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  #41  
Old Posted Aug 21, 2009, 6:44 PM
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^Yah those all seem fitting to me. You could just have the History professors from ASU, NAU and UA figure out who would be worthy or not. Or just let Marshall Trimble decide.

They dont all have to be super important politicians or anything. People who entertained Arizona or had any major contributions should also be considered. Hm lets see if I can come up with a reasonable list of 100:

1. Barry Goldwater
2. Carl Hayden
3. Father Kino
4. Sandra Day O'Connor
5. Frank Luke (already has a statue near the capitol, but Im including him towards my count towards 100).
6. Pat Tillman
7. Ira Hayes
8. William Rehnquist
----Udall family, who'd perhaps not be desrving individually but together you could do a small "Udall plaza" or something:
9. David King Udall (AZ Territorial Legislature, patriarch of Udall family)
10. Don Taylor Udall (AZ statr legislature)
11. Jessie Adison Udall (chief justice AZ supreme court)
12. John Hunt Udall (Mayor of Phx)
13. Levi Stuart Udall (Chief justice AZ Supreme court)
14. Nick Udall (Mayor of Phoenix)
15. Mo Udall (congressman from AZs 2nd, presidential candidate)
16. Steward Udall (congressman from AZs 2nd)
17. John McCain (Im not a fan of him but he's probably important enough to due the presidential run)
18. Percival Lowell
19. Steve Allen
20. Frank Lloyd Wright
21. Jack Swilling
22. Darrell Duppa
23. George WP Hunt
24. Zane Grey
25. Cesar Chavez
26. John Wesley Powell
27. Marcos de Niza
28. Francisco Vasquez de Coronado
29. Dwight Harkins
30. "Wallace" aka Bill Thompson
31. "Ladmo" aka Ladimir Kwiatkowski
32. Pat McMahon
33. Waylon Jennings
34. Alice Cooper
35. Isabella Greenway
36. Charles T. Hayden
37. Eddie Basha Sr
38. Done Bolles
39. Steven Speilberg
40. Ernest McFarland
41. John F Long
42. Jerry Colangelo
43. Frank Borman (astronaut Apollo 8)
44. Linda Ronstadt
45. Stevie Nicks
46. Henry F Ashurst
47. Bruce Babbitt
48. Dr Eugene Shoemaker (one of the founders of astrogeology)
49. James Gadsen
50. Del Webb
51. Rose Mofford
52. Charles Poston
53. Sharlot Hall
54. Mary Jane Coulter
55. Ralph Haver
56. Al Beadle
57. Dwight B Heard
58. Bennie Gonzales
59. Paul Coze
60. Phillip Cambell Curtis
61. Robert Maytag
62. James S Douglas
63. John Jacob Rhodes
64. Cochise
65. Bill Williams
66. Dorothy Gilbert
67. John Alsap
68. John Y.T. Smith

Hm Ive sort of hit a mental wall at this point. Surely Ive left out a lot of people and maybe included some that I shouldnt have. But like I said, get actual Historians together and they should be able to come up with something.

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Originally Posted by glynnjamin View Post
^How many statues do we need for Pat Tillman? The guy got killed by friendly fire. While he is infinitely more heroic than that Piestewa squaw, I don't think we need a statue of him in every part of town.
Theres on statue of him by the Cardinals stadium and thats it. Would having one more near the Capitol really some travesty?

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Originally Posted by glynnjamin View Post
But ya, I guess you could do influential people TO the state, not necessarily FROM the state.
Yah they wouldn't have to be natives since so few people are. Requiring them to be natives would be sort of dishonest and rule out a lot of important people.
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  #42  
Old Posted Aug 21, 2009, 7:01 PM
Vicelord John Vicelord John is offline
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I want my name somewhere in that list. I've been influential to the state's um.... uh..... pooping department.
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  #43  
Old Posted Aug 29, 2009, 9:57 PM
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I am fairly new to these threads, but love the info and input given.

Regarding the million trees in Phoenix, I think something like this would be a great idea. I went to a dbacks game recently and it was hotter than hell. The only cool air we got on the way to and from the parking garage was from a blower coming out of a hotel. Here in the desert, palo verdes, mesquites, etc. give very little shade, and even though they require little maintanance, there are other great shade trees that would be good downtown like those real thick ficus trees.
I know it would probably be real expensive, but if these big shade trees lined the streets of downtown, they could also set up a mist system which would be real nice for anyone to be outside in the city. Maybe the buildings' ac units condensation could be a source for the system. For example, the new architecture building at UofA sends its condensation water into a small courtyard pond which includes some fish and a nice area to lounge. I don't know, I just think Phoenix isn't pedestrian-friendly and needs a little character.
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  #44  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2009, 3:30 AM
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I was down around the Capitol for a short bit this weekend and had a few thoughts about it:

First off Wesley Bolin Memorial Plaza is a freakin' joke. Its more or less a glorified landscapped parking lot. The surface parking within the plaza needs to be removed entirely at some point to give the plaza and the memorials the importance they deserve. Theres lot of surface parking lots in the area that could be replaced with a garage to make up for the lost parking.

Secondly, and because of cost this would have to be done over time, Id like to see the buildings between Washington and Jefferson from 7th Ave to Wesley Bolin removed. The exception would be the beautiful Carnegie library, its terrific and surrounded by a park, so it should stay. However the extremely ugly buildings between 12th Ave and Wesley Bolin should be demolished and replaced as the state outgrows them, theyre hideously ugly, anti urban and just bleak. Theres also some small warehouses closer to the CBD that would have to be removed, but hopefully they could be moved to the Warehouse district and into some of the surface lots there to help fill it out.

Then you could replace the pads the buildings were on with a large grassy mall from 7th to Wesley Bolin much like the National mall. There are already plans to demolish the current Senate and House buildings at some point and replace them with newer structures 'behind' the historic capitol building (to the west), so that would be the first step in removing the clutter and creating a nice mall that would connect downtown to the capitol.

Youd of course want something to balance out the East end of such a mall just like how the National Mall has the Capitol on one side and the Washington monument on the other. Perhaps some sort of Centennial Monument could be placed on the block bounded by Washington, Jefferson, 7th and 8th. Maybe an obelisk, maybe something more original, Im not sure. It would have to be something fairly vertical in nature to provide a balance with the horizontal nature of the mall and to provide a transition between the taller structures of downtown to the more midrise capitol area. Perhaps something in the neighborhood of 100 feet would be fitting for a Centennial monument, or maybe that would be too cheesy, I dunno.

EDIT: Err look at this, I typed all that and they already had this same idea in 1969 for the most part:

Last edited by HooverDam; Aug 31, 2009 at 3:44 AM.
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  #45  
Old Posted Aug 31, 2009, 6:53 AM
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Hoover - i love your thoughtfulness and enthusiasm and most of your ideas. we seem to really think a lot, esp when it comes to these grand schemes and dreams. i like your list of 100 names so far, too. perhaps it could be this kinetic list (its own thread? a Centennial thread?) where folks suggest names to add to or delete, etc. should they no longer be alive?
a few others i've thought to add (names i assoc w/ AZ in some way, tho they may not be worthy of a Top 100):
Walter Bimson, Rickie Lee Jones, Sandra Bernhard, Jess Nicks, Dwight Heard,
Paolo Soleri, Lynda Carter, the lady who founded Sesame Street, Calvin Goode, Navajo Code Talkers, the Rosenzweigs, Pauline Weaver, Bill Williams,
robert McCulloch, Geronimo, the Kolb Bros, Raul Castro, Polly Rosenbaum,
Sheriff Garfias, Adam Diaz, Glen Campbell, Marty Robbins, Rex Allen, Barbara Eden, lee Marvin, Dick van Dyke, mr Luhrs, Mr Wrigley, James mcClintock,
Herb and Dorothy McLaughlin, Father Braun, dr Chandler, winfield scott, etc. sorry if i duped some on yours.
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  #46  
Old Posted Sep 8, 2009, 5:42 PM
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Dreamers look anew at Valley waterways
5 commentsSept. 7, 2009 12:00 AM
The Arizona Republic

"Early this year, a group of dreamers envisioned something radical for metro Phoenix:

They imagined that the Valley cities actually use their only real source of surface water, the Valley's canal system, as an architectural asset. Imagine that.

Well, they did. Imagine creating buildings and open space to attract throngs of people alongside the Valley's canals, that is. And with luck the result will provide the spark for the real-life development at some of the heretofore ignored urban corners where water flows.

The "Canalscape" competition has been sponsored by the American Institute of Architects, Phoenix Metro Chapter in conjunction with Arizona State University's Canalscape Symposium - the gathering in February of this year of architects, engineers, Salt River Project officials and students that analyzed the challenges of developing the canal regions and kicked off the competition.

About 70 professionals participated. They included architects, engineers, developers and, in some of the most serious development projects, experts in restaurant design. They produced 13 entries, three of which have been selected as most outstanding. On this page today, we present those winners along with five other entries that organizers felt were worthy of public recognition.

The winning entries will be presented to the public at a special, monthlong Canalscape Exhibition beginning Nov. 10 at the ASU Art Museum. The exhibit also will be included as part of the national Greenbuild International Conference and Expo, which will be held in November in Phoenix.

The brainchild of Nan Ellin, planning program director of ASU's School of Geographical Sciences and Urban Planning, the Canalscape project has had a concrete goal: Spur interest in the development of canal banks. Or, more precisely, development of the private land immediately adjacent to the canals.

Some of the design projects envision using the canal water ambitiously - re-routing canal water so that it meanders through the development before being returned to its downstream journey. Others are more modest, seeking to incorporate shading and vegetation to encourage canal-bank use.

Metro Phoenix is an American rarity: an urban region that effectively turns its back to water. The Canalscape project seeks to turn all that around.

Imagine that."


Ok, why didn't developers in the valley do this a long time ago? Look at what Scottsdale has done to their "waterfront". This could spur much needed development along the canals and create more leisure and useful areas to be.

So here's another idea: Use the canals as a transportation route. The canals go right through the city in a way that freeways and rail do not go. At each development site, set up some sort of station/stop/port for this transportation. It obviously wouldn't be able to handle a high volume of people, but it could still service some sort of boat transportation system.

What do you think?



Here is the Canalscape site: http://canalscape.asu.edu/
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  #47  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2009, 3:25 AM
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i posted this in a subcategory of this thread too, figured this would be better... my bad if thats annoying
Hey, this is my first post so I hope I didnt screw up. Im an architecture and sustainability major at ASU.... I worked on a project for the 3rd street and Roosevelt neighborhood last semester for a new urbanism class that I was taking. Thought you guys would like to take a look. There are no skyscrapers, just forward thinking urbanism. Something that in my opinion is more important to Phx than just the skyline.


existing aerial view (for lack of time and energy im not going to list all the project boundaries, but it is basically roosevelt to fillmore and 3rd to parts of 5th streets.


infill shown along new "urban path" that uses existing alleys. New development includes mixed use buildings, live work units, stores, skate park, bball court, urban homes, and a community center


skate park and urban pathway with addition of stores and live/work homes

We chose the area because of its uniqueness and the possibilities of connecting downtown ASU, the tgen and medical district, the Roosevelt arts district, and the LRT. I dont know how much you guys know about New Urbanism, but it is basically about connectivity, diversity, and walkable streets. We decided to use existing alleys to create an urban pathway that ran from the 3rd and 4th street "wishbone" and roosevelt to fillmore near downtown ASU. We decided that This neighborhood had the most capability to become diverse, with the ASU students, hipsters (artitsts), old folks at the westward ho, and middle aged people moving into the area (mckinley lofts, and the alta apts). The streets would need to be narrowed and shade would have to be installed through both architecture and trees. Street front retail as well as live work units would be incorporated throughout the project.




street facing urban homes, with small backyards. To accomodate open space there are inclusive parks along the "urban pathway" promoting families to move to the urban core

Because this was a group project I only did the design work for 80% of the project. Im not going to focus on the logistics of everything, its more about the ideas. The goal was to create a neighborhood that had character and functionality. With our calculations the neighborhood would recieve a LEED-ND gold rating.


former Canvas gallery turned into Farmers Market and store

My ideas though were to use as many of the existing buildings as possible, the closed down gallery canvas was turned into a farmers market and local store. The empty lot between a set of apts and the puppet theater on 3rd was going to be a skate park along the new urban pathway. A community center was built that would contain many street front stores catering to the largely diverse neighborhood. Urban homes, and live work units lined the urban pathway. Though spotty, the infill changed the look and feel of the neighborhood. We focused on many policy and design options in a 20 page paper we had to develop. I would hope one day to be able to work on projects like this, that will be built for the city of Phoenix. If i dont go crazy from all the hurdles and red tape first.




Let me know what yall think- Mitch
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  #48  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2009, 3:44 AM
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not sure what the lure for pedestrian malls is.

http://www.emich.edu/public/geo/557b....pedmalls.html

many such examples can be found. more so than to the contrary. i'd much rather see narrowed two way streets with side street parking to keep traffic further from pedestrians. wide sidewalks and shorter distances between intersections are necessary also. add beautiful streetscape, and you have a vibrant downtown, not cut off from traffic (possible customers), and friendly to pedestrians. many cities have gone the pedestrian mall route and are now or have since returned to a street. why copycat failures?
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  #49  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2009, 3:44 PM
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mitch, good work. It's obviously much better than the empty lots and random stuff that is there now. However, the only thing that's off-putting (only IMO) is the complete randomness of everything. I like the streets where you put rows of townhouses or rowhouses facing the streets, or the row of lower-rise commercial, but then you have other areas where the buildings seem to turn in on themselves and cater to the interior courtyards or pedestrial mall looking areas.

My ultimate goal for this area would be for it to be constructed like old European cities. All streets would be lined with store fronts (with residential on top) or just row houses. It would completely encircle all of the empty blocks, with the same street-front minimal setback 3-5 story buildings. Then, the interiors would have courtyards. Like this from Rome:

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  #50  
Old Posted Sep 16, 2009, 4:34 PM
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The streets would need to be narrowed and shade would have to be installed through both architecture and trees.
This is exactly what Phoenix needs to do ASAP. 1st, 2nd, 5th Streets, Fillmore, etc...get rid of the red curbs, allow neighborhood resident parking permits.

The savings in street maintenance would easily pay for the lush landscpaped streets and pedestrian ways.
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  #51  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2009, 10:15 AM
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From an article about SRP's humble beginnings

Quote:
"They go build a series of dams in the 1920s on the Salt River - Mormon Flat, Horse Mesa and Stewart Mountain," Kupel said. "Those dams are not for irrigation, per se. Those are cash-register dams to make money through the sale of power."
That is the single best reason I've ever seen to demolish those downriver dams and restore some natural flow to the Salt River. I had no idea they weren't used for irrigation at all.
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  #52  
Old Posted Oct 1, 2009, 10:34 AM
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Well I think the first problem you'd run into is needing to replace the power production cheaply. Since the dams are already built it probably doesn't cost much to keep them running. Though between them they only generate 105,000 KW of power. For comparisons sake then new Solana generating station will create 280 megawatts and Palo Verde pumps out 3.2 gigawatts. Just another in the litany of reasons to build more nuclear plants, sadly we're too backwards in this country to do that.

Also Mormon Flat dam creates Canyon Lake, Horse Mesa dam creates Apache Lake and Stewart Mountain dam creates Saguaro Lake. Those are big recreation opportunities for people and obviously theres a service economy built around those lakes, youd probably meet a lot of resistance if you tried to do away with them.

EDIT: VVV No, there really isn't. But Im not going to derail the thread into a nuclear power debate. People who are anti nuclear power are probably also anti apple pie and baseball.

Last edited by HooverDam; Oct 2, 2009 at 4:18 AM.
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  #53  
Old Posted Oct 2, 2009, 12:46 AM
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Quote:
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Just another in the litany of reasons to build more nuclear plants, sadly we're too backwards in this country to do that.
You forgot the litany of reasons not to build them; yes...there are many.
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  #54  
Old Posted Feb 14, 2010, 9:32 PM
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Flipping around the channels that have the Winter Olympics on made me think Phoenix should try to get the World Baseball Classic and/or the World Basketball Championship we certainly have the proper facilities to host either.
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  #55  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2010, 12:42 AM
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Why shoot so low? How about the Summer Olympics them selves. Hold it in the spring or fall. Hold the Sailing events in San Diego, rapid events on the Colorado river, near Grand Canyon. It could be an entire state event.

BTW, I believe we held part of the WBC last time it held.
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  #56  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2010, 12:43 AM
Vicelord John Vicelord John is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HooverDam View Post
Flipping around the channels that have the Winter Olympics on made me think Phoenix should try to get the World Baseball Classic and/or the World Basketball Championship we certainly have the proper facilities to host either.
The world baseball classic was here back in 2004. I remember because I had to go to work at 2AM to unload busses and deliver luggage to the players rooms at the Wyndham.

I got a hat.
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  #57  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2010, 1:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vicelord John View Post
The world baseball classic was here back in 2004. I remember because I had to go to work at 2AM to unload busses and deliver luggage to the players rooms at the Wyndham.

I got a hat.
Yes and no, some of the preliminary games were here but that was like a test series or something if I recall. 2006 (San Diego) and 2009 (LA) are the only actually WBCs that have happened so far.

EDIT: RE: The Olympics. Hosting events like the WBC finals or the World Basketball Championships would help prove Phoenix capable of hosting a bigger event like the Olympics. I still think Phoenix hosting the Olympics would be highly unlikely due to our weather. You can't move it around too much due to pro players taking part, for instance you'd run into the NBA season if you go earlier than mid June or later than early October.

Additionally Phoenixs total lack of worldwide standing and image as a global city would make them selecting us unlikely. Chicago couldn't get it, Phoenix would have a tough road to ho. Now by 2024 maybe thatll all have changed but who knows. I imagine the 2020 games will be somewhere in Africa as the 2016 games went to Rio largely because S. America hadn't had the games yet. Early cities shooting for the 2020 games are Capetown, South Africa, Durban, South Africa and Rabat, Morocco, I'd bet one of them gets it. I suspect North Americas best shot would be in 2024, but then you also have to consider the competition from Mexico & Canada.

Trying to lure the Pan Am games would be a wise move for the Valley though, it again shows capability in hosting such events and would be good for tourism and exposure. Phoenix was slated to host the Goodwill games before they got cancelled, I imagine we could pretty easily host the Pan Am games with our already large, first class sports infrastructure.

The Pan Am games have lost some significance in America in recent years and I'd imagine thats in part due to the fact that they haven't been held here since 1987 (Indianapolis). Guadalajara has the 2011 games, Toronto the 2015 (both cities are putting in future Olympic bids), so Phoenix would certainly be wise to go for the 2019 games.

Last edited by HooverDam; Feb 15, 2010 at 1:24 AM.
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  #58  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2010, 2:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HooverDam View Post
People who are anti nuclear power are probably also anti apple pie and baseball.
People who are pro-nuclear don't have all the facts. No need for a ridiculous comparison.
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  #59  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2010, 3:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HooverDam View Post
Yes and no, some of the preliminary games were here but that was like a test series or something if I recall. 2006 (San Diego) and 2009 (LA) are the only actually WBCs that have happened so far.
It was not a test series. It was the first round, consisting of USA, Canada, Mexico and South Africa. It was not the finals, but it was definitely the World Baseball Classic. I know what you are saying though, this is sort of like having the NCAA regionals but not the Final Four.
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  #60  
Old Posted Feb 15, 2010, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbenjamin View Post
It was not a test series. It was the first round, consisting of USA, Canada, Mexico and South Africa. It was not the finals, but it was definitely the World Baseball Classic. I know what you are saying though, this is sort of like having the NCAA regionals but not the Final Four.
Right, it must've been 2006 though, there was no WBC in '04. From WikiP:
Quote:
The 2006 World Baseball Classic was the inaugural tournament between national baseball teams that included players from Major League Baseball. It was held from March 3 - March 20 in stadiums that are in and around Tokyo, Japan, San Juan, Puerto Rico, Lake Buena Vista, Florida, Phoenix, Arizona, Scottsdale, Arizona, Anaheim, California and San Diego, California). Japan, led by Sadaharu Oh, became the first champions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhxPavilion View Post
People who are pro-nuclear don't have all the facts. No need for a ridiculous comparison.
I already gave you the last word on this, no need to bring it up again. This isn't the place to discuss such a topic.
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