Vancouver Downtown Streetcar | Proposed

[Jared]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Translink opposes it because it will duplicate existing or planned services (i.e. the City of Vancouver is already well served and regional funding are being spent in underserved areas)

I could see an integrated fare system.

I think there is legislation barring other private public transit operators (can't reacll off the top of my head) - but the legislation could probably easily (within 6 mos to a year?) be amended to allow a municipality to operate or contract for it.

What about the West Vancouver Blue Buses? Are they "city owned" but operated by translink?

[deasine]

They could start another level in transit. Currently, Translink's operating companies are BCRTCL (SkyTrain), CMBC (Bus & SeaBus), and WCE. We could have a different operating company that is just for the streetcars, like VSC (Vancouver StreetCar Company).

[Rusty Gull]

Originally Posted by Jared

What about the West Vancouver Blue Buses? Are they "city owned" but operated by translink?

This is a good question. I'm unclear on how the Blue Bus system works, but one thing I know is that the bus service afforded to West Vancouverites is second to none, and blows TransLink's service right out of the water.

The contrast is especially stark when comparing West Vancouver (Blue Bus) to neighbouring North Vancouver (TransLink).

As far as the streetcar vs. buses argument goes, the pros in favour of the streetcar are many: modern, environmentally sound, esthetically pleasing, tourist-friendly, would interface better with public spaces like Granville Island and Stanley Park. Better yet, much of the routing is already in place, so this one is a no-brainer!

If anything, I think this service would actually help TransLink in terms of alleviating the inevitable over-crowding on the Canada Line once it catches on with Richmond and South Vancouver commuters.

[deasine]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gull

This is a good question. I'm unclear on how the Blue Bus system works, but one thing I know is that the bus service afforded to West Vancouverites is second to none, and blows TransLink's service right out of the water.
...

If anything, I think this service would actually help TransLink in terms of alleviating the inevitable over-crowding on the Canada Line once it catches on with Richmond and South Vancouver commuters.

West Vancouver Transit has a contract running as a sort of sub division of Coast Mountain Bus Company.

Or it might feed more people into the Canada Line as more people take streetcar from Granville island into Olympic Village station =)

[Hed Kandi]

A stretcar named Vancouver
False Creek trial heralds possible streetcar rebirth
Andy Ivens

Province

Wednesday, March, 12, 2008



Vancouver councillors yesterday approved an $8.5-million trial project that could herald the rebirth of a streetcar system in the city.

The demonstration streetcar line could be in place for the 2010 Winter Olympics.

If all goes well, it will run on the old CPR right-of-way between Granville Island and the Canada Line rapid transit station at 2nd Avenue and Cambie, a short hop from the Athletes Village at the southeast corner of False Creek.

The $8.5 million will pay for the replacement of the track to allow the popular Downtown Historic Railway to continue its weekend runs while accommodating the modern demonstration equipment.

Future phases of the the "Downtown Streetcar" project could include a link to Waterfront Station, with spurs to Yaletown from

Science World, and to Stanley Park from Waterfront.

The proposal to have staff explore a private partner to help spread the costs around did not receive unanimous approval.

The five NPA councillors present supported the idea of enlisting a public-private partnership -- P3 -- to bring the scheme to fruition. Coun. Raymond Louie and his two Vision Vancouver cohorts voted against a public-private partnership.

"I think it's premature at this time to have staff undertake an extensive process to explore a P3," Louie said after the vote.

Coun. Suzanne Anton, who voted for the P3 motion, said: "Once the public sees it, there's no going back. I'd like to see it go on the Arbutus Corridor, too."

© The Vancouver Province 2008

[Rusty Gull]

Originally Posted by deasine

West Vancouver Transit has a contract running as a sort of sub division of Coast Mountain Bus Company.

Or it might feed more people into the Canada Line as more people take streetcar from Granville island into Olympic Village station =)

Given its success, why haven't more municipalities emulated West Vancouver's Blue Bus model? Is it because they have to play ball as long as they want SkyTrain, Seabus, etc? (in other words, if you want the big ticket items like trains and boats, you're stuck with the shoddy bus service too?)

[jlousa]

I would've guessed it's because no other city could afford to provide a bluebus service. Heck in West Van if you go on vacation you can call the police dept and they will check up on your house until you return, try that in Vancouver.

Glad to see this is going ahead, would love to see Phase 1+2 completed as well.

[LeftCoaster]

Which one is phase 2, Stanley park extension or pacific Blvd extension?

I personally would love to see a loop around downtown, following the stanley park extension, cutting south along denman and then cuttingeast down beach/pacific.

A line bisecting downtown running down either burrard or granville would be great too.

[Rusty Gull]

Originally Posted by LeftCoaster

Which one is phase 2, Stanley park extension or pacific Blvd extension?

I personally would love to see a loop around downtown, following the stanley park extension, cutting south along denman and then cuttingeast down beach/pacific.

A line bisecting downtown running down either burrard or granville would be great too.

As for the Stanley Park/Coal Harbour extension, there is -- believe it or not -- already opposition gunning against it, including Art Phillips!

The Nimbies in this town never cease to amaze me: they organize against projects that haven't even been thought of yet!

[Rusty Gull]

Originally Posted by jlousa

I would've guessed it's because no other city could afford to provide a bluebus service. Heck in West Van if you go on vacation you can call the police dept and they will check up on your house until you return, try that in Vancouver.

Good points. Someone has to pay the bill for these kind of services.

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gull

As for the Stanley Park/Coal Harbour extension, there is -- believe it or not -- already opposition gunning against it, including Art Phillips!

Don't they live at the Bayshore condos?

[SFUVancouver]

Well tough for them. The street layout of Coal Harbour was designed with a streetcar in mind so the plan, in some form, was there before the NIMBY residents.

[deasine]

Wow... people opposing to clean frequent not-an-eyesore rapid transit? -_-" I think the stanley park extension would be great as it makes Coal Harbour more "live" than it is... Coal Harbour right now is pretty quiet compared to the rest of Downtown.

[vanlaw]

We need a lobby group in Vancouver to Nimby the Nimby's. Show up at every council meeting where Nimby's may be to heckle them.

[clooless]

Originally Posted by Rusty Gull

As for the Stanley Park/Coal Harbour extension, there is -- believe it or not -- already opposition gunning against it, including Art Phillips!

The Nimbies in this town never cease to amaze me: they organize against projects that haven't even been thought of yet!

What is the substance of the argument of those opposed to the streetcar, if you don't mind?

I don't get it. Streetcars mean better transit, less pollution (relatively speaking), better movement of people and a more livable downtown. I loved using the streetcars when I was in Europe. What the hell kind of city do these naysayers expect, anyway?

[The_Henry_Man]

Originally Posted by Hed Kandi

A stretcar named Vancouver
False Creek trial heralds possible streetcar rebirth
Andy Ivens

Province

Wednesday, March, 12, 2008



Vancouver councillors yesterday approved an $8.5-million trial project that could herald the rebirth of a streetcar system in the city.

The demonstration streetcar line could be in place for the 2010 Winter Olympics.

If all goes well, it will run on the old CPR right-of-way between Granville Island and the Canada Line rapid transit station at 2nd Avenue and Cambie, a short hop from the Athletes Village at the southeast corner of False Creek.

The $8.5 million will pay for the replacement of the track to allow the popular Downtown Historic Railway to continue its weekend runs while accommodating the modern demonstration equipment.

Future phases of the the "Downtown Streetcar" project could include a link to Waterfront Station, with spurs to Yaletown from

Science World, and to Stanley Park from Waterfront.

The proposal to have staff explore a private partner to help spread the costs around did not receive unanimous approval.

The five NPA councillors present supported the idea of enlisting a public-private partnership -- P3 -- to bring the scheme to fruition. Coun. Raymond Louie and his two Vision Vancouver cohorts voted against a public-private partnership.

"I think it's premature at this time to have staff undertake an extensive process to explore a P3," Louie said after the vote.

Coun. Suzanne Anton, who voted for the P3 motion, said: "Once the public sees it, there's no going back. I'd like to see it go on the Arbutus Corridor, too."

© The Vancouver Province 2008

The NPA should also consider extending the Pacific Blvd extension route all the way to English Bay, the West End and the southern entrance to Stanley Park. The current No.6 bus on Davie takes way too long, and that potential extension can be linked to Yaletown Skytrain station.

[LeftCoaster]

Originally Posted by vanlaw

We need a lobby group in Vancouver to Nimby the Nimby's. Show up at every council meeting where Nimby's may be to heckle them.

The yimbies?

[cornholio]

They should really have the demonstration phase done up to Main street and ready to be used right after the Olympics. It will get huge ridership and relieve the congestion on the 99 b line and other buses along the Broadway corridor. It would be the best, fastest and most convenient connection between the Skytrain line and the Canada line which will take up and attract allot more commuters coming of the expo and millennium lines. Having said this im willing to bet that if it is a P3 partnership then this is exactly whats going to happen, it really is a no brainer imo. The line could probably get huge amounts of ridership...pretty much anyone off the Expo line and even the Millennium line during non peak hours when its possible to cram comfortably on to the Expo trains at Broadway. Its only a one stop hop to Main st. from Broadway. From Main street on a dedicated right of way the street car could probably get you to the Canada line in 5 or so minuets having only 2 stops along the way. The rest of the route probably will get much less ridership but I think it will still do ok and I dont see why it wouldn't be profitable.
Compare this to using the 99 b line to connect to the Canada line.

[deasine]

New Uploaded Document of the City Streetcar Project:

Why a Downtown Streetcar?

Vancouver’s Transit Strategy depends upon an expanded network of rail-based services. The future Downtown Streetcar is an important component of this strategy that will extend the regional transit network to connect major destinations in the metropolitan core, including Granville Island, Chinatown, and Gastown.

The Downtown Streetcar, if built, would provide a direct connection to two regional rapid transit lines – the Canada Line and the Expo Line. It could ultimately be expanded to connect with the extension of the Millennium Line and to destinations such as Stanley Park, UBC, and south along the Arbutus Corridor.

The Downtown Streetcar could be an important element of a sustainable transportation system that will support Vancouver’s Olympic Village and the larger Southeast False Creek (SEFC) sustainable neighbourhood. For SEFC, the Downtown Streetcar would reduce transportation-related greenhouse gas emissions and vehicle kilometres driven by 25 to 50 per cent.

Expanded rail infrastructure would also support Vancouver’s growing communities by providing more accessible and green transportation options.

In SEFC, the streetcar will be located in a dedicated green median which will incorporate innovative stormwater features including infiltration galleries.

Recent survey findings from the Mustel Group revealed that over 80 per cent of respondents are in favour of a streetcar service linking Granville Island with Downtown and the Canada Line.

Due to the forecasted high ridership of the Downtown Streetcar, preliminary financial analysis suggests a better than break-even operation scenario – a significant finding for a new transit system. The project will, however, need contributions from many partners to be realized.

The 2010 Demonstration Project – A First Step
Vancouver City Council decided in March 2008 to support a transportation showcase project for the 2010 Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games. By January 2010, a demonstration version of the Downtown Streetcar will run
between Granville Island and the new Canada Line Olympic Village Station (see map) using modern streetcars.

Delivering a streetcar system by 2010 was one of the proposed public transportation projects of the Vancouver 2010 Bid Book. A demonstration Downtown Streetcar for the 2010 Winter Games will ensure reliable, accessible, and sustainable transportation for the athletes, visitors and residents alike. Modern and fully accessible streetcars could operate every six minutes between Granville Island and the future Canada Line Olympic Village station.

The demonstration portion of the future Downtown Streetcar line already has a dedicated rail right-of-way, with 1.8 kilometres of track for a restored heritage streetcar that presently runs on weekends during the tourist season. This track is being replaced and both heritage and modern streetcars will be able to use it.
A demonstration streetcar will extend the regional transit network during the 2010 Winter Games and decrease the number of private vehicles, motor coaches, and transit diesel buses to and from Granville
Island.

Actual ridership and success of the 2010 demonstration streetcar project will help determine the importance and future timing of completing remaining sections of the Downtown Streetcar line. This transportation showcase project will be an important first step in realizing the overall Downtown Streetcar line. It also signals a commitment to return the streetcar to Vancouver.

Steetcar Backgrounder ~ Source: City of Vancouver ~ http://vancouver.ca/engsvcs/transport/streetcar/pdfs/streetcarfactsheet-mar12.pdf

[officedweller]

Ubc???