HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Downtown & City of Ottawa


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #41  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:32 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by FutureWickedCity View Post
Would this plan require the demolition of the Goodlife gym and all those other businesses attached to the arena? Seems like an awful waste and a lot of people would really miss that Goodlife
Move GoodLife to the Horticulture temporarily
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #42  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:37 PM
c_speed3108 c_speed3108 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,808
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
Move GoodLife to the Horticulture temporarily
Jokes aside, I would suspect they would be able to accommodate the bulk of the displaced business elsewhere and the are putting back more retail than they are removing.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #43  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:41 PM
phil235's Avatar
phil235 phil235 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 3,765
Quote:
Originally Posted by c_speed3108 View Post
The biggest concern I see is that if the Green Roof on the arena (aka the replaced berm) can not support a few people sunbathing or having a picnic lunch then it certainly would not support adding temporary seating for a larger event such as a Grey Cup game.
Hard to tell from the drawing whether there will be a slope on the stadium side as well. If so, they may have room for seating. That end of the stadium where you can hang out and have a beer is one of its best features, so I can't imagine that they will lose that area entirely. But agreed, they need to factor that in. It also looks like it would be possible to use the arena concourse for football games, kind of like they do now.

Also agree with the hotel idea. There is no doubt in my mind that a hotel in the Glebe would do well.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #44  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 1:48 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
If the arena has a big window towards the football field, we can put some climate controlled seating in there!!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #45  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 2:24 PM
TransitZilla TransitZilla is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,739
Looks pretty good to me. Hopefully they can figure out a way to make the arena roof accessible or at least still have the toboggan hill in the winter. It seems to be pretty popular, and it's pretty nice to have outdoor skating and tobogganing in one spot.

Also hope that the city can improve the park, particularly the water feature, to make it more interesting and attractive to visit. This should be the best splash pad in the city.

Edit: also would like to see a hotel. Seems like a no-brainer.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #46  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 3:58 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 1,332
Quote:
Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
Why are you encouraging people to drive to major events at Lansdowne?

"Sorry if there's traffic, you live in a City. Move closer and walk. " That just tells people not to bother going there and that is exactly what has been happening with all of downtown for decades.
I didn't mean to diminish the plight of public transit users. I've lived in Ottawa for 20 years now, on all sides of the core, and now within 5km of the core.

I'm at Lansdowne a couple times a month, before and after construction, by car, bus, bike, electric scooter, on foot, and yes, hiking from Slater/Bank to Lansdowne on game day because waiting for a packed bus didn't seem appealing. I've also had the bus experience and it was fine, because it was raining and I didn't want to walk. Still made it in time for the game.

What I haven't done is schlepped from Canada Post on a yellow school bus. No thank you. I guess you'd say enough people do that so that my preferred modes aren't overloaded.

Going to Lansdowne on a random weekend is a nice outing, buying a small thing at Whole Foods and getting free parking to boot. Very nice. Biking there is relatively easy as well, hooking up with a canal or river trail and arriving with ample bike racks at Horticulture. Electric scooting, while fun and efficient, is a pain in the butt because of all the exclusion zones. Without those zones, I'd probably prefer to scoot my way down there in the summer. Far faster than public transit or driving, without the sweat of biking. One of my other favorites is to drive and park on the other side of Echo and walk across the new bridge. Also a nice way to get there.

Walking to Lansdowne during a game is pandemonium, but it's a large crowd, and I expect to be stuck going in, and stuck going out. The key is to relax.

I've waited for a bus in front of the stadium after a game, mostly because I was schmammered and didn't think a cab was going to be catchable there. Caught one within a few minutes, and it didn't take too long to get out of the 'stadium zone' to change modes of transportation.

My point is, none of these modes is particularly a pain in the ass yet, game or no, and densifying the site will be good for business and will not overload any of these modes. People panic about density for no reason. Plenty of neighborhoods in large cities around the world are far denser than this. That's my point.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #47  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 5:10 PM
rocketphish's Avatar
rocketphish rocketphish is offline
Planet Ottawa and beyond
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 12,338
'Lansdowne 2.0' includes new arena, stands, 1,200 more living units
OSEG promising next phase of park's revitalization will be cost-neutral to taxpayers

CBC News
Posted: Apr 27, 2022 10:02 AM ET | Last Updated: 4 minutes ago




The Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group's proposal for the next phase of the revitalization of Lansdowne Park includes a new arena and concert venue, a new north-side stadium structure with more than double the current retail space underneath, and 1,200 new residential units.

OSEG's proposal, unveiled Wednesday during a news conference at TD Place Stadium, will cost an estimated $330 million but will be "tax-neutral," according to OSEG president and CEO Mark Goudie, who called it a "self-financing proposition and proposal."

Goudie said the first phase of the plan involves moving the current Civic Centre arena to the east end zone of TD Place.

The standalone arena, which would remain home of the OSEG-owned Ottawa 67's and the Ottawa BlackJacks basketball team, would be reduced to 5,500 seats and would also act as a venue for concerts and other indoor events. It would have suites opening onto the field and a green roof that would meld with the existing berm that overlooks the Great Lawn at Lansdowne Park.

The second phase would involve a complete replacement of the north-side stands, with 11,100 seats on two levels (a reduction from the current 14,000), plus two "fan decks" for mingling and field-level "bunker suites," Goudie said.

The new north-side stands will be more upright than the current structure, which architect Barry Hobin called inefficient and "a total space hog."

"It's not a people building, and it's barely a sports building," said Hobin, whose firm has been tapped to design the municipally owned elements of the project, including the arena and stadium.

Goudie agreed, calling the 1967 Civic Centre and north-side stands "functionally obsolete. They're at the end of their life and need to be replaced."

The city has already spent $135 million to renovate the south-side stands at TD Place as part of the first phase of the Lansdowne Park revitalization.

Overhauling the Civic Centre also creates an opportunity for more retail and mixed-use space, from the current 40,000 square feet to 100,000.

Towering above the new north side structure will be 1,200 new residential units. Preliminary drawings show three highrise buildings dominating the centre of Lansdowne Park.

Ten per cent of the new residential units will be affordable, Goudie promised.

As they have throughout the Lansdowne Park revitalization process, speakers at Wednesday's news conference contrasted the new venue with the "concrete jungle" that existed before, with one participant claiming the Glebe site was a "sketchy" place to be before the renovation.

Goudie said in designing "Lansdowne 2.0," OSEG and its partners have stuck to the guiding principles laid out by the city.

"What this is about is place-making," he said.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...plan-1.6432445
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #48  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 5:11 PM
rocketphish's Avatar
rocketphish rocketphish is offline
Planet Ottawa and beyond
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 12,338


The arena will indeed have suites opening onto the field.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #49  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 5:24 PM
harls's Avatar
harls harls is offline
Mooderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Aylmer, Québec
Posts: 19,702
Looks like only white people go to football games.
__________________
Can I help you?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #50  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 5:36 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
So if they are building temporary seats holding 35% of the current north side capacity, that represents short of 5k. So max for a Grey Cup game would be 27k, it seems.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #51  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 5:40 PM
Tesladom Tesladom is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 467
Quote:
Originally Posted by harls View Post
Looks like only white people go to football games.
Young white people
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #52  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 8:43 PM
waterloowarrior's Avatar
waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
National Capital Region
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Eastern Ontario
Posts: 9,244
Thoughts from the ward councillor and link to his community consultation
https://twitter.com/ShawnMenard1/sta...A1rvz8vWFrhRpw
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #53  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 9:17 PM
waterloowarrior's Avatar
waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
National Capital Region
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Eastern Ontario
Posts: 9,244
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #54  
Old Posted Apr 27, 2022, 10:38 PM
Friedrich Nietzsche Friedrich Nietzsche is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Feb 2022
Posts: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by waterloowarrior View Post
"This STATE-OF-THE-ART venue will be home to the Ottawa 67’s and Ottawa Blackjacks and will host WORLD-CLASS arts and entertainment"

Uh oh they're throwing around these kind of words again get ready folks this is gonna be a disaster ... again.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #55  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2022, 12:15 AM
postingaboutottawa postingaboutottawa is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Posts: 80
"world class arts and entertainment for a venue of this size" is code for jack white and whichever comedian is breaking into the mainstream that year

if it actually has a stage, sound and light setup in line with modern shows its kind of impossible for it to end up worse than the civic centre. The city will probably go along with the overall concept but i can see there being pressure to do an estimate for what it would cost to make a roof people can walk on
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #56  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2022, 1:31 AM
rocketphish's Avatar
rocketphish rocketphish is offline
Planet Ottawa and beyond
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 12,338
New North Side + arena, for three towers with 1,200 units — a trade we should make?
There's much to like about OSEG's proposal — although it's likely to get a frosty reception at city hall and in the Glebe

Kelly Egan, Ottawa Citizen
Publishing date: Apr 27, 2022 • 3 hours ago • 3 minute read


Oh for Lansdowne’s best-laid plans — in April, the cruelest month.

Wednesday’s media briefing was held outside, Section S, South Side, in a frigid, hair-tangling wind, with snow squalling sideways across the perfectly green field, the assembled reporters looking like Shackleton’s huddled crew, the seven guest speakers not much warmer on a thin iceberg of chairs.

“I think I’ll stop now. My hands are frozen,” architect Barry Hobin said, surrendering the hand-held microphone after an abbreviated slide presentation.

One imagines the $330-million proposal may be headed for a frosty reception at city hall as well, where it is to be received by a committee of councillors in May.

There is quite a bit to like about the proposal from the Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group. It is pitching a new North Side stands, to hold 11,200 (plus standing room) and a relocation of the Civic Centre arena to where the east-end berm sits, beyond the end zone.

The new arena, or “event centre,” would be smaller (5,500 versus 9,500), thus better suited to junior hockey crowds and filling a niche for travelling entertainment acts too big for the National Arts Centre but not suitable for the Canadian Tire Centre.

(A quick history reminder: The North Side and Civic Centre were built as Centennial projects and — in arena and dog years — 1967 was a very long time ago. “Leaking, rusting, crumbling, beginning to fall apart,” is pretty much the non-engineer’s verdict on the hulking structure.)

Now to the troublesome part. OSEG is pitching three towers — two rental, one condo — behind the new north stands, to hold about 1,200 residential units. The towers (of unspecified height, but one assumes the 30-storey range) would sit on a new podium that would house about 100,000 square feet of retail, more than twice what currently exists.

Well, the Glebe will have a thing or two to say about dropping 1,200 highrise units along a short spur off Bank Street. And some of those things will not be good.

As for financing, well, here is where the magical thinking comes in. There are probably four people in the city who truly understand how OSEG’s “”waterfall” financial arrangement with the city truly works and, trust me, I’m not one of them.

But we’re told the city would take on debt to secure the $330 million, then sell the “air rights” for the three towers and use “tax increment financing” to cover the rest. The idea is that the towers would create a good deal of new property tax, in perpetuity, and a portion of that would be used to eventually retire the debt.

OSEG calls this “self-financing,” which we will take at face value.

Capital Ward Coun. Shawn Menard awaits the city staff report on the proposal but has initial concerns. He said Wednesday he’s open to the possibility of more housing density at Lansdowne but thinks the plan needs a broad public consultation before next steps are taken.

Among the aspects to be explored, he said, are the new sporting venues, changes to the public realm, the effects on transportation and the public financing. The issue is big enough, he believes, that it should be left to the next mayor and council, to come into office after the October election.

OSEG imagines a much quicker timeline: the committee level in May, to council later that month, possibly shovels in the ground in November.

Give this much to the private partner: They have a plan and they’re in a hurry. The arena would be built first, from 2023 to 2025, the stadium from 2025-27, with the towers in the pipe from 2024 to 2029.

Because it would be phased, CFL football and junior A hockey would not be disrupted. And, oddly, the important vista to the Aberdeen Pavilion would actually be improved (widened) because, as Hobin puts it, the current North Side is “a space hog.”

(Its footprint is so big, in fact, that the new stands and proposed retail podium would easily fit inside it.)

There will be much discussion, no doubt, about the whether the city is turning over more of its premier public park to private, for-profit interests. Well, that deal with the devil has already been struck, has it not? When you have Whole Foods, you’ve gone whole hog, no?

The city could have entirely redone the park on its own. Instead, it threw much of the cost — and the risk — to the private sector. (The results, on the whole, have been fairly good, I would argue.)

So now to fix the last big broken piece, the ’67 hangover. Only how?

To contact Kelly Egan, please call 613-291-6265 or email kegan@postmedia.com
Twitter.com/kellyegancolumn


https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...we-should-make
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #57  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2022, 2:54 AM
Catenary Catenary is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,308
Quote:
Originally Posted by phil235 View Post
Interesting. There is a lot to digest in this proposal. It appears that the idea of putting the arena on the end is to allow them to build it without closing the existing arena. That may be sacrificing good design for practicality. Same thing with taking away the north side roof, which is not ideal in our climate.

I also wonder how much of the park will be taken up and how much space they will lose for festivals and events. It looks like a lot. The berm is a pretty popular spot and a cool feature for concerts, and it's clear that won't be accessible anymore. I can't imagine them fitting in an arena without eating into a big chunk of the great lawn.

I definitely support the additional housing, which really should have been part of the first phase. I am wondering how they will get 720 more parking spots there, and how much they will need to expand the entrance/exit. Ideally they will just make everything pedestrian only, or pedestrian only evenings and weekends, which will make it more of a people place.
Other than the end, I don't know where the arena would fit. The existing design is terrible for an arena, and building more traditional stacked football stands with an arena adjacent would require team relocation and prevent housing from being added, which will fund the project.

I think events like Cityfolk and Escapade are potentially the biggest losers here.

720 parking spots is likely doable with a 2-storey garage under the new construction. Portions of the existing garage already 2 levels.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #58  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2022, 5:51 AM
jt-mtl jt-mtl is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
New North Side + arena, for three towers with 1,200 units — a trade we should make?
There's much to like about OSEG's proposal — although it's likely to get a frosty reception at city hall and in the Glebe

Kelly Egan, Ottawa Citizen
Publishing date: Apr 27, 2022 • 3 hours ago • 3 minute read


Oh for Lansdowne’s best-laid plans — in April, the cruelest month.

Wednesday’s media briefing was held outside, Section S, South Side, in a frigid, hair-tangling wind, with snow squalling sideways across the perfectly green field, the assembled reporters looking like Shackleton’s huddled crew, the seven guest speakers not much warmer on a thin iceberg of chairs.

“I think I’ll stop now. My hands are frozen,” architect Barry Hobin said, surrendering the hand-held microphone after an abbreviated slide presentation.

One imagines the $330-million proposal may be headed for a frosty reception at city hall as well, where it is to be received by a committee of councillors in May.

There is quite a bit to like about the proposal from the Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group. It is pitching a new North Side stands, to hold 11,200 (plus standing room) and a relocation of the Civic Centre arena to where the east-end berm sits, beyond the end zone.

The new arena, or “event centre,” would be smaller (5,500 versus 9,500), thus better suited to junior hockey crowds and filling a niche for travelling entertainment acts too big for the National Arts Centre but not suitable for the Canadian Tire Centre.

(A quick history reminder: The North Side and Civic Centre were built as Centennial projects and — in arena and dog years — 1967 was a very long time ago. “Leaking, rusting, crumbling, beginning to fall apart,” is pretty much the non-engineer’s verdict on the hulking structure.)

Now to the troublesome part. OSEG is pitching three towers — two rental, one condo — behind the new north stands, to hold about 1,200 residential units. The towers (of unspecified height, but one assumes the 30-storey range) would sit on a new podium that would house about 100,000 square feet of retail, more than twice what currently exists.

Well, the Glebe will have a thing or two to say about dropping 1,200 highrise units along a short spur off Bank Street. And some of those things will not be good.

As for financing, well, here is where the magical thinking comes in. There are probably four people in the city who truly understand how OSEG’s “”waterfall” financial arrangement with the city truly works and, trust me, I’m not one of them.

But we’re told the city would take on debt to secure the $330 million, then sell the “air rights” for the three towers and use “tax increment financing” to cover the rest. The idea is that the towers would create a good deal of new property tax, in perpetuity, and a portion of that would be used to eventually retire the debt.

OSEG calls this “self-financing,” which we will take at face value.

Capital Ward Coun. Shawn Menard awaits the city staff report on the proposal but has initial concerns. He said Wednesday he’s open to the possibility of more housing density at Lansdowne but thinks the plan needs a broad public consultation before next steps are taken.

Among the aspects to be explored, he said, are the new sporting venues, changes to the public realm, the effects on transportation and the public financing. The issue is big enough, he believes, that it should be left to the next mayor and council, to come into office after the October election.

OSEG imagines a much quicker timeline: the committee level in May, to council later that month, possibly shovels in the ground in November.

Give this much to the private partner: They have a plan and they’re in a hurry. The arena would be built first, from 2023 to 2025, the stadium from 2025-27, with the towers in the pipe from 2024 to 2029.

Because it would be phased, CFL football and junior A hockey would not be disrupted. And, oddly, the important vista to the Aberdeen Pavilion would actually be improved (widened) because, as Hobin puts it, the current North Side is “a space hog.”

(Its footprint is so big, in fact, that the new stands and proposed retail podium would easily fit inside it.)

There will be much discussion, no doubt, about the whether the city is turning over more of its premier public park to private, for-profit interests. Well, that deal with the devil has already been struck, has it not? When you have Whole Foods, you’ve gone whole hog, no?

The city could have entirely redone the park on its own. Instead, it threw much of the cost — and the risk — to the private sector. (The results, on the whole, have been fairly good, I would argue.)

So now to fix the last big broken piece, the ’67 hangover. Only how?

To contact Kelly Egan, please call 613-291-6265 or email kegan@postmedia.com
Twitter.com/kellyegancolumn


https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local...we-should-make
I have a feeling the NIMBYs will be planning to protest this
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #59  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2022, 6:44 AM
mykl mykl is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harley613 View Post
I still don't get how that many units will work at Lansdowne but we'll see...
1200 units = 3 buildings, ~33 floors, 12 units per floor. very doable.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #60  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2022, 9:24 AM
Ottawacurious Ottawacurious is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2022
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 365
There's a lot I like about it but perhaps even more things that could be improved if I'm allowed to dream a bit?

I'd love to see more height in the towers. I'm thinking 60 stories for at least one of them. One of the towers would be a condo/hotel with a casino and spa. Think of a Brookstreet hotel. The condo/spa/casino/hotel would be useful year round including during the winter.

Perhaps by allowing those additional amenities, it will offset the cost of having a green roof/berm people can walk on.

While I'm dreaming, I'd like to see a pedestrian tunnel (or raised parkway) to provide a direct connection between Lansdowne and the canal pathways. Traffic management at Princess Patricia Way will only get worse in time and needs to be addressed.

I'm in favour of the additional parking due to larger buildings but am also in favour of improved shuttle transit along the parkways on game days.

Again, since I'm dreaming, let's bring back that pedestrian bridge and island idea to reduce pedestrian traffic on Bank Street Bridge. Ie. Go really big and launch a pedestrian Bridge from the berm across to pig island then to the intersection of riverdale/echo/colonel by. I don't know if it's better to raise the parkway or to have the Bridge go over the parkway. Meh! It's an idea!
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Downtown & City of Ottawa
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 7:19 AM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.