PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread

[AbortedWalrus]

That study just highlights how ridiculous any effort to increase mandatory parking minimums in the city is. The city wants to do everything it can to "fix" the parking problem but the things that actually work. They need to put permit zones in the entirety of greater CC, at the very least, from Girard to Washington. Then they need to drastically up the cost of permits. I think $500 for the first car and $1000 for the second would be nice. Parking shouldn't be virtually free like it is now.

[mcgrath618]

I think better subways are needed before we move to make it harder to park. I can't get from 30th st to Rittenhouse without going entirely out of my way and that is a sin.

[iamrobk]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

I think better subways are needed before we move to make it harder to park. I can't get from 30th st to Rittenhouse without going entirely out of my way and that is a sin.

I have no idea how getting from 30th Street to Rittenhouse relates to parking unless you're trying to suggest that we should be encouraging people to make that drive regularly...

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by iamrobk

I have no idea how getting from 30th Street to Rittenhouse relates to parking unless you're trying to suggest that we should be encouraging people to make that drive regularly...

That was just one example. My point was that we should be encouraging people to drive less into the city and take PT instead, to minimize traffic, to spur business and to soften our blow on the environment (but mainly to minimize traffic).
If the city had more subways and less parking, there would be tons of increased foot traffic, and people would be less inclined to drive into the city, therefore allowing for there to be less parking spaces.
But until we have better PT, people will want their cars.

[Londonee]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

I think better subways are needed before we move to make it harder to park. I can't get from 30th st to Rittenhouse without going entirely out of my way and that is a sin.

I mean, you could just take the trolley that runs every 5 minutes from 30th Street to 19th street and then walk down 2.5 blocks? Or one of several bus routes that run down Chestnut?

[El Duderino]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

I think better subways are needed before we move to make it harder to park. I can't get from 30th st to Rittenhouse without going entirely out of my way and that is a sin.

That should only take about 25 years to become a reality if the billions of dollars and incredibly detailed plans plans are ready immediately. And the trip from 30th Street to Rittenhouse takes about 15 mins whether walking or driving. That said, it would be amazing (and would help with car traffic) if Philly had a better rail transit system, no matter what specific mode.

Part of this discussion is that folks are seemingly equating easy parking with easy, cheap parking - there are few areas in the city where you can't easily park if you're willing to pay the market rate (as can be seen from the availability percentages in studies). The expectation of inexpensive, quick parking isn't really an economic reality anymore - this is one of the trade-offs of increased development.

Not adding additional parking/discouraging driving also aligns with the city's stated goal of reducing carbon emissions 80% by 2050 (and yes, I realize that buildings - especially ones with ample concrete - are major contributors to emissions, too).

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by Londonee

I mean, you could just take the trolley that runs every 5 minutes from 30th Street to 19th street and then walk down 2.5 blocks? Or one of several bus routes that run down Chestnut?

I did forget about the trolley route, which is close, but not exactly on the square. Someone who is less versed with PT and Philly wouldn't know that.

However, buses are terrible. They take 10 minutes to go a mile. Why we have this extensive bus system and only three subways is beyond me.

Back to subways, I do remember that there used to be a plan to extend PATCO across the river and then up 32nd or something like that. I would love for that to happen. Oh well.

Why isn't the Philly Transit thread tagged again?

[GtownFriend]

Plans moving forward for boutique hotel at old Family Court, developer says
http://www.philly.com/philly/columni...-20180709.html

Plans to turn the former Family Court building near Logan Square into a luxury hotel are back on track...

“It will be a high-rated, 4½-star hotel, but it will be an individual boutique hotel,” said Peebles, who likened it to the Hay-Adams Hotel in Washington.

A revised version of the plan was eventually accepted by the Park Service, but it involved costly adjustments to the proposal as well as a reduction in the number of guest rooms to 205, down 10 from the count in its original proposal to the federal agency.

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

I did forget about the trolley route, which is close, but not exactly on the square. Someone who is less versed with PT and Philly wouldn't know that.

However, buses are terrible. They take 10 minutes to go a mile. Why we have this extensive bus system and only three subways is beyond me.

Back to subways, I do remember that there used to be a plan to extend PATCO across the river and then up 32nd or something like that. I would love for that to happen. Oh well.

Why isn't the Philly Transit thread tagged again?

I regularly take the 17 and 48 buses and they generally move pretty well to the point that I'm very satisfied with those routes. In Center City, it can also easily take 10 minutes to drive a mile in a car during rush.

[allovertown]

Originally Posted by AbortedWalrus

That study just highlights how ridiculous any effort to increase mandatory parking minimums in the city is. The city wants to do everything it can to "fix" the parking problem but the things that actually work. They need to put permit zones in the entirety of greater CC, at the very least, from Girard to Washington. Then they need to drastically up the cost of permits. I think $500 for the first car and $1000 for the second would be nice. Parking shouldn't be virtually free like it is now.

I agree permit prices need to be increased. But I think there should be exponential increase with each car in the household, and possibly keep the first car a little cheaper. I understand that sometimes a car is needed, but way too many people in philadelphia have needless extra cars. a bunch of the cars on my street move once a week and no more.

[eixample]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

That was just one example. My point was that we should be encouraging people to drive less into the city and take PT instead, to minimize traffic, to spur business and to soften our blow on the environment (but mainly to minimize traffic).
If the city had more subways and less parking, there would be tons of increased foot traffic, and people would be less inclined to drive into the city, therefore allowing for there to be less parking spaces.
But until we have better PT, people will want their cars.

While additional subways would help people get into the city, in this day and age they are just too expensive to build. We could achieve the same end with better bus service (dedicated bus lines with vigorous traffic enforcement for example) and better regional rail service (15 minute headways all day with late night service) for much less money than building new subways. Better buses would help people from close in neighborhoods that are not subway adjacent getting into center city while regional rail could handle farther out city neighborhoods and suburbs.

Originally Posted by allovertown

I agree permit prices need to be increased. But I think there should be exponential increase with each car in the household, and possibly keep the first car a little cheaper. I understand that sometimes a car is needed, but way too many people in philadelphia have needless extra cars. a bunch of the cars on my street move once a week and no more.

I agree with this, but I would also like to see much more ride share (more availability, more flexible options and hopefully lower prices as a result of the increase in the scale of the operation). My household has one car that we only use a few times a week that I would consider giving up with better ride share options. Imagine two ride share vehicles on every block in center city, south philly, etc. You could go to the grocery store or movies or to a party in the suburbs at night without dreading finding parking when you get home!

Also street sweeping will help people get rid of extra cars since they'll get ticketed when they have to move those cars every other week.

[SEFTA]

Originally Posted by eixample

Also street sweeping will help people get rid of extra cars since they'll get ticketed when they have to move those cars every other week.

[PhillyEngineer]

Originally Posted by Mr Saturn64

You can see this on top of the gallery. Isn't there a big movie theater coming in there or something like that?

Yes - AMC is gong to have a multi screen theater on the third floor. The existing third floor of the old JCP/BCF had to be demolished in order to raise the roof to accommodate the large movie screens.

[Londonee]

Originally Posted by eixample

While additional subways would help people get into the city, in this day and age they are just too expensive to build. We could achieve the same end with better bus service (dedicated bus lines with vigorous traffic enforcement for example) and better regional rail service (15 minute headways all day with late night service) for much less money than building new subways. Better buses would help people from close in neighborhoods that are not subway adjacent getting into center city while regional rail could handle farther out city neighborhoods and suburbs.



I agree with this, but I would also like to see much more ride share (more availability, more flexible options and hopefully lower prices as a result of the increase in the scale of the operation). My household has one car that we only use a few times a week that I would consider giving up with better ride share options. Imagine two ride share vehicles on every block in center city, south philly, etc. You could go to the grocery store or movies or to a party in the suburbs at night without dreading finding parking when you get home!

Also street sweeping will help people get rid of extra cars since they'll get ticketed when they have to move those cars every other week.

Nice points here. Definitely agree on skyrocketing the price of a permit beyond 1 or 2.

In terms of bus service, I think increasing (or is it decreasing) headways dramatically so they actually function for center city residents would be a major QOL improvement. On weekends, certain buses that I use operate every 40minutes..... what a joke? Ridership is low on those days b/c that's simply not a viable option for *most* people in Center City - the vast majority of whom have enough means to just say f*ck it and order an Uber.

To McGrath who doesn't like bus service....I'd advise that he give it more of a try and trust that in most times outside of crazy buys weekdays...bus service is amazingly on time, decently fast, and, of course, $1.80 one way.

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by Londonee

bus service is amazingly on time, decently fast, and, of course, $1.80 one way.

$2.50 or $2 with token or SEPTA Key equivalent.

[Redddog]

Originally Posted by Jayfar

$2.50 or $2 with token or SEPTA Key equivalent.

Speaking of all this subway stuff, anyone know when the HAIL they're planing on finishing the 15th street station renovation?

[volguus zildrohar]

Originally Posted by Redddog

Speaking of all this subway stuff, anyone know when the HAIL they're planing on finishing the 15th street station renovation?

That'll be going on for a few years. Once they're finished with the El platforms they're moving down to the Broad Street Subway platforms and corridors. Considering it's a Philly union job I'd say 2034 looks about right.

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by Redddog

Speaking of all this subway stuff, anyone know when the HAIL they're planing on finishing the 15th street station renovation?

I met the architect who designed it. He says that they're slightly behind schedule (as per par in Philadelphia). I've seen the finished renderings that weren't posted online, it looks very good.

[eixample]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

I met the architect who designed it. He says that they're slightly behind schedule (as per par in Philadelphia). I've seen the finished renderings that weren't posted online, it looks very good.

Did he say whether the City Hall station would be closed during the renovations and for how long? It was discussed that they couldn't do the renovations to that station without closing it completely but I don't recall if that was ultimately decided.

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by eixample

Did he say whether the City Hall station would be closed for good and for how long? It was discussed that they couldn't do the renovations to that station without closing it completely but I don't recall if that was ultimately decided.

It was undecided at the time, but I will assume that they're gonna wait as long as possible before closing it.