Sports in Canadian culture

[suburbanite]

We also had the Argonauts practicing on our field during lunch that no one ever seemed very interested in. There was literally a team 100m away from our training room and our coaches would be showing us comparison videos of Sunday's games with our last match.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by The_Architect

Rogers has been trying to kill the Argos since they took over the Skydome. Fuck them.

I think there is a perception (accurate or not, I don't know) among pro-NFL Canadians that the existence of the Argos or CFL in general is a barrier to the NFL coming to Canada.

The NFL itself has always been cautious in its approach towards Canada, and its language vis-à-vis the CFL you will notice is always very respectful. Most of the anti-CFL/pro-CFL talk and action comes from Canadians, not from Americans who say "your league sucks, join ours!"

Even recently there were rumours that the NFL apparently doesn't want to come to Toronto unless something is done for the Argos like a new stadium.

If the people who want to bring the NFL to Toronto really do hate the CFL and the Argos that badly, then this constant bringing up of the Argos issue by the NFL (this is not the first time we have heard about them doing this) must be a big thorn in their side and they likely think it would a lot simpler if the Argos just vanished.

Some people may also have in mind the 1970s when the fledgling World Football League wanted to put a team in Toronto called the Northmen. In the end Parliament stepped in to prevent this and protect the CFL. And the Northmen ended up in Memphis and became the Southmen. (Not sure if there would be political intervention today if the NFL came north though.)

[Barnard's Star]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I think there is a perception (accurate or not, I don't know) among pro-NFL Canadians that the existence of the Argos or CFL in general is a barrier to the NFL coming to Canada.

The NFL itself has always been cautious in its approach towards Canada, and its language vis-à-vis the CFL you will notice is always very respectful. Most of the anti-CFL/pro-CFL talk and action comes from Canadians, not from Americans who say "your league sucks, join ours!"

Even recently there were rumours that the NFL apparently doesn't want to come to Toronto unless something is done for the Argos like a new stadium.

If the people who want to bring the NFL to Toronto really do hate the CFL and the Argos that badly, then this constant bringing up of the Argos issue by the NFL (this is not the first time we have heard about them doing this) must be a big thorn in their side and they likely think it would a lot simpler if the Argos just vanished.

Some people may also have in mind the 1970s when the fledgling World Football League wanted to put a team in Toronto called the Northmen. In the end Parliament stepped in to prevent this and protect the CFL. And the Northmen ended up in Memphis and became the Southmen. (Not sure if there would be political intervention today if the NFL came north though.)

The Argos failure = NFL success attitude is baffling. If you want to take a practical step toward nudging Toronto into the NFL then buy Argos tickets. The single biggest motivator to the NFL coming north would be the wild success of existing football teams in Canada's largest cities. Instead we have an inverse correlation between city size and football interest in Canada. Add to this the relative failure of the Bills in Toronto and the shrinking of grassroots programs and the only fair conclusion down south is that urban Canada does not support gridiron. If the Argos just vanished it would only confirm the indifference. (Perhaps people think Varsity Blues attendance would impress the NFL.)

Agree as well that the CFL debate is almost wholly an intra-Canadian affair. The attitudes I've found online from the U.S. toward the league range from indifferent to mildly respectful to good-natured joshing. There's certainly no hate.

[esquire]

^ Good point. The irony here is that if the Argos had consistently attracted average crowds of 45,000 fans a game, Toronto would have received a NFL team by now.

Montreal was in the same boat before, ignoring its CFL team because it wanted the NFL. It ended up without football altogether for a long stretch. Contrast with Baltimore which supported its CFL team and ended up getting the Ravens.

[MrOilers]

Originally Posted by Acajack

That said, the adamancy of much of the pro-NFL crowd in Canada strikes me as overkill most of the time. I mean, why are they all over CFL forums and such saying the CFL sucks and the NFL is the best?

This is my question as well. It's really perplexing.

The NFL is awesome, and I casually follow it every year (I have never had a favorite team). However, I think the CFL is also awesome. I have an attachment to the home team, and I don't even think about the NFL or the USA when I'm watching it. I have no idea where this "CFL sucks" attitude comes from.

In fact, I have a few friends in the USA who love football, have never been to Canada, yet they watch CFL games whenever they can, because it's a very good league. It deserves a hell of a lot more love from Canadians, that's for sure.

[Acajack]

Interesting article:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/tomvanri...ockey-go-home/

[The_Architect]

What a tool.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by The_Architect

What a tool.

Who?

[FrankieFlowerpot]

The article writer I'm guessing

[elly63]

Originally Posted by MrOilers

In fact, I have a few friends in the USA who love football, have never been to Canada, yet they watch CFL games whenever they can, because it's a very good league. It deserves a hell of a lot more love from Canadians, that's for sure.

It is strange how some "Canadians" go out of their way to denigrate homegrown product. What's really strange is how many Americans watch the game on ESPN 2, obviously they see something that the NFL fanboys in Canada do not. The high ratings are somewhat shocking (to me). And it's not a fad like Australian rules football was for a while years ago.

And speaking of ratings, just listening to PTS and they speculated what will happen to the Raptors with the new hockey deal. Raptor ratings are infinitesimal now what will happen when they go head to head nightly with hockey. Raptor ratings are another dirty little secret brought to you courtesy MLSE. Sorry, meant to say hidden from you by MLSE.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by suburbanite

We also had the Argonauts practicing on our field during lunch that no one ever seemed very interested in. There was literally a team 100m away from our training room and our coaches would be showing us comparison videos of Sunday's games with our last match.

That says a lot about the intelligence of some of your posts. Obviously, the coaches were a huge influence on you.

[SignalHillHiker]

Uh oh...

Nova Scotian screech-in gets thumbs down

A screech-in party during last weekend's Grey Cup festivities is not going over well with some Newfoundland traditionalists.

Sheilagh Williams, who has screeched-in thousands of people — usually tourists, who are then deemed honorary Newfoundlanders after the light-hearted ceremony — for more than a decade with Spirit of Newfoundland in St. John's, was not impressed.

She said the Schooners' attempts to emulate a ceremony that she takes great pride in performing is insulting.

"I would just say it's wrong. It failed in my opinion," Williams said.

Pushing for CFL team

The Atlantic Schooners are from Halifax, a city that's been pushing to land a CFL team for years. Each year they throw a party to show what the rest of Canadian football fans are missing.

And it appears they borrowed a little from their East Coast neighbours to enhance the experience.

Shanneyganock's Chris Andrews says the terminology tends to change depending on the issue.

"I once again find it funny that when it's appropriate we're all Atlantic Canadians, and where it's not, we're not," he laughed.

His view on the apparent cultural kleptomania?

"When you're the best, people borrow from you all the time. And if that's what it takes to help them attract more people to their tent and make it a better time for them, nothing wrong with it."

The Atlantic Schooners also flew a tonne of authentic Newfoundland Screech, the brand of rum that is traditionally used for the event, to Regina for the big party.

"(But) if they could afford to fly up 46 pallets of Screech, I'm sure they could have flown up one Newfoundlander to do the screech-in," said Andrews.

Williams, meanwhile, would rather the Maritimers drew on their own culture and tradition for such large, high-profile events.

"I don't find it flattering. It's just one more thing that people would want to take. But that's not up for the taking, in my mind. That's our tradition."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfou...down-1.2442886


Three thoughts:

1. I agree that they shouldn't be doing it. It's not Nova Scotian and, more importantly, it's not representative of what Canadian football fans would experience visiting Halifax for CFL games. Halifax is far less removed, culturally, from other mainland Canadian cities than we are.

2. Although I feel that way, I'm a little uncomfortable with the sensation. It seems reasonable to me to want to protect one's culture, but less so to prevent it from spreading. Completely disagree with and horrified by the quote, "When you're the best, people borrow from you all the time." It's just a silly ceremony, not some symbol of cultural superiority. And I'm quite sure it's a relatively modern invention. I highly doubt we were Screeching In Basque whalers and Portuguese fishermen in the 1600s.

3. I hope they get their CFL team ASAP so, for the rest of its existence, we can joke we got it for them. All jokes aside, though, I do hope they get it. I'd like to see the CFL grow, and I'd like to see Atlantic Canada included more in major sports.

EDIT, one more:

4. Wow, most people's reactions are less nuanced than mine. I'm hearing a lot of "They should drown in that Screech", "Someone should **** them with that cod", etc.

[SignalHillHiker]

Discussing this with Copes, who is originally from Nova Scotia, and I learned something new:

Kitchen parties are originally and predominantly a Maritime thing, especially Nova Scotia. Even Google agrees, "Nova Scotia Kitchen Party" gets way more results than "Newfoundland Kitchen Party". And "Maritime Kitchen Party" gets more than both combined.

I had absolutely no idea. I thought we were the only ones who even used the phrase.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

4. Wow, most people's reactions are less nuanced than mine. I'm hearing a lot of "They should drown in that Screech", "Someone should **** them with that cod", etc.

A lot of aggression there... maybe CFL scouts need to be spending more time in NL

[someone123]

One irony here is that the NL liquor corp, which produces Newfoundland Screech (and has presumably orchestrated a PR-driven screech-in resurgence), sold them a ton of the stuff.

The bitter response (including allusions to a lack of culture in NS) is classic. The Halifax CFL people have also been bombarded with the message that the city doesn't pay enough attention to the rest of the region.

I think the right response to this is to ignore the other parts of Atlantic Canada and let them sort their own neuroses out.

[SignalHillHiker]

Originally Posted by esquire

A lot of aggression there... maybe CFL scouts need to be spending more time in NL

Perhaps.

Someone123: If it was meant to represent that it would be "Atlantic Canada's" team, it was handled poorly.

It reminds me of the opening ceremonies on the Olympics in Beijing, where they had performers wearing the folk costumes of all of China's various ethnic groups - but every single one of them was Han Chinese. The complaint then was that these various cultures were far more than just Han Chinese in costumes - and the same is true about this.

And even if they'd done it right, or had Newfoundlanders involved... Atlantic Canada's team? Seriously? People here barely know what football is. I doubt more than a handful of people from here would travel to Halifax to see a game.

And if it's just meant to represent what's available in Atlantic Canada... it's a 1,500 km drive from Halifax to St. John's. With the ferry ride, it kills more than a day. The drive from Halifax to Ottawa is shorter. CFL fans probably aren't going to end up here. It'd be better to promote things along the highway inland through the Maritimes.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by someone123

I think the right response to this is to ignore the other parts of Atlantic Canada and let them sort their own neuroses out.

Don't worry someone, the rest of us here in the outer colonies are all quite used to being taken for granted and being ignored by the denizens of greater Haligon.

[logan5]

There's a link in that Forbes article to a list of current NHL team Values. Canadian teams make up 3 of the top 4 on the list. Unbelievably, the Canucks are close to the same valuation as the Habs and are ahead of all the big U.S. markets except New York. The Canucks are worth more than the Chicago White Sox and Toronto Blue Jays.

Rank Team Current Value:

1. Toronto Maple Leafs - $1,150 million

2. New York Rangers - $850 million

3. Montreal Canadiens - $775 million

4. Vancouver Canucks - $700 million

5. Chicago Blackhawks - $625 million

6. Boston Bruins - $600 million

7. Philadelphia Flyers - $500 million

8. Pittsburgh Penguins - $480 million

9. Detroit Red Wings - $470 million

10. Los Angeles Kings - $450 million

http://www.forbes.com/nhl-valuations/list/

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker

Perhaps.

Someone123: If it was meant to represent that it would be "Atlantic Canada's" team, it was handled poorly.

It reminds me of the opening ceremonies on the Olympics in Beijing, where they had performers wearing the folk costumes of all of China's various ethnic groups - but every single one of them was Han Chinese. The complaint then was that these various cultures were far more than just Han Chinese in costumes - and the same is true about this.

And even if they'd done it right, or had Newfoundlanders involved... Atlantic Canada's team? Seriously? People here barely know what football is. I doubt more than a handful of people from here would travel to Halifax to see a game.

And if it's just meant to represent what's available in Atlantic Canada... it's a 1,500 km drive from Halifax to St. John's. With the ferry ride, it kills more than a day. The drive from Halifax to Ottawa is shorter. CFL fans probably aren't going to end up here. It'd be better to promote things along the highway inland through the Maritimes.

Oddly enough though, the Grey Cup twitter related hashtags were the top ones in St. John's on Grey Cup Sunday. I looked at things after the game as I was curious if there was any attention on it, due to what I had heard about the lack of interest in football there. Seems there is at least a little interest... Enough to register a takeover in social media commentary anyway.

Is it a new thing? Or is there generally a bit of interest/curiosity for the Championship game?

[SignalHillHiker]

I don't see why it would be new... perhaps interest does exist but just isn't visible?

There was a CBC story about a family from Saskatchewan who moved here and trying to make football a thing. That'd be about the only thing I could think of to make the level of interest you noticed new... other than that, I'd assume it's been there for a while.