs in the 1970s/80s. Which I guess is what a ton of people from Pittsburgh feel too, when they come back to visit these days.

[eschaton]

Looks like we might - finally - get some new apartments on the North Shore. The Post-Gazette is reporting a new plan for the conversion of the historic building remaining on Reedsdale Street near the T station. The old plan was a 129-room hotel which fell through due to financing concerns. The new plan will involve 33,000 square feet of Class A office space, and 20 apartment units - mostly in a new-construction annex built on the roof. Kinda a drop in the bucket, but at least it's a start.

[photoLith]

^
That's awesome, I've always hoped that building would get renovated. It's kinda not by much though, but you can take the T into downtown for free so that would be pretty sweet.

[GeneW]

Originally Posted by eschaton

Looks like we might - finally - get some new apartments on the North Shore. The Post-Gazette is reporting a new plan for the conversion of the historic building remaining on Reedsdale Street near the T station. The old plan was a 129-room hotel which fell through due to financing concerns. The new plan will involve 33,000 square feet of Class A office space, and 20 apartment units - mostly in a new-construction annex built on the roof. Kinda a drop in the bucket, but at least it's a start.

I'm all for that building being re-used but I can't imagine living there. As anyone who lives in Allegheny West can tell you, game days at the stadium are really freaking loud. I live four blocks from Heinz Field and I can hear every play of the game and every lyric when there's a concert there. By then end of Pitt's season, I'm pretty tired of Sweet Caroline.

[mikebarbaro]

Not sure if this was posted before at all but I just saw this updated rendering for the PNC Park office towers on Post Gazette...

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by mikebarbaro

Not sure if this was posted before at all but I just saw this updated rendering for the PNC Park office towers on Post Gazette...

Any news regarding the project? Hard to believe something of that scope would be built on spec.