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  #61  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2009, 3:32 PM
Chaps Chaps is offline
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Originally Posted by J_M_A View Post
I dont think you understood what I was getting at. What I was saying is there there is good value for the price. There are many wood structure condos out there going for more then 300k. So to pay around 300k for a brand new concrete structure with underground parking, there is amazing value there.

I believe it was also announced on the news talk this morning that they are adding 5 more floors to the condo complex. Did anyone else hear this?
As in 30 floors total???

First it was 18, then we heard 25 a while ago. So 5 more storey's since the 25 announcement?
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  #62  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2009, 6:30 PM
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Originally Posted by J_M_A View Post
I dont think you understood what I was getting at. What I was saying is there there is good value for the price. There are many wood structure condos out there going for more then 300k. So to pay around 300k for a brand new concrete structure with underground parking, there is amazing value there.

I believe it was also announced on the news talk this morning that they are adding 5 more floors to the condo complex. Did anyone else hear this?
Yep I definitely get what you're saying. It's just that sometimes people don't go for the most sensible or best value. And sometimes they don't have a choice.

Your point is that you like the $300,000 price for a 900 sq foot downtown unit. But you'd also wait several years before putting money down.

However at $150,000 I suspect you might beg borrow or steal the money today for a deposit.

That's kind of my point. If they want a big bang and momentum, start at $150,000 and give off an impression of limited availability by selling floors 5 through 15. If they sell those all out and get some free PR of maybe some people lining up or even better, hope that some people start jostling each other in the line.

Once the hype machine is fully cranked up, then sell more premium units with extra goodies, perhaps adding $10,000 per floor.

You can always do freebies like fireplace, granite, etc. to close some sales. But they never want to be seen as lowering the price.

That's the playbook used for these projects elsewhere, I could see them trying it here. Though I could also see them just starting off asking top dollar on day one and wondering why sales are so slow off the bat.

It's all about creating a compelling value proposition, and I'm not sure small condos at $300,000 in the city center have mass appeal (yet).
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  #63  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2009, 7:27 PM
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I haven't had a chance to read through all this unit price speculating but there is no way they will be going for anything less than $250K, which I'm inferring someone is suggesting Westgate to advertise. If you look on MLS, condos all over Regina are going for well over that price. With the corner of Albert and Vic being a prime location (at least it should-be), I cannot see the units going for less than even $300K. No company would be doing as much as Westgate is doing with its open houses and development discussions or the other companies who are already building large condo developments elsewhere in the city (mostly in the east) if they didn't think they were going to get market rate, which right now I'm estimating to be anywhere between $300K and $400K.

My 33 year old house that is 800 sq ft was purchased for $235K in the summer. If I could have bought a brand new 900 sq ft condo downtown for the same price or less, I would be ridiculously angry now and the real estate market would be collapsing.

Or am I missing a point...
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  #64  
Old Posted Dec 2, 2009, 11:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Neil View Post
Yep I definitely get what you're saying. It's just that sometimes people don't go for the most sensible or best value. And sometimes they don't have a choice.

Your point is that you like the $300,000 price for a 900 sq foot downtown unit. But you'd also wait several years before putting money down.

However at $150,000 I suspect you might beg borrow or steal the money today for a deposit.

That's kind of my point. If they want a big bang and momentum, start at $150,000 and give off an impression of limited availability by selling floors 5 through 15. If they sell those all out and get some free PR of maybe some people lining up or even better, hope that some people start jostling each other in the line.

Once the hype machine is fully cranked up, then sell more premium units with extra goodies, perhaps adding $10,000 per floor.

You can always do freebies like fireplace, granite, etc. to close some sales. But they never want to be seen as lowering the price.

That's the playbook used for these projects elsewhere, I could see them trying it here. Though I could also see them just starting off asking top dollar on day one and wondering why sales are so slow off the bat.

It's all about creating a compelling value proposition, and I'm not sure small condos at $300,000 in the city center have mass appeal (yet).
You'd be right there... although the quality of the Westgate development is miles ahead of that proposed condo tower on Rose, Rose was priced in the 300K+ zone and units weren't really moving... and that project is all but dead because of it. I wonder if the research the Westgate developers have done into the market picked up on that project...
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  #65  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2009, 6:24 PM
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You'd be right there... although the quality of the Westgate development is miles ahead of that proposed condo tower on Rose, Rose was priced in the 300K+ zone and units weren't really moving... and that project is all but dead because of it. I wonder if the research the Westgate developers have done into the market picked up on that project...
The Westgate research seemed to be really superficial. It consisted of knowing that there have been no purpose built residential towers built for the last 30 years, only rehabs, and that theirs would be the tallest ever. I'm not even sure that's correct. Aren't there at least a couple of seniors towers that have been built? I'm not slamming them, just saying the people who were present seemed to know precious little about Regina. They were aware of the downtown plan, but not really fluent about it as they said a few things with respect to that were just wrong. Overall it reminded me of how rock bands grab a local team jersey and learn the mayor's name so they can get some easy applause.

Someone did ask them about the proposed or current Rose street condos and they'd never heard of them specifically. That's when the boss man piped up and said they purposely wanted to avoid doing local research cause they didn't want to be tainted by old established local attitudes. It caught my attention cause the way it was said sounded kind of blunt, and it was also sort of funny that he would say that at a session that was set up under the guise of seeking local input!
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  #66  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2009, 6:58 PM
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Originally Posted by djforsberg View Post
I haven't had a chance to read through all this unit price speculating but there is no way they will be going for anything less than $250K, which I'm inferring someone is suggesting Westgate to advertise. If you look on MLS, condos all over Regina are going for well over that price. With the corner of Albert and Vic being a prime location (at least it should-be), I cannot see the units going for less than even $300K. No company would be doing as much as Westgate is doing with its open houses and development discussions or the other companies who are already building large condo developments elsewhere in the city (mostly in the east) if they didn't think they were going to get market rate, which right now I'm estimating to be anywhere between $300K and $400K.

My 33 year old house that is 800 sq ft was purchased for $235K in the summer. If I could have bought a brand new 900 sq ft condo downtown for the same price or less, I would be ridiculously angry now and the real estate market would be collapsing.

Or am I missing a point...
How would you like it if the Plains/Westgate condos are:

1050 sq feet, 10' ceilings, upgrades, 1 secure indoor parking spot, price: $235k

1280 sq feet, same as above but with extra bathroom, etc, price: $300k

Because that's the current specs & pricing of units listed on skhomes and MLS as of today.

There were numerous units in all 3 of the major downtown condo towers that sat vacant all through the spring, summer, and fall. Not sure how your agent missed that if you were interested in that. The prices fell from $300+ to the low $200's and still no bites.

I know several that eventually decided to de-list and just grab the short term rent money until that market picks up. This was after months and months with very few showings. One got an offer but it was for less than $200k.

You might be seeing people attempting to sell their suburb condos for $300k. But just because somebody's asking $300k doesn't mean they're getting that or anything close. And for some reason those condos at the outskirts are more popular than downtown. Don't ask me why, I don't like 'em.
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  #67  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2009, 7:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Neil View Post
How would you like it if the Plains/Westgate condos are:

1050 sq feet, 10' ceilings, upgrades, 1 secure indoor parking spot, price: $235k

1280 sq feet, same as above but with extra bathroom, etc, price: $300k

Because that's the current specs & pricing of units listed on skhomes and MLS as of today.

There were numerous units in all 3 of the major downtown condo towers that sat vacant all through the spring, summer, and fall. Not sure how your agent missed that if you were interested in that. The prices fell from $300+ to the low $200's and still no bites.

I know several that eventually decided to de-list and just grab the short term rent money until that market picks up. This was after months and months with very few showings. One got an offer but it was for less than $200k.

You might be seeing people attempting to sell their suburb condos for $300k. But just because somebody's asking $300k doesn't mean they're getting that or anything close. And for some reason those condos at the outskirts are more popular than downtown. Don't ask me why, I don't like 'em.
I think you are ingnoring a major difference. The exisiting downtown condos you are referring to I believe are all former office building retrofits that the developers acquired cheaply. You can't build a new, quality highrise condo for anything approaching $235 per square foot.
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  #68  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2009, 11:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil View Post
How would you like it if the Plains/Westgate condos are:

1050 sq feet, 10' ceilings, upgrades, 1 secure indoor parking spot, price: $235k

1280 sq feet, same as above but with extra bathroom, etc, price: $300k

Because that's the current specs & pricing of units listed on skhomes and MLS as of today.

There were numerous units in all 3 of the major downtown condo towers that sat vacant all through the spring, summer, and fall. Not sure how your agent missed that if you were interested in that. The prices fell from $300+ to the low $200's and still no bites.

I know several that eventually decided to de-list and just grab the short term rent money until that market picks up. This was after months and months with very few showings. One got an offer but it was for less than $200k.

You might be seeing people attempting to sell their suburb condos for $300k. But just because somebody's asking $300k doesn't mean they're getting that or anything close. And for some reason those condos at the outskirts are more popular than downtown. Don't ask me why, I don't like 'em.

I cant speak for all of the downtown conversions. But in regards to the TD Bank conversion, The sound proofing was absolutely horrible. I had clients of mine who lived there and they said they could stand in one end of the condo and hear into their neighbours unit which was at the opposite end. I personally would never even consider looking in that building.
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  #69  
Old Posted Dec 3, 2009, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Stormer View Post
I think you are ingnoring a major difference. The exisiting downtown condos you are referring to I believe are all former office building retrofits that the developers acquired cheaply. You can't build a new, quality highrise condo for anything approaching $235 per square foot.
Also of note are the condo fees in those buildilngs... Sure some of the prices of the units in the TD tower weren't too bad... some around $235K like Neil said... but the big factor there was also the condo fees... TD building condo fees were right up in the area of $500/month. $500 is definitely on the high side for condo fees.
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  #70  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 12:09 AM
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Just out of curiosity, what are property taxes on a $300,000 dt condo?
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  #71  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 12:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Nathan View Post
Also of note are the condo fees in those buildilngs... Sure some of the prices of the units in the TD tower weren't too bad... some around $235K like Neil said... but the big factor there was also the condo fees... TD building condo fees were right up in the area of $500/month. $500 is definitely on the high side for condo fees.
I saw fees as high as $700 a month in one unit. Where as I pay $185 a month with underground heated parking, and it also includes water.
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  #72  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 2:27 AM
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Originally Posted by J_M_A View Post
I saw fees as high as $700 a month in one unit. Where as I pay $185 a month with underground heated parking, and it also includes water.
thats why new is better iam sure people would want new instead of all those old bank tower conversions ,on another note it would be nice if the tower would be 30 floors , maybe 5 floors of hotel , plus 25 floors of condo tower
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  #73  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 2:38 AM
timewilltell timewilltell is offline
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as per

Last edited by timewilltell; Mar 21, 2010 at 9:03 PM.
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  #74  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 3:46 AM
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Originally Posted by timewilltell View Post
as per 980 news they state the new tower will be the tallest in regina at 25 floors
http://www.newstalk980.com/story/20091203/26345

So I guess that means the tallest building in Saskatchewan. Great to hear.
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  #75  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 4:16 AM
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http://www.newstalk980.com/story/20091203/26345

So I guess that means the tallest building in Saskatchewan. Great to hear.
I thought the Delta was 25... (it's the current tallest isn't it?).
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  #76  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 5:35 AM
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I thought the Delta was 25... (it's the current tallest isn't it?).
As far as I know it is. I guess it really just depends how high they make the ceilings for the new condos and if they try to add some stuff at the top to give it some extra height.

Although it's great to hear of something so high going up in Regina, I think it's gonna make the skyline a bit awkward... That location isn't exactly central so for a while it's going to look a little off-kilter.
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  #77  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 4:57 PM
Neil Neil is offline
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Originally Posted by Stormer View Post
I think you are ingnoring a major difference. The exisiting downtown condos you are referring to I believe are all former office building retrofits that the developers acquired cheaply. You can't build a new, quality highrise condo for anything approaching $235 per square foot.
Well at this point we're comparing quality of one high rise condo to one that is still imaginary. But the TD Bank has concrete separation vertically and the code approved condo sound separation horizontally. If at the end of the day the Plains condos switch out of poured demising walls then you'll have identical 'quality' between them. The standards for commercial construction often far exceed that of residential anyway.

Regarding TD, I have heard of some noise issues on back-to-back walls, but one corner unit hearing another corner unit would be quite unlikely. Maybe the person reporting it is confused about which unit they are hearing. Probably the Plains building will be similar to the others, possibly better but the differences would be likely small.
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  #78  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 5:43 PM
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I saw fees as high as $700 a month in one unit. Where as I pay $185 a month with underground heated parking, and it also includes water.
There are many factors that go into those fees so you can't always compare apples to oranges. One place or the other might include or exclude concierge, gym, digital tv & internet, taxes, insurance, water treatment, exterior services, heat, electrical, special assessments, etc. So one building might be $200 but you spend $300 on other costs, and the next building is $500 with everything included.

But yes at TD and Hamilton, fees are disproportionately high and rising. New rules are pushing up fees in most condos to beef up reserves. For some of the currently listed condos, fees are stated around $200-300.

So the original point still stands... that high rise executive condos are currently struggling to sell in the 200's. What will happen as tons of extra supply comes on stream?
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  #79  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 5:56 PM
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Originally Posted by timewilltell View Post
thats why new is better iam sure people would want new instead of all those old bank tower conversions ,on another note it would be nice if the tower would be 30 floors , maybe 5 floors of hotel , plus 25 floors of condo tower
As I recall the hotel is a different tower of 10 floors linked to the condo tower somehow. The 10th floor of the hotel was earmarked for pool & fitness center shared by the hotel and condo users.
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  #80  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2009, 5:59 PM
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Just out of curiosity, what are property taxes on a $300,000 dt condo?
It's based not just on value but size and other factors. But expect around $2000-3000 per year.

The Plains ones they are trying to qualify for a tax incentive that might reduce that for the first several years (though I wonder if that might be tied to where the owner works since its under the walk to work program)
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