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  #1  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 8:28 PM
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Google maps

I didn't notice until just now that the satellite images of Calgary seem to be better quality than before. Maybe last week was the last time I looked? Maybe longer. It seems you can zoom in as far as it will let you now without going blank and telling you that they don't have images for that zoom level in this region.

The images (or at least some) are new since last time too but still at least a few months out of date (maybe depending on the neighbourhood?).

Does anyone know when the street level views will start appearing?
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  #2  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 8:36 PM
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Google Earth shows the bow in a fairly recent stage, although I can't see the Favco cranes.
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  #3  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 9:32 PM
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Bow still has the Wolff up in it, so combined with the green grass around I'd say they are using likely images from last September or so.
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  #4  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 9:56 PM
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On another board it was pretty much determined to be Sunday, September 14th, 2008 at around 11AM. Based on:

Park N' Rides empty

Chuch lots full

Grass

Where various posters had their vehicles, taking into account when they were out of town, etc.

Time of day was based on shadowing, and when various churches had their services.
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  #5  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 11:07 PM
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^ you know google earth gives you the date of the image right?
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  #6  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2009, 11:11 PM
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^Yeah that was pointed out after a bunch of people had already figured it out by process of elimination.
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  #7  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 1:46 AM
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I figured it was a Sunday... the East end of North Hill Centre, near SAIT was almost empty. lol
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  #8  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 4:54 AM
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The imaging is very nice.

But it missed my house having grass by a week
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  #9  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 5:02 AM
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Originally Posted by feepa View Post
^ you know google earth gives you the date of the image right?
Not for a lot of imagery. Like, say, the recent Calgary imagery.

At least not without substantial mucking about. But the base "date taken" info is most certainly not there when simply looking.

And now that I look at it, I can't actually see any DigitalGlobe layer that lines up with the September date. Not even close. However I know it's correct(ish) based on many things.

Oh yeah, and for those into this sort of thing, Google has had the Streetview cars in town this month. Supposedly imagery from that will be up in just a few weeks, but we'll see. Should be rather interesting.

Last edited by freeweed; Apr 17, 2009 at 5:13 AM.
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  #10  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 4:08 PM
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Oh yeah, and for those into this sort of thing, Google has had the Streetview cars in town this month. Supposedly imagery from that will be up in just a few weeks, but we'll see. Should be rather interesting.
My parent's city in England just came online with streetview, and I was able to relive my vacation in Rome using streetview. Pretty interesting stuff, actually. I have never used it for anything other than browsing around, but I can imagine it can be useful if you want to check out a street or location prior to actually going there.

Just to keep the conversation going, what are people's thoughts on the privacy "issues" that have been raised? Obviously Google blurs as many faces as it can, and will do so on request if any are missed. I don't have a problem with as Google is gathering information from a public roadway and is documenting what people have the right to view in person and even photograph from that same public roadway.

Hopefully it caught me in my underwear while gazing out of the upstairs window while brushing my teeth.
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  #11  
Old Posted Apr 17, 2009, 5:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Stang View Post
Just to keep the conversation going, what are people's thoughts on the privacy "issues" that have been raised? Obviously Google blurs as many faces as it can, and will do so on request if any are missed. I don't have a problem with as Google is gathering information from a public roadway and is documenting what people have the right to view in person and even photograph from that same public roadway.
Not to dwell on this, but I'm deeply disturbed by the concept, if not this particular implementation.

1. Visible in public and documented for worldwide viewing for the rest of history are two very, VERY different things. At least apples and oranges are still both fruit. Mass recorded surveillance is always a bad idea, period.

2. To those who use phrases such as "if you have nothing to hide..." - your opinion is hereby discarded. Everyone has something to hide. If you disagree, please feel free to install a camera in your bedroom that records your every move for the rest of the world to view.

3. (Invoking Godwin) Imagine if the Nazis or Soviets had this sort of data available once they came into power. Orwell wasn't kidding, and he wasn't exaggerating. If you doubt this in any way, ask folks in the Netherlands what they currently feel about having every citizen record their religion in a democratic government database.

All that aside, Streetview doesn't bug me too much compared to similar things. Maybe I just haven't seen the corporate world so carefully screw the masses over yet. I shudder to think of the possibilities if we ever see a less-than-perfect government in power.

There will be a lot of one-off cases about this, though. Blurred faces and plates don't do squat if you can be ID'd from your clothing, or if your car is in any way unique. Which applies to a surprising number of people.
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  #12  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 12:12 AM
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Not to dwell on this, but I'm deeply disturbed by the concept, if not this particular implementation.
I think we can agree on the fact that the true extent of this sort of technology remains to be seen. The archival aspect is an interesting one, because who's to say that the material (original, un-blurred) couldn't be seized and used in investigations, etc. "Sorry - your alibi doesn't check out because the Google streetview truck shows you walking up to the door".

I am personally not too concerned about the whole thing - at least what Google is doing - I see it is an interesting evolution to mapping and navigation that is in itself pretty amazing. I have a reasonable expectation of privacy in my house and in my bedroom, and I don't feel that this infringes on it. I also think that the likelihood of being snapped by the Google truck as it drives by is a needle in a hay stack type of thing, let along doing something in public that would be illegal, inappropriate, etc.

The cynic in me, however, thinks that we all might be come a little too comfortable with being photographed, filmed, etc. and we, as a society, might become complacent to the whole idea and, as you made a reference to Orwell, could see it come back and bite us in the ass.

And you bet - if a government/regime ever saw a reason, be it Nazis or whoever, they'd have the means to either obtain it themselves, or force the provider to play along. I'm just not convinced that having a picture of my house, even with me visible in the frame, that is anywhere from months to years old, is going to help anyone round me up and throw me in the slammer.

But I'll admit that I'm maybe a bit naive about it at the same time - "who would want anything to do with little old me?"

Interesting stuff - kind of uncharted territory (pun kind of intended).
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  #13  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 12:31 AM
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When they start wanting to do 360 panoramas of my bedroom, I'll have a problem.
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  #14  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 1:52 AM
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I'm just not convinced that having a picture of my house, even with me visible in the frame, that is anywhere from months to years old, is going to help anyone round me up and throw me in the slammer.
I'm not either, but who knows what stupid (and potentially horrible) laws might come up in the future.

I'm not worried about the present - this stuff is all in public anyway. I'm worried about what happens when someone in the future adds Streetview to property ownership records, and applies that against some sort of hysteria that we can't even imagine now. Maybe we'll see a crusade against people who at one point owned SUVs or something. Had one parked in the driveway in the past 10 years? Off to the carbon offset camps for you!

Don't forget, even in supposedly "free" countries like the US, we had people's lives completely ruined over things they did 20 years in the past. Imagine a modern-day "Red Scare" over something stupid like what colour your hair was, or whether or not you had siding vs stucco on your house. Remember, in the 1930s no one in their right mind would possibly consider attending a political meeting to be somehow dangerous in the future. Most people would have laughed you out of the room if you had suggested anything of the sort.

Seems about as silly as worrying about the government knowing your religion (incidentally, most Canadians are happy as clams to report this even today), and yet here we are forgetting history on a regular basis.

Do I worry about Streetview? Not in the least. Do I worry about most people having zero clue about the possibilities? Absolutely.
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  #15  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 3:18 AM
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Do I worry about Streetview? Not in the least. Do I worry about most people having zero clue about the possibilities? Absolutely.
I hear you. The same argument is true for a lot of other digital media on the web too - it stays around for a long, long time. I'm sure that quite a few people have already been burned by the messages they posted on Facebook in the past, the drunken party photos they post on Flickr, etc. There is an increasing acceptance of making your private life public, especially among the younger internet users.
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  #16  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 4:04 AM
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I hear you. The same argument is true for a lot of other digital media on the web too - it stays around for a long, long time. I'm sure that quite a few people have already been burned by the messages they posted on Facebook in the past, the drunken party photos they post on Flickr, etc. There is an increasing acceptance of making your private life public, especially among the younger internet users.
Yeah, totally agree with this. Myspace, Facebook, Twitter, message boards. It isn't hard to piece together tidbits of information people voluntarily provide to the public-at-large and put them together and use them against that person. Many employers are known to google someone's name before hiring or browse Facebook. Personally, keeping "connected" isn't as important as keeping a lot to myself... as I type this on a very active message board.

Skim through this thread from beyond.ca, a Calgary automotive enthusiast forum. Colesnotes: 2 guys agree, on the forum, to a sale of a 80GB PS3 and accessories for $300, guy A gets it home, realizes it's a 40GB not 80GB, wants his money back, guy B won't agree to meet. Guy A posts this thread looking for suggestions on what to do, various forum members do some googling/facebooking, etc. and find his name, home address, all phone numbers, place of work, car make/model, several pictures which are then photoshopped and posted elsewhere on the internet, etc. Other forum members then post fake kijiji ads soliciting intimate homosexual encounters using all this information, creating a smearing campaign on Facebook, do prank phone calls, various threats of showing up at his home or workplace to "influence" him to follow up and correct this scam, etc.

This was all over $300, or really whatever the monetary difference between a 40GB and an 80GB PS3 is. So in a week this kid goes from making a simple life mistake to having the top Google results of his name make him out to be a monster, and having, by his own account, hundreds of phone calls a day looking for gay sex or asking about fake marketplace listings. The guy certainly didn't do himself any favours in the matter, but still.

Anyway, bit of an involved example, but an ex-girlfriend or an old high-school classmate that had it out for you could do a lot just with the 1000+ Facebook pictures that some people have posted for all to see.


--------------------

Way off-topic with that last bit.

With regard to Google Earth and Street View, or really the public availability of it, I think Freeweed has a point that it has potentially bad consequences in the future. Whether those consequences are realized or not is something else.

Another thing is the balance between having the information current enough to use for navigation in a city that changes as much as Calgary does (new roads, changed alignments/traffic control devices, etc.) and being so current that it can potentially be used more to surveil and monitor people more closely and accurately.
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  #17  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 3:29 PM
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A little known fact, the original street view camera was invented here in Calgary.
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  #18  
Old Posted Apr 18, 2009, 4:50 PM
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yes, that's true. I wish Canada would finally allow streetview for our cities. It's an awesome tool!
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  #19  
Old Posted Apr 19, 2009, 2:50 AM
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yes, that's true. I wish Canada would finally allow streetview for our cities. It's an awesome tool!
It's happening in Calgary and Winnipeg (at the least) as we speak.
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  #20  
Old Posted Apr 24, 2009, 10:45 PM
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It's happening in Calgary and Winnipeg (at the least) as we speak.
I saw the Google car parked at the Superstore on Country Hills and Sarcee at about 4:00 pm. It had a cover over the "hardware" but it was still pretty obvious.

So yes - they most certainly are doing it as we speak.
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