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  #41  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2018, 9:18 PM
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
Surely any form in a suburb is suburban form?
I think we have different definitions of suburb and suburban. I consider a suburb to be any municipality that functions mainly as spillover from another neighbouring municipality. But the actual built form of such a spillover municipality can be anything including dense and ultra urban (like some suburbs of NYC or Paris). Meanwhile, the core municipality can also have areas that range from very urban to suburban. There are areas within the city limits of most major cities in Canada that I would consider thoroughly suburban even though they're not in suburbs. I would consider this to be suburban for instance, even though Etobicoke is no longer a suburb.
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  #42  
Old Posted Aug 12, 2018, 9:35 PM
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The Hamilton suburb of Dundas has a sort of "New England town" feel.
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  #43  
Old Posted Aug 16, 2018, 10:45 PM
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Etobicoke is suburban but it's not suburban in the same sense of Westchester or whatever. High-rises everywhere, people walking the streets, waiting for the bus. It's a different feeling. Everything, everyone is more connected.

People idealize isolation but I don't. New York, Boston, Philadelphia got ravaged by those same ideals. Same would've happened to Toronto if it had followed the same path. Instead, we are getting the Hurontario LRT. I don't mind that at all.
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  #44  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2018, 3:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Doady View Post
Etobicoke is suburban but it's not suburban in the same sense of Westchester or whatever. High-rises everywhere, people walking the streets, waiting for the bus. It's a different feeling. Everything, everyone is more connected.

People idealize isolation but I don't. New York, Boston, Philadelphia got ravaged by those same ideals. Same would've happened to Toronto if it had followed the same path. Instead, we are getting the Hurontario LRT. I don't mind that at all.

Westchester does have high-rises though - and transit ridership higher than the typical US city. The idea of "Westchester" is not that it's some sort of sprawled out, semi-rural Atlanta-style suburb - it's that it's a collection of substantial, pre-war, railroad-centred towns that have sort of sprawled into each other (it also includes the city of Yonkers, which is not by any means suburban) - with a mix of typical suburbia and more exclusive, semi-rural large lot development (as well as more recent, multi-family TOD construction). Suburban Boston and Philadelphia developed in a similar pattern.


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  #45  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2018, 5:16 PM
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Yeah, I wouldn't say Toronto followed a denser, more urbane path than older east-coast American cities, it just developed its suburbs in the automobile age. A Westchester-style suburb is basically a small city/town/village that's been incorporated into the larger metro, is connected by rapid transit, but is old enough to have a substantial urban character of its own. Certainly they tend to being genteel and leafy, but they're not rural or developed with an ideal of isolation.

The largest are downright urban, like White Plains, NY. Even smaller ones have a strong, walkable, urban-village core.
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  #46  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2018, 8:42 AM
Hali87 Hali87 is offline
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Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin View Post
Westchester does have high-rises though - and transit ridership higher than the typical US city. The idea of "Westchester" is not that it's some sort of sprawled out, semi-rural Atlanta-style suburb - it's that it's a collection of substantial, pre-war, railroad-centred towns that have sort of sprawled into each other (it also includes the city of Yonkers, which is not by any means suburban) - with a mix of typical suburbia and more exclusive, semi-rural large lot development (as well as more recent, multi-family TOD construction). Suburban Boston and Philadelphia developed in a similar pattern.
Isn't York Region basically like this though? Places like Aurora and Newmarket seem to have fairly old and substantial downtowns, for example. Other suburbs (parts of Mississauga, Brampton, Oakville, etc.) seem to be kind of like this as well. Oshawa has an old established downtown but feels different due to its roots in heavy industry. The Ontario suburbs are a bit more heavily slanted towards the "sprawl into each other" but the overall idea seems similar. I assume these developed more along Yonge Street and similar than along the rail line.
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  #47  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2018, 10:28 AM
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Whitby is another with a decent core.

https://goo.gl/maps/kpJSLX1YwQ92

Its core, and surrounding older neighborhoods, are sandwiched between two rail lines.
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  #48  
Old Posted Aug 19, 2018, 4:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Hali87 View Post
Isn't York Region basically like this though? Places like Aurora and Newmarket seem to have fairly old and substantial downtowns, for example.
Westchester hardly has any big box stores or cookie cutter subdivisions though.
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  #49  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2018, 12:21 AM
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One thing I've noticed among Canadian urbanists will often deem "character" suburbs like Port Credit as "not really suburbs" as if suburbs can only be cookie cutter subdivisions.
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